Orguss TV series

[jenius]

I agree Honneamise with pretty much all of that. Like I said earlier, I felt the ending was just kind of a "It has ended... anything now is possible." I don't really think there is a straight answer on what that ending actually was. To be honest, with how completely out there and whacky that entire series was (I mean that in a good way though, I found it fantastic in both the fantasy sense and the overall quality) the ending seems to fit perfectly.

[Renato]

I still don´t know what all the scenes with the main characters as possible couples are supposed to mean: "could-have-beens" or "may-be´s in other dimensions" ?

Even within the distorted dimensions Kei has always been a human and had no tentacles, so why has he got them in one of those scenes? But... wasn´t there some dream sequence in the middle of the series with Mimsy (or another character) being a human? I really don´t remember,  I have to watch it again....

373324[/snapback]

Yeah, I think that is supposed to show that any outcome is now possible, which is how the world should be. I think one of those scenes which flashed up at the end was Mimsy as a human, running with Kei. Don't remember seeing Kei with tentacles...

[ghostryder]

I'm about the watch Ep. 35, so this is all good to absorb as a primer, before I watch, get confused by the subs, and go WTF????!!!!!!

[Renato]

I would've thought it would spoil the surprise... and you'd still go "WTF??!"

[Boxer]

Hey! This thread's alive again!

And to think, the Ending of Orguss is just as confusing and frustrating as the TV ending of Evangelion, in which fans always ask: 'WTF?'

In my opinion, when the D-capsule enters the huge Tokuiden in orbit it brings the past and Present Kei and Olsen into a dimensional null space in the area around the bomb. It isn't the exact location in space and time, but in the same sense it is. The bomb is gone, but the fighters remain. it is also daylight there as opposed to dusk/dawn when the fighting took place at the beginning of the series.

When Kei and Olsen shoot one another the decable should be resolved, but because of certain factors, it doesn't end up that way.

I argued earlier for multiple dimensions. Here's how I see it:

You know how the Emaan and Terram were so concerned about 'brainwashing' Kei and Olsen? It is because they have the same effect Shinji Ikari did in Evangelion's 'Instrumentality project'- they could determine the outcome of the world. Had Kei been captured and convinced to return the world to the way it was, this is what would have happened when the Tokuiden bubble popped. If Kei wanted to live in a universe with Mimsy and the Emaan population, then this would have been the result.

So as I see it, Kei wanted everyone to be happy after the resoultion of the Tokuiden, and didn't have a specific focus. Thus, when the bubble burst, the multitude of possible universes branched out once again into their own strings. Thus we see Kei and Mimsy with the baby, Kei back with Tina again, Olsen and Athena, Shaya and her lover, all those dimensions are possible and happened in the wake of the space/time Oscillation bomb.

Think of it as all dimensional strings being clumped together in one point for a time because of the D-bomb (which we see in the series), but after the D-bomb's resolution and the bubble burst, the dimensions no longer have commonality and seperate into individual universes.

This is how the origional series of Orguss ends, and I think it's brilliant.

---------

And no, we never see Kei portraying himself as an Emaan. Presumably this is because the universe resolved itself in Kei's point of view, in which he never envisioned himself as an Emaan.

------------

In reguards to Space Island one, I'm not sure how it got there either. I assume it was built during Kei's time and abandoned up there after the D-bomb went off. Since the D-effect seems to only effect the earth, anything outside of the Earth's atmosphere must have reamained unaffected by the D-shift. It's then possible that the east and west sides, since they couldn't return to earth, fought it out and busted up Space Island one.

-----

Cameo notice; Did anyone see an Emaan Amuro Rey in the Emaan city? And the Arcadia is still out there...

[jenius]

Goo - I just finished Orguss02. That was.... special. Really, I didn't find it to be a horrible anime but it didn't seem to capture any of the charm of the original series. I suppose that's a topic for a thread I missed about 15 years ago though

Now that I understand that the Space Island was a plot device used to rush the characters I appreciate it a lot more. In the end, did we get a shot of the dinosaur people all being happy? They seemed like the saddest group to me.

[Boxer]

Hehe... did it have much to do with Orguss at all? That's the main sinker for the 02 OAV- nothing to do with Orguss at all, other than dropped names and references.

And I don't recall if we see Jabby with Linbulm (sp?). We see him looking over the baby, and we see Shaya happy with her husband, so *shrug* who knows? Maybe it was supposed to be assumed.

[Renato]

There is no Orguss 02. La-la-lah, not listening.

To be honest, I didn't think it was as bad as Macross II in that it wasn't a rehash sequel. The idea of having relics from another dimension which are more technologically advanced is cool and works BECAUSE it is Orguss.

But the characters are stupid, why does that girl have super powers and it only really gets quite good in the last two episodes.

Tai never got any love from the characters in the original except for Mohme, though, so it's good to see him back. Even if he looks nothing like himself.

[honneamise]

There is no Orguss 02.  La-la-lah, not listening. 

To be honest, I didn't think it was as bad as Macross II in that it wasn't a rehash sequel.  The idea of having relics from another dimension which are more technologically advanced is cool and works BECAUSE it is Orguss.

But the characters are stupid, why does that girl have super powers and it only really gets quite good in the last two episodes.

Tai never got any love from the characters in the original except for Mohme, though, so it's good to see him back.  Even if he looks nothing like himself.

373877[/snapback]

When I bought Orgusss 2 in ´95 i LOVED it for the setting, design, suspense, the whole retro-thing and this cool Roy Fock--- ah, Manning-guy - but I did not fully understand what was going on in the end because I had no idea what the original series was all about.

Now that I know the "Classic" Orguss series I understand O-02 better but at the same time I find the whole idea of "there are still artifacts and contradictions from other dimensions" a bit far-fetched.

Even if we don´t know in detail what was going on in the end of Orguss TV, I´m pretty sure things were not meant to be just partly resolved.... I still like O 02, but finally getting the original series was one of the best ideas I ever had

[Boxer]

As with all things Orguss, getting the original series is the closest to a Macross FTW! as we'll ever get.

My head will explode if a DVD remastered version appeared. The Emaan nation would cry out in joy if a sequel was made.

The Mu would dominate the world if they made a sequel to O2. >>;

What I Reeeeeeeely want (other than...eheh...Lieea and Maaie >>; ) would be some of the old Orguss models. I have some, but I'm afraid to bust them out and paint them up because they're getting rarer and rarer to find.

[honneamise]

As with all things Orguss, getting the original series is the closest to a Macross FTW! as we'll ever get.

My head will explode if a DVD remastered version appeared. The Emaan nation would cry out in joy if a sequel was made.

The Mu would dominate the world if they made a sequel to O2. >>;

What I Reeeeeeeely want (other than...eheh...Lieea and Maaie >>; ) would be some of the old Orguss models. I have some, but I'm afraid to bust them out and paint them up because they're getting rarer and rarer to find.

374618[/snapback]

I wouldn´t mind if Orguss had gone the way of a multi-series/OVA etc- franchise like Macross but I guess the story of this whole strange universe pretty much came full circle with the ending of the TV series... and all those really strange mecha designs were not as popular as the VF of Macross I assume - although I love all of them.

Lieea and Maaie´s M-Lovers/Molervers/M.Rovers whateveryoucallit are among my favourite model kits. It´s a pity that IMAI went bancrupt - Aoshima seems to have their molds now but I don´t think the Orguss line will be reissued soon... same thing with ARII- they don´t seem to bother with reissue plans as well so you have to spend a mad 85$ for a Drifand Dal on eBay.

[Renato]

Lieea and Maaie´s M-Lovers/Molervers/M.Rovers whateveryoucallit are among my favourite model kits. It´s a pity that IMAI went bancrupt - Aoshima seems to have their molds now but I don´t think the Orguss line will be reissued soon... same thing with ARII- they don´t seem to bother with reissue plans as well so you have to  spend a mad 85$ for a Drifand Dal on eBay. 

374651[/snapback]

!!! I never knew they made a Dal!! I neeeeed!! Does it "transform" (retract, whatever)??

[Renato]

When I bought Orgusss 2 in ´95 i LOVED it for the setting, design, suspense, the whole retro-thing and this cool Roy Fock--- ah, Manning-guy - but I did not fully understand what was going on in the end because I had no idea what the original series was all about.

374615[/snapback]

I bought it around the same time (Manga release, yeah?) and I thought the same thing about Manning/Focker!!

I didn't like the show too much except for the last two episodes.

I had been wanting to see the original ever since and recently I finally got the chance. I now dislike the sequel even more as a result, though.

And as I've mentioned time and again, I have been looking for an OST of the TV show forever... Anyone have MP3s of the songs?

Orguss rocks.

[honneamise]

Lieea and Maaie´s M-Lovers/Molervers/M.Rovers whateveryoucallit are among my favourite model kits. It´s a pity that IMAI went bancrupt - Aoshima seems to have their molds now but I don´t think the Orguss line will be reissued soon... same thing with ARII- they don´t seem to bother with reissue plans as well so you have to  spend a mad 85$ for a Drifand Dal on eBay. 

374651[/snapback]

!!! I never knew they made a Dal!! I neeeeed!! Does it "transform" (retract, whatever)??

374670[/snapback]

Yes there is a Dal, made by ARII. While the detailing is quite good and the kit is really BIG (1/48!), the transformation (to three-wheeled car type) is lousy. The front legs have some kind of 90 degree turning mechanism but it is so sloppy (not even polycaps here) you should better glue it in one position.

There is an ARII release but it was also marketed by Revell, they had one as "Trigon" and one with the original boxart by Takani.

Revell :

The Trigon had a photo of an assembled model as boxart

and orginal ARII:

[honneamise]

When I bought Orgusss 2 in ´95 i LOVED it for the setting, design, suspense, the whole retro-thing and this cool Roy Fock--- ah, Manning-guy - but I did not fully understand what was going on in the end because I had no idea what the original series was all about.

374615[/snapback]

I bought it around the same time (Manga release, yeah?) and I thought the same thing about Manning/Focker!!

I didn't like the show too much except for the last two episodes.

I had been wanting to see the original ever since and recently I finally got the chance. I now dislike the sequel even more as a result, though.

And as I've mentioned time and again, I have been looking for an OST of the TV show forever... Anyone have MP3s of the songs?

Orguss rocks.

374671[/snapback]

You are right Renato, of course it was the Manga release on 3 tapes!

"War - I love it! Death, destruction and easy money!" Haha, this guy was even better than the "original" Focker

I´ve been looking for the Orguss OST as well. I searched amazon and - they actually had it listed! I ordered and after some months of delays they told me they don´t get it anymore. Not that I hadn´t expected that in the first place. That´s about the closest I got so far....

No mp3´s or anything

[ghostryder]

I would've thought it would spoil the surprise... and you'd still go "WTF??!"

373649[/snapback]

I sort of knew the premise of the story, so not a spoiler for me. On that note, I finished the series, and have a few of WTFs:

When Kei and Olsen arrive at the special point, it's at a point in space-time where the time bomb had been detonated, and thus a null-space (like the eye of a hurricane). To me, it seems like the younger Kei/Olsen were not necessarily the ones who were around when the bomb was set off, but represent an alternate path after the bomb was set off. In the series, we see the path where Kei and Olsen are hurled into the future 10 years apart, whereas the younger pair represent a path where they were sent right back to where they were when the bomb went off, only later in the day. That's why the Broncos appear out of nowhere.

So I'm wondering if there are a bunch of other alternate Kei/Olsen pairs that got sent God-knows-where after the bomb went off. Would they represent/explain all the alternate realities we see at the end? Still doesn't explain how these two particular Kei/Olsen pairs stabilized all the realties by killing each other off.

I'm still unsure if these two were meant to be immune from the effects of the bomb and all the interweaving af parallel universes - that's the only way I can explain the Kei w/ a tentacle at the end, unless Mimsy was sporting a 3rd one

All in all, I like the "anything is possible" warm and fuzzy feeling at the end.

[Boxer]

Orguss could continue if one were to focus on one of the diverent universes. Say, the top of the space elevator fell and the Orguss was recovered... in the past. Then the Emaan show up, all that stuff... and don't forget the Mu... when reactivated units start rising out of the ground from falling to earth and getting buried in the distant past...

With all the dimensional possibilities of Orguss, it's fantastic what can be done. Orguss 02 is a dismal failure because it didn't tie in close enough to the origional- almost nothing is the same except Tai, who we SAW VAPORIZED at the Space Elevator at the end. (Sorry to spoil that )

Yes I saw the Dal kit here and there. Might be one available on Ebay for the usual astronomical price

THE SOUNDTRACK DOES EXIST! in Lp form. I tried to secure some of the records but alas, poor community college student funds couldn't cut it. Legend (the internet) speaks of a CD version of the soundtrack released somewhere, sometime. The image is lost on my hard drive, as well as the ISN code, but I'm sure you could dig through ancient history (the internet) to find it.

And if you do, COUNT ME IN as someone who wants it.

Yeah, when IMAI went belly up it sounded the deathknell for Orguss. The final blow came when Orguss 02 was put out, and now we have the 'robotech problem:'

"Yeah, Orguss is my favorite anime."

"Orguss? Oh, you mean Orguss II! I thought it was weird."

"No, I mean the origional Orguss."

"What's that?"

*Slap head*

because Orguss 02 is actually on shelves now, as opposed to the origioanl Orguss which is only available in a HK bootleg!

And unlike Macross or Gundam, with notstalgic good feeling, Orguss' fan following is usually by the Curious and by the fortunate.

Unless you wondered where some of the bits on Star Trek's Stargazer came from. Yeah, the Orguss gun is on it. I don't think it shoots missiles though...

[jenius]

my would be Orguss script:

Kei arrives in some dimension 20 years later (again). This time the Earth is a lot better off and no one really feels a burning need to restore it. However, something resulting from Kei's screwing with the dimensions is definitely having a very negative effect on everyone and Kei sees it's up to him to solve things. This time though, he's got to kill his own daughter with Mimsy to do it!

Okay, maybe now i'm just getting way morbid.

[Renato]

my would be Orguss script:

Kei arrives in some dimension 20 years later (again).  This time the Earth is a lot better off and no one really feels a burning need to restore it.  However, something resulting from Kei's screwing with the dimensions is definitely having a very negative effect on everyone and Kei sees it's up to him to solve things.  This time though, he's got to kill his own daughter with Mimsy to do it!

Okay, maybe now i'm just getting way morbid.

375063[/snapback]

Now that just sounds like Back to the Future on crack.

"War - I love it! Death, destruction and easy money!" Haha, this guy was even better than the "original" Focker 

Hee hee. I remember that one. There was also the line he said to that girl that went like "Whaddya waitin' for?! Go now before I throw you down on the ground and rape you!"

Unlike Focker, I can actually believe him meaning it!

[jenius]

The only thing that he didn't have (Manning) was a really good drunk scene. If they showed him good and wasted once and not thinking it was a bad thing at all then he would have been nearly a dead-ringer.