mechaninac Posted August 16, 2005 Posted August 16, 2005 ...That franchise was Star Trek, and look how well that turned out. 320734[/snapback] That turned out so bad that it lasted 18 uninterrupted years on TV in various incarnations and in 10 theatrical movies...no sir, not successful at all. (j/k) Sorry, just couldn't resist. You are right, Star Trek's unrealistically utopian view of the future always rubbed me the wrong way. I much rather watch a show that shows humanity with all of its best and worst aspects, and BSG delivers this in spades...granted, they do go a little overboard sometimes with some of the irrational choices some of the characters make, but overall, the show is so well written that I can forgive it some minor flaws.
kalvasflam Posted August 16, 2005 Posted August 16, 2005 The BSG premise is actually a great one. It's an open ended story for survival. Given their numbers, it's actually pretty interesting to see people more or less always on the ropes. You get a good sense of despair all the time, and it's really nice to see hope getting raised (Cyclon basestar going kaboom) to everything going to hell (Adama getting shot) in the span of a few minutes. Then watching the character reactions. It's quite different from how JMS set up Babylon 5 as a story arc. But in both cases, you get a sense that it's an epic story that is being told. One is a little more open ended than the other. This is a long way from the various star trek incranations which became stale after a while. On a personal note, I still wish Starbuck was a man. The thought of Apollo and Zack sleeping with Starbuck was bad enough, the having her shacking up with Baltar too... yikes. Cause however you looked at it, the old Starbuck was generally an optimistic type even in the worst situations, this one is just plain dark most of the time.
EXO Posted August 16, 2005 Posted August 16, 2005 Some people seem to be getting far too preoccupied with the story and characters not unfolding the way that they'd personally like to see it happen. So what if Adama isn't running the fleet the way that you'd have done it? Did it ever occur to you that these issues beween the characters and the problems that their actions create are intentional on the part of the writers? Conflict is drama, and the "perfect" scenarios that some of you are coming up with make for boring television. We used to have a franchise where everything was orderly, and all the characters were perfect, enlightened people, and everything got done by the book and wrapped up neatly. That franchise was Star Trek, and look how well that turned out. 320734[/snapback] Well said... That's exactly what I was thinking... people want the show to go their way so much that they forget that it's a story that being told to them not a history lesson with facts already laid. As much as people hate Roslyn, there are people in history who were respected but had unpopular beliefs and choices. Why are people analyzing how stupid it is that 1/3 of the fleet left? That's the point, supplies and and support were heavily sacrifice by doing so and it creates conflict.
Knight26 Posted August 16, 2005 Posted August 16, 2005 It's never shown or stated that Starbuck hooked up with Apollo. It is that she was engaged to Zack, and yes she did get smashed at the Colonial day party and end up in the sack with Baltar, but I think that may have been the booze, lol. There is obviously some tension there between her and Apollo as well, perhaps she has something of a thing for him, maybe out of guilt for what happened to his brother, or perhaps they are genuine feelings, but she does not act on them out of guilt. That is probably something that will be explored later, maybe if/when they get the resistance fighters on Caprica back to the fleet.
EXO Posted August 16, 2005 Posted August 16, 2005 It's never shown or stated that Starbuck hooked up with Apollo. It is that she was engaged to Zack, and yes she did get smashed at the Colonial day party and end up in the sack with Baltar, but I think that may have been the booze, lol. There is obviously some tension there between her and Apollo as well, perhaps she has something of a thing for him, maybe out of guilt for what happened to his brother, or perhaps they are genuine feelings, but she does not act on them out of guilt. That is probably something that will be explored later, maybe if/when they get the resistance fighters on Caprica back to the fleet. 320821[/snapback] Isn't there a rule that they can't hook up? Like the Chief and Boomer?
Knight26 Posted August 16, 2005 Posted August 16, 2005 Yeah it would be considered fratrinization since he is her superior officer, and her commanding officer, big no no there, same reason why colonel O'Neil never got to nail Carter on SG-1.
justvinnie Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 I don't get it... the whole point of sending someone there was to check if there were cylons around so they cna take a chance and go to Kobol. The fact that the cylons were there when they returned proves the fact that they were making sweeps. The 3 raptors were suprised because the intelligence changed quickly. I would think that the fact the unexpected thing happen would make it more believable. 320583[/snapback] My point is that the tactics displayed aren't logical in keeping with the tech level. FTL means that the Cylons can show up any moment. If there is not standing intelligence that the area is clear then it can't be assumed to be clear because a scout report from several hours ago said it was clear. It's been shown that the Raptors are capable of making continuous jumps. The fact that they were not prepared to jump back immediately is lack of logical tactics. Being surpised is one thing, being caught unprepared is unforgivable. Another thing that really bothers me is that the reason the ammunitions depot in Ragnar was there was because it is known that the radiation affects cylon technology. Considering that Adama is aware of human form cylons, why didn't he just hang out in the nebulae for a bit to flush out all the infiltrators. Such nebulae aren't exactly difficult to find either. They tend to be large after all and broadcast distinct powerdul radiation signatures that surely the BSG can detect. vinnie
Gaijin Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 (edited) I don't get it... the whole point of sending someone there was to check if there were cylons around so they cna take a chance and go to Kobol. The fact that the cylons were there when they returned proves the fact that they were making sweeps. The 3 raptors were suprised because the intelligence changed quickly. I would think that the fact the unexpected thing happen would make it more believable. 320583[/snapback] My point is that the tactics displayed aren't logical in keeping with the tech level. FTL means that the Cylons can show up any moment. If there is not standing intelligence that the area is clear then it can't be assumed to be clear because a scout report from several hours ago said it was clear. It's been shown that the Raptors are capable of making continuous jumps. The fact that they were not prepared to jump back immediately is lack of logical tactics. Being surpised is one thing, being caught unprepared is unforgivable. Another thing that really bothers me is that the reason the ammunitions depot in Ragnar was there was because it is known that the radiation affects cylon technology. Considering that Adama is aware of human form cylons, why didn't he just hang out in the nebulae for a bit to flush out all the infiltrators. Such nebulae aren't exactly difficult to find either. They tend to be large after all and broadcast distinct powerdul radiation signatures that surely the BSG can detect. vinnie 320981[/snapback] You just missed the entire point of the show. But you don't care for it anyways, so...why watch and analyze? The Ragnar thing...they would have gotten clobbered by the Basestars and Raiders that were searching for them. It wouldn't take long for them to be destroyed there. Edited August 17, 2005 by Gaijin
justvinnie Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 the basic idea of good sci fi, that the stories are about characters and their conflicts and questions issues of the human condition. Agreed, but applies to all stories. Mindless violence and extreme sex gets old fast, at least to watch. I just don't think BSG is all that. Nice premise and nice mood and atmosphere, failure in dynamics both character and event. At least for me. You just missed the entire point of the show. But you don't care for it anyways, so...why watch and analyze? The Ragnar thing...they would have gotten clobbered by the Basestars and Raiders that were searching for them. It wouldn't take long for them to be destroyed there. 321034[/snapback] Eh, if you think so. I'm confident there's very little about the show that I can't debate on. And you missed my point that it's not exactly that hard to find such a nebula. I understand why people like this show. I had the marathon over the weekend because everyone had high praise for it, including my new gf (the real reason why I watched it). Figured I'd see what the fuss was about. To tell you the truth, I don't really care to see what the next episode is, but she probably will, which means I probably will too. I don't hate the show, just not impressed with it. And it's in my nature to analyze everthing. Can't feel one way or another if you don't really know why. Actually tried to rewatch yesterday. Never know if opinions change once you are aware of where things are headed. It was painful, found myself forwarding a lot (oddly enough to scenes of Adama Sr and the CIC). At least we agree that Firefly is good. Still pop in an episode every now and then. vinnie PS: Anyone listen to Vienna Teng? This is cool.
EXO Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 My point is that the tactics displayed aren't logical in keeping with the tech level. FTL means that the Cylons can show up any moment. If there is not standing intelligence that the area is clear then it can't be assumed to be clear because a scout report from several hours ago said it was clear. It's been shown that the Raptors are capable of making continuous jumps. The fact that they were not prepared to jump back immediately is lack of logical tactics. Being surpised is one thing, being caught unprepared is unforgivable. 320981[/snapback] How fast did you want them to jump back? As soon as they detected the cylons one of them got hit. And then it was just seconds before the next one got hit and they were unable to jump from the hit. The third one was able to jump back but only after they were ordered to. Give or take a couple of seconds to edit in some lines for some drama, I'd say it all happened pretty fast. Another thing that really bothers me is that the reason the ammunitions depot in Ragnar was there was because it is known that the radiation affects cylon technology. Considering that Adama is aware of human form cylons, why didn't he just hang out in the nebulae for a bit to flush out all the infiltrators. Such nebulae aren't exactly difficult to find either. They tend to be large after all and broadcast distinct powerdul radiation signatures that surely the BSG can detect.vinnie 320981[/snapback] How long would you say it would take before the Cylons starved them out for hanging out in the nebulae? 20 or 40 years? At the time Adama decided to go to the depot, they were there to arm themselves and fight, but it was obvious that they had to run. Time was a commodity they couldn't lose. It's the whole point of the series... they were on the run from a relentless enemy. I think your idea of a series would be completely boring if you had your way. Let's see how long a series about a group of ships that goes nowhere to avoid fighting would last. Also the last time you looked for a nebula with specific conditions what planet did you jump from? I'm not saying there aren't plot holes but I think you're forcing yourself to hate the show more than you have to.
GreenGuy42 Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 There's also that little thing of Adama possibly being a Cylon. After his conversation with the Chief and reaction to Boomer in the morgue (reminded me of her reaction to the Raider, really) it wouldn't come as a surprise at all that he's another double agent.
Duke Togo Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 There's also that little thing of Adama possibly being a Cylon. After his conversation with the Chief and reaction to Boomer in the morgue (reminded me of her reaction to the Raider, really) it wouldn't come as a surprise at all that he's another double agent. 321067[/snapback] Except he has a child. Well, he HAD two.
bsu legato Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 I doubt we'll see any more major characters revealed as Cylons. It worked with Boomer, but if they keep going back to the well with that 'surprise' it'll lose its impact. Now the supporting cast is still fair game, but I think most of them are pretty safe. Even Tigh's wife will likely be human. A selfish, manipulative bitch of a human, but human nonetheless.
Seven Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 Is it possible that Adama was replaced when he was stuck on Ragnar Station? This is also the thought that crosses my mind with Boomer is that after she shot Adama and was revealed to be a Cylon, no one ever came to a conclusion that she was replaced when she got out of the Raptor on the Basestar. Everyone immediately jumped to the conclusion that she had always been a Cylon. Any thoughts on this?
EXO Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 (edited) Is it possible that Adama was replaced when he was stuck on Ragnar Station? This is also the thought that crosses my mind with Boomer is that after she shot Adama and was revealed to be a Cylon, no one ever came to a conclusion that she was replaced when she got out of the Raptor on the Basestar. Everyone immediately jumped to the conclusion that she had always been a Cylon.Any thoughts on this? 321104[/snapback] In the miniseries Adama got a transmission that there are only 12 models of Cylons... why they can't make anymore? I dunno. (now THAT'S a plot hole...) Should Adama take that seriously? Not sure either. But it sets up the precedent that the models are already set and each one looks a certain way, meaning they can't copy a person in an instant and exchange them with a fake. There's also the fact that they try to talk about their childhoods when accused of being a Cylon. So that means that they can't grow old or start out as a child, I'm assuming. Edited August 17, 2005 by >EXO<
Skippy438 Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 I think the next big main character/cylon plot point will be when a Cylon confronts Starbuck and calls her mother, since it looks like the Cylons stole some of her eggs. It was nice to actually see another Cylon model (that makes 5 now?)
bsu legato Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 So far there is ZERO precedent for any humans to have been replaced by a Cylon. Instead, what we've are more like Cylon sleeper agents. In Boomer's case, she wasn't even aware that she was a Cylon.
kalvasflam Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 In the miniseries Adama got a transmission that there are only 12 models of Cylons... why they can't make anymore? 321110[/snapback] Who was it that sent the message though? It was never very clear, Baltar knew I think since Six told him, that's one possibility, the other was Boomer was the one who made the transmission. Not at all obvious, don't think they ever put that up. I don't think Adama told anyone else either did he? It was unconfirmed information from unknown source.
CoryHolmes Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 same reason why colonel O'Neil never got to nail Carter on SG-1. 320836[/snapback] *snort* Didn't stop the writers from trying to cram that pairing down our throats, sideways.
Gaijin Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 In the miniseries Adama got a transmission that there are only 12 models of Cylons... why they can't make anymore? 321110[/snapback] Who was it that sent the message though? It was never very clear, Baltar knew I think since Six told him, that's one possibility, the other was Boomer was the one who made the transmission. Not at all obvious, don't think they ever put that up. I don't think Adama told anyone else either did he? It was unconfirmed information from unknown source. 321126[/snapback] It was never made clear who left that note.
Major Johnathan Posted August 17, 2005 Posted August 17, 2005 Even Tigh's wife will likely be human. A selfish, manipulative bitch of a human, but human nonetheless. 321073[/snapback] Just to be safe, Adama should throw her out the nearest airlock. What are friends for?
Gaijin Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 This next ep is a 2 parter and we'll see the "end" of the arcs from last season (well, some supposedly).
Dobber Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 (edited) Maybe the Cylons "God" created the human form cylons, but then they decided to kill him or her, in order to make themselves greater or more godlike, like what they did to the colonies, before he/she could create many more copies thinking they were perfect and alive...ie....able to procreate. Chris Edited August 18, 2005 by Dobber
GRAND CANNON Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 PS: Anyone listen to Vienna Teng? This is cool.321044[/snapback] 'Scuse the OT interruption, but this is great stuff. Haven't seen the movie yet, but plan on seeing her at a show in October. Thanks for the vid. ** You may now return to your regularly scheduled thread.**
Zor Primus Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Any word if there is any truth behind a Pegasus episode? I heard it might be for episode 9 or something. Female skipper too...
cobywan Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Any word if there is any truth behind a Pegasus episode? I heard it might be for episode 9 or something. Female skipper too... 321296[/snapback] It's absolutely true. And it's episode 10.
Dobber Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 If you want to know who Cain is then read on..... Michelle Forbes (aka. Ensign Ro Larin from ST TNG) I'm pretty sure it's been posted already, but just in case I gave the warning. Chris
Dobber Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Cobywan is correct episode 10....which really sucks becasuse that'll be the last episode until january 06!!!! Damn Cliffhangers!!!!! The follow-up episode in Jan. is titled "The Ressurection Ship" I haven't heard much about it but I've read VERY interesting theories based on the title. If you would like to hear read on, again NO ACTUAL spoilers, just speculation.............. Again this is all speculation with NO confirmed spoilers but some have speculated that the Ressurection Ship is a ship that is carrying Human form Cylons. Starbuck may have been correct when she was interogating Leobin when she said that they are too far away to transmit back into new bodies.So the Res. Ship would enable them to transmit into a new body after they die. If the Colonials could take out that ship, it might make the Cylons chasing them think twice since they really could DIE. Pretty cool theory I thought. Chris
azrael Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 (edited) Lucy Lawless will guest star in an episode airing Sept. 9th. http://www.cinescape.com/0/editorial.asp?a...55&obj_id=49442 Spoiler (Highlight to read) Lawless guest-stars in "Final Cut", where she will play a reporter who gets unlimited access to film aboard Galactica and documents the stress of military life during wartime. The marines, led by Lt. Palladino, get widely criticized when his crew opens fire on civilian protesters, killing four and wounding 12. Then there's a death threat against Col. Tigh. Meanwhile, President Roslin and Cmdr. Adama offer Fleet News Service full access to the pilots and crew. Along the way, the reporter uncovers some major secrets and faces an ethical dilemma. She may be a recurring character...who knows. Edited August 18, 2005 by azrael
EXO Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Michelle Forbes and Lucy Lawless... Amazon women from Space! Awesome!
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 A great episode tonight. I really wanna see whats gonna happen next week. A consistently good show, and I hope Lee and his dad work it out and get him back in a Viper soon.....
GRAND CANNON Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 Sure was a great ep. Here's a little "love triangle" that's going to be interesting when the fleet joins up: Doubt it's a spoiler, but ya never know...so go ahead and highlight.... Helo ..."I love Sharon. She's carrying our baby."Boomer..."I love Helo. I'm carrying our baby." Chief ...
Major Johnathan Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 (edited) I don't know, I knew they'd have Adama go to the rescue of the renegade fleet, but I didn't like how Apollo's replacement was an incompetant fool. Ya can't tell me without Apollo, the rest of the pilots suck beyond belief. I'm sure as soon as Apollo returns, they'll turn in to battle hardened aces again. The whole fleet has exactly two competent pilots, the rest are dumb asses. BUT the two decent pilots turn out to be Hawkeye and Trapper John, always getting in to wacky trouble, but the CO can't throw 'em in the brig because they need to operate/pilot Vipers. One thing thats starting to confuse me, why do the Cylons need human females to breed when Boomer got herself knocked up just fine? P.S. I just had a thought, but they've already blown it, it would have been more believable if when Apollo and Starbuck come back, they get demoted. Let there be a competent squadron leader that they have to follow. They could have introduced or developed a whole new character for that purpose. But now we're stuck with, as I say, Hawkeye and Trapper. See, Tigh plays Frank Burns, always by the book and telling on our heroes and Adama is the hapless Col. Henry Blake. ? Edited August 20, 2005 by Major Johnathan
Duke Togo Posted August 20, 2005 Posted August 20, 2005 I don't know, I knew they'd have Adama go to the rescue of the renegade fleet, but I didn't like how Apollo's replacement was an incompetant fool. Ya can't tell me without Apollo, the rest of the pilots suck beyond belief. I'm sure as soon as Apollo returns, they'll turn in to battle hardened aces again. The whole fleet has exactly two competent pilots, the rest are dumb asses. BUT the two decent pilots turn out to be Hawkeye and Trapper John, always getting in to wacky trouble, but the CO can't throw 'em in the brig because they need to operate/pilot Vipers. One thing thats starting to confuse me, why do the Cylons need human females to breed when Boomer got herself knocked up just fine? 321682[/snapback] Yeah, I pretty much agree. Like most of season two, when it hits it hits hard, but there have been a few too many misses. The lack of consistancy doesn't keep the show from being great, but it could be even better. Was it ever established how Baltar sees Six, and I just missed it? I can't help think that's she's a figment of his imagination, and that he may just be completely out of his mind at this point. And I still think they are wasting his character. Put him in charge of a Basestar or something. Where's Lucifer, damnit? I need some "By your command" goodness. Ah, but the Pegasus is coming... all will be forgiven then.
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