Batgirl - on HBO Max (CANCELLED)

[Big s]

It didn’t look too impressive from the pictures anyway. Very cosplay kinda look. I guess the audiences at those screenings will be the last to see it for a long while. 

[Seto Kaiba]

I'm only slightly surprised.

WB has been struggling with its DC movie franchise for a while now, and after Marvel ran out an embarrassing flop with Morbius not once but twice, I'm almost wondering if (and indeed hoping) we're seeing the beginning of the end of Hollywood's manic obsession with adapting American superhero comics.

Batman and the extended Bat-family seem to be hard to adapt well. It's not surprising they'd struggle with Batgirl, which looked to be a good deal less grim and brooding than the other Bat-fare on offer lately.  The audience has expectations of such an old legacy property, and that's increasingly an expectation of a rich emo kid punching the mentally ill rather than a colorful film that feels more like an actual comic book.

[mikeszekely]

If WB doesn't have any faith in it I get not putting it in theaters, I guess.  But if the movie was done I don't understand why they wouldn't at least put it on HBO Max.

[azrael]

Some trades report test screenings came out poor. Other say the ballooning budget may not have recouped in theater earnings. Some insiders are saying none of the above. WB's new management want the DC properties to have theatrical releases. No HBO Max-only releases. Straight on theatrical releases.

Regardless, there are likely still more of changes going on and coming down at WB-Discovery, with word changes are coming to HBO Max soon, so this might not be the end of it. I imagine they are looking at the whole slate of WB projects and looking at what to cut their losses on.

edit: There's an earnings call scheduled on Thursday, 8/4/2022. Some big changes will likely be announced, starting with... layoffs.

[Big s]

From my understanding the movie was done filming, but not complete. It sounds as if the test screenings went poorly and the film was already over budget and would need even more to finish and even more if they decided to do reshoots to fix the film, so they decided to cut their losses since after all that there’s still more expenses including marketing and distribution if they decided to do the theater thing

[Bolt]

Tax write off..

[azrael]

2 hours ago, Bolt said:

Tax write off..

'Startin to sound like it..

[sh9000]

I was mainly interested in the movie for Keaton's Batman.  Oh well.  Hope Flashpoint still gets released.

[TangledThorns]

I suspect it was Catwoman bad. Good for WB for finally having standards.

[Big s]

12 minutes ago, TangledThorns said:

I suspect it was Catwoman bad. Good for WB for finally having standards.

I don’t know if necessarily quality standards as much as realizing the potential for extreme financial loss. A lot of big movies aren’t doing as well financially as expected this year at the theaters and then this particular film wasn’t necessarily meant for that. Technically it was supposed to be an hbo max film, but that crazy budget kept ballooning. From what I’ve been reading it was only supposed to cost somewhere around 50 million, then reports are that they were somewhere between 75 and100 million and that still wasn’t covering all the final completion costs. Then tack on another 100 or so million for marketing and distribution if they decided to put it in the theaters. The whole thing sounds like a money pit

[technoblue]

I’m not sure this has anything to do with standards. Like Bolt said, it’s more about a tax write off. Batgirl was over budget and became a prime target for it after the WB/Discovery merger went through.

The new CEO David Zaslav is a curious one with his strategy of cutting things left and right. Rumor has it that none of the scripted shows are off the table and HBO Max itself could get tossed out like the baby with the bathwater.

Edit: The earnings call is tomorrow, so we may get more news and/or clarifications then.

Edited August 3, 2022 by technoblue

[Big s]

2 hours ago, technoblue said:

I’m not sure this has anything to do with standards. Like Bolt said, it’s more about a tax write off. Batgirl was over budget and became a prime target for it after the WB/Discovery merger went through.

The new CEO David Zaslav is a curious one with his strategy of cutting things left and right. Rumor has it that none of the scripted shows are off the table and HBO Max itself could get tossed out like the baby with the bathwater.

Edit: The earnings call is tomorrow, so we may get more news and/or clarifications then.

That’s basically what I’ve been hearing. The HBO max rumors are all over the place right now. They range from a massive reduction of employees like 70% to complete cancellation of service. I haven’t heard anything concrete yet, but maybe tomorrow we’ll get some answers 

[technoblue]

3 hours ago, Big s said:

That’s basically what I’ve been hearing. The HBO max rumors are all over the place right now. They range from a massive reduction of employees like 70% to complete cancellation of service. I haven’t heard anything concrete yet, but maybe tomorrow we’ll get some answers 

Indeed. Although, I am worried about future projects that were in the planning stages, like JMS’s Babylon 5 reboot.

[Big s]

2 hours ago, technoblue said:

Indeed. Although, I am worried about future projects that were in the planning stages, like JMS’s Babylon 5 reboot.

As much as I liked B5 , I have a bad feeling that’s probably one of the ones on the chopping block.

[TangledThorns]

10 hours ago, Big s said:

That’s basically what I’ve been hearing. The HBO max rumors are all over the place right now. They range from a massive reduction of employees like 70% to complete cancellation of service. I haven’t heard anything concrete yet, but maybe tomorrow we’ll get some answers 

That would be insane if HBO Max shut down. I'd expect Paramount or Peacock to shut down first IMHO. That being said it looks like WB/HBO is learning from Netflix's mistakes and choosing quality over quantity, especially with their movies. Most likely using THE BATMAN as a new benchmark for any new DC films expected to be made too.

[Big s]

2 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

That would be insane if HBO Max shut down. I'd expect Paramount or Peacock to shut down first IMHO. That being said it looks like WB/HBO is learning from Netflix's mistakes and choosing quality over quantity, especially with their movies. Most likely using THE BATMAN as a new benchmark for any new DC films expected to be made too.

I personally have a feeling that they’re just trimming the fat here and those massive layoffs are probably just parts of wb that are producing nothing anyone was really watching similar to the Netflix trim that happened a few months back. The rumors however are going pretty extreme though and it would be wild to lose HBO max altogether, but I guess anything is possible these days. Parts of the extreme side of the rumor mill says they’ll make money back by selling their shows and movies to one of the other big names like Netflix to make a profit.
And yeah definitely surprised this isn’t a thing for Paramount, with such a lack of subscriptions and overall popularity. I still know people that didn’t even know the service existed 

[M'Kyuun]

I'm only just catching up w/ all the Batgirl hoopla, mostly thanks to its trending on Twitter. I never really had any expectations built up for this, so I'm a bit neutral about its being shelved. However, if they decided to do a Batgirl tv series, I'd love to see them cast Sadie Sink from Stanger Things as the eponymous heroine. The girl has chops, and bonus, she's a natural red head, perfect for a young Barbara Gordan learning the ropes as a burgeoning crimefighter. Hire Dina Meyer, who played Barbara Gordon in 2002's Bird's of Prey to play her mom, and with whom she shares a believable likeness, unlike so many other odd parent-child castings. Cast an 18 year-old Dick Grayson and a Batman in his thirties as mentors and friends. With good writing and prod values. I think it'd make for a good show.

[Roy Focker]

Maybe they're going to use the budget that going to be spent on Batgirl's post production towards replacing Ezra Miller in that Flash movie.

[Black Valkyrie]

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZbQRNo4Wuc

 

[azrael]

Looking at it from a financial perspective (which will be the justification), if Batgirl's perspective viewing numbers would be no better than if it was in theaters, is it worth it? We'll probably be seeing the extreme form of Netflix's culling. HBO Max is going away. Discovery+ will probably be cut and both become tabs on whatever new service is combining the 2 services.

2 hours ago, Big s said:

 Parts of the extreme side of the rumor mill says they’ll make money back by selling their shows and movies to one of the other big names like Netflix to make a profit.

And we know how much trouble that is down the road (ala Marvel), but to recoup whatever debt Discovery inherited from AT&T from buying WB on top of the $43B spent buying WB, I wouldn't rule out anything. 

[Big s]

I feel bad for Michael Keaton. He finally gets filmed as Batman again and we may never get to see it. The batgirl thing is definitely canceled and the flash thing is sounding like it’s gonna end up the same. 
too bad they can’t just get Tim Burton and do a real sequel to his two movies, but I kinda doubt that zaslav wants to try an experiment like that.

[Thom]

And, of course, the Supergirl movie may be tanked also, esp if the Flash is cancelled. 

Edited August 4, 2022 by Thom

[Big s]

1 hour ago, Thom said:

And, of course, the Supergirl movie may be tanked also, esp if the Flash is cancelled. 

Yeah, the rumors even on the less extreme side have said supergirl is already past tense. The Flash is sounding more up in the air. I guess the big boss doesn’t want replacement heroes, but the biggest name superheroes to be the focus like Superman, Batman and Wonderwoman instead of sidelining them. Not sure if that means a reboot or if that means to put the focus back to the bigger justice league heroes.

I’m really curious where The Batman or the Joker end up fitting in. Like could a reboot start with the Batman or will it just be dumped as a one off movie now. 

[Thom]

And I'm getting tired of Superman and Batman all the time. Yet another reboot. Yet another sequel. Yet another actor... Yes, I'll go and watch if they look good and I'll be excited for it, but I want something/someone else too. Cinematic Marvel has such a breadth of characters and there is room for all of them to shine, but DC wants just three? And after almost every movie post Man of Steel has been mild to mediocre..? (Not looking at you Wonder Woman or Aquaman!) You'd thing they'd want to continue to build their stable up rather than paring it down.

To me, that is just short-sighted gains at the expense of long-term goals. Which seems to be the same playbook that got them Justice League.

[Big s]

25 minutes ago, Thom said:

And I'm getting tired of Superman and Batman all the time. Yet another reboot. Yet another sequel. Yet another actor... Yes, I'll go and watch if they look good and I'll be excited for it, but I want something/someone else too. Cinematic Marvel has such a breadth of characters and there is room for all of them to shine, but DC wants just three? And after almost every movie post Man of Steel has been mild to mediocre..? (Not looking at you Wonder Woman or Aquaman!) You'd thing they'd want to continue to build their stable up rather than paring it down.

To me, that is just short-sighted gains at the expense of long-term goals. Which seems to be the same playbook that got them Justice League.

I’d like a good Superman movie. He’s only been in crappy ones lately and his solo thing was a let down. If he gets a reboot, I’d be happy if it actually gives him a good film for once. As far as Batman, the last film was good and I don’t know about just ditching him. I guess we’ll find out something soon as to the future of dc films

[mechaninac]

 

[TangledThorns]

WB also needs to cast mentally stable actors for their hero roles too. Some DC actors have a history with substance abuse and the law; namely Afflek and Ezra Miller.

[Thom]

Some things you can't see until fame knocks some cracks into a person's facade.

 

[Big s]

2 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

WB also needs to cast mentally stable actors for their hero roles too. Some DC actors have a history with substance abuse and the law; namely Afflek and Ezra Miller.

I don’t think anyone knew the issues with Ezra at the time he was hired. It seems he’s had problems for quite a while, but things didn’t come forward til recently. And there are some that have had major problems in the past, but overcame them like RDJ. Honestly there’s so many actors and comedians that get hired to do movies and the majority do drugs ranging from the semi legal to the overly prescribed to the hardcore stuff.
Amber Turd had people backing her to get aquaman like her ex hubby. These projects happen and sometimes you just don’t know where the big drama is coming from until there’s big drama. Marvel/Disney tends to be super strict with actors behaviors to try and wrangle them in and keep them somewhat in line, whereas the WB offered a bit more freedom, but I don’t know if that would’ve changed the outcome of the Ezra flash mess

[pengbuzz]

On 8/4/2022 at 6:58 PM, Thom said:

And I'm getting tired of Superman and Batman all the time. Yet another reboot. Yet another sequel. Yet another actor... Yes, I'll go and watch if they look good and I'll be excited for it, but I want something/someone else too. Cinematic Marvel has such a breadth of characters and there is room for all of them to shine, but DC wants just three? And after almost every movie post Man of Steel has been mild to mediocre..? (Not looking at you Wonder Woman or Aquaman!) You'd thing they'd want to continue to build their stable up rather than paring it down.

To me, that is just short-sighted gains at the expense of long-term goals. Which seems to be the same playbook that got them Justice League.

I'd like to see them do a decent film on others as well: Green Lantern was such a fail that Deadpool even lampooned it! I'd love to see them do one on Deathstroke the Terminator, or even some of the not-so-well-known ones like Booster Gold or Orion.

[Big s]

2 hours ago, pengbuzz said:

I'd like to see them do a decent film on others as well: Green Lantern was such a fail that Deadpool even lampooned it! I'd love to see them do one on Deathstroke the Terminator, or even some of the not-so-well-known ones like Booster Gold or Orion.

I wouldn’t mind a good Green Lantern movie.

[Thom]

5 hours ago, pengbuzz said:

I'd like to see them do a decent film on others as well: Green Lantern was such a fail that Deadpool even lampooned it! I'd love to see them do one on Deathstroke the Terminator, or even some of the not-so-well-known ones like Booster Gold or Orion.

It would need Ryan Reynolds doing a cameo while reading a Deadpool comic. In high heel boots.

[Convectuoso]

[Big s]

2 hours ago, Convectuoso said:

Supposedly they were just gonna kill him off anyway from what the rumors are saying of those at the screenings.