DARTHTODD Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 First off (just some personal history), I've been a fan of Macross mecha/toys for over 2 years now. I love them to death! Finally, I thought that I should watch some Macross DVD's and get a taste of what the shows are all about. I started off with Do You Remember Love. Let me say that I was extremely excited to view this after all the good things that I've heard about this movie. I know this is going to probably make some people mad (I'm sorry), but after viewing this movie, I can't believe how badly I disliked it. Overall, I don't think that I've disliked a movie more than this one. There were a few things that I didn't hate, the mecha of course/fighting/anime style but I thought that the storyline was incredibly childish/lame. The singing also annoyed the hell outta me. Again, this is just my opinion and I could be wrong (in fact, I'm sure some of you will think I'm definetely wrong). Is there anyone else out there that agrees with me? I guess I just can't see how some of you could love this movie so much. I realize there were some good lessons that this movie was trying to bring out, but I just don't think that it did a good job of it. Anyways, I will say though that I enjoyed Macross Zero (1st episode). I thought that the anime was great and the storyline wasn't too bad either. I guess it's kind of weird to find out how much I enjoyed Macross Zero and hated DYRL considering they're in the same universe/overall story. Anyways, sorry again if I pissed some of you off but I just wanted to get my thoughts out there and find out if anyone else feels the same way. By the way, I am not judging the Macross TV series, just DYRL. You'll have to let me know if the TV series is better than DYRL or different, etc. Thanks (don't rip on me too bad.....) Quote
Duke Togo Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 DYRL? is a "retelling" or "re-imaging" of the original TV series. I could be wrong, but it doesn't sound like you are destined to be a Macross fan. Quote
SuperOstrich Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 I don't think you'll piss anyone off. Afterall, everyone's makes mistakes. Quote
imode Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 No biggie. The series and movie are like a soap opera set in space. Mostly drama with a sci-fi backdrop. It's not everyone's bag. The toys on the other hand, are pretty universal. I don't know many people who explicitly hate Macross toys. Quote
Duke Togo Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 (edited) I don't think you'll piss anyone off. Afterall, everyone's makes mistakes. I agree. We aren't talking about Macross 7 afterall! Edited January 31, 2004 by Duke Togo Quote
J A Dare Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Wasn't DYRL made for Macross fans? I could understand why the uninitiated would be turned off with a WTF-is-going-on? mentality. It's a bit confusing without the SDF background info. Besides, you have to like cheesy love triangles/songs/dramas/soap operas to LOVE Macross. If you just like the mechs/action, then you ain't a TRUE Macross fan. Quote
Duke Togo Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 The not liking Minmay part will be a problem if he ever gets around to watching the TV series. Quote
azrael Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 There's plenty of Macross to watch and like. You don't like one? No biggie. You don't like the whole franchise... meh. Quote
lebhead Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 don't worry... i have always felt that the story in DYRL was by far the weakest in Macross (even more so than II in some respects). it's hard/impossible to get 36 episodes into 2 hours. it just doesn't work. i'll always feel that the perfect Macross includes DYRL's animation and the TV series' story. if you haven't tried watching the original 36 episodes, then i think you will really enjoy them. and then if you watch DYRL again after that, you may enjoy it more as well. after all, DYRL was created for fans of Macross - so there is an underlying assumption that you at least know the main story going into the movie. Quote
duckie81 Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 (edited) I don't know how you found DYRL horrible, but to me it was awesome? The fact that you are more interested into the mecha/action probably hints at the idea that you probalby aren't into the storyline that revolves around Macross, etc. For me, the bizzaire love triangle was what made me love Macross. The mechas are cool, the storyline is great, but the last 9 or so episodes were what really made me fall in love with Macross. DYRL, on the otherhand, probalby isn't something you can take in if you haven't seen Macross tv. And man, did i love that scene between Hikaru/Misa/Minmay, where Hikaru confesses his love towards Misa. Priceless! Edited January 31, 2004 by duckie81 Quote
ComicKaze Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 (edited) Really? What's wrong with the story? I don't think you are going to be a Macross fan. I'm a Macross fan for the storyline and not the mecha believe it or not. I don't know if you'll ever watch the original series but it makes the story that is condensed in DYRL more fleshed out. Personally, I don't like Macross Zero at all. You might want to watch Macross Plus if you want something more adult/serious but DYRL was incredibly serious. Can you list exactly what was wrong? It's gotta be pretty bad if it's the worst movie you've ever seen. Maybe you just aren't used to watching oldschool anime whereas I cannot stand anything made after 1999. Don't bother with 7, I can tell you would hate it. Edited January 31, 2004 by ComicKaze Quote
ewilen Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 I made the mistake of showing my wife DYRL before she'd seen the TV show. She hated it, and I can see why. In DYRL, we really see very little of Hikaru's personality (if anything, he seems more like a bumpkin) and not much more of anyone else's, so why should we care about the characters? IMO, DYRL really only works for most people if you go in with all the "baggage" from the series. Then it becomes interesting to watch how they updated the mecha and character visuals and scrambled all the story elements around. Oh, once I started showing her the TV series, she became addicted. By the way, you didn't watch the dub of DYRL, did you? That would be a major impediment, as by all accounts it's one of the worst dubs ever. Quote
Panon Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Anyways, sorry again if I pissed some of you off but I just wanted to get my thoughts out there and find out if anyone else feels the same way. By the way, I am not judging the Macross TV series, just DYRL. You'll have to let me know if the TV series is better than DYRL or different, etc. Nothing wrong with that. I personally find it one of the weakest parts of Macross. It looks wonderful and.. well, that's it's strongest point. I've always found it a pretty weak compressed and simplified revisioning of the original series, changed for the worse. Really, it's an excuse to see our favourite old characters and valkyries given a second life with terrific high budget animation. Beyond that.. meh. Quote
DARTHTODD Posted January 31, 2004 Author Posted January 31, 2004 Can you list exactly what was wrong? It's gotta be pretty bad if it's the worst movie you've ever seen. Maybe you just aren't used to watching oldschool anime whereas I cannot stand anything made after 1999.Don't bother with 7, I can tell you would hate it. The reason I didn't like it is I guess I like anime/movies in general that are more realistic. Again, I really wanted to like this movie, but when you have parts of the storyline that include someone that can stop fighting by singing a song....it just seemed extremely cheesy to me. Again, when the Zentraedi were analyzing the captured humans and the dialogue was about hugging, kissing....cheesy (in my viewpoint). Also, they're in the middle of a war where the extermination of humans is in the balance...and Hikaru is off taking joyrides through the galaxy, etc. Doesn't seem like the actions of someone who is in the military. Other things seemed outta balance. The zentraedi destroy everything on the earth so quickly but yet they can't destroy the Macross which is significantly smaller than earth/size of their own Zen fleet. The Zen seem so formidable at some points, and laughably incompetant at others. There are other "inconsistencies" that bothered me, but these are the main ones. I know this is a story and not suppossed to be real life, but I thought that they could've done a much better job of making it realistic. Perhaps I would like the series more as I'm sure it's fleshed out more. Honestly though, is the TV series fairly similar to DYRL? If it is, I don't think it's my cup of tea.... Also, how is Macross Plus compared to DYRL/Zero? Does it have a lot of singing/cheesy stuff in it or is it more adult similar to what Zero is like? I'm interested to know as I did enjoy Macross Zero and I would like to watch Plus if it's like Zero. Interesting to read your comments so far and BTW, it's nice to know there are some of you out there that didn't think DYRL was that great. Quote
Aegis! Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Wasn't DYRL made for Macross fans? I could understand why the uninitiated would be turned off with a WTF-is-going-on? mentality. It's a bit confusing without the SDF background info. Besides, you have to like cheesy love triangles/songs/dramas/soap operas to LOVE Macross. If you just like the mechs/action, then you ain't a TRUE Macross fan. mmm..I don´t think you strictly have to love drama/love triangles/soap operas to love Macross , that´s more in the line of Sailot Moon I would say. I hate soap operas and cheesy drama as well as the cliche love triangles yet I love every Macross to date (except MII of course). Quote
Aegis! Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Can you list exactly what was wrong? It's gotta be pretty bad if it's the worst movie you've ever seen. Maybe you just aren't used to watching oldschool anime whereas I cannot stand anything made after 1999.Don't bother with 7, I can tell you would hate it. The reason I didn't like it is I guess I like anime/movies in general that are more realistic. Again, I really wanted to like this movie, but when you have parts of the storyline that include someone that can stop fighting by singing a song....it just seemed extremely cheesy to me. Again, when the Zentraedi were analyzing the captured humans and the dialogue was about hugging, kissing....cheesy (in my viewpoint). Also, they're in the middle of a war where the extermination of humans is in the balance...and Hikaru is off taking joyrides through the galaxy, etc. Doesn't seem like the actions of someone who is in the military. Other things seemed outta balance. The zentraedi destroy everything on the earth so quickly but yet they can't destroy the Macross which is significantly smaller than earth/size of their own Zen fleet. The Zen seem so formidable at some points, and laughably incompetant at others. There are other "inconsistencies" that bothered me, but these are the main ones. I know this is a story and not suppossed to be real life, but I thought that they could've done a much better job of making it realistic. Perhaps I would like the series more as I'm sure it's fleshed out more. Honestly though, is the TV series fairly similar to DYRL? If it is, I don't think it's my cup of tea.... Also, how is Macross Plus compared to DYRL/Zero? Does it have a lot of singing/cheesy stuff in it or is it more adult similar to what Zero is like? I'm interested to know as I did enjoy Macross Zero and I would like to watch Plus if it's like Zero. Interesting to read your comments so far and BTW, it's nice to know there are some of you out there that didn't think DYRL was that great. Trust me , Macross Plus is quite mature in its plot and action sequences , it does have a lot of music but it´s taken in a different way than in DYRL? or the TV series. And if you liked Macross Zero just by watching Episode 1 then I reccomend you watch the other 2 cause they simply kick major ass compared to episode 1 (i.e. they get even better) , particlarly Episode 2 features some hints at the main characters past (Roy and Aries , Shin´s parents death , etc...) , Episode 3 has A LOT of awesome action sequences while alos featuring some flshback scenes and yet more AFOS stuff....oh yeah I forgot , thereñre a lot of new mechas in EP.3 as well. Back to M. Plus , there´s definetively no cheesyness in the OVAs or the Movie , I hope you like them. Quote
azrael Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Also, how is Macross Plus compared to DYRL/Zero? Best way to know is to watch it and find out. Quote
Southcross Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Regardless of how many times I watch Mac+ (the OVA), I still go wow. Every time I watch DYRL... I think its "OK" Its all a matter of tastes. I suggest watching Plus and making the decision for yourself Worst case buy the Mac+ movie... If you don't like it, you can just give it to me Quote
treatment Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 too bad you don't like DYRL. you're just one of the very few that don't like it. Quote
mighty gorgon Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Also, how is Macross Plus compared to DYRL/Zero? Does it have a lot of singing/cheesy stuff in it or is it more adult similar to what Zero is like? I'm interested to know as I did enjoy Macross Zero and I would like to watch Plus if it's like Zero. I must confess that I am more of a fan of the VFs that of the storyline, but Mac+ has a great story (singing included), IMHO the best of all (the few) I've seen, included M0... It even made me forget the VFs. Quote
soze Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 (edited) Also, how is Macross Plus compared to DYRL/Zero? Does it have a lot of singing/cheesy stuff in it or is it more adult similar to what Zero is like? I'm interested to know as I did enjoy Macross Zero and I would like to watch Plus if it's like Zero. Interesting to read your comments so far and BTW, it's nice to know there are some of you out there that didn't think DYRL was that great. Macross Plus is my favorite so far.... It's a more recent anime (Mid-Late 1990's i think), so you'll probably like it much better. The flying scenes in there also felt less "1980's generic flight scenes" to me too. As far as the music goes.... I think it's great! I have both of the OST's. It's got orchestral arrangements by Yoko Kanno, a rock song, an A-Capella song, and some techno beat numbers thrown in there too. I strongly suggest you try Macross Plus out. Edited February 2, 2004 by soze Quote
Hurin Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 I made the mistake of showing my wife DYRL before she'd seen the TV show. She hated it, and I can see why. In DYRL, we really see very little of Hikaru's personality (if anything, he seems more like a bumpkin) and not much more of anyone else's, so why should we care about the characters? IMO, DYRL really only works for most people if you go in with all the "baggage" from the series. Then it becomes interesting to watch how they updated the mecha and character visuals and scrambled all the story elements around.Oh, once I started showing her the TV series, she became addicted. By the way, you didn't watch the dub of DYRL, did you? That would be a major impediment, as by all accounts it's one of the worst dubs ever. What he said. In my opinion, you have to have seen the TV series before you can appreciate DYRL. Once you've seen both, it's entirely possible to like DYRL more (some do). But, I don't think many of those people who prefer DYRL to the TV series could have ever gotten to that point without first having seen the TV series. On a subconcious level, you bring all of the more thorough story-development from the TV series to the movie. . . even when you are noticing that the movie cuts a lot out. In other words, you already care about the characters and like them in DYRL because you saw the TV series. Whereas, if you come to DYRL first, there isn't enough character/story development to make you give a rat's #ss about what happens to these strange people on the screen. H Quote
ewilen Posted January 31, 2004 Posted January 31, 2004 Answering a few points/concerns. 1) Music & the TV series. The idea behind the use of music against the Zentradi is better developed in the TV series, as is the "culture shock" idea of Zentradi being discombobulated by seeing the sexes mixing and kissing. The general idea is the same, but it's fleshed out and introduced more gradually. I'd say, if you can stand the original Star Trek with the captain repeatedly teaching alien women about "what is this LO-OVE, Kirk?", it probably works at least as well if not better. 2) Mac+ also has music as an important element, but here it's combined with some more sophisticated scifi concepts reminiscent of Stanislaw Lem (and probably others). To say more would be to spoil the plot. The other major plot elements are, of course, Valkyries (in this case, a fly-off between competing test projects, obviously a nod to the real-life YF-22/YF-23 competition) and a social/psychological drama that reminded me a bit of Hitchcock (Marnie, Psycho, Vertigo, Spellbound). Quote
ComicKaze Posted February 1, 2004 Posted February 1, 2004 (edited) Yeah, DarthTodd, the things you need to know are all in the TV series. These are major plot points that actually make sense if you watch the series. 1) Music, Songs, Kissing, etc. are very important because the Zentradi were genetically created to be unfeeling military giants that fought for the Protoculture. In the series, this is fleshed out by the Zentradi feeling disgusted and being weakened by a reaction in their genetics and some Zentradi defecting to the human side because they are overwhelmed by our culture and the new emotions they are feeling. The problem with DYRL is that they very barely show these things and only the effects. The reason Minmay sings in the climactic battle is to both boost morale and also paralyze the enemy Zentradi fleets. 2) Hikaru does very unmilitary things because he is very young & foolish, only 16. In the TV series, he didn't even want to be in the UN Spacy Navy. The SDF-1 was forced to evacuate Earth and he and Minmay were caught up by accident. He's just a kid in love who was forced to enter the military because of circumstances and he fights with this. There is an episode where he gets his first kill and he's totally frozen and suffering from shock. Minmay is a civilian. Do you know the background and history of why they were in the position they were in at the beginning of DYRL? How the SDF-1 folded and accidentally transported the whole city on the island with them to Pluto and so, had to integrate the city and 50,000 civilians into their ship? In your case, the animation in the Macross TV series will look very dated/cheap as well as the music cheesy so I suggest maybe you watch Macross Plus because I know you'll love it. Very strong adult theme and storyline/mystery/technothriller. Edited February 1, 2004 by ComicKaze Quote
soze Posted February 2, 2004 Posted February 2, 2004 (edited) I thought there was something wrong after the upgrades... but I guess it's ok now.... Well, actually there's still something funky with the posts in this thread... but when I quote... it comes out with the correct previous posts? Edited February 2, 2004 by soze Quote
DARTHTODD Posted February 4, 2004 Author Posted February 4, 2004 Thanks guys, definetely going to check out Macross Plus. Just ordered to other two episodes of Zero also. Can't wait, thanks! Quote
Marso Posted February 4, 2004 Posted February 4, 2004 DYRL rules Where the heck can you find it in the U.S.? I've never seen it for sale anywhere. Quote
mitsuyagi Posted February 4, 2004 Posted February 4, 2004 (edited) You can find it on Ebay, or in The valkyrie exchange.com. Edited February 4, 2004 by mitsuyagi Quote
F-ZeroOne Posted February 4, 2004 Posted February 4, 2004 Darth Todd, a lot of the answers you may be looking for can be found in the original Macross TV series. To tackle just one, the Zentraedi didn't smear the Macross all over the solar system because a) they were intrigued by Earth culture and wanted to study it further [1] and b) it would have made for a bloody short movie. I can understand how you feel - DYRL was made for an audience already familar with the original, and I liked ti a lot more after I became more familar with the TV series. ( something similar happened with me and Gunbuster. When i first saw it, I did not get it at all. Then, some time later, I saw Evangelion, and went back and re-watched Gubuster, which in many ways is kind of a proto-Evangelion, and now I love it. BUSTER BEEAAAMMMMMMMMMMMM!!! ) However, if you still don't like it after that, thats your opinion. The best anime is the one you like the best, after all...! [1] by sending hordes of heavily armed mecha to attack it. They are villians to start with, after all... Quote
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