HG and BW reach an agreement (Link included)

[Bolt]

@jvmacross love the new avatar 

They will undoubtedly make Kawamori san design the mechs..

16 minutes ago, Shawn said:

When is the next Tamashi Nations web episode?

I wanna see if they still put up the placard!

lol. Could that be a thing of the past?Inquiring western minds want to know!

7 minutes ago, sh9000 said:

I love Kawamori’s pic that he posted.

speak of the floating head! Nice!

[Seto Kaiba]

17 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

With this new "agreement" and fuzzy good feelings, this movie now seems more possible....more importantly, recent "tweets" suggest that there should be nothing to stop Kawamori's involvement in any "Robotech/Macross" project now [...]

Eh... looking at it from a pure feasibility standpoint, I don't think the prospects of the proposed live action movie are affected by this.

Given Harmony Gold's own comments on the matter, the proposed live action Robotech movie was always tipped to be a complete reimagining.  A clean break from anything that had existed in Robotech up to that point.  That effectively guaranteed that the movie would never be made, because why bother going to all the time and expense of developing an all-new IP on WB's or Sony's dime to unnecessarily fork over partial ownership to a company whose involvement was little more than licensing them the name of an obscure 80's TV cartoon?

If Sony actually decides to pull the trigger, it feels like this opens the door for Sony to drop the obscure Robotech name in favor of the more noteworthy Macross one.

To be honest, I don't expect to see anything new from Robotech going forward.  We know Harmony Gold has been looking for a way out ever since Shadow Chronicles bombed.  It was originally supposed to be the live action movie, where they'd just sit back and collect royalties while someone else did all the actual work.  Now it looks like it's going to be functioning as Big West's distribution partner, sitting back and collecting royalties while Funimation or whoever does all the actual work.

[Invid99]

If Sony is still moving forward with the live-action adaptation, maybe it will be new reimagining of the whole R' and Macross with a new title? 

[Bolt]

For that matter, it would be a completely different story/ movie. And might as well be calling Top Gun3..

[Seto Kaiba]

6 minutes ago, Invid99 said:

If Sony is still moving forward with the live-action adaptation, maybe it will be new reimagining of the whole R' and Macross with a new title? 

Except for the "new title" part, that's what it was supposed to be from the outset... a complete departure from any previously existing material.  An all-new story with all-new characters and designs, etc. etc.  Essentially a completely separate story with the Robotech name hastily slapped onto it.  Harmony Gold's plan was for that new, all-original Robotech movie to be a replacement for the failed Robotech animated series and be the new face of the franchise.  WB or Sony would do all the work, and Harmony Gold would just sit back and collect the royalties.

 

2 minutes ago, Bolt said:

For that matter, it would be a completely different story/ movie. And might as well be calling Top Gun3..

Which is, yes, why it hasn't been made.  There's no advantage in it for WB or Sony to develop an original IP all on their own and then hand over royalties from it to some third party for the use of a name that the film is at-best tangentially related to.  They could stick an original name on it and keep all the money for themselves.

[Roy Focker]

1 hour ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Harmony Gold quite literally gave up on Robotech's animated series almost fifteen years ago when Robotech: the Shadow Chronicles bombed...

They have effectively zero incentive to continue Robotech at this point.  By supporting Macross instead, they can make the same (or better) money with less effort and investment on their part.  They'll take the path of least resistance because they know Robotech was, and is, a functionally dead brand.  They might still bluster a bit about Robotech and Carl Macek's alleged vision, but odds are they aren't going to bother attempting to develop Robotech any further.  

I agree.  HG has pretty much abandoned Robotech.  Sure they've handed out licence agreements for 3rd parties to make toys and games but they haven't added anything new to continue the story themselves.  They can just let Bigwest do all the creative work.  My guess is if Bigwest has a new Macross sequel they first have to approach HG and give them the option join in on international distribution.  HG can pickup some of the costs for a share profits or do nothing and accept an agreed upon lower fee.

[Vifam7]

So, does this agreement mean that a non-Japan based company like Kitz Concept now has access to the Macross Plus or Macross 7 property (for merchandises) by negotiating through HG? It doesn't seem like it but just wondering.

Edited April 9, 2021 by Vifam7

[Nied]

Keep in mind that from a legal perspective if you think you have the rights to a property it's a good idea to maximally protect that claim through legal means, but at the same time from a business perspective it's a really bad idea to try and make new works based on that claim because you still might lose. It's hard to attract investors to fund a project that might get stuck in legal hell.

[easnoddy]

Seriously, why is Robotech even part of this discussion?   Its a DEAD franchise which by-and-large makes crappy merchandise.

HG would have done good to basically tombstone Robotech and just do the work to license/distribute Macross and Mospeada internationally.  That way they get access to Bandai and Arcadia toys and those companies just have to put the little HG sticker on the boxes and pay the licensing and get open access to the international (and American) markets.

HG should absolutely look to reboot Mospeada with the new designs like was done with SB Yamato.  Thats a potential money-maker right there.

Edited April 9, 2021 by easnoddy

[azrael]

14 minutes ago, Vifam7 said:

So, does this agreement mean that a non-Japan based company like Kitz Concept now has access to the Macross Plus or Macross 7 property (for merchandises) by negotiating through HG? It doesn't seem like it but just wondering.

It just means HG won't stop them. Who Kitz Concept negotiates with is entirely up to them. But HG won't stand in the way. That's all this means.

[Bolt]

Good luck Kitz...

[jvmacross]

I see no reason why KC would not be able to get licensing directly from BW to, for example, expand their lineup of 1/12 figs from their current SDFM series....imagine some M+ and M7 figs...I think they would do a good job...and Bandai doesn't seem to care too much for Macross figs....but who knows....now that they can freely sell them anywhere in the world, that may change....

At the very least, it would seem they should be able to get a HG license to produce DYRL figs....that alone would be something positive 

Edited April 9, 2021 by jvmacross

[jvmacross]

A new Golden Age of Macross Merchandising is upon us........re-assume the position!

 

[Chronocidal]

1 hour ago, Shawn said:

When is the next Tamashi Nations web episode?

I wanna see if they still put up the placard!

I think this particular product line is one of those things that this may actually not have any noticeable effect on.

First off, since HG still has a stake in SDFM/DYRL, they'll be owed a cut of the sales, and who knows if Bandai will want to deal with them.  Second, just because the market opens up does not mean Bandai is going to suddenly ramp up production to satisfy demand for the international market.  I sincerely doubt they're going to change their production strategy at this point.

I don't expect the Bandai DX situation to change at all (at least not quickly), for any of the current merchandise.  Maybe certain things will be available from more foreign retailers like BBTS, but it's not like the HG embargo has stopped anyone from being able to shop for Macross stuff at HLJ, AmiAmi, or any one of dozens of other import retailers.  Pre-order madness is not unique to Macross, it happens with all of the stuff Bandai sells.

One exception to this might be the P-Bandai stuff, and web exclusives that are "made to order."  If there are proper terms worked out for how HG can take a cut of the things they are owed a cut of, maybe we'll start seeing a lot more Macross stuff on the international Tamashii site.

Where I think we'll see the most change is with the plastic model market, really.  I've never seen any sort of scarcity with regards to the Macross model market, and Bandai just keeps pumping those out alongside their Gundam kits.  Between them and Hasegawa, I wouldn't be at all surprised to start seeing Macross kits pop up alongside the other mecha kits.

What I think I'm most curious to see is how Arcadia could take advantage of this.  Since they already use contracted factories, I'd be interested to see if they reach out for more international manufacturing and distribution deals.  Bandai probably isn't going to be quick to jump on the international sales bandwagon, so that market might be wide open for Arcadia to get a good foothold.

Kitz Concept is another wild card that could stand to gain a lot, if Bandai doesn't want to expand their market.

The wild unlikely future speculation side of me is imagining some wacky merger between Arcadia and Kitz Concept, where we suddenly start getting new dual-branded Macross/Robotech releases of Hikaru Ichijo / Rick Hunter VF-1Js made from Arcadia's molds with Kitz Concept's paintwork, with stickers for both names.  

Edited April 9, 2021 by Chronocidal

[Gerli]

 

[Nied]

56 minutes ago, Nied said:

Keep in mind that from a legal perspective if you think you have the rights to a property it's a good idea to maximally protect that claim through legal means, but at the same time from a business perspective it's a really bad idea to try and make new works based on that claim because you still might lose. It's hard to attract investors to fund a project that might get stuck in legal hell.

To be a little more direct here I wouldn't mistake HG's reluctance to get into a legal morass over the now resolved rights over Macross as reluctance to make new material. The Macross part of Robotech is so foundational to the story (it's literally the inciting incident)! that it's tough to work around it if the rights issue isn't firm (think how they chucked theMacross cast into a space hole in Shadow Chronicles). They've obviously got a passionate (if maybe not talented) creative team over there so I wouldn't be surprised if HG decides to do something with the property.

[Seto Kaiba]

49 minutes ago, easnoddy said:

Seriously, why is Robotech even part of this discussion?   Its a DEAD franchise which by-and-large makes crappy merchandise.

Mainly because the official statement mentions it, both in the context of Robotech allegedly having a future and apparently Big West having a say in said future.

And, of course, there are folks wondering about the implications... even though the most realistic and likely outcome is, as we've said, Harmony Gold dropping Robotech like a roadkill raccoon to focus on Macross distribution.

 

49 minutes ago, easnoddy said:

HG would have done good to basically tombstone Robotech and just do the work to license/distribute Macross and Mospeada internationally.  That way they get access to Bandai and Arcadia toys and those companies just have to put the little HG sticker on the boxes and pay the licensing and get open access to the international (and American) markets.

Except for the MOSPEADA part, that's almost certainly the direction they're headed... and entirely voluntarily at that.

 

49 minutes ago, easnoddy said:

HG should absolutely look to reboot Mospeada with the new designs like was done with SB Yamato.  Thats a potential money-maker right there.

Not Harmony Gold.  They don't have the money, the talent pool, or the industry clout to pull that off... and they can't do it anyway because the IP is owned by Tatsunoko Production.

Tatsunoko Production might take an interest if their Genesis Breaker project is well-received.  Mind you, after seeing the quality (or lack thereof) in Tatsunoko's last attempt at mecha anime I would be VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY afraid for MOSPEADA if they announced they were going to reboot it.  I have neither forgiven nor forgotten the landfill-on-fire that was The Price of Smiles. 

[Kelsain]

3 hours ago, treatment said:

Hope Funi/Sony or whoever else gets the license can get the old Manga dubs and subs if/when they decide to release M+ BD...
 

Yup, keep Brian Cranston as Isamu.

Otoh if Funimation dubs Frontier, I’m betting they cast Matt Mercer as Ozma.

[Seto Kaiba]

1 minute ago, Nied said:

They've obviously got a passionate (if maybe not talented) creative team over there so I wouldn't be surprised if HG decides to do something with the property.

What they don't have is money.

After Shadow Chronicles flopped, Harmony Gold's senior management cut off funding for future Robotech animation development.  Tommy Yune had promised them that his Shadow Chronicles OVA was going to be a huge hit that would make Robotech relevant or even mainstream in the anime industry, that it would bring in new fans in droves, and that it would attract investors who would finance all episodes after the first one.  That, obviously, did not happen.  Harmony Gold's management stuck to the terms they'd set and refused to fund any further development, leading to Shadow Chronicles episodes 2-4 being cancelled, and the only subsequent works being a dub of existing material and a Kickstarter campaign to fund development of a new series pilot.

Now that Harmony Gold can make money on animation distribution without having to actually spend their own money to develop new material... you bet your backside they'll drop the non-performing Robotech property in a heartbeat.

[Nied]

4 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

What they don't have is money.

After Shadow Chronicles flopped, Harmony Gold's senior management cut off funding for future Robotech animation development.  Tommy Yune had promised them that his Shadow Chronicles OVA was going to be a huge hit that would make Robotech relevant or even mainstream in the anime industry, that it would bring in new fans in droves, and that it would attract investors who would finance all episodes after the first one.  That, obviously, did not happen.  Harmony Gold's management stuck to the terms they'd set and refused to fund any further development, leading to Shadow Chronicles episodes 2-4 being cancelled, and the only subsequent works being a dub of existing material and a Kickstarter campaign to fund development of a new series pilot.

Now that Harmony Gold can make money on animation distribution without having to actually spend their own money to develop new material... you bet your backside they'll drop the non-performing Robotech property in a heartbeat.

I mean, it's rare for projects like these to be self funded anyway and you sure as crap aren't going to get investors to fork over the dough for production work if a whole third of your IP is in dispute. That's why they had to jump through weird funding hoops like the Academy kickstarter.

[jvmacross]

43 minutes ago, Gerli said:

 

[pengbuzz]

4 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Your definition of victory is too narrow, my friend.

Harmony Gold abandoned the field.  They've signed the instrument of surrender.

It just wasn't a completely unconditional surrender.

Instead, true to the company's quasi-Italian roots, once they'd exhausted their bluster and their elaborate aggressive posturing failed to impress... they switched sides.  They decided to knuckle under and learn to love the taste of Big West's boot leather rather than lose the farm on a slow and fundamentally unwinnable battle of attrition.

Yeah, Harmony Gold will collect some small percentage of the take from Macross licensing... but that's all.  Big West gave up NOTHING in this.  NOTHING.  And they got everything they wanted.  Harmony Gold, on the other hand, effectively gave up almost everything it had for a few crumbs from Big West's table.  They withdrew their opposition to Macross's global licensing.  They'd already effectively abandoned Robotech and now apparently are giving Big West partial control over it as well.  The only thing they can cling to is the hope that Sony will green-light a Robotech movie... which, from the outset, was never going to use Big West's IP anyway and is all but guaranteed to be a failure because failing is what American anime adaptations DO.

It's not quite the complete annihilation that folks who utterly loathe Harmony Gold were hoping for, but it's INCREDIBLY close in the final analysis.

Robotech is, for all practical intents and purposes, dead.  Harmony Gold has bent the knee to Macross's owners without any significant concessions from Big West's side.  That's a win by any standard.

 

No, it's nothing like that.

The statement about Harmony Gold's rights is basically just affirming that Harmony Gold's license agreement with Tatsunoko Production is still valid and in force... the one which only grants Harmony Gold the distribution and merchandising rights to the Super Dimension Fortress Macross animation outside Japan.  They've never been able to use Big West's intellectual property in the proposed live action movie.  (Indeed, they had announced the film with the intention of it being a "reimagining" with all-original design works.)

 

Agreed. I think folks should celebrate while there's still something to celebrate. With all the craziness and grief that has taken place the last year and a half, "take yer victories where you can get them". And this one was almost on a silver platter.

[Seto Kaiba]

22 minutes ago, Nied said:

I mean, it's rare for projects like these to be self funded anyway and you sure as crap aren't going to get investors to fork over the dough for production work if a whole third of your IP is in dispute. That's why they had to jump through weird funding hoops like the Academy kickstarter.

The IP wasn't in dispute.  Their IP problem was that Macross, the most popular third of Robotech, was unavailable for use in sequel development because its IP was owned by Big West not Tatsunoko and Tatsunoko therefore couldn't authorize them to use it the way they could stuff from Southern Cross or MOSPEADA.  Not that being unable to base sequels on your franchise's most popular installment is any less discouraging to investors.

But the biggest part of why they had to self-fund was that the Robotech franchise's track record was abysmal.  Every attempt to develop a sequel failed, and several cost the investors significant sums in the process.  

The current situation doesn't really do anything to change Robotech's ugly history of failure... so I wouldn't count on them finding money to make anything new for it.

[jvmacross]

2 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

The IP wasn't in dispute.  Their IP problem was that Macross, the most popular third of Robotech, was unavailable for use in sequel development because its IP was owned by Big West not Tatsunoko and Tatsunoko therefore couldn't authorize them to use it the way they could stuff from Southern Cross or MOSPEADA. 

When HG acquired the rights for SDFM, SC, and Mospeada.....the IP holders did not have any problems about how their IP was to be released by HG?

I guess what I would like to know is if BW was expecting to see Macross released in the US as basically Macross in English?  With that said, if that is the case....why couldn't HG just break up Robotech and reboot it as three separate series under some "Robotech" Anthology if they are still hung up on keeping the Robotech name "alive" and release the three separate shows as individual stories within a Robotech Anthology.  It basically would be HG finally doing the right thing.  Of course, it would relegate Macek's Robotech into a Disney-like Star Wars EU "Legends" product....I personally would have no problem with that.

[Bolt]

I'm sure their (HG) caffeine fueled brains are contorting in all kinds of ways, imagining what they could do.. let's see what reality dictates..

[Nied]

6 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

When HG acquired the rights for SDFM, SC, and Mospeada.....the IP holders did not have any problems about how their IP was to be released by HG?

I guess what I would like to know is if BW was expecting to see Macross released in the US as basically Macross in English?  With that said, if that is the case....why couldn't HG just break up Robotech and reboot it as three separate series under some "Robotech" Anthology if they are still hung up on keeping the Robotech name "alive" and release the three separate shows as individual stories within a Robotech Anthology.  It basically would be HG finally doing the right thing.  Of course, it would relegate Macek's Robotech into a Disney-like Star Wars EU "Legends" product....I personally would have no problem with that.

HG's claim has been that they have the international rights to Macross and it's derivatives and that as a consequence of that they have the right to make their own derivatives, BW obviously disputed that and it's the source of this whole 20 year saga. This new agreement gives HG the right to make derivative works based on SDFM and it's not really clear to me whether they also get a cut from later Macross works and frankly I don't really care because as a consumer I get access to them anyway. AFAICT there's nothing stopping both from happily coexisting now. If HG wants to make something interesting with Robotech featuring characters from SDFM they can (I've always had a soft spot for The Sentinels), but also BW can release 25 odd years worth of back catalog here in the US on Blu-Ray. Sure if HG makes some new Robotech property that creates an issue with different continuities but Macross has had 2-3 separate continuities since I was a toddler. What's one more?

[Nied]

There doesn't necessarily have to be loser in every conflict. Sometimes parties can come to an agreement where everyone gets some or all of what they want. Now let's all eat cake and ice cream for dinner and play with our chogokin DX VF-4s.

[Seto Kaiba]

14 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

When HG acquired the rights for SDFM, SC, and Mospeada.....the IP holders did not have any problems about how their IP was to be released by HG?

I guess what I would like to know is if BW was expecting to see Macross released in the US as basically Macross in English?  With that said, if that is the case....why couldn't HG just break up Robotech and reboot it as three separate series under some "Robotech" Anthology if they are still hung up on keeping the Robotech name "alive" and release the three separate shows as individual stories within a Robotech Anthology.  It basically would be HG finally doing the right thing. 

I don't think Big West had any expectations on that front.

Y'see, Big West gave the international distribution and merchandising rights for the original Macross TV series to Tatsunoko Production as compensation for the assistance Tatsunoko provided in funding production of the series.  Tatsunoko then turned around and licensed those rights it'd obtained from Big West to Harmony Gold USA in '84.  They didn't need to involve Big West in any way, because those rights belonged to Tatsunoko.

Tatsunoko Production itself was likely originally operating under the assumption that Harmony Gold's plan was to dub the series into English under its original title.  That was, after all, Harmony Gold's actual plan initially.  They were a couple episodes into production of the dub when Revell forced a course change that led to Robotech as we know it.

In theory, there would be nothing stopping Harmony Gold from breaking Robotech up and making it an artifact title for an anthology-type presentation... except the Robotech fanbase itself and the misguided hagiography whenever Carl Macek's name comes up.

 

14 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

Of course, it would relegate Macek's Robotech into a Disney-like Star Wars EU "Legends" product....I personally would have no problem with that.

They've already done it to 90% of Robotech's material.  What's 10% between friends?

 

 

2 minutes ago, Nied said:

HG's claim has been that they have the international rights to Macross and it's derivatives and that as a consequence of that they have the right to make their own derivatives, BW obviously disputed that and it's the source of this whole 20 year saga.

Harmony Gold's claim was only half of that... they mistakenly (or so they said after the fact) claimed that their license agreement with Tatsunoko granted them exclusive control of all things Macross outside of Japan.  They walked that one back fairly quickly after Tatsunoko got wind of it and corrected them.  That's what led to them going after the trademarks on the Macross name, logos, and key art as a way to support their effort to prevent their relaunch of Robotech from having to compete against Macross.

That unfounded claim prompted a copyright review - not a dispute - between Big West and Tatsunoko in Japan's courts to make sure that everyone was clear on who owned what and why under the original contract between Big West and Tatsunoko from 1982.

One of the major problems with talking about this is that so many people oversimplify things and give folks entirely the wrong idea about what happened.

The only parties that have ever genuinely disputed the validity of Harmony Gold's license to the original show have been the folks Harmony Gold has sued for infringement like FASA, Catalyst Game Labs, etc.

 

2 minutes ago, Nied said:

This new agreement gives HG the right to make derivative works based on SDFM

No, it really doesn't.

The statement just says that the existing status quo that was already in place from the very beginning is still in place and that Harmony Gold's existing license is unaffected by this new distribution agreement.

Harmony Gold still can't produce derivative works based on Super Dimension Fortress Macross.  They can distribute the original animation, edit it for content, and make merch based on it to their heart's content but that's all.

[jvmacross]

17 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Harmony Gold still can't produce derivative works based on Super Dimension Fortress Macross.  They can distribute the original animation, edit it for content, and make merch based on it to their heart's content but that's all.

Does this mean HG could license someone to make a shot-by-shot conversion or adaptation of SDFM into live-action using the original designs either exactly or "tweaked" for aesthetics?  I mean, if the SDFM series was converted into a bad comic book back in '85....couldn't that also be done using any other medium...including a live-action TV series or film?  Weren't there also books?  If I recall correctly, they went "deeper" into the story, tech, etc. and introduced things that were not really detailed in the Robotech TV series.

Edited April 9, 2021 by jvmacross

[deathzealot]

Honestly. While I am glad that things are looking up for Macross thanks to this, I am a bit sad that Robotech may not be a thing anymore. Robotech was my childhood and the reason I got into Macross in the first place so if Robotech goes the way of the dodo (or already has been as Seto has mentioned) then I do not know what to think about this. Sigh.

[Nied]

18 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

No, it really doesn't.

The statement just says that the existing status quo that was already in place from the very beginning is still in place and that Harmony Gold's existing license is unaffected by this new distribution agreement.

Harmony Gold still can't produce derivative works based on Super Dimension Fortress Macross.  They can distribute the original animation, edit it for content, and make merch based on it to their heart's content but that's all.

I don't see how that reading is supported by what we've seen so far. Especially since all the press releases talk about one derivative work quite explicitly.

[JB0]

5 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

Does this mean HG could license someone to make a shot-by-shot conversion or adaptation of SDFM into live-action using the original designs either exactly or "tweaked" for aesthetics?  I mean, if the SDFM series was converted into a bad comic book back in '85....couldn't that also be done using any other medium...including a live-action TV series or film?  Weren't there also books?  If I recall correctly, they went "deeper" into the story, tech, etc. and introduced things that were not really detailed in the Robotech TV series.

Comic books and novelizations are considered merchandise, which is why HG can make them. They don't have rights to produce derivative moving-picture productions, be they animated or photographic.

[Einherjar]

4 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

Does this mean HG could license someone to make a shot-by-shot conversion or adaptation of SDFM into live-action using the original designs either exactly or "tweaked" for aesthetics?  I mean, if the SDFM series was converted into a bad comic book back in '85....couldn't that also be done using any other medium...including a live-action TV series or film?  Weren't there also books?  If I recall correctly, they went "deeper" into the story, tech, etc. and introduced things that were not really detailed in the Robotech TV series.

They tried something like that already back in 2017.  Remember?

For people who have not been in the forums in a while, this is what HG was doing with Robotech for the past few years leading up to this.

[Invid99]

8 minutes ago, deathzealot said:

Honestly. While I am glad that things are looking up for Macross thanks to this, I am a bit sad that Robotech may not be a thing anymore. Robotech was my childhood and the reason I got into Macross in the first place so if Robotech goes the way of the dodo (or already has been as Seto has mentioned) then I do not know what to think about this. Sigh.

The same happened to me too. It was Robotech that got me into Macross. When I started watching Robotech, I didn't knew it was a different adaptation from SDFM. Thought it was the same thing. I was really shocked and surpised when I found out about the debacle of HG. 

[Seto Kaiba]

22 minutes ago, jvmacross said:

Does this mean HG could license someone to make a shot-by-shot conversion or adaptation of SDFM into live-action using the original designs either exactly or "tweaked" for aesthetics?  I mean, if the SDFM series was converted into a bad comic book back in '85....couldn't that also be done using any other medium...including a live-action TV series or film?  Weren't there also books?  If I recall correctly, they went "deeper" into the story, tech, etc. and introduced things that were not really detailed in the Robotech TV series.

So, the answer here is all down to what's legally considered to be a derivative work vs. what's legally considered to be merchandise.

Because Super Dimension Fortress Macross is a TV series - a motion picture - creating another motion picture work like a TV series or movie based on it or its IP would be derivative work and therefore prohibited.

By the same token, narrative media in a non-motion picture format like a novelization, comic book, or video game would be considered merchandise and therefore A-OK because HG has the merchandising rights under license.

This distinction between what's derivative work vs. what's merchandise is the reason Harmony Gold can use the merchandising rights it licensed to adapt SDF Macross or its Robotech "Macross Saga" into comics, novels, etc. but had to redesign all of the Macross Saga characters for Robotech II: the Sentinels and Robotech: the Shadow Chronicles to avoid a copyright infringement suit for unauthorized use of those designs.

 

17 minutes ago, Nied said:

I don't see how that reading is supported by what we've seen so far. Especially since all the press releases talk about one derivative work quite explicitly.

What are you talking about?  The official statement doesn't mention derivative works at all.

It lays out only the following points:

1. The agreement was signed 1 March 2021.
2. Harmony Gold has agreed to get out of the way of Macross distribution worldwide.
3. Big West will not stand in the way of distribution of a Robotech live action movie in Japan if one is made.
4. Harmony Gold's license agreement with Tatsunoko Production, under which they hold the "rest of world" distribution and merchandising rights to SDF Macross excl. Japan is recognized as valid by all parties.
5. Going forward, Big West and Harmony Gold will collaborate on distribution of future Macross and Robotech works.

Harmony Gold has NEVER had the ability to make derivative works based on Super Dimension Fortress Macross's IP... because Tatsunoko doesn't have that ability, and all of Harmony Gold's rights were obtained from its licensing agreement with Tatsunoko Production.  That's why Rick Hunter et. al. were redesigned for Sentinels, and again for Shadow Chronicles, and why pretty much all their sequel efforts are MOSPEADA-based.  Even HG itself has been pretty clear on this.

The Robotech live action movie is not a derivative work WRT Super Dimension Fortress Macross.  It has always, from the moment it was announced back in 2007, been explicitly indicated to be a reimagining of the Robotech story that has no connection to the Robotech TV series.

Edited April 9, 2021 by Seto Kaiba