Graham's clarification - Yamato VF-0S

[Nani?!]

Ewilen you sound like a MW professor. Nice stats.

I, too am a little iffy about the 1/100 line. Whether or not I buy it really depends heavily on what the quality:price ratio is.

I totally understand Dampiel's arguement that consistency is important to a collector when it comes to scale. Which is why I initially cringed at the idea that Yamato was releasing yet another scale. But I think there has to be an equilibrium at some point between practicality and size.

A Valk reaching in lengths of 40 cm or 15 1/2 inches I think, really leans over the ledge both in price and size. Is it possible? Sure. But personally, in that size the price to pay (both monetarily and size) starts to surpass the "cool factor".

I think it's more important that we stress accuracy of the scales already introduced. To me, the ability to squeeze detail and quality into a smaller package is more impressive than creating a huge valk. Of course, it can't be TOO small... but regardless, I want to see yamato up the ante in quality while lowering price. If they can do it with the New 1/100's, and steadily increase the quality of the 1/72, 1/60 lines, I'll be happy.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

naw an F-16 is the size of a VF-1. VF-0 is closer to a F-14 Tomcat's size. I believe the SV-51 would be close to S-37 Berkut size which is by far the largest fighter to be made in the last 10 yrs...actually its a technolog demonstrator but you get the point.

OH i dont have the battroid measurements...every site i went to only had the legneth in fighter mode =(.

You all knwo my vote. pwerfect transformation and BIG. 1/60+ 1/48 would be nice but hey as long as its perfect transformable kick ass

[ewilen]

1:60 is the way to go, same size as 1:48 VF-1, but to scale with 1:60 Vf-1s

I agree.

also, has anyone seen those 1:48 diecast F-16s at Walmart? since the real f-16 would be about 18 meters, shouldn't those toys be a good indicator of how big a 1:48 0 would be?

Nope, the F-16 is 15 m long. The F-14 is 19.5 m long so that would be a better comparison; I understand Walmart has it in 1/48.

[DrClay]

ok, go to wal mart and hold an F-14

[Sumdumgai]

I've read Aegis' preachings about the evils of the 1/48 line.

Okay I know the VF-0 and YF-19 would be about 15.5 inches, and that doesn't turn me off.

I don't see it the same way that it would be too bulky or be impractical.

Bigger doesn't necessarily mean more detail, but it does mean I won't have a little peace of earwax for a pilot figure. It also means I get nice little detailed cockpit innards.

I'm not trying to convince you Aegis to want a 1/48. Go ahead and argue.

But, why are you on a crusade against the idea of non-VF-1 valks in 1/48 scale?

It's not like people are screaming, "Skip the 1/72 line! Skip the 1/60 line!"

You've preached so many times about how we don't understand the size, or that it would be impractical, or that you don't need the size to ge tthe detail.

As someone so eloquently put it before "We're not pissing on your parade, so quit pissing on ours!" <_<

[Nani?!]

In a perfect world, we'd have 2 scales. Yamato would either make everything 1/60 and 1/48. 1/48's would be for the die-hard "we want it big and beautiful. look at that fat thang!" collectors. 1/60's would be for the casual and budget/space concerned die hards. This is probably a good financial venture for them as well because people that bought tons of the 1/48 VF-1's will probably still buy tons of everything else in 1/48. All the 1/60 people will also rejoice that their scale is also "not dead" as was previously believed. In short, everyone gains from having 2 scales. You take a look at the poll on the other page, and it's pretty much 50/50. Everyone will be happy, with the exception of a dozen or so 1/72 people.

Nice.

Although I'm not quite sure if all 1/48 people are affluent enough to buy "tons of everything else in 1/48".

Let us 1/60 and 1/48 people stop arguing and respect each other. Both of us are "Die hards". No one can tell me otherwise... I spent 1000's of dollars on this stuff.

I just wish yamato was more consistent with their scales. Eliminating the 1/60 scale is almost a slap in the face for us 1/60 collectors. Yamato, Stop bunny hopping from scale to scale.

[JValk]

kids wouldnt be adverse to buying huge plastics planes - and parents wouldn't either. look at that old gi joe tomcat - that was pretty big wasn't it? and tons of kids had that!

[imode]

In a perfect world, we'd have 2 scales. Yamato would either make everything 1/60 and 1/48. 1/48's would be for the die-hard "we want it big and beautiful. look at that fat thang!" collectors. 1/60's would be for the casual and budget/space concerned die hards. This is probably a good financial venture for them as well because people that bought tons of the 1/48 VF-1's will probably still buy tons of everything else in 1/48. All the 1/60 people will also rejoice that their scale is also "not dead" as was previously believed. In short, everyone gains from having 2 scales. You take a look at the poll on the other page, and it's pretty much 50/50. Everyone will be happy, with the exception of a dozen or so 1/72 people.

Nice.

Although I'm not quite sure if all 1/48 people are affluent enough to buy "tons of everything else in 1/48".

Let us 1/60 and 1/48 people stop arguing and respect each other. Both of us are "Die hards". No one can tell me otherwise... I spent 1000's of dollars on this stuff.

I just wish yamato was more consistent with their scales. Eliminating the 1/60 scale is almost a slap in the face for us 1/60 collectors. Yamato, Stop bunny hopping from scale to scale.

That was in reference to Chan and some of the other crazy people we have here

[Draykov]

kids wouldnt be adverse to buying huge plastics planes - and parents wouldn't either. look at that old gi joe tomcat - that was pretty big wasn't it? and tons of kids had that!

That was like $30 in 1983 money though.

[imode]

kids wouldnt be adverse to buying huge plastics planes - and parents wouldn't either. look at that old gi joe tomcat - that was pretty big wasn't it? and tons of kids had that!

That was like $30 in 1983 money though.

I think he was talking more about the size rather than the price.

[Draykov]

kids wouldnt be adverse to buying huge plastics planes - and parents wouldn't either. look at that old gi joe tomcat - that was pretty big wasn't it? and tons of kids had that!

That was like $30 in 1983 money though.

I think he was talking more about the size rather than the price.

My bad, I thought the issue was size and cost still.

Edited January 29, 2004 by Draykov

[Nani?!]

QUOTE (imode @ Jan 29 2004, 05:31 PM)

QUOTE (Draykov @ Jan 29 2004, 04:30 PM)

QUOTE (JValk @ Jan 29 2004, 05:27 PM)

kids wouldnt be adverse to buying huge plastics planes - and parents wouldn't either. look at that old gi joe tomcat - that was pretty big wasn't it? and tons of kids had that!

That was like $30 in 1983 money though.

I think he was talking more about the size rather than the price.

My bad, I thought the issue was size and cost still.

I think Draykov was right to mention price. A gi joe Tomcat is no where in the same vicinity in price as a 1/48 VF-1. The size isn't the issue alone, it's the size/quality:price ratio that's the issue. If the 1/48 VF-1's were as cheap as GI Joe tomcats, I think there's no question that they'd sell a TON more...

[imode]

I suppose the real shame is that Yamato isn't allowed to sell Macross state-side. The domestic escaflowne version is 2/3 the price of the Japanese release. Just imagine if the same held true for domestic versions of all their Macross toys.

[Nani?!]

I suppose the real shame is that Yamato isn't allowed to sell Macross state-side. The domestic escaflowne version is 2/3 the price of the Japanese release. Just imagine if the same held true for domestic versions of all their Macross toys.

It probably would. If you look at everything imported VS domestic version, it always ended up cheaper.

If you really sit down and think about the price, it's really no joke. $180 for a 1/48 with fastpacks. That's the price of a PS2. As much as I LOVE Macross. It's a bit steep... The day Macross breaks the HGUSA barrier is the day of great jubilation for us state-side collectors.

[Draykov]

I suppose the real shame is that Yamato isn't allowed to sell Macross state-side. The domestic escaflowne version is 2/3 the price of the Japanese release. Just imagine if the same held true for domestic versions of all their Macross toys.

It probably would. If you look at everything imported VS domestic version, it always ended up cheaper.

If you really sit down and think about the price, it's really no joke. $180 for a 1/48 with fastpacks. That's the price of a PS2. As much as I LOVE Macross. It's a bit steep... The day Macross breaks the HGUSA barrier is the day of great jubilation for us state-side collectors.

No kidding. Exactly how long is HG's license supposed to last, anyway? It's been 20 years!

[ewilen]

If that's a serious question, the serious answer is: probably nobody knows outside of HG and Tatsunoko.

Now, what the license really lets HG do, and prevents Yamato from doing is another question. If you're interested, see the licensing debate thread for numerous guesses.

[Draykov]

If that's a serious question, the serious answer is: probably nobody knows outside of HG and Tatsunoko.

Now, what the license really lets HG do, and prevents Yamato from doing is another question. If you're interested, see the licensing debate thread for numerous guesses.

Yes, I was serious. I've been meaning to check that thread out, actually.

[kensei]

I´m getting tired of listening to the same excuse : Oh ! if they´re making a 1/60 monster then there are no limits !

Now how many of you will buy it ?  I assume you´ll also get the 1/1 helmet now don´t ya ? and most important , where´s your precious 1/60 Monster ?

Giving that excuse is just a poor exposition of mindless fanatism. just because the label says 1/48 it´s gonna be great isn´t it.

I bet everytime someone mentions a possible 1/60 M0 line you all get the image of the lame 1/60 VF-1s , same size , same detail , same crapyness....But oh ,wait , I just remembered something , isn´t the VF-0 the same size as the M+ valks ?

Aren´t the 1/72 M+ toys  bigger than the 1/60 VF-1s ? wouldn´t 1/60 M+ toys be larger than the 1/48 VF-1s too ? then why should the M0 toys be made unreasonable  large and expensive if they can be just as detailed , big and great as the 1/48 VF-1s in 1/60 ?

Dont take this as a whine or anything ,I know we´ve discussed this over and over but  I´m juts tryng  to point out the fact that having 1/48 M0 toys just because a few want them to have a 1/48 label in them is just ridiculous while we could have the same stuff with the same quality and price in a not much smaller scale. 1/48 will just make them big and unreasonably expensive , not great.

Saying they should make them in 1/48 because they are making ludicrously expensive toys like the 1/1 helmet and 1/60 Monster that absolutelly NO ONE WILL BUY is a lame excuse and a bit selfish concidering most of the consumers  don´t have that budget and will just be left with the 1/100 toys , when having 1/60 would be just as with the 1/48 VF-1s , same collectability , price and detail.

1/48 would make them prohibitive not only for the poor fans but also for those that were fine with the 1/48 VF-1´s price.

Don't fire before you lock on to your target mate. I'm getting two of those Monsters when they come out thankyou very much. (I've sacrificed a lot though too just because I've put in a little more money than estimated just in case )

Really, with these expensive toys, it all depends on how much you want it. I'm not the richest guy on these boards or on the planet, but if I can find a way to scrape up money in any way I'll do it, Whether it's never letting the dishwasher going through the dry cycle to save power costs (that's ultra tight ass I know ) or simple pimpin .

But still I agree with you Aegis, let's just drop the concept of scales now and think for a minute. A 1/48 valk at the moment is plenty enough of toy to handle isn't it? Very decent amount of detail as well right? Well then, it is easy to get toys at lower scales around the same size as a VF-1 (not scale) and have the same amount of detail you guys would all enjoy. Not less. Now with the guys who want all their toys in 1/48 for the sake of keeping within one scale, I can't help you there.

Edited January 30, 2004 by kensei

[Jawjaw]

Really, with these expensive toys, it all depends on how much you want it. I'm not the richest guy on these boards or on the planet, but if I can find a way to scrape up money in any way I'll do it, Whether it's never letting the dishwasher going through the dry cycle to save power costs (that's ultra tight ass I know ) or simple pimpin .

I must say, if you can scrape up $600 for the estimated cost of two Monsters - I would like to hear how you can do it. When your bills outweight your income, there is not a lot you can do. But that pmpin sounds interesting. I'll have to watch "American Pimpin" a few more times to learn the trade.

For those trying to compare the cost of a local non-transforming toy to an imported transforming toy, it makes no sense. The transforming toy has much more R&D in it, more parts, and a much more technical assembly process. How do you think all those screws got put in place on your 1/48? Then you have to MSRP along with high shipping fees. I'll agree that Yamato's are expensive in general, but so are a lot of other different high detailed toys. You have to remember that Yamato's market (Japan) is pretty small and Macross is not the most popular show. If Yamato could export and get big chains like Walmart, Target, and TRU to buy then everything would be different.

[Dat Pinche Haro!]

you know....this scale is perfect...now i can put on my gundam weapons on a vf

[VF-18S Hornet]

I am in the same boat with a kid on the way so I don't mind a lower price point of the the VF-0 right now.

Same here. My daughter was born Thursday. My Macross hobby funds will be low for a long time.

Ouch!!! Oh well there's always a second job to consider congrats on having a healthy baby girls uh.. I mean girl:lol: .

[Bloodcat]

Yeah yeah, im back..

K, now on to business..

I like the idea of a more reasonably priced toy. However PVC and massive removable/lego forming parts?

I dunno.

As to Yammie stuff selling stateside? I like a lot of the Yammie toy looks, but the price and stability of the toys has always been kinda iffy with me. A cheaper price would sure be welcome. Just take a look at some of the Bandai stuff. Nearly 30 bucks in Japan for MSiA Devil Gundam. Same toy at my local Wal Mart? 8 BUCKS. Don't tell me a prettier box and some panel work save around 2/3rds or so of the price! Transformers Binaltech/Alternators prove the same thing. 50 dollars in Japan. Cut out the diecast and go with a different base color and its 20 bucks.

Give me cheap, cheerful, yet made with a high quality.

I gotta go wait and see on this new Valk for now.

[FlyingPika]

Prime is $90, and a VF-1 /148 is $130, i don't get that when prime is 200% more toy ^^

[myk]

200%? What is that supposed to mean, and how did you arrive at that number?

[Rick_Randy]

Maybe they discounted Masterpiece Convoy due to his lack of "trailer"

[eugimon]

I dunno about the claim that convoy is 200% more toy than a 1/48 valk...

I have both and I have to say there are a bunch of things wrong.. QC problems on my convoy as well.

fer instance:

1. red paint spilled during the chroming process on his grill.. paint is fused in now.

2. chrome on his body near the head.. luckily I got this out without trouble.

3. right body flap ( the part that folds out near the wheel well in cab mode) will not stay in the open position.

4. loose arm communicator in left arm.

5. left chest piece piece does not like to stay closed in cab mode.

and then there are the design issues:

1. poor matrix light up button placement, hinders head movemend.

2. the big freaking hole in his head.

3. he can barely hold his own gun.

4. you pretty much have to take the shoulder thing off of megs for prime to be able to hold him properly.

6. convoy tends to lean forward or backwards... mine has fallen over on his own weight before.

7. feet and head tend to pop out easily from their ball joints.

So if I consider that a yammie 1/48 has way more points of articulation, has a more detailed paint job, is made of more parts has more accessories.. PLUS has a smaller market and from a smaller company... I dunno, I think the extra thrity bucks is well justified.

[Radd]

I'm dissapointed, but then again I like large scale toys and perfect transformation. Still, I'm hoping that Yamato continues to milk the idea of two lines. One for casual collectors, and one for those that crave size, accuracy, and detail.

For those still arguing against 1/48th Plus/Zero/VF-X toys, stop raining on our parade. You don't like large toys, don't buy them. Some of us happen to like large scale toys and are more than happy to shell out for them. Some of us like the idea of a line of large scale Valkyrie toys, highly detailed and all in scale to each other. If you don't like that idea then you're quite welcome to the smaller 1/60, 1/70, and 1/100 lines.

[cube]

damn eugimon, sounds like you got ripped on your Prime...I just got mine today, and it doesn't have any probs at all. It can hold megs fine, it can hold the big gun fine (just slide it up a bit so the trigger isn't in the hand). It stands fine, poses fine, and the feet and head are on tight. The only change I would make is to color the matrix light switch red, so it doesn't stand out as much.

[eugimon]

!!! I'm so sad now !!! I got the defective convoy... oh well.

[ewilen]

For those still arguing against 1/48th Plus/Zero/VF-X toys, stop raining on our parade.

Eh, it's all just jawboning anyway.

You don't like large toys, don't buy them. Some of us happen to like large scale toys and are more than happy to shell out for them. Some of us like the idea of a line of large scale Valkyrie toys, highly detailed and all in scale to each other. If you don't like that idea then you're quite welcome to the smaller 1/60, 1/70, and 1/100 lines.

I think the point is (or should be) that Yamato is unlikely to produce all the scales listed. If they do, everyone's happy. If they don't, then the 1/48 fan's joy is the 1/60 fan's disaster, and vice-versa.

[bandit29]

For those still arguing against 1/48th Plus/Zero/VF-X toys, stop raining on our parade.

Oh please. Need a box of tissue? It just forum BS.

[Angel's Fury]

Wow! 13 pages already?

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

i wonder if graham sent shawn some scans eith new pics but he hasnt been able to upload since his work schedule changed. Hmm. Has anyone seen new pics in the japanese hobby mags?

[Dat Pinche Haro!]

can't wait until these are up for preorders! i just hope someone SAYS something about it being on preorder