Star Trek: Picard (CBS All-Access)

[lechuck]

 

[sh9000]

Maybe the season 3 blu-ray will go up for order on Picard Day 6/16.

[Thom]

I have no problem with the Titan-A being renamed Enterprise-G, but I think what they should do is show a brand new ship. first of her class named Titan-B.

[borgified]

If they want a new Titan B, where the heck is Starfleet going to get the raw materials?  
 

The major ship dock has been destroyed, very limited amount of resources are available (LaForge is still kit bashing the Enterprise D at the OG Spacedock after getting a hold of the Ross Class Syracuse Engineering Section) and whatever else is happening at the same time.

[azrael]

3 hours ago, borgified said:

 (LaForge is still kit bashing the Enterprise D at the OG Spacedock after getting a hold of the Ross Class Syracuse Engineering Section)

The USS Syracuse was a Galaxy-class, not a Ross-class.

[Seto Kaiba]

5 hours ago, borgified said:

If they want a new Titan B, where the heck is Starfleet going to get the raw materials?  
 

The major ship dock has been destroyed, very limited amount of resources are available (LaForge is still kit bashing the Enterprise D at the OG Spacedock after getting a hold of the Ross Class Syracuse Engineering Section) and whatever else is happening at the same time.

A major shipyard was destroyed.

Utopia Planetia wasn't even the only Starfleet shipyard in Earth's solar system. It's implied that it was the largest and most prestigious shipyard in the Sol system and possibly in the Federation as a whole, but it's one of at least 19 shipyards that have been mentioned over the years. Captain Sisko's USS Defiant was built at the Antares shipyards for instance, and quite a lot of ships were built in the San Francisco yards in Earth orbit including several of the Enterprises and the Titan.

As to why Geordi appropriated the stardrive section from the USS Syracuse, that probably has less to do with resources and more to do with the fact that the Galaxy-class was old, obsolete, and quite rare to boot. At least one Galaxy class ship was lost before the Battle of Wolf 359, and that battle was what prompted Starfleet to radically rethink its approach to starship design. Several more were lost after that point, including the Enterprise-D and the Odyssey, and it's likely several more suffered critical damage or were lost in the many fleet engagements of the Dominion war. With the class already considered obsolete and many examples no longer in service, building a whole new stardrive section to complete a museum piece was probably considered a waste of resources when they could simply pull a complete one from a decommissioned sister ship and just repaint its markings.

As far as raw materials go... It's worth remembering that quite a lot of starship construction involves industrial replicators. They're very likely recycling garbage, wreckage, and other salvage into fresh starship parts

Edited June 11, 2023 by Seto Kaiba

[JB0]

4 hours ago, borgified said:

If they want a new Titan B, where the heck is Starfleet going to get the raw materials?  

They're just going to rename the Enterprise-G that was under construction to Titan-B.

The marking guys are working overtime, since they only just finished painting over the LAST designation.  The hull probably started as the Defiant-C.

[borgified]

Back to Starfleet Academy I go and get a refresher for being out of sync. 

[Seto Kaiba]

14 hours ago, JB0 said:

They're just going to rename the Enterprise-G that was under construction to Titan-B.

The marking guys are working overtime, since they only just finished painting over the LAST designation.  The hull probably started as the Defiant-C.

It's not ablative armor... it's just far too many coats of paint from repeated renamings.

[sh9000]

Patrick Stewart reflects on Picard season 3.

[TangledThorns]

3 episodes in and its a lot better than the previous two seasons. Though the second season set a really low bar, really really low.

That being said the VFX is amazing compared to what we had back during the TNG days.

 

[Seto Kaiba]

7 minutes ago, TangledThorns said:

3 episodes in and its a lot better than the previous two seasons. Though the second season set a really low bar, really really low.

It is... but it's basically pure fanservice.

 

7 minutes ago, TangledThorns said:

That being said the VFX is amazing compared to what we had back during the TNG days.

That's another really low bar to clear.  They did their best back in the day, but the tech has come a loooooooooooong way.

[sh9000]

https://www.startrek.com/news/star-trek-picard-final-season-complete-series-legacy-collection

Happy Picard Day.  I think I'll order the Season 3 Blu-ray Steelbook.

[borgified]

https://deadline.com/2023/06/star-trek-picard-patrick-stewart-gates-mcfadden-jonathan-frakes-interview-1235414808/

[sh9000]

https://a.co/d/ii8cdZx

https://www.target.com/p/ka-star-trek-picard-final-season-steelbook-blu-ray-blu-ray/-/A-89412585

Blu-ray Steelbook

 

https://a.co/d/hsFybUg

https://www.target.com/p/star-trek-picard-final-season-blu-ray-blu-ray-2023/-/A-89407550

Blu-ray

Edited June 21, 2023 by sh9000

[borgified]

Edit: If you look closely at timestamp 1:17, there is a Q-Rau (and a VF-1?) at the far left corner of the screen. Plus more Macross related mecha along the way near the 13:00 mark.  

 

Edited June 21, 2023 by borgified

[Thom]

That was a great clip and I loved the closer look at the ships. What detail!!

And anyone else catch the familiar face in the background at 13:26?

[borgified]

[borgified]

Note: Due to time limitations, there is no Trek Quiz or Stuck on a Deserted Island.

[borgified]

Looking back on Older Tweets...

From David Blass (June 8)

From Wil (creator of the first Legacy poster a la TOS Undiscovered Country {?} ) on  June 20

From Trek Core (June 19)

@sh9000:  Is the newer Picard ships (above) in the Star Trek: Ships of the Line calendar or not?   

[TangledThorns]

Finished the season3/series finale. Way better than the previous two however...

1. Nostalgia is getting old in sci-fi & fantasy and is probably dooming it.
2. BORG as plot line is tired, was already used in the previous seasons too.
3. Revenge plots are old AF too.

 

That being said I just realized Amanda Plummer's (Vadic) father played a villain in Star Trek 6 too.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 28, 2023 by TangledThorns

[sh9000]

@borgified AFAIK the only ships in the calendar are the ones shown in these pics.

[Thom]

4 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

Finished the season3/series finale. Way better than the previous two however...

1. Nostalgia is getting old in sci-fi & fantasy and is probably dooming it.
2. BORG as plot line is tired, was already used in the previous seasons too.
3. Revenge plots are old AF too.

 

That being said I just realized Amanda Plummer's (Vadic) father played a villain in Star Trek 6 too.

Really agree about point 2. I think they were doing really well with the Changeling plot and putting the Borg in only muddled it up at the end. Still enjoyable, but just once again with too many villains.

[Seto Kaiba]

9 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

Finished the season3/series finale. Way better than the previous two however...

1. Nostalgia is getting old in sci-fi & fantasy and is probably dooming it.
2. BORG as plot line is tired, was already used in the previous seasons too.
3. Revenge plots are old AF too.

Yeah, season three is pretty much pure nostalgia-fodder.

The Borg... yeah... and it doesn't help that, because Star Trek: Voyager did so much more with the Borg and the Borg Queen than The Next Generation and its movies ever did, Picard's third and final season feels like the coda of Jean-Luc's adventures is him on janitorial duty cleaning up the crumbs of Sisko and Janeway's adventures.  The Dominion War was Sisko's thing and and Janeway's the one responsible for the dire straits the Borg found themselves in.

It almost feels like the Borg Queen came back to get revenge on the wrong person... future!Admiral Janeway is already dead, but she and now!Admiral Janeway are the ones who wrecked the Borg Collective's sh*t so comprehensively they're down to a single barely operational cube.

It could've been handled better, but at least it was better than the two previous seasons.  We'll take what we can get, right?

 

9 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

That being said I just realized Amanda Plummer's (Vadic) father played a villain in Star Trek 6 too.

Pretty much the entire reason they cast her, if you take their press releases at face value.

[Thom]

9 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Yeah, season three is pretty much pure nostalgia-fodder.

The Borg... yeah... and it doesn't help that, because Star Trek: Voyager did so much more with the Borg and the Borg Queen than The Next Generation and its movies ever did, Picard's third and final season feels like the coda of Jean-Luc's adventures is him on janitorial duty cleaning up the crumbs of Sisko and Janeway's adventures.  The Dominion War was Sisko's thing and and Janeway's the one responsible for the dire straits the Borg found themselves in.

It almost feels like the Borg Queen came back to get revenge on the wrong person... future!Admiral Janeway is already dead, but she and now!Admiral Janeway are the ones who wrecked the Borg Collective's sh*t so comprehensively they're down to a single barely operational cube.

It could've been handled better, but at least it was better than the two previous seasons.  We'll take what we can get, right?

 

Pretty much the entire reason they cast her, if you take their press releases at face value.

I never felt that Picard was cleaning up anyone else's mess. He was the first to face the Borg and really had the closest association with the Queen - at least until she turned her eyes on Data.If you think about it. other than Q there were really no other big bads for Picard, as they took care of both in Season 2. Well, except for Q and his inconvenient way of understanding death better than us corporeal flesh bags. In this, I felt the Changeling threat was big enough.

[borgified]

The changeling threat was actually presented in DS9 @Thom. Feels like this version of the Changeling threat was slightly watered down for the this last season of Picard (its been years since I last saw DS9 so I could be wrong).    

[Seto Kaiba]

5 hours ago, Thom said:

I never felt that Picard was cleaning up anyone else's mess. He was the first to face the Borg and really had the closest association with the Queen - at least until she turned her eyes on Data.If you think about it. other than Q there were really no other big bads for Picard, as they took care of both in Season 2. Well, except for Q and his inconvenient way of understanding death better than us corporeal flesh bags. In this, I felt the Changeling threat was big enough.

He kind of is, though...

While Jean-Luc Picard was the first Starfleet Captain to encounter the Borg and he did suffer at their hands and might even consider them his most bitter enemy, that feeling was never mutual.  The Borg Collective's villain decay might've started on Jean-Luc's watch in Star Trek: First Contact with the reinvention of the Borg as cyber-zombies controlled by a Queen, but it was Star Trek: Voyager that really put them through the wringer when they were coopted as recurring antagonists.  Janeway made enough of a nuisance of herself in her encounters with the Borg for the Queen to be her signature antagonist and for the Borg Queen to absolutely loathe her after the first few run-ins.  Janeway was also the one to put the Borg in the dire state we see in Star Trek: Picard.  Future!Janeway from "Endgame" infected the Borg Queen with that neurolytic pathogen that wiped out almost the entire Collective and left the Borg Queen cannibalizing drones to stay barely alive on the one remaining functional Borg cube.

Likewise, it was Benjamin Sisko who was really the nemesis of the Founders.  He made first contact with the Dominion.  He was the one the Dominion used to benchmark the Federation's reactions to the Dominion, the commander of the most important military installation in the entire Dominion War, and commanded several key offensives that led directly to the Dominion's defeat.  He was also basically Starfleet's expert on changeling infiltration.  Sisko's true nemesis was Gul Dukat, but the Founders and Dominion were something of an overlapping interest after Cardassia joined the war and Dukat became the Founders representative governing Cardassia.

Jean-Luc Picard's nemesis was, if anyone, Q.  But they wasted Q on that god-awful second season and quite honestly Picard's relationship with Q came to a more logical end in "All Good Things".

 

 

25 minutes ago, borgified said:

The changeling threat was actually presented in DS9 @Thom. Feels like this version of the Changeling threat was slightly watered down for the this last season of Picard (its been years since I last saw DS9 so I could be wrong).    

Significantly watered down... it's actually a bit of a plot hole.

Whatever changed about how the rogue Founders shapeshift that allowed them to pass undetected despite the anti-changeling measures from the Dominion War, it left them with the weaksauce weaknesses that were previously unique to Odo and attributed to him being an inexperienced shapeshifter.  The Founders used to be undetectable and able to hold their shape indefinitely.  These new ones need to return to their liquid state for several hours a day and when they go too long between rests their disguise starts to slip.

[Thom]

5 hours ago, borgified said:

The changeling threat was actually presented in DS9 @Thom. Feels like this version of the Changeling threat was slightly watered down for the this last season of Picard (its been years since I last saw DS9 so I could be wrong).    

Oh, I know. I watched the series.

4 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

He kind of is, though...

While Jean-Luc Picard was the first Starfleet Captain to encounter the Borg and he did suffer at their hands and might even consider them his most bitter enemy, that feeling was never mutual.  The Borg Collective's villain decay might've started on Jean-Luc's watch in Star Trek: First Contact with the reinvention of the Borg as cyber-zombies controlled by a Queen, but it was Star Trek: Voyager that really put them through the wringer when they were coopted as recurring antagonists.  Janeway made enough of a nuisance of herself in her encounters with the Borg for the Queen to be her signature antagonist and for the Borg Queen to absolutely loathe her after the first few run-ins.  Janeway was also the one to put the Borg in the dire state we see in Star Trek: Picard.  Future!Janeway from "Endgame" infected the Borg Queen with that neurolytic pathogen that wiped out almost the entire Collective and left the Borg Queen cannibalizing drones to stay barely alive on the one remaining functional Borg cube.

Likewise, it was Benjamin Sisko who was really the nemesis of the Founders.  He made first contact with the Dominion.  He was the one the Dominion used to benchmark the Federation's reactions to the Dominion, the commander of the most important military installation in the entire Dominion War, and commanded several key offensives that led directly to the Dominion's defeat.  He was also basically Starfleet's expert on changeling infiltration.  Sisko's true nemesis was Gul Dukat, but the Founders and Dominion were something of an overlapping interest after Cardassia joined the war and Dukat became the Founders representative governing Cardassia.

Jean-Luc Picard's nemesis was, if anyone, Q.  But they wasted Q on that god-awful second season and quite honestly Picard's relationship with Q came to a more logical end in "All Good Things".

 

 

Significantly watered down... it's actually a bit of a plot hole.

Whatever changed about how the rogue Founders shapeshift that allowed them to pass undetected despite the anti-changeling measures from the Dominion War, it left them with the weaksauce weaknesses that were previously unique to Odo and attributed to him being an inexperienced shapeshifter.  The Founders used to be undetectable and able to hold their shape indefinitely.  These new ones need to return to their liquid state for several hours a day and when they go too long between rests their disguise starts to slip.

And yes, Janeway (young and old) did a lot to damage the Borg. And yes, Sisko dealt with the Founders and the Dominion war, I just don't see that as 'possessive,' in that no one else can battle them for plot. Picard dealt with the Borg first and then Janeway did, which is fitting seeing as she was in their neck of the galaxy, but that didn't mean that Voyager was poaching another's enemy for themselves. It's all a shared universe after all, with the flip-side being, if I recall correctly, during DS9's Dominion War, there were questions as to where was the Enterprise during the whole thing?  So, I don't see any problem with STP using them, in that they are enemies of the Federation as a whole, except for the fact that they were bait-n-switch bag guys - whereas the Changelings were already enough.

Edited June 29, 2023 by Thom

[sh9000]

Less than 3 months until the blu-ray release of season 3.  Ended up ordering the steelbook at Target which had the cheaper price.

[Seto Kaiba]

2 hours ago, Thom said:

And yes, Janeway (young and old) did a lot to damage the Borg. And yes, Sisko dealt with the Founders and the Dominion war, I just don't see that as 'possessive,' in that no one else can battle them for plot.

I don't disagree... but in a long-running series or franchise like this, there's always going to be That One Enemy who has more chemistry and screen time with a particular member of the cast and becomes "their" villain.

Jean-Luc Picard's signature antagonist has always been Q.  Q was TNG's first AND last villain, and he had more face time with Picard than any other character.  Even when he was on other Trek shows, Q always found a way to work Picard into whatever he was doing.  The Borg Queen might've been introduced in a TNG movie, but almost all her appearances were in VOY, it's Janeway's name she was snarling in frustration in most of her appearances, and it's VOY that brought the Borg so low.

It's not that they're exclusive, just that the Borg Queen's way more associated with Janeway than Picard... esp. since we're seeing the Borg Queen in the aftermath of what the two Janeways did to her.  It doesn't really feel like a final showdown for Picard because he only ever fought the Borg Queen once, and even then Data did all the heavy lifting.  It lacks a certain je ne sais quoi when it comes to a main character's final showdown, y'know?

 

2 hours ago, Thom said:

Picard dealt with the Borg first and then Janeway did, which is fitting seeing as she was in their neck of the galaxy, but that didn't mean that Voyager was poaching another's enemy for themselves.

I mean, they kinda did in a way.

The TNG writer's room considered the Borg to be Too Awesome To Use, which is why they appeared so infrequently in the series and only had two direct confrontations with the crew of the Enterprise prior to First Contact.  It was VOY's writers who decided to use the Borg as a recurring antagonist in a similar vein to the Klingons and instigated the villain decay that landed them in the mess they're in in Picard.  The Borg are in the state they're in not because of anything Picard did, but because of EVERYTHING Janeway did.

 

2 hours ago, Thom said:

if I recall correctly, during DS9's Dominion War, there were questions as to where was the Enterprise during the whole thing?  So, I don't see any problem with STP using them, in that they are enemies of the Federation as a whole, except for the fact that they were bait-n-switch bag guys - whereas the Changelings were already enough.

There is that, yeah... but the Dominion War was largely fought by the Jem'Hadar, the Breen, and the Cardassians.  The Enterprise crew fought in the war, but it was Sisko's lot who had most of the contact with the Founders because they had Odo and proximity to the wormhole.

If you're doing a big finale for one of the franchise's most iconic characters, you'd want the final villain to have some serious personal resonance for that character right?  Picard's never had any involvement with the Founders and, well, the Borg Queen's less his nemesis and more an annoying ex who's spent more time at loggerheads with Janeway than him.  Q's the one who bookended Picard's entire experience, and they wasted him on season two.

[JB0]

4 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

 

Jean-Luc Picard's signature antagonist has always been Q.  Q was TNG's first AND last villain, and he had more face time with Picard than any other character.  Even when he was on other Trek shows, Q always found a way to work Picard into whatever he was doing. 

It is kinda funny that Q is Picard's signature antagonist, when Q considered Picard the closest thing in the universe he had to a friend.

...

Was Q just tsundere?

[Thom]

14 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

...

If you're doing a big finale for one of the franchise's most iconic characters, you'd want the final villain to have some serious personal resonance for that character right?  Picard's never had any involvement with the Founders and, well, the Borg Queen's less his nemesis and more an annoying ex who's spent more time at loggerheads with Janeway than him.  Q's the one who bookended Picard's entire experience, and they wasted him on season two.

Definitely agree that Q should have been third season rather than second. As to villains, I don't mind if they trade them off, AFAIC. Having only on crew (cast) dealing primary with one enemy seems rather restrictive in story telling. They can trade trade off enemies seeing as they are a shared universe and then have fuller stories and interactions. They don't feel so encapsulated that way.

[Seto Kaiba]

13 hours ago, JB0 said:

It is kinda funny that Q is Picard's signature antagonist, when Q considered Picard the closest thing in the universe he had to a friend.

...

Was Q just tsundere?

There is definitely some bromance there on Q's side.

... wait, does this make Q Jack's atemporal stepfather?

... on further note, was the reason Q hit Janeway up for help with family planning because Jean-Luc had already shot him down?

I feel like this could veer into some dangerous fan-fiction territory VERY quickly.

 

2 hours ago, Thom said:

Definitely agree that Q should have been third season rather than second. As to villains, I don't mind if they trade them off, AFAIC. Having only on crew (cast) dealing primary with one enemy seems rather restrictive in story telling. They can trade trade off enemies seeing as they are a shared universe and then have fuller stories and interactions. They don't feel so encapsulated that way.

Yeah, I know... it's a shared universe and all, but even in shared universes some protagonist/antagonist pairings just feel proprietary y'know?

When the Joker's the big bad, everyone expects Batman.  It's the same thing here.

Yeah, Jean-Luc has history with the Borg... but it was Kathryn Janeway who was the Wrecker of the Borg's sh*t on a repeat basis for three entire seasons and a series finale which resulted in an offscreen Borg genocide that set up the entire third season of Picard.

[pengbuzz]

...

Edited July 13, 2023 by pengbuzz

[Thom]

11 hours ago, pengbuzz said:

 

Until the next Trek series, which brings in the hitherto unknown male Borg ruler, whom seeks to re-establish the collective:

  Hide contents

Wait for it...

  Hide contents

Hence....The Borger King.