Bandai VF-31AX Kairos Plus - Hayate Type

[no3Ljm]

18 minutes ago, kajnrig said:

1) Is the extra arm armor based at all on the Armored Pack? I saw in the video a couple pages back that the Armored Pack's arm gatling guns include a similar armor panel that fits onto the regular 31J/C/etc. arm.

Yes, it is based on the previous TV Armored Pack. As a naked Valk, it help makes the arm looks beefier this time around.

18 minutes ago, kajnrig said:

2) That being the case, can the extra armor be removed here to reveal a regular 31 arm beneath?

I'm not sure if the arm armor is connected thru a hinge with metal pin. If not, you can probably pull it out from the hinge. (Not advisable if you're not sure if it's going to break.) However, if you're going to transform it back to Fighter mode, then you will have an expose arm joints. Since it's on the hinge, see if you can fold it more towards the arm so you can expose more of the thin arms.

18 minutes ago, kajnrig said:

3) From this video (timestamped), it seems the extra arm armor slides up the forearm toward the elbow for fighter mode, and down toward the wrist for battroid/Gerwalk mode (probably frees up space for the elbow joints to move). Does it being in the lower position inhibit the ability to stow it away in fighter mode?

I would say yes. Because by pulling it upward, it exposes the wrist joints to help maneuver the hands folding it back to the wing.

18 minutes ago, kajnrig said:

4) The bicep portion of the arm armor, does it ever change orientation relative to the bicep, or is it always in line with the elbow bend? If the latter, could it reasonably be attached permanently to the bicep, and its own "elbow" joint removed? Would this interfere with transformation in any way?

 

I think it's obvious what I want to do with this information, if possible:

- permanently affix the bicep armor to the bicep

- remove the extra elbow joint

- have the forearm armor permanently in the "down" position

I think the answer to this, if you try to have it fix to the elbow is that those panels that covers the arm area will not line up properly not to mention exposed joints in Fighter mode is going to be obvious. But if those things will not bother you, then I think you can have it affix to the bicep with some modification. As for the forearm armor, you can't permanently put it in the 'down' position due to the wrist joints pertaining to Question #3.

 

[last_raven]

3 hours ago, Mommar said:

I figured out how to get the left side gun to sit nearly flush but I can't get the right side to work at all.  The stiffness/placement of the double elbows under the fold-able panel seems to be a key part of how to get the cannon to sit flush.  This is 262 levels of engineering stupid.

We'll thank the Windermerean engineering borrowed for the AX then, I guess? /s

Though the Sv 262 did always give me Syd Mead vibes not sure I could risk having the DX release, maybe the Mirage kit though.

2 hours ago, Chronocidal said:

Don't blame you, it's not even illustrated in the instructions.  This is why I am so confused as to why the parts even move to begin with.

The two sides of the arm not attached to the folding arm shield are not directly attached to the arm itself, they're on sliders.  There's really no good way to grip it, but if you push the outside of the arm toward the elbow, it helps the guns sit level in fighter.

Photos will probably help.  I might have missed something in the instructions, but couldn't read them anyhow.  

The part with the blue paint slides.  It actually moves farther than I thought, making a weird quarter-cuff around the wrist in the full extension, and moving back behind it in the opposite direction.

Here's a different angle, showing the blue section pushed back toward the elbow.  The bit outlined in pink is part of the wrist that should be sticking out past the blue slightly to make sure the gun has enough clearance to lay flat against the arm.

It's entirely possible I missed this as a step in the instructions, but I didn't see anything calling out sliding those panels in either direction.

  

This is exactly what's happening in the pics above, but like I said, I didn't see it in the instructions at all, and those pieces are a royal pain in the arse to actually move, because there is nothing to grip them by (and I think mine may have even been glued down by a sloppy assembly).

If those armor bits aren't slid as far toward the elbow as possible, they inhibit the gun from rotating enough to lay flat on the underside.

 

I've actually seen a few Japanese toy reviewers discuss this as making a bit but not a total difference with the guns but maybe they didn't fully commit to the slide as you said. Did this help with the arm gap near the inner wing edge at all? That's honestly my biggest gripe visually (and structurally) with this release. I like the chonkier arms for battroid mode a lot but I hate how they mess with the fighter mode. 

[Chronocidal]

42 minutes ago, last_raven said:

I've actually seen a few Japanese toy reviewers discuss this as making a bit but not a total difference with the guns but maybe they didn't fully commit to the slide as you said. Did this help with the arm gap near the inner wing edge at all? That's honestly my biggest gripe visually (and structurally) with this release. I like the chonkier arms for battroid mode a lot but I hate how they mess with the fighter mode. 

Think I would need to see that gap highlighted in a photo to know exactly where it is, because there are a few levels of "gap" in the way the guns mount.

I don't think it has much of an effect on anything besides the gun pivots, since those arm panels are right up against it when it folds down, and not having the arm slid all the way up will force the gun barrels down away from the arms.

[no3Ljm]

So I decided opening my Hayate VF-31AX late last night after work due to @kajnrig's inquiry regarding the arm armor parts. After seeing the bottom portion of the Fighter, I am acknowledging everyone's feedback regarding the gaps underneath. Sad to say, they were all true. Mine came with those wing tabs not inserted to the legs. And I can see it that it's thicker like how @DeathByAzns pointed out from the previous page. This release is far inferior from the VF-31.

For its origami-panel designs of the arm and its armors, I'm wondering how they're going to fare on the YF-21 in case that one goes into production?

 

Edited January 12, 2022 by no3Ljm

[Chronocidal]

Yeah, I shudder at the thought of how Bandai's engineers would tackle that mess of panels.  

I will make one positive point for the new design of the arm though.  Because of how they reworked the shoulder rotation hinge, it no longer has to pass over that lip from the backplate, so at least they removed one of the old sources of paint wear.

Not that it fixed any of the other rubbing spots (or prevented my copy from coming out of the box with a bunch of worn spots on other parts of the arms), but it did fix that particular problem.

I think the wing/leg tabs are just the most baffling thing though.  You can see where they added some sort of lip on the inside of the holes on the legs, as if they're meant to grip the tabs with a snap, but coming out of the box, the tabs were just far too big to even enter those slots.  Someone just made a massive tolerancing error on those tabs, and even removing the sloppy molding seams on them wasn't enough to fix them, I had to file them down pretty significantly on all sides before they would slot into place.

[MacrossJunkie]

I finally got mine delivered yesterday. I like the look of it, but I have some issues with it from my brief time messing with it. I'm not sure if this is just a problem with my copy or if the first four I list below are more widespread. I haven't really had a lot of time to keep up to date with things. 

First issue:  The part of the wings that peg into the legs in fighter mode don't really fit in the holes in the leg. Either the pegs are too large or the spacing is not wide enough. It might require some modification to fix. 

2nd issue: the peg near the front of the gunpod doesn't go in properly because it seems the gunpod is a little short. I have to extend out the tip some in order for it to fit in properly.

3rd issue: a relatively minor gripe but it bothers me... the forearm cover leaves a large gap between it and the wing and no amount of massaging or repositioning the arms seems to fix that.

4th and most annoying: The friggin' fold up gray clips that keep the top half locked down in battroid mode are extremely weak and don't keep it in place. Any amount of movement makes the top half slip out of the clips. This was never an issue with any of the previous 31's I have. I basically have to keep it in fighter or gerwalk mode because battroid is hopeless as it is right now.

5th: I hate the gunpod design in terms of practicality for the toy. There's just no way for the poseable hands to hold it and I'm forced to swap to the fixed pose hands to hold it. That thick bar where the grip hinge is just gets in the way of everything and it has to be held at an odd angle. Also, it's heavy and, at least for my copy, it causes the arm to sag down from the weight. It can't hold it up at all.

 

Edit: Just read some of the previous comments and it seems some of my issues are not just issues for me.

Edited January 12, 2022 by MacrossJunkie

[Mommar]

27 minutes ago, MacrossJunkie said:

I finally got mine delivered yesterday. I like the look of it, but I have some issues with it from my brief time messing with it. I'm not sure if this is just a problem with my copy or if the first four I list below are more widespread. I haven't really had a lot of time to keep up to date with things. 

First issue:  The part of the wings that peg into the legs in fighter mode don't really fit in the holes in the leg. Either the pegs are too large or the spacing is not wide enough. It might require some modification to fix. 

2nd issue: the peg near the front of the gunpod doesn't go in properly because it seems the gunpod is a little short. I have to extend out the tip some in order for it to fit in properly.

3rd issue: a relatively minor gripe but it bothers me... the forearm cover leaves a large gap between it and the wing and no amount of massaging or repositioning the arms seems to fix that.

4th and most annoying: The friggin' fold up gray clips that keep the top half locked down in battroid mode are extremely weak and don't keep it in place. Any amount of movement makes the top half slip out of the clips. This was never an issue with any of the previous 31's I have. I basically have to keep it in fighter or gerwalk mode because battroid is hopeless as it is right now.

5th: I hate the gunpod design in terms of practicality for the toy. There's just no way for the poseable hands to hold it and I'm forced to swap to the fixed pose hands to hold it. That thick bar where the grip hinge is just gets in the way of everything and it has to be held at an odd angle. Also, it's heavy and, at least for my copy, it causes the arm to sag down from the weight. It can't hold it up at all.

 

Edit: Just read some of the previous comments and it seems some of my issues are not just issues for me.

You listed everything we’ve been talking about.

[Chronocidal]

Yeah, definitely not isolated issues.  I haven't tried battroid at all yet, so I can't verify the clips failing, but have to agree that the 31 series as a whole has the worst gunpod design to date, both because the handle is a flimsy piece of junk, and because it requires those idiotic pointing hands.  The 31AX makes the whole issue worse by making the gunpod friggen huge.  

I didn't notice the gunpod tab issue not pegging into the belly without extending, but I did notice it tends to pop out of the slot very easily.  The two might be the same thing.

The tolerances team was out to lunch on this release.

[MacrossJunkie]

Well, that's just disappointing to hear. Prior to the 31AX, the 31 series was, for the most part, pretty solid in terms of QC and such. They really dropped the ball on this one. Spent the money on that useless Walkure stand instead of paying the QC people.

[sqidd]

Mine are junky too.

[Angesdad]

All of sudden I don't feel as bad not jumping on the bandwagon..But it looks cool! 

Edited January 12, 2022 by Angesdad

[Chronocidal]

I can't argue the looks aren't good, but it's just really weird how many things went wrong.

I'm not sure I can call them QC issues even, since for the most part everything is beautiful.  These feel more like design and engineering flaws, because certain things just don't work.  Quality control should have absolutely caught them, but it's like they completely bypassed the prototype stage for such issues to exist in the final product.

Maybe they got complacent because they expected such a minor update to work just as well as the old 31 series?  I don't know.  The sloppy molding issues I've seen make me suspect this design got contracted out to a different factory.

[Sanity is Optional]

I'm guessing they did the re-design with a different team than handled the original DX design? (internal vs T-Rex??)

Just my take as a Mechanical Engineer. This sort of thing is a bit expected when you have new people working on an existing design.

[sqidd]

32 minutes ago, Angesdad said:

All of sudden I don't feel as bad not jumping on the bandwagon..But it looks cool! 

I "pose and forget" my toys so I'm not particularly upset. It's not like I transform things more than once or twice. But it is disapointing.

And yeah, it looks cool! 

1 minute ago, Sanity is Optional said:

I'm guessing they did the re-design with a different team than handled the original DX design? (internal vs T-Rex??)

Just my take as a Mechanical Engineer. This sort of thing is a bit expected when you have new people working on an existing design.

That checks out.

[last_raven]

8 minutes ago, Sanity is Optional said:

I'm guessing they did the re-design with a different team than handled the original DX design? (internal vs T-Rex??)

Just my take as a Mechanical Engineer. This sort of thing is a bit expected when you have new people working on an existing design.

That's my guess as well. Mine actually just came in today and the droop out of the box doesn't seem to be as severe but I won't have time to really dig into it until after work tonight. I'm still really happy with how it looks but I definitely cycle stuff in and out of display every few months right now so it will get transformed a lot. I honestly just bought the Fold Projector Speaker VF31 and the Lil Draken's to have on the Walkure stand even if I am able to remedy some of the fighter mode issues. 

[davidwhangchoi]

Pre order cancelled 😠 

[last_raven]

18 minutes ago, davidwhangchoi said:

Pre order cancelled 😠 

Not even gonna lie if I could've I would've especially given that I box'd my Alto YF-29 Full Set to put this guy out. I don't think it's a total flop it's just been a long time since I have seen Bandai/Tamashii drop the ball like this. If the Fold Projector Siegfried is a dud too I am just gonna take the L on that I guess because I haven't had any 31s yet. I've only heard good things about the bulk of the 31 line so far especially from @jenius videos so fingers crossed for the Speaker Pack/Fold Projector/Space Magic version. I know I am keeping my 31AX so I am gonna keep my PO for the super packs especially because it looks like I can mount some of @Xigfrid 31-series missiles with the packs on still. I still need to finish and paint them. That and Luna Park is the new king of bubble wrap and tamper tape so I'll forgive the delays for now. 

 

Guarantee there's a 1.5ver incoming after the review cycle is done tho

[Master Dex]

22 minutes ago, last_raven said:

Guarantee there's a 1.5ver incoming after the review cycle is done tho

I kinda hope they have time to incorporate the fixes for Mirage if at all.

[last_raven]

24 minutes ago, Master Dex said:

I kinda hope they have time to incorporate the fixes for Mirage if at all.

I agree but I strongly doubt it unless they are willing to postpone release but I believe they have done so before. Looking at some of the early images and prototypes it looks like it's really the production models that crap the bed. I have to go back and look closely at the broadcasts but they looked pretty tight before. I just managed to get my cockpit open and it was a bear to open up the first time, I was afraid of breaking something or cracking it for a bit but I wasn't gonna brute force it. I needed to apply leverage from below the bubble with my nails to get it up, thankfully no scratches or warping. 

 

I was gonna get the Mirage version first because red is three times faster and Mirage was the best girl from Delta but it looked like her head sculpt was introducing serious humpage and I didn't want that for the first VF-31 I was buying. And look how things went! 😋

[sqidd]

1 hour ago, davidwhangchoi said:

Pre order cancelled 😠 

I don't think they're THAT bad. I have a lot of toys that are way worse.

[Master Dex]

8 minutes ago, sqidd said:

I don't think they're THAT bad. I have a lot of toys that are way worse.

Yeah honestly, As much as Bandai should do better and hopefully does in the future... all this I'm hearing... it's trivial to me. I know not everyone feels that way but I will transform once in a blue moon likely. Same for my 262.. it's a pain to work with yes but most of the time I just admire it where it is. I haven't got my AX yet but next week I will and see how it measures up.. but even if I have to put some work in, I'll learn to live eventually.

But yeah they should do better.

[davidwhangchoi]

i understand that some of you feel it's not bad but for 300+ shipped to get to me, i'd be disappointed esp since the 31A and delta mold has been out for a while. 

 

Listing the worst:

Bandai with the crumbling shoulders on the green general machine Mac F 171's, all of them crumbled. 

Arcadia with that stupid DD sv-51 two left ankle issue at factory

Bandai Alto 29 replacement shoulder misprint

Arcadia VF-0A Shin type ball joint breaking off at the hip bar because excess glue and poor management at factory plus scratched canopy's because they forgot to file down sharp edges.

Early Yamato vf-0 crumbling arms and vf-1 cracked shoulders.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 13, 2022 by davidwhangchoi

[Chronocidal]

To be fair, I don't think this is anything remotely near the level of failure that the VF-171 was.  That spontaneously exploded.

This is just.. carelessness, and sloppiness in a design, not a material manufacturing failure.  Oversized tabs are fixable, even if it's dumb that we have to do it.

If I'm quite honest.. It's incredibly refreshing to receive a Bandai valk with a flaw that I can actually fix myself without destroying it in the process.  That might be a first.  

[DYRL VF-1S]

5 hours ago, sqidd said:

I "pose and forget" my toys so I'm not particularly upset. It's not like I transform things more than once or twice. But it is disapointing.

And yeah, it looks cool! 

That checks out.

Word and ditto.

 And honestly, this doesn’t sound nearly as troublesome as MP-44 3.0 for those that collect TF. Now that sucked for the money. I need to open my 31A though so obviously I can’t speak to the experience.

[Scyla]

For those who have the toy in hand can you tell where it was manufactured?

I know that the paperwork that comes with HLJ orders usually states the country of origin. That way I found out that my Metal Build Gold Frame was manufactured in the Czech Republic I believe.

I heard Bandai is manufacturing some of the Dragonball S.H.Figuarts in Vietnam and the first runs had all kinds of QC issues. Same goes for the Takara Materpiece Hound who was allegedly produced in Vietnam too and was a QC nightmare. 

[crackpot]

50 minutes ago, Scyla said:

That way I found out that my Metal Build Gold Frame was manufactured in the Czech Republic I believe.

That's interesting. Which Gold Frame?

The country of production came into mind as well with all these tabbing issues. Bandai's made in Vietnam products seem to have issues from what I have read.

[Scyla]

23 minutes ago, crackpot said:

That's interesting. Which Gold Frame?

The country of production came into mind as well with all these tabbing issues. Bandai's made in Vietnam products seem to have issues from what I have read.

The Amatsu Mina Princess in the Sky version.

[Angesdad]

1 hour ago, Scyla said:

I heard Bandai is manufacturing some of the Dragonball S.H.Figuarts in Vietnam and the first runs had all kinds of QC issues. Same goes for the Takara Materpiece Hound who was allegedly produced in Vietnam too and was a QC nightmare. 

I am positive that they'll eventually get better at it over time.

[DYRL VF-1S]

39 minutes ago, crackpot said:

That's interesting. Which Gold Frame?

The country of production came into mind as well with all these tabbing issues. Bandai's made in Vietnam products seem to have issues from what I have read.

Time to retire this sn. You officially have 666 comments.

[no3Ljm]

With all that being said, it's still Bandai's fault for not QC-ing their products properly.

 

[Scyla]

1 hour ago, no3Ljm said:

With all that being said, it's still Bandai's fault for not QC-ing their products properly.

 

Without a doubt.

I was just interested why there seems to be sich a discrepancy between the VF-31 and the VF-31AX since it is a proven design and the VF-31 Siegfrieds from the show where pretty much perfect from a QC standpoint.

[manfred17]

For me the main problem comes from the new design of the arms. The "origami" style design would require more attention to avoid all these QC issues.

For the price and for what we would expect, this is quite disappointing.

[last_raven]

24 minutes ago, Scyla said:

Without a doubt.

I was just interested why there seems to be sich a discrepancy between the VF-31 and the VF-31AX since it is a proven design and the VF-31 Siegfrieds from the show where pretty much perfect from a QC standpoint.

Amen to that. 

The blue and white striping on the back of mine is misaligned with the head and everything past it too by maybe 1.5-2mm which is super minor but not something I have yet seen on a DX Valk. Aside from that it looks like I got pretty lucky on the arms I am able to get the arm guns into a good spot without needing to fudge the back pegs but that wasn't the case until I tried putting it in fighter mode without the hands. I was able to close up the wing gap pretty well but as soon as you touch anything it shifts around again. Probably going to live in battroid mode for a good while

 

[sqidd]

2 hours ago, Scyla said:

 

I was just interested why there seems to be sich a discrepancy between the VF-31 and the VF-31AX since it is a proven design and the VF-31 Siegfrieds 

The design of something is only half the job. Production is a whole different deal.

There is a big problem worldwide right now with quality because of COVID. I suspect it's a lot of factors from the quality of raw materials (something I'm having problems with) to lots of new employees to a general ability for the individual to use COVID as an excuse for screwing off. IDK what the situation is in Asia but in the US finding and retaining good employees right now is really hard.

[MacrossJunkie]

I used an Xacto knife to shave down the pegs in the wings some. No left over scratches and looks pretty clean that way. 

Now it fits in snugly.

Fixing that I think also helped other fitment issues or maybe it's because I transformed it to battroid and back again. 

I don't have to extend the tip of the gunpod anymore to get the peg at the tip to slot into the hole at the underside.

Also the arm/bicep covers now no longer really have a gap on either side or at least it's to a degree I find acceptable. It's mostly in how you position the arms.

Instead of having the arms pushed up against the underside of the wings, I pulled it down at the elbows as much as I could.