charles88 Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 On 10/5/2022 at 10:37 AM, RangerKarl said: Re: papa Immelmann whitewashing Reveal hidden contents I think in this movie's continuity he never dropped the Bomb, just nicked the gene samples. Anyway I quite enjoyed it. It's no SnT but it'll do. Things I enjoyed were Reveal hidden contents Bogue throwing out Sheryl's line, and the training scene. I'm fairly sure somebody was copying someone else's HUD scene during one chase sequence. Expand Reveal hidden contents More like Wright take back what was stolen from Eplison Quote
Bolt Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 So how did Xaos come up with such nice gear? And did Max bankroll his own YF-29..? Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 On 10/5/2022 at 4:31 PM, Bolt said: So how did Xaos come up with such nice gear? Expand It's mentioned only in passing in the Macross Delta TV series and some promotional material for it in Great Mechanics G, but Xaos has a similar arrangement with the governments of the Brisingr Alliance that SMS's Frontier branch had with the Frontier Government in Macross Frontier. Namely, the Brisingr Alliance (the local NUNG economic and mutual-defense pact) contracted Xaos to carry out the operational evaluation testing on its domestically developed 5th Generation VF before the local New UN Forces formally adopt it as their next main fighter. The government gets a pack of expendable mooks (Xaos) whose deaths or injuries are all legally considered "accidental" to test their new fighter in battlefield conditions and Xaos gets to borrow a bunch of trial production next-generation VFs from the government to use while carrying out their contractual obligations to support the defense of the region. Xaos simply went one step further and customized (at their own expense) a handful of the VF-31As they were given into the Siegfried type for Walkure's flight demonstration and bodyguard team. Otherwise, their gear is noticeably less nice than SMS's. Their other branches are flying VF-171s where SMS's had VF-19s, and SMS had the latest prototype Macross-type ship while Xaos seems to have an older, less capable model. On 10/5/2022 at 4:31 PM, Bolt said: And did Max bankroll his own YF-29..? Expand The Blu-ray liner notes literally say that it is unknown how Max came to possess a YF-29. (Kawamori jokes that he might've used his influence with the New UN Forces to get it.) Quote
Bolt Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 (edited) On 10/5/2022 at 6:53 PM, Seto Kaiba said: (Kawamori jokes that he might've used his influence with the New UN Forces to get it.) Expand That wouldn't have been the first time. And i do find it suitable for Max. He always had the shiny new toys. In this case , matte blue Edited October 5, 2022 by Bolt Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 On 10/5/2022 at 7:21 PM, Bolt said: That wouldn't have been the first time. And i do find it suitable for Max. He always had the shiny new toys. In this case , matte blue Expand Well, sort of... on previous occasions, Max was a Colonel (or higher) in the New UN Forces and the commanding officer of the local New UN Forces for an entire emigrant fleet. He had a LOT more direct pull with the military. It's very jarring and nonsensical for Private Citizen Maximilian Jenius to somehow be able to obtain The Most Powerful Valkyrie, a craft so expensive and advanced that even central New UN Forces special forces units have to twist arms and take extraordinary measures to acquire them. Quote
Marzan Posted October 5, 2022 Author Posted October 5, 2022 On 10/2/2022 at 1:44 AM, Heron said: Yeah I disagree with Kawamori giving up his interest in Macross. Delta is merely what the current audience of Japan wants. At least from most reports from there. As well as a large number of international audiences. But now that Macross is free of the previous HG restrictions, we may see a different take on series in the future. Expand You have a point, but it's debatable. Delta wasn't the huge success in Japan either. Just look at the viewing figures for films from other anime franchises and it is dwarfed many times over. Unless it's only supposed to be a vehicle for advertising Walküre in which case it's doing its job well I suppose. As for Kawamori, I love the guy to bits and he's an incredible artist, creator and world builder, but I stand by my point that he hasn't really done a memorable, quality show since...well, Frontier actually. I would love to be proven wrong by the next iteration of Macross. Quote
kalvasflam Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 In terms of how Max got his YF-29... the answer is simple, cause he is Max. Now there is a question probably somewhere about how did Milia get her YF-29... wanna know the answer? Cause duh... Max has one, so of course she gets one. How else is Bandai going to hawk a Red YF-29. Heh, most likely to split up 50 years running. I am curious to see what the performance of the VF-25 and VF-31 is compared to each other, and how those rank against the VF-27 and VF-31. Honestly, it feels like Kawamori decided to be like Sukhoi and go with a bunch of Flanker derivatives, starting with the YF-24. Quote
charles88 Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 On 10/5/2022 at 6:53 PM, Seto Kaiba said: The Blu-ray liner notes literally say that it is unknown how Max came to possess a YF-29. (Kawamori jokes that he might've used his influence with the New UN Forces to get it.) Expand Well Max and his family are kinda treated as royalty by NUNS for being 1st interspecies couple. Its shows that Max and Milia have VF-25 in Frontier Movie 2 novelization. Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 (edited) On 10/5/2022 at 7:45 PM, Marzan said: You have a point, but it's debatable. Delta wasn't the huge success in Japan either. Just look at the viewing figures for films from other anime franchises and it is dwarfed many times over. Unless it's only supposed to be a vehicle for advertising Walküre in which case it's doing its job well I suppose. Expand It's pretty obvious Macross Delta was primarily a vehicle for Walkure... the writing in much of the TV anime bordered on an Excuse Plot to have Walkure go places and sing. On 10/5/2022 at 8:06 PM, kalvasflam said: In terms of how Max got his YF-29... the answer is simple, cause he is Max. Expand Eh... people are gonna ask that question, since the central New UN Forces can barely lay hands on a YF-29 in the best of circumstances how did a 70+ year old retiree apparently get a personal one, esp. after leaving the military and no longer being able to use his clout as commander of a New UN Spacy defense force to secure the latest models. On 10/5/2022 at 8:06 PM, kalvasflam said: I am curious to see what the performance of the VF-25 and VF-31 is compared to each other, and how those rank against the VF-27 and VF-31. Honestly, it feels like Kawamori decided to be like Sukhoi and go with a bunch of Flanker derivatives, starting with the YF-24. Expand The VF-25 and VF-31A are about on par with each other. They share a LOT of parts in common too. The VF-27's got higher performance than either, with the Siegfried VF-31 custom hovering between the VF-25/VF-31 and VF-27 performance-wise. EDIT: To make this a bit more precise, the production-intent VF-25 and VF-31 both have a thrust-to-weight ratio of approximately 39. The VF-27's is 46.5, the VF-31 Siegfried's is 44.9, the YF-30's is 53.1, and the YF-29's is 61.2. Edited October 5, 2022 by Seto Kaiba Quote
Bolt Posted October 5, 2022 Posted October 5, 2022 On 10/5/2022 at 8:06 PM, kalvasflam said: In terms of how Max got his YF-29... the answer is simple, cause he is Max. Expand That's my thought, just wondering what the in universe explanation is. No explanation is very Kawamori. On 10/5/2022 at 8:06 PM, kalvasflam said: Honestly, it feels like Kawamori decided to be like Sukhoi and go with a bunch of Flanker derivatives, starting with the YF-24. Expand Starting with the YF-25, everything else is a derivative of the YF-24.. On 10/5/2022 at 9:52 PM, Seto Kaiba said: It's pretty obvious Macross Delta was primarily a vehicle for Walkure... the writing in much of the TV anime bordered on an Excuse Plot to have Walkure go places and sing. Expand Agreed. And yet Frontier is enjoying the same musical success ( even more, IMO) , except the Frontier anime is way better. Point being, Delta could have been just as good or better, without needing to exist as a vehicle for Walkure music touring the Islands. Quote
charles88 Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 (edited) On 10/5/2022 at 9:52 PM, Seto Kaiba said: Eh... people are gonna ask that question, since the central New UN Forces can barely lay hands on a YF-29 in the best of circumstances how did a 70+ year old retiree apparently get a personal one, esp. after leaving the military and no longer being able to use his clout as commander of a New UN Spacy defense force to secure the latest models Expand One of the reason that his daughter are one of the founder of NUNS especially on De centralization policy and one of the leader of anti Pro Earth UN space during Unification war aka VF-X 2. Also Max and His wife got themselves VF-25 8 years ago in Frontier Movie 2 novelization as they join NUNS in Final battle. So of course NUNS would give YF-29 to Max. Delta Movie 2 also show there a lot of NUNS and Xaos Captain are still deeply respected Max Actually YF-25 build based on YF-24 blueprint to reduce cost and increase its versatility Edited October 6, 2022 by charles88 Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 (edited) On 10/6/2022 at 12:18 AM, charles88 said: One of the reason that his daughter are one of the founder of NUNS especially on De centralization policy and one of the leader of anti Pro Earth UN space during Unification war aka VF-X 2. Also Max and His wife got themselves VF-25 8 years ago in Frontier Movie 2 novelization as they join NUNS in Final battle. So of course NUNS would give YF-29 to Max. Delta Movie 2 also show there a lot of NUNS and Xaos Captain are still deeply respected Max Expand 🙄 That's ridiculous and I have a feeling you KNOW it's ridiculous. Yes, Max was allegedly a backer of the anti-facist paramilitary group Vindirance during the Second Unification War. Macross Chronicle does not present it as a fact, but as rumor along with his supposed connection to Mariafokina Barnrose. Max and Milia did, as I noted here and in other topics, fly VF-25s in the novelization of the Macross Frontier movies. They did so as part of the New UN Spacy and SMS reinforcements arriving to support the Macross Frontier fleet. Not as private citizens. Regardless of the length of his military service, there is no way the New UN Government or New UN Forces are going to just give a retired soldier who is now a private citizen and nothing more a beyond-state-of-the-art fighter that is vastly more powerful and exponentially more expensive than even a current-generation main variable fighter. Not only is there literally a regulatory bureau in place specifically to prevent that kind of military abuse of authority after the Second Unification War, but the New UN Gov't and New UN Forces know only too well what happens when a top ace switches sides and has access to advanced weapons like that. The New UN Gov't had (and has) arms export restrictions that prevented the VF-19 being being adopted by emigrant forces in any significant numbers and prevented them from sharing full specs for the YF-24 Evolution to the emigrant governments. (The backstory for the VF-19EF/A also provides a statement that trying to purchase military tech like that "through channels" is illegal. Isamu tried it, and was only saved by Dr. Neumann hastily conceiving a VF-19 service life extension program and naming Isamu as its test pilot.) On 10/6/2022 at 12:18 AM, charles88 said: Actually YF-25 build based on YF-24 blueprint to reduce cost and increase its versatility Expand More like to work around the areas omitted from the specs by the central New UN Forces and meet the specific priorities of the Frontier fleet. Edited October 6, 2022 by Seto Kaiba Quote
kalvasflam Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 I want the VF-35 next, the Felonski equivalent. Cause Max and Milia definitely need those. If you don't have a blue and red variant of every VF, you are doing something wrong. Somewhere in the Macross universe, there is a very large building which matching red and blue painted Valk of every type ever, just so that we can have matching Max/Milia pairs. It's almost as ubiquitous as Jolly Rogers for VF-1. I always found it hilarious that NATO decided to give a ridiculous code name like Felon to the SU-57. Flanker, Fullback, those were decent names, Firkin, hey, I can even get behind that. Felon. Why don't they just call it F***face. Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 1:01 AM, kalvasflam said: Somewhere in the Macross universe, there is a very large building which matching red and blue painted Valk of every type ever, just so that we can have matching Max/Milia pairs. Expand I'm pretty sure we saw that in an episode of Macross Delta... the "Jenius Air" hangar in Mirage's backstory. Quote
Bolt Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 12:41 AM, Seto Kaiba said: Regardless of the length of his military service, there is no way the New UN Government or New UN Forces are going to just give a retired soldier who is now a private citizen and nothing more a beyond-state-of-the-art fighter that is vastly more powerful and exponentially more expensive than even a current-generation main variable fighter. Expand Which makes me think he bank rolled it himself. With good connections. Regardless of the debate. He has one fine YF-29. And on that note, do we know it can outperform a VF-24 ? Probably. But leave it to Earth and they will inject a few VF-24's with some ante upping improvements. Once the YF-29 cat was out of the bag. On 10/6/2022 at 1:06 AM, Seto Kaiba said: I'm pretty sure we saw that in an episode of Macross Delta... the "Jenius Air" hangar in Mirage's backstory. Expand my thoughts exactly. Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 1:11 AM, Bolt said: Which makes me think he bank rolled it himself. With good connections. Regardless of the debate. He has one fine YF-29. Expand Eh... I know I'm probably being a bit harsher on that half-arsed creative decision than I actually need to be, too. I've probably said this before in other threads, but I kind of dislike the YF-29 on principle. It's Macross's first real Super Prototype. It is, in Macross, the same kind of thing that the Gundams are in most Gundam shows. It's an irresistable force AND an immovable object. It's an impractical superweapon that is so expensive it can never be mass produced or used widely, but not so expensive that there can conveniently be just one of them hanging around somewhere in case someone needs to be play the next mission with the cheats enabled. It's so incredibly expensive and resource-intensive that there's no believable way for someone to just have one. Giving a YF-29 to any member of the Jenius family other than Mirage would be grotesque overkill. Giving a YF-29 to Max basically allowed him to hijack the entire film and steal focus from the main characters at least three times, including during the climax of the film! Reveal hidden contents Not to mention humiliate the main characters publicly apparently just for laughs. I enjoyed it because I kind of already thought the protagonists were schmucks, but seeing them beaten down for no real reason like that had to suck for Delta fans. On 10/6/2022 at 1:11 AM, Bolt said: And on that note, do we know it can outperform a VF-24 ? Probably. But leave it to Earth and they will inject a few VF-24's with some ante upping improvements. Once the YF-29 cat was out of the bag. Expand We've got no specs for the VF-24 used by Earth and the central New UN Forces, so it's hard to say. It is worth noting that every 5th Gen VF was developed from a redacted version of its specs that omitted key/proprietary technological advancements, leaving emigrant governments to fill in those gaps on their own. We know the YF-29 was developed to exceed the performance of the YF-24 Evolution but it's left unclear if it truly did so and if so by how much. I'd assume the YF-29 probably does surpass the VF-24, but ends up on the losing side of the equation because the VF-24 can be mass produced and the YF-29 can't because of its massive price tag and the insanely high fold quartz requirements. Quote
charles88 Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 1:47 AM, Seto Kaiba said: We know the YF-29 was developed to exceed the performance of the YF-24 Evolution but it's left unclear if it truly did so and if so by how much. I'd assume the YF-29 probably does surpass the VF-24, but ends up on the losing side of the equation because the VF-24 can be mass produced and the YF-29 can't because of its massive price tag and the insanely high fold quartz requirements Expand Then YF-30 and then VF-31 came in surpass VF-24 and seems to be VF-31 are one of best replacement for VF-24 Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 2:22 AM, charles88 said: Then YF-30 and then VF-31 came in surpass VF-24 and seems to be VF-31 are one of best replacement for VF-24 Expand Ah, that's incorrect. The YF-30 was not developed to surpass the YF-24 or anything like that. It was developed as an Experimental aircraft (an "X-plane") and built to evaluate several new technologies, the most important of which was the Fold Dimensional Resonance system that was developed as a way to cross dimensional faults. The reason it was designated as a prototype (YF) instead of an Experimental aircraft (VF-X/VX) was to exploit a loophole in the New UN Government's laws about disclosing newly developed technologies. Classifying it as a prototype allowed SMS Uroboros to avoid having to make those disclosures to the central New UN Government and continue testing in secret for much longer than they normally would have been able to. The YF-30's performance is actually lower than the YF-29's by a fair amount, and it's much less heavily armed as well because it was not developed as a combat aircraft. For its part, the VF-31 was nominally developed from the YF-30... but it is a heavily economized model that shares little in common with the YF-30 apart from its basic design and transformation. It was not developed as a successor to the VF-24. In fact, its performance is on the same level as the VF-25's and it shares a lot of parts with the VF-25 as well. The VF-31 was locally developed within the Brisingr cluster as an economic stimulus and for export sale to other governments. Rather than purchase a 5th Generation VF from another government like buying VF-25s from the Frontier fleet, they developed their own new model locally to keep that money inside their own economy and create jobs. Their other goal was to bring money into the cluster by selling VF-31s to other governments that hadn't already purchased an export variant of someone else's 5th Gen VF design. (Its backstory is heavily inspired by Japan's own domestic 5th Generation fighter program that had the same motivations.) The VF-31 Siegfrieds used by the Delta Flight of Xaos's Ranga branch 3rd Fighter Wing are "aftermarket" customizations of the stock VF-31A Kairos that adopt a detuned version of the YF-30's engine and a much less capable, but still gobsmackingly expensive, version of the YF-29's Fold Wave System. The modifications push the VF-31 airframe to its limit but only really improve it enough to rival the performance of the VF-27. The VF-31AX Kairos Plus is... Reveal hidden contents ... basically just a Siegfried that's been repaired with stock VF-31A parts and had additional fold quartz introduced to its budget Fold Wave System to further improve the VF-31's performance. It still doesn't come anywhere close to the YF-29's level, but it was enough to fight the mass-produced Sv-303 Vivasvat on a semi-level footing. Quote
DewPoint Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 In light of recent events, it seems like large fold faults are a desirable thing to find. So I have recently been thinking: Reveal hidden contents In DYRL? Misa didn't tell Hikaru everything she read off the city computer at the time and knew where she was taking the Megaroad 01 when they left Earth. They encountered a fold fault and found something really, really good. So good that they decided to "disappear" from the galaxy to keep what they found from being exploited. I'm now thinking it was the Protoculture home world. Too much of a stretch? Quote
charles88 Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 3:26 AM, Seto Kaiba said: The YF-30 was not developed to surpass the YF-24 or anything like that. It was developed as an Experimental aircraft (an "X-plane") and built to evaluate several new technologies, the most important of which was the Fold Dimensional Resonance system that was developed as a way to cross dimensional faults. The reason it was designated as a prototype (YF) instead of an Experimental aircraft (VF-X/VX) was to exploit a loophole in the New UN Government's laws about disclosing newly developed technologies. Classifying it as a prototype allowed SMS Uroboros to avoid having to make those disclosures to the central New UN Government and continue testing in secret for much longer than they normally would have been able to. The YF-30's performance is actually lower than the YF-29's by a fair amount, and it's much less heavily armed as well because it was not developed as a combat aircraft Expand I see. I thought YF-30 performance are almost as equal as YF-29 as in Macross 30, Leon beat his former friend that piloting YF-29B which stated upgraded YF-29. Is it because Leon is better pilot or hospital friend lost his will to fight? Quote
pengbuzz Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 (edited) On 10/6/2022 at 1:47 AM, Seto Kaiba said: Eh... I know I'm probably being a bit harsher on that half-arsed creative decision than I actually need to be, too. I've probably said this before in other threads, but I kind of dislike the YF-29 on principle. It's Macross's first real Super Prototype. It is, in Macross, the same kind of thing that the Gundams are in most Gundam shows. It's an irresistable force AND an immovable object. It's an impractical superweapon that is so expensive it can never be mass produced or used widely, but not so expensive that there can conveniently be just one of them hanging around somewhere in case someone needs to be play the next mission with the cheats enabled. It's so incredibly expensive and resource-intensive that there's no believable way for someone to just have one. Giving a YF-29 to any member of the Jenius family other than Mirage would be grotesque overkill. Giving a YF-29 to Max basically allowed him to hijack the entire film and steal focus from the main characters at least three times, including during the climax of the film! Reveal hidden contents Not to mention humiliate the main characters publicly apparently just for laughs. I enjoyed it because I kind of already thought the protagonists were schmucks, but seeing them beaten down for no real reason like that had to suck for Delta fans. We've got no specs for the VF-24 used by Earth and the central New UN Forces, so it's hard to say. It is worth noting that every 5th Gen VF was developed from a redacted version of its specs that omitted key/proprietary technological advancements, leaving emigrant governments to fill in those gaps on their own. We know the YF-29 was developed to exceed the performance of the YF-24 Evolution but it's left unclear if it truly did so and if so by how much. I'd assume the YF-29 probably does surpass the VF-24, but ends up on the losing side of the equation because the VF-24 can be mass produced and the YF-29 can't because of its massive price tag and the insanely high fold quartz requirements. Expand I know how Max got his YF-29: Reveal hidden contents WARNING: THE INFO CONTAINED WITHIN MAY CHANGE THE VERY COURSE OF HISTORY! YOU MAY NOT COME OUT UNSCATHED SHOULD YOU READ THIS! YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!!! Reveal hidden contents WE REALLY MEAN IT!!! Reveal hidden contents Private Citizen Maximilian Jenius made an appointment with NUNS, walked in with Millia in tow and showed them the most powerful document in Macross history. A document so incredibly potent, so awesomely omnipotent and terrible in its' scope and magnitude, that entire civilizations (including the Zentraedi, Mardook, Supervision Army and the Protoculture trembled at the promised fury of its' awesome might. Even the dreaded Vajra and Protodevlin fear it and shudder in horror. What was this horrific, eldritch-like horror of a tome that set flight to all these, and terrorized all these people? Reveal hidden contents ARE YOU SURE YOU REALLY WANT TO KNOW? Reveal hidden contents LAST CHANCE TO BAIL OUT NOW!!! Reveal hidden contents I'M BEGGIN' YA KID!!! TURN BACK NOW IF YOU DON'T WANT YER HEAD MELTING LIKE THAT GUY IN RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK!!! Reveal hidden contents OR LIKE THAT GUY IN THE LAST CRUSADE WHO DRANK FROM THAT CUP!! SERIOUSLY, THAT WAS GROSS!! HIS EYEBALLS SHRIVELED!! Reveal hidden contents Okay...you asked for it: Reveal hidden contents It was... THE SCRIPT. Reveal hidden contents Or it could be Max brought...a shrubbery: Edited October 6, 2022 by pengbuzz Quote
Keith Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 SF lost my order apparently, now it's backordered everywhere... Quote
kalvasflam Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 Ok, I was kind of joking about the garage full of red and blue Valks, but not really that much with why Max got the YF-29. Cause let's face it, if you had a prototype uber fighter, who would you want flying it or testing it? Answer: the best pilots you can find, and my guess is Max still fits that bill, and Milia is probably not too far behind. Age not withstanding, Unlike the Gundamverse, top notch experimental mecha is not accidentally handed over and then kept by snot nosed punks who has not one bit of military experience. As for Delta, they should be thankful that Max blew them away in a YF-29, because at least that's an excuse they can use, he was flying the better plane, a gen 6 vs a gen 5. what would be far more humiliating is if Max decided to come out in a VF-1 and wiped the mat with them, which would you rather go with? Grandpa beat me in a superior machine, or grandpa spanked with me in a fighter that hasn't seen active service in 40 years. That's an equivalent of having an F-4 shooting down a squad of F-35. If anything, the writers did Delta a favor having Max beat them up in YF-29. Think how much complaints people would have if he was in a VF-4 or a VF-1. Let's face it, Max was the bright spot in the movie. If he overshadowed the rest of the plot and characters by being there, that's literally just telling people how badly the movie sucked. Quote
Bolt Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 (edited) From what I've seen and read. Many references to M+ and, of cours Megaroad-01. I appreciate trying to tie it all together, but.. Reveal hidden contents The Megaroad-01 "stuck" in a fold fault? Really?? So they went nowhere and have been stuck nowhere for decades? How boring and unimaginative, I have to say And ( yes I know it's explained) somehow "LadyM" can still give orders to everyone ? And Lady M is the Megaroad?? What does that even mean?! There are several gaps and inconsistencies. Oh ya, right! It's Macross! I think it was better when we didn't know certain things.. Edited October 6, 2022 by Bolt Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 4:51 AM, DewPoint said: In light of recent events, it seems like large fold faults are a desirable thing to find. So I have recently been thinking: Reveal hidden contents In DYRL? Misa didn't tell Hikaru everything she read off the city computer at the time and knew where she was taking the Megaroad 01 when they left Earth. They encountered a fold fault and found something really, really good. So good that they decided to "disappear" from the galaxy to keep what they found from being exploited. I'm now thinking it was the Protoculture home world. Too much of a stretch? Expand Probably not, given that... Reveal hidden contents ... the Megaroad-01 itself is the thing stuck in a fold fault. Early emigrant ships like the Megaroad-class were not exactly comfortable or enjoyable places to live long-term. So much so, in fact, that occasional riots because of the living conditions were common enough for the New UN Government to commission a countermeasure for them. Testing of the prototype went... poorly. In a very public manner. You would know it as the Sharon Apple Incident. She was designed to use mild hypnosis to help suppress rioting and help the emigrant population Keep Calm and Carry On. Being stuck on one of those ships for decades would probably be a profoundly unpleasant experience. On 10/6/2022 at 5:08 AM, charles88 said: I see. I thought YF-30 performance are almost as equal as YF-29 as in Macross 30, Leon beat his former friend that piloting YF-29B which stated upgraded YF-29. Is it because Leon is better pilot or hospital friend lost his will to fight? Expand By the specs, the YF-29's flight performance is around 20% higher than the YF-30's. All in all, Leon did have a bit of an advantage in that the fight with Rod took place inside of a base where Rod couldn't leverage the YF-29's maneuverability. Reveal hidden contents On 10/6/2022 at 6:35 AM, pengbuzz said: THE SCRIPT. Expand I am told the New UN Government and New UN Forces do not negotiate with terrorists. On 10/6/2022 at 3:58 PM, kalvasflam said: As for Delta, they should be thankful that Max blew them away in a YF-29, because at least that's an excuse they can use, he was flying the better plane, a gen 6 vs a gen 5. what would be far more humiliating is if Max decided to come out in a VF-1 and wiped the mat with them, which would you rather go with? Expand Based on the official materials I've seen, the YF-29 is still considered to be a 5th Generation VF. An extra feature on the Macross Delta TV anime Blu-rays tries to claim the VF-31 Siegfried is a Gen 5.5 unit but there is no real indication what constitutes a 6th Generation machine and the Siegfried isn't a production unit anyway so its classification should be the same as the parent machine (5th Gen). There was, of course, the Third Option of having Max use a different 5th Generation Valkyrie closer in performance to the VF-31. He (and Milia) had VF-25s in the novelization of the second Macross Frontier movie. Or even just giving Max a Siegfried with the FSW after Delta Flight changed to the Kairos Plus. Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 3:58 PM, kalvasflam said: Think how much complaints people would have if he was in a VF-4 or a VF-1. Expand That kinda already happened once... Mariafokina Barnrose spanked NUNS Special Forces ace Aegis Focker in a VF-1X when he was using a VF-19A. Quote
Bolt Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 Another few thoughts. Reveal hidden contents So all the Protoculture ruins disappeared once the fold fault/gate closes. 1) Are these ruins physically real when they appear? They are tucked away in some other dimension(s) otherwise ? 2) Which came first, the chicken or the egg?! So when the fold fault,( in which the Megaroad is trapped) opened. That opens other gates for these other protoculture ruins to emerge? Or do they emerge and the Megaroad gate is opened? In other words, if these other Protoculture ruins were to be brought back, would that reopen the gate to the Megaroad? More like unanswerable questions Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 (edited) On 10/6/2022 at 7:22 PM, Bolt said: More like unanswerable questions Expand I consider this video meme completely appropriate and even on topic considering the big-eared Ferengi-like aliens we see in The Labyrinth of Time. The first one is actually answered in the Macross Delta TV anime directly, so I don't see a reason to spoiler tag that one. On 10/6/2022 at 7:22 PM, Bolt said: 1) Are these ruins physically real when they appear? They are tucked away in some other dimension(s) otherwise ? Expand By "ruins" I'm assuming you mean the Protoculture System. Yes, the Protoculture System's resonators are physically real. They're hidden/stored in fold space when they are not active, either because the Protoculture were concerned someone might tamper with them after they died out or simply to keep them out of the way. On 10/6/2022 at 7:22 PM, Bolt said: 2) Which came first, the chicken or the egg?! Expand For the record, the answer is the egg did. Eggs predate chickens by approximately 340 million years. </overlyliteralgag> Reveal hidden contents On 10/6/2022 at 7:22 PM, Bolt said: So when the fold fault,( in which the Megaroad is trapped) opened. That opens other gates for these other protoculture ruins to emerge? Or do they emerge and the Megaroad gate is opened? In other words, if these other Protoculture ruins were to be brought back, would that reopen the gate to the Megaroad? Expand That second one. Heimdall used the Siren Delta System to wake up the Protoculture System's resonators on the worlds of the Brisingr cluster in order to tap into one of the system's secondary functions, a network of Super Fold Gates connecting the resonators to each other. You saw Delta Flight use this network to "sneak" onto Windermere IV from another planet back in the Macross Delta TV anime. The Siren Delta System was able to use the whole network's power to open a Super Fold Gate to the Megaroad-01. Opening another Super Fold Gate to the fold fault the Megaroad-01 is stuck in would probably require the same steps Heimdall used. Having the coordinates to its location in fold space, activating the Protoculture System, and having a Star Singer to direct its operation to open a super fold gate to the Megaroad-01's location in fold space. Edited October 6, 2022 by Seto Kaiba Quote
Bolt Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 Lol. Ok. So.. Reveal hidden contents Is there any explanation given as to why the Megaroad is damaged so badly on its starboard side? Quote
Mommar Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 4:26 PM, Seto Kaiba said: Probably not, given that... Reveal hidden contents ... the Megaroad-01 itself is the thing stuck in a fold fault. Early emigrant ships like the Megaroad-class were not exactly comfortable or enjoyable places to live long-term. So much so, in fact, that occasional riots because of the living conditions were common enough for the New UN Government to commission a countermeasure for them. Testing of the prototype went... poorly. In a very public manner. You would know it as the Sharon Apple Incident. She was designed to use mild hypnosis to help suppress rioting and help the emigrant population Keep Calm and Carry On. Being stuck on one of those ships for decades would probably be a profoundly unpleasant experience. By the specs, the YF-29's flight performance is around 20% higher than the YF-30's. All in all, Leon did have a bit of an advantage in that the fight with Rod took place inside of a base where Rod couldn't leverage the YF-29's maneuverability. Reveal hidden contents . He (and Milia) had VF-25s in the novelization of the second Macross Frontier movie. Or even just giving Max a Siegfried with the FSW after Delta Flight changed to the Kairos Plus. Expand But they've already sold us two blue 25's and a three blue 31's. Quote
kalvasflam Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 10:05 PM, Mommar said: But they've already sold us two blue 25's and a three blue 31's. Expand Just shut up and by the new blue VFs, otherwise, your collection will never be complete. And if you don't buy the red Valks, think how lonely the blue valks will be, or their offspring Purple Valks. 🤣 Quote
Bolt Posted October 6, 2022 Posted October 6, 2022 Holding out for the (BLUE) YF-21 Bandai promised/teased! Lol. Maybe the next Macross series or OVA needs a retro VF-22 storyline. I mean , they did Zero like decades after SDFM! Quote
Seto Kaiba Posted October 7, 2022 Posted October 7, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 9:36 PM, Bolt said: Lol. Ok. So.. Reveal hidden contents Is there any explanation given as to why the Megaroad is damaged so badly on its starboard side? Expand Misa is really bad at parallel parking. Reveal hidden contents Now, in all seriousness, the damage to the Megaroad-01 was almost certainly caused by the ship's initial contact with the unusually intense fold fault it is now caught in. Fold faults have been presented as fairly dangerous phenomena with the potential to severely damage or even destroy ships since the concept was first introduced in Macross Frontier. The New UN Government's cover story for the loss of the 117th Research Fleet in 2048 was that the fleet was destroyed in a fold accident when they encountered an unexpectedly intense fold fault. Macross Chronicle one-upped it by indicating that several emigrant fleets had gone missing due to fold faults. One of the technology sheets asserts that attempting to forcibly cross a fold fault carries a "risk of disaster". In Macross Delta's TV anime, it is said that Windermere IV was discovered by accident when Megaroad-04 encountered the fold fault surrounding the planet and were forced back into realspace by the resultant damage. On 10/6/2022 at 10:05 PM, Mommar said: But they've already sold us two blue 25's and a three blue 31's. Expand Yeah, and the liner notes actually mention that there was concern about even giving Max a blue YF-29 because they were concerned it being a YF-29 might get it mistaken for Alto's or its blue paintjob and Frontier connection might get it mistaken for Michael's. Regardless of model, it was going to be Blue Valkyrie No.2 in the movie since blue is also Hayate's signature color. (Master File also offers a blue paintjob for an Emerald Force VF-25.) Quote
kajnrig Posted October 9, 2022 Posted October 9, 2022 I managed to source a viewing, and I made it roughly halfway through before calling it quits. I might finish it, but boy, do I just not care. At all. I am so ready to move on from Delta, or at least whichever creative voices are responsible for Delta. I had really hoped that this movie would learn from the ample criticism leveled at the show and first movie and discard all excess baggage to hone in on executing the fundamentals. But the first hour of it is just more of the same. There's like twelve movies/shows/OVAs' worth of workable ideas stuffed into this, and it focuses on absolutely none of them. I can't even get excited at the introduction of nostalgia trap Max Jenius when it's just one more of a mass of hastily-introduced plot developments. The only positive of the film is the Yami Q-Ray music, and that's not nearly good enough to save the film. Quote
David Hingtgen Posted October 10, 2022 Posted October 10, 2022 The 10 mins of the new Frontier short has more feels and more impactful music than all of Zettai. Just imagine if it'd been reversed----10 mins of Delta, a full new movie for Frontier... Quote
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