Advanced Destroid Program (Destroid Upgrades)

[azrael]

Dial it down please. Name calling and insults usually ends any kind of debating.

[pengbuzz]

1 hour ago, azrael said:

Dial it down please. Name calling and insults usually ends any kind of debating.

My apologies. Dialed down, and previous snarkiness removed (as far as I know) from my previous post.

To try to move this into a more positive light: @Seto Kaiba: would there be a situation/ situations where destroids would be more useful in combat than a Valkyrie? An example I can think of is perhaps Southern Cross or maybe Mospeada, where it looks like much of the fighting was ground based (admit it's been a while since I've seen either series, so this is by very shaky recollection). Or would those be poor venues for that?

Edited February 9 by pengbuzz

[Seto Kaiba]

On 2/9/2024 at 3:33 AM, pengbuzz said:

To try to move this into a more positive light: @Seto Kaiba: would there be a situation/ situations where destroids would be more useful in combat than a Valkyrie?

Thus far, the only case that's mentioned after the First Space War era in official publications is the defense of the interior of (very large) later-generation emigrant ships like the 5th Generation Island Cluster-class.

Official publications for the Macross Frontier series and movies point to that as the main reason for the Macross Frontier fleet's use of the Cheyenne II Destroid.  Its relatively small size and its ability to switch between walking and rolling on the wheels built into its feet allowed it to be highly mobile (for a Destroid) and go almost anywhere inside of the Islands without much difficulty without damaging infrastructure like the road system.  Even then, Macross Chronicle suggests the main role of Destroids stationed inside emigrant ships is delaying tactics so the ship's Valkyries can return and mop up the intruders.  (Their use on the exterior of ships like the Macross Quarter as anti-air defenses is noted to be support of the ship's fixed anti-aircraft defenses.)  The Macross 7 fleet had something vaguely similar in the form of the Patroid, an armored car that could turn into a vaguely Zaku Tank-like robot form.

The area where Destroids seem to really shine after the First Space War isn't in combat, but as larger versions of heavy machinery.  In Macross 7, we see many old Series 04 units owned by City 7 residents that have been converted with things like cement mixers and trowels, cranes, and drills.  Macross Frontier materials note that the civilian market version of the Cheyenne II (the "Destroid Work") was very popular as a piece of highly versatile construction equipment and for things like asteroid mining.  Macross Delta shows us more of same (though it calls them "Workroids") with the Shahal City spaceport on Al Shahal making liberal use of Workroids for freight handling.

 

On 2/9/2024 at 3:33 AM, pengbuzz said:

An example I can think of is perhaps Southern Cross or maybe Mospeada, where it looks like much of the fighting was ground based (admit it's been a while since I've seen either series, so this is by very shaky recollection). Or would those be poor venues for that?

The settings of those stories are very different.

Super Dimension Cavalry Southern Cross never really explains why military robots are a thing in its setting.  They seem to have them just because it's the spacefuture and because the show's premise demands them.  The war is mostly fought on the ground because the Zor's objective is on Glorie's surface and because their more advanced technology gave them a decisive edge over Glorie and Liberte's fleets despite the inexperience in war that allows the Southern Cross Army to hold them off for a time planetside.

Genesis Climber MOSPEADA had something vaguely akin to a Destroid in the form of the (backstory only) Armo-Soldiers... early robotic weapons that were used by the 1st Earth Descent Operation.  There are a bunch of different types in the concept art, but the only model to actually appear (in a still shot) was the Condor.  Like the more advanced robotic weapons in the 2nd Earth Descent Operation at the start of the series proper, they were wiped out by the Invit's superior numbers and their own lack of awareness that the Invit's energy sensors could track them as long as their powerplants were running.  The fighting there is on the ground because it's the story of a small number of survivors waging the best little guerilla war they can on their way to the Invit's central hive and because the Invit don't really have space forces in the conventional sense and not even really being that interested in fighting except in their own defense.

In both cases, humanity's tech level is a fair bit lower than it is in Macross since they had to come by it honestly instead of being able to copy the Protoculture's homework.  The level of technological advancement is much closer to that of Gundam's Universal Century.

Edited February 10 by Seto Kaiba

[JB0]

Destroids seem to also be used for more-or-less police work on Earth after the war. 

I would assume that any community with full-size zentradi would see an advantage to get their Patlabor on. 

...

Though I think 7 had transforming helicopters?

The M3 shows 7 having a transforming police car. 

Edited February 11 by JB0

[Seto Kaiba]

20 minutes ago, JB0 said:

Destroids seem to also be used for more-or-less police work on Earth after the war. 

I would assume that any community with full-size zentradi would see an advantage to get their Patlabor on. 

In some capacity, though they shared the role with the Valkyries stationed around Earth's fledgling cities until the New UN Government finally got sick of dealing with giant Zentradi violence and banned Zentradi from living as giants on Earth's surface in 2030.

Most emigrant fleets don't permit giant Zentradi for resource reasons, with Macross Frontier being one of the few exceptions (presumably at the behest of its Zentradi financial backer Richard Bilra), so the problem doesn't seem to have popped up in many other places.  There was some rioting on Uroboros, but that was apparently induced rather than a natural occurrance, and Master File suggests the aggression problem that led to rioting was first mitigated with medication and then cured with gene therapy.

[Shawn]

On 2/1/2024 at 4:52 AM, sketchley said:

I think there's a bit of 'lost in translation' (E→J) and 'wasei eigo' (Japanese English) that makes the naming confusing for us native English speakers.  Macross Chronicle* explained the roles of each type of Variable craft somewhat.  VA and VB are:

 

It also doesn't help that the only example of a VB we've seen is the VB-6...

 

* http://sdfyodogawa.mywebcommunity.org/MCRtechnology/01aVariableFighter.php

 

Is this one from the Advanced Valkyrie series considered the precursor of the VB series? 

[Seto Kaiba]

1 hour ago, Shawn said:

Its this one from the Advanced Valkyrie series considered the precursor of the VB series? 

Hard to say... it does show up on Macross Chronicle's Variable Fighter design lineage diagram (Technology Sheet 01Q), but it's not connected to anything on either side.

Macross Chronicle Technology Sheet 01L mentions a VB-4 and a VB-5 that we know nothing about, so they may be unrelated or there may be some unknown models in the middle there somewhere.