Strike Fast Packs?

[Godzilla]

Ok, we only seen them in DYRL but the only VFs sporting the strike packs are the VF-1S. Are we to assume that the strike packs are for Officers/squadron leaders?

[Nightbat]

Something along those lines

you don't give an expensive weapon to a rookie

chances are he'll never get the chance to use it

[JsARCLIGHT]

I still stick to my guns (pun intended) that the strike cannon is no more expensive than normal HMMP nasalle weapons but it rather requires a certain level of skill to use well in combat. The thing is basically a huge fixed weapon and unlike the swarms of self guided missles that the normal HMMP torches out a fixed in-line firing beam weapon would take a great deal of skill to use effectively in combat.

Any shnook can dump a swarm of missles into an enemy target and fly away... it takes a pro to line up a shot with ship's guns and clip the enemy from a distance... at combat speed... while manuvering...

Edit: and as for the cost thing, over the course of the weapon's life it would cost much less than the standard HMMP missle nasalle as the missle nasalle must be constantly reloaded with none-too-cheap missles whereas the beam cannon runs of ship's power and thus costs "nothing" to shoot. It may have a high price tag to build but it's operational cost should be very slim.

Edited April 23, 2004 by JsARCLIGHT

[azrael]

I would say it is dependent on mission specifics. In a Macross game, there was a scene in an opening sequence (you can find it on the 20th Anniversary DVD) where you see 2 cannon fodder VF-1As with Strike packs instead of Super packs. Sure you can be a pro, but you can be a pro in a VF-1A and still use Strike packs as opposed to just be in a VF-1S. Also, the Compendium lists the Strike pack (more importantly, the replacement double cannon) as an option to the standard VF-1 Super packs.

The HMMP-02 pod can be replaced by the optional Mauler RO-X2A high-powered double-action beam cannon pod (mounted on dorsal section).

Therefore, I will say that the Strike packs are dependent on mission specifics more than user preference (with Roy, he could get away with it since he's CAG) with rank having nothing to do with it except abuse of privilege. It does not matter what VF-1 you fly.

[UN Spacy]

Honestly. I don't see why Strike Cannon's were only flown by Squadron Leaders. From what we've seen Focker do with the Strike Cannon (in the Saturn Rings Battle) it seems as powerful as another gunpod. It's NOT powerful enough to "turn the tide" of any battle.

[Druna Skass]

How come later VFs don't have Strike style cannons?

[RichterX]

Because they noticed they weren't that good...

[Boxer]

Yeah,

And is it possible for a VF-1 (Or any VF for that matter) to mount two Beam pods instead of missile pods?

[azrael]

How come later VFs don't have Strike style cannons?

Most likely cost. JsARCLIGHT provides a good answer to that.

It may have a high price tag to build but it's operational cost should be very slim.

Beam weapons are expensive. Especially ones of that caliber. The VF-4 was the only fighter to have beam weapons as it's primary weapon. Due to it's costs, it was replaced with the VF-5000 as the primary fighter. The operational costs may be low, however the building and maintanence costs out weigh the operational costs. Hence the need to go back to using the gunpod as the primary weapon.

And is it possible for a VF-1 (Or any VF for that matter) to mount two Beam pods instead of missile pods?

Of course. Anything is possible.

[mechaninac]

Although it exists somewhat outside the "official" Macross lineage, the VF-2SS with SAP also sported a huge PBC on it.

[ewilen]

Any shnook can dump a swarm of missles into an enemy target and fly away... it takes a pro to line up a shot with ship's guns and clip the enemy from a distance... at combat speed... while manuvering...

I think we can agree that there's isn't much evidence one way or another so let me offer some speculation...

At the ranges/speeds/maneuver rates of space combat as portrayed in Macross, I think it'd be virtually impossible to hit a fighter-sized target using manual aiming (including aiming by pointing your vehicle) unless you have a weapon which fires a sustained "burst". So I'd argue that the Strike Cannon is aimed and/or triggered by computer. It would work something like this:

• Pilot (or gunner) designates target.

• Motors in cannon-mount aim at target, stabilize weapon; pilot gets a cue telling him the fire control system has developed a continuously updated fire control solution and cannon is ready to fire.

• Pilot depresses trigger to tell fire control system to fire at optimal moment.

• Fire control system actually controls the precise moment of firing to ensure beam will meet target based on relative motion of cannon (unless stabilization is perfect) and target.

(If I'm not mistaken, the cannon mount can only adjust in one dimension, so stabilization can't be perfect.)

So using the Strike Cannon may involve a bit of additional training, but I doubt that it requires a deadeye sniper.

[Coota0]

Yeah,

And is it possible for a VF-1 (Or any VF for that matter) to mount two Beam pods instead of missile pods?

My thought on that is: I dont see why not, but I'll bet there is one heck of a power drain from firing both at once

[Aurel Tristen]

How come later VFs don't have Strike style cannons?

This can be attributed to additional development and incorparation of Zjentohlauedy technology, Protoculture technology, OTM, improved engines lead to beam weapons on VFs becoming more of a design standard rather than augmentative option.

[JsARCLIGHT]

At the ranges/speeds/maneuver rates of space combat as portrayed in Macross, I think it'd be virtually impossible to hit a fighter-sized target using manual aiming (including aiming by pointing your vehicle) unless you have a weapon which fires a sustained "burst". So I'd argue that the Strike Cannon is aimed and/or triggered by computer.

I was always under the assumption that the VF's in Macross closely followed the tactics and "operational logic" of the modern aircraft they were drawn from... like the F-14 Tommy. That big Tom has an inboard cannon on it that is sort of like the gunpod on the VF series... you have to manually line up your shots with that thing using only a dancing piter and crosshairs and some pilots could shave the fleece off a sheep with those things. I can't imagine the Strike Cannon, or the standard gunpod, would be much different. In all truth we have only seen a Strike Cannon fire two, maybee three times in the anime... the best being the shot on the Zentran capturing Hikaru and Minmay by Focker. The Cannon was a single blast shot and he hit that sucker right in the numbers for a clean kill. You can see the Cannon fire and it appears to not move at all, fixed in place.

I think if anything the Strike Cannon is more anime magic than gimble mounted and computer controlled.

[ewilen]

I agree that the gunpod on a Valk functions much like the Vulcan in a US fighter jet--although it has a higher caliber and lower rate of fire. Guns in modern fighters are short range weapons, though, and the way you use them is to press the trigger just as the target is moving through the space where the shells are going to be, and keep it held down for IIRC about half a second. So the target flies through the "stream" of shells and hopefully gets hit by a few of them. Whether that would work with a beam weapon depends on how long the beam can be sustained. Add to that the fact that the Strike Cannon seems to get used at longish ranges (as shown by Focker's shot).

Ultimately I agree that it's probably something we're not supposed to think too much about, but if we want to get techno-geekish about it (and I think Kawamori would approve, based on M0), that's how I think a Strike would work. If the cannon is completely fixed, then I still think the trigger would be computer assisted as I described.

[eugimon]

I like ewilen's idea for the strike... the thing does have that HUGE sensor mounted on it, afterall.

Besides, it wouldn't take much movement of the cannons to alter the direction of the shot... especially at the ranges shown in the anime... a tiny adjustment of the barrels, say 1 degree, could have a huge impact on where the beam will go.

I also agree that a pilot can learn to do surgery with those guns manually... but why.. the computers are there so why not make the most use of them?

[Jin_Kune_Do]

Who knows?...maybe during a stressed combat situation, you dont have time to wait for the "target computer" to lock on, and you (asuming you are an ace like Roy) knows for sure you can hit the target without waiting for the lock.

Kinda like the Ace Combat series, where you have to blow up bridges or you are are on the 6 of a enemy fighter and your already stressed since your trying to dodge the shots being fired at you from your own 6. And then you would rather just fire the guns/missils and do it manually.

Just my two cents.

-Jin