Avengers: Endgame

[Mommar]

Wow, it’s a good thing spoilers don’t bother me (and I already read them).  I’m waiting at the theater now and just had a Homer Simpson leaves The Empire Strikes Back moment.

[David Hingtgen]

6 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

Was there an intermission? If not, I'm gonna have to wait till it comes to Disney+ or VOD, ugh. 

Two spots good for a bathroom break:

1.  About an hour in----incredibly tiny spoiler, only spoils "the location of a place that some people in the movie travel to that we all saw in the trailer anyways, though it wasn't labeled/super-obvious to everyone where it was":

Spoiler

Screen will show "Tokyo"---go right then.  The next couple minutes are totally missable, and shown/implied by the trailer

2.  About an hour and a half in, or a bit more, like 1:45----pretty minor/vague spoiler, and you'll miss a smidge of the plot, but far better than picking a place at random and missing a critical moment:

Spoiler

Screen will show "New Jersey" and it'll be a fairly dusty opening couple seconds----watch like the first minute, just to "establish the scene" and figure out what's their plan/what's likely to happen next----then go, and come back and see the result---it should be pretty apparent/expected what happened, though you may miss a moment that'll make a later event a bit less direct/important/emotional/satisfying

 

Don't dare go during the last hour.  But you can get up and go the second the credits start rolling, no mid/post-credit scenes. 

[seti88]

1 hour ago, sh9000 said:

 

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Are there 2 Captain Americas at the end?  There’s the aged one but what about the one in the timeline that was visited?  Is he still frozen or did he die?

There were so many cameos in this movie.  It would have been nice to see Vision and Maria Hill but what was shown was damn cool.

 

 

Spoiler

Logically there should be 2. The aged cap could have gone back and got married (to peggy based on the flashback) and lived an unassuming life.
He then appeared at the bench and passed falcon his version of the shield.

Yes it means there are 2 shields...and is the falcon the next captain america, when the other captain america wasnt the one passing him the shield.

Time travel shenanigans again..no point wrapping my thoughts around it...

 

[Mommar]

3 hours ago, seti88 said:

 

  Hide contents

Logically there should be 2. The aged cap could have gone back and got married (to peggy based on the flashback) and lived an unassuming life.
He then appeared at the bench and passed falcon his version of the shield.

Yes it means there are 2 shields...and is the falcon the next captain america, when the other captain america wasnt the one passing him the shield.

Time travel shenanigans again..no point wrapping my thoughts around it...

 

Spoiler

I think the both of you are really missing the bigger picture here.  Cap made out with his Granddaughter in Civil War.

 

[Golden Arms]

Awesome film.  Can't wait to see it again.

[Mommar]

I don't know how I feel about it.

 

Spoiler

Where did Cap leave Mjolnir?

 

Spoiler

Also, I don't think they technically fixed Loki escaping.

And just when in the hell is Wandavision going to take place?  After Civil War but before Infinity War?  I was really hoping they'd go the White Colored Vision Route for this film.

I'm of two minds about Falcon Cap.  Bucky was at least an enhanced human so wielding the shield makes more sense from a physical perspective.  Also they only ever give him rifles otherwise.  And in all three films they've teased him holding the shield like he would take over.  On the other hand Anthony Mackie is awesome.

 

Edited April 26, 2019 by Mommar

[Mog]

Just got back from watching it.

Nice ending with some fun callbacks:
 

Spoiler

 

Cap's elevator scene with the Hydra boys.

"On your left" from Winter Soldier.

The little grin shared between Wasp and Ant-Man ("If I was with you, you wouldn't have gotten caught.")

The silly horn on the van.

Proof that Tony Stark has a heart.

 

Also, was I the only one who thought, "WHO THE HELL IS THAT. . ."
 

Spoiler

 

. . . SCRAWNY, LONG HAIRED TEEN AT TONY'S FUNERAL?!! --(I had to look it up and found out it was the precocious kid that helped Tony in Iron Man 3.)

Loved how they ended Tony's story, but a little unsure about Cap's ending.  Guess the dude deserves a happy ending with Peggy Carter, but felt like a bit too much of a cheat. 

And how the heck are they still gonna do a Black Widow movie now that she's Soul Stone sacrificed?  Prequel?

 

Would have loved to have seen some tie in to the Marvel TV or Netflix shows, but it sucks that they couldn't pull it off or make it work storywise or contractually.

Spoiler

Yeah, we got Peggy and Jarvis from Agent Carter.  But five years later, Coulson is already long dead.  And damn, would have been fun to see Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider sling-ring his way in or Cage, Jessica Jones, or one of the Iron Fists pop up for the big show-down.

 

[seti88]

1 hour ago, Mommar said:

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I think the both of you are really missing the bigger picture here.  Cap made out with his Granddaughter in Civil War.

Spoiler

She wasnt cap's grandaughter in civil war. Peggy married someone else right?

 

 

1 hour ago, Mommar said:

I don't know how I feel about it.

 

  Hide contents

Where did Cap leave Mjolnir?

Spoiler

Cap better not forget to pass it back to thor....imagine leaving it in storage and noone would be able to move it!

  Hide contents

Also, I don't think they technically fixed Loki escaping.

And just when in the hell is Wandavision going to take place?  After Civil War but before Infinity War?  I was really hoping they'd go the White Colored Vision Route for this film.

I'm of two minds about Falcon Cap.  Bucky was at least an enhanced human so wielding the shield makes more sense from a physical perspective.  Also they only ever give him rifles otherwise.  And in all three films they've teased him holding the shield like he would take over.  On the other hand Anthony Mackie is awesome.

Spoiler

When cap returned the stone, wouldnt that remove alternate timelines, as mentioned by hulk to the ancient one?
So loki's escape would essentially cease to exist...

Same tots, bucky would better suit the shield, as he being an enhanced soldier. Not entirely sure abt the meaning, is the falcon going to be the next cap, or is he remaining the falcon but with a shield...if he turns out to be the new cap, then what happens to the other captain america which logically should also exist? brain hurts....i think am gonna take a nap... 

 

 

 

Edited April 26, 2019 by seti88

[Mog]

6 hours ago, sh9000 said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Are there 2 Captain Americas at the end?  There’s the aged one but what about the one in the timeline that was visited?  Is he still frozen or did he die?

There were so many cameos in this movie.  It would have been nice to see Vision and Maria Hill but what was shown was damn cool.

 

Spoiler

Maria Hill was there at Tony's funeral (back and to the right. . . . behind teen-aged Iron Man 3 kid).

Regarding Cap, here's my timeline (from Steve's perspective):

• Gets frozen in WWII;
• Unfrozen in 2000's;
• Endgame, Tony's Death;
• Goes back in time to put Stones back in place;
• Goes to 1950's (to dance with Peggy and enjoy life);
• Lives out life and waits for moment on bench.

So yeah, two Steve's in the timeline.  But probably avoid each most of the time. 

How he gets the second shield?  No friggen clue.  Guess, he asked Peggy to ask Howard Stark to make an extra one?

I did read an article that kinda explains my unease with Cap doing what he did.  Just not in his character.  He'd sit idly by while Hydra infiltrates SHIELD?!  The boy scout would hide away and not save every single person he could?  Just doesn't sound like the Cap we've seen in all these films.

As for Loki, I don't think Endgame Avengers saw him disappear with the Tesseract.  And it would be hard as stink for them to stop Loki without totally, utterly mucking everything up (especially with Robert Redford's character there and all the other past Avengers there at that moment).

 

[F18LEGIOSS]

1 hour ago, Mog said:

  Hide contents

Maria Hill was there at Tony's funeral (back and to the right. . . . behind teen-aged Iron Man 3 kid).

Regarding Cap, here's my timeline (from Steve's perspective):

• Gets frozen in WWII;
• Unfrozen in 2000's;
• Endgame, Tony's Death;
• Goes back in time to put Stones back in place;
• Goes to 1950's (to dance with Peggy and enjoy life);
• Lives out life and waits for moment on bench. 

So yeah, two Steve's in the timeline.  But probably avoid each most of the time. 

How he gets the second shield?  No friggen clue.  Guess, he asked Peggy to ask Howard Stark to make an extra one?

I did read an article that kinda explains my unease with Cap doing what he did.  Just not in his character.  He'd sit idly by while Hydra infiltrates SHIELD?!  The boy scout would hide away and not save every single person he could?  Just doesn't sound like the Cap we've seen in all these films.

As for Loki, I don't think Endgame Avengers saw him disappear with the Tesseract.  And it would be hard as stink for them to stop Loki without totally, utterly mucking everything up (especially with Robert Redford's character there and all the other past Avengers there at that moment).

 

Spoiler

 

There are two charaters who meet their twins: Captain and Nebula. One Nebula is shot dead, so no time disturbance for this character.

For captain, this is different: I agree wiith mog, he gets frozen in WW2, the cap from the future (Steve2) goes back in time, lives out life with Peggy. I think she is the only one who really knows what happens in the future, remember when she said: the best thing to do " is to start over " in captain america civil war? The original shield is developped by Howard Stark and is used by cap  until thanos breaks it apart in the original timeline. Peggy and Coulson should have helped Steve2 building Falcon's shield from the one not finished yet we saw in Iron man 2.  Steve2 might have spent his time working with other superheros we will see in the MCU like xmens,wolverine to prepare a future without Tony Stark.

 

Edited April 26, 2019 by F18LEGIOSS

[Dobber]

Had a lot of fun with this movie, so many great moments.

 

  Hide contents

Loved Captain Marvel destroying Thanos’s ship, the Cap vs Cap fight and “America’s ass” along with the “I can do this all day...yeah I know” Cap wielding the Hammer awesome! Personally, I did think the “Girl power” thing to get the Gauntlet through the line was a bit on the nose but whatever. Not that there is a problem with warrior woman just the blatant staging was cheese. 

 Tony’s end was touching, and I LOVED smart Hulk. I am kind of confused by the Falcon becoming the new Cap. I mean his oldest dearest friend is right there who is enhanced similarly to Steve. Just seemed an odd choice as Falcon is already....well...Falcon. 

 Also thank for pointing out who the kid was at Tony’s wake. I was totally confused.

[Mommar]

Anybody know how to spoiler tag from a phone?  I can’t respond to anything right now because of this seeming lack of feature.

[Mog]

2 minutes ago, Mommar said:

Anybody know how to spoiler tag from a phone?  I can’t respond to anything right now because of this seeming lack of feature.

I think you have to type:  "[ spoiler]" (just remove the space between the [ and the s), write your text, and then put in "[/spoiler]" at the very end.

. . . And I think I speak for most guys when I say

Spoiler

Thank you, Big THOR-Bowski!!

Now I can tell my wife, "Hey Babe!  I'm just trying to get that Chris Hemsworth bod'!" 

 

[Mommar]

48 minutes ago, Mog said:

I think you have to type:  "[ spoiler]" (just remove the space between the [ and the s), write your text, and then put in "[/spoiler]" at the very end.

. . . And I think I speak for most guys when I say

  Reveal hidden contents

Thank you, Big THOR-Bowski!!

Now I can tell my wife, "Hey Babe!  I'm just trying to get that Chris Hemsworth bod'!" 

 

That sort of helps.  But responses to spoilers by others are getting deleted.  My responses won’t make sense.

 

well crap, that one worked.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Mommar

[Mommar]

Redacted, spoiler tags did not work.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Mommar

[sh9000]

@Mommar your spoiler tags aren’t working.  You should delete all of that.

[sh9000]

 

 

[Lolicon]

Saw it. Great sendoff for the Avengers as we know them. I liked this one better than Infinity War.

[Dobber]

1 hour ago, Mog said:

I think you have to type:  "[ spoiler]" (just remove the space between the [ and the s), write your text, and then put in "[/spoiler]" at the very end.

 

 

That’s how I do it all the time.

Chris

Edited April 26, 2019 by Dobber

[Dobber]

3 minutes ago, Lolicon said:

Saw it. Great sendoff for the Avengers as we know them. I liked this one better than Infinity War.

Same here.

[azrael]

18 minutes ago, Mommar said:

Redacted, spoiler tags did not work.

You have to insert the tags yourself.

	[spoiler]<Insert spoiler here>[/spoiler]
	

[Mommar]

5 minutes ago, azrael said:

You have to insert the tags yourself.

	[spoiler]<Insert spoiler here>[/spoiler]
	

 

I know.  Did not work.

[renegadeleader1]

This movie had its moments, but it felt way too much like a muddled mess for my taste. Especially how everything got resolved.

Anyways, my question...

How the **** do you "put back" the soul stone? Unsacrifice someone? Also how do you think Cap is going to react to landing on the planet and finding out the guardian of the stone is the Red Skull?

[Dobber]

20 minutes ago, renegadeleader1 said:

This movie had its moments, but it felt way too much like a muddled mess for my taste. Especially how everything got resolved.

Anyways, my question...

 

  Hide contents

How the **** do you "put back" the soul stone? Unsacrifice someone? Also how do you think Cap is going to react to landing on the planet and finding out the guardian of the stone is the Red Skull?

 

couldn’t it just be given back to Red Skull?

Chris

[Dangard Ace]

13 hours ago, Mog said:

Just got back from watching it.

Nice ending with some fun callbacks:
 

  Hide contents

 

Cap's elevator scene with the Hydra boys.

"On your left" from Winter Soldier.

The little grin shared between Wasp and Ant-Man ("If I was with you, you wouldn't have gotten caught.")

The silly horn on the van.

Proof that Tony Stark has a heart.

 

Also, was I the only one who thought, "WHO THE HELL IS THAT. . ."
 

  Hide contents

 

. . . SCRAWNY, LONG HAIRED TEEN AT TONY'S FUNERAL?!! --(I had to look it up and found out it was the precocious kid that helped Tony in Iron Man 3.)

Loved how they ended Tony's story, but a little unsure about Cap's ending.  Guess the dude deserves a happy ending with Peggy Carter, but felt like a bit too much of a cheat. 

And how the heck are they still gonna do a Black Widow movie now that she's Soul Stone sacrificed?  Prequel?

 

Would have loved to have seen some tie in to the Marvel TV or Netflix shows, but it sucks that they couldn't pull it off or make it work storywise or contractually.

  Hide contents

Yeah, we got Peggy and Jarvis from Agent Carter.  But five years later, Coulson is already long dead.  And damn, would have been fun to see Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider sling-ring his way in or Cage, Jessica Jones, or one of the Iron Fists pop up for the big show-down.

 

You’re not the only one at The Who the hell is that scene.  

 

As for

Black widow movie.  If they follow the comic books peoples souls are sucked into the soul gem but they can also be released.  So Natasha could comeback if they down Adam warlock story

[Dobber]

poor Obi-Wan felt it in a galaxy Far Far Away.  After a certain physique is revealed 

[Gerli]

Amazing movie, loved it.

 

testing testing

Edited April 27, 2019 by Gerli

[Mog]

2 hours ago, Dobber said:

 

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poor Obi-Wan felt it in a galaxy Far Far Away.  After a certain physique is revealed 

 

 

Spoiler

 

The Thor-Bowski:  "Natalie Portman left me, I failed at my goals, and I became a chubby slob."

Vader:  "Hold my beer. . ."

 

 

[sh9000]

21 hours ago, seti88 said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Logically there should be 2. The aged cap could have gone back and got married (to peggy based on the flashback) and lived an unassuming life.
He then appeared at the bench and passed falcon his version of the shield.

Yes it means there are 2 shields...and is the falcon the next captain america, when the other captain america wasnt the one passing him the shield.

Time travel shenanigans again..no point wrapping my thoughts around it...

 

I think that might be it.

[Mommar]

19 hours ago, seti88 said:

 

 

For whatever reason the quoted text isn't showing up for you.

Spoiler

Concerning Peggy/Sharon.  Flash back to Winter Soldier when Steve visits Peggy.  She still has a picture of Steve.  And she never mentions any additional husband.  Wouldn't that have been a dick move to marry some other dude but keep around a photo of an old flame?  If you consider Peggy had a picture of Steve on her desk at work in New Jersey in the 70's as well it seems pretty clear they were always married and she knew it.  So that Granddaughter of hers, Sharon, is very likely his Granddaughter.  Maybe that's why Steve didn't want to tell Falcon who his wife ended up being?  lol

To your second point, no, putting the Tesseract back would not have fixed Loki's escape.  They jumped to Jersey because Loki made off with the Tesseract in NY.  The situation with The Ancient One is different.  Returning the Time Stone at the point it was taken would mean The Ancient One would have been able to keep using it as she would have and she would have passed it down to Strange as was intended too.  There was no way to "return" the Tesseract at the point Loki grabbed it and teleported away, that was a deviation.  Unless Steve went back to that point and prevented Tony2 from getting smacked in the head by the Hulk coming out of the stairwell and then he slipped the Tesseract back into their hands then Loki still made off with it there and the timeline split.

 

 

14 hours ago, Dobber said:

Had a lot of fun with this movie, so many great moments.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Loved Captain Marvel destroying Thanos’s ship, the Cap vs Cap fight and “America’s ass” along with the “I can do this all day...yeah I know” Cap wielding the Hammer awesome! Personally, I did think the “Girl power” thing to get the Gauntlet through the line was a bit on the nose but whatever. Not that there is a problem with warrior woman just the blatant staging was cheese. 

 Tony’s end was touching, and I LOVED smart Hulk. I am kind of confused by the Falcon becoming the new Cap. I mean his oldest dearest friend is right there who is enhanced similarly to Steve. Just seemed an odd choice as Falcon is already....well...Falcon. 

 Also thank for pointing out who the kid was at Tony’s wake. I was totally confused.

Spoiler

So in the comics, at one point, Steve's Super Soldier Serum goes away and he quickly ages to an old man.  At that point he gives the shield to Falcon and he becomes Captain America.  He has both the shield and Falcon Wings.  His costume actually looks pretty cool IMO.  The decision to do that was political on Marvel Comics part and they screwed with his personality to reflect that decision as well, no doubt the same political thinking was made on the part of the MCU as well.  I said before it makes more sense for Bucky to have the shield since he's an enhanced human like Steve was (in the comics Falcon is enhanced too.)  I just happen to be okay with the choice in the MCU even if it makes less sense because I respect Anthony Mackie and would like to see him be Captain America.

 

[seti88]

7 hours ago, sh9000 said:

I think that might be it.

 

4 hours ago, Mommar said:

For whatever reason the quoted text isn't showing up for you.

  Reveal hidden contents

Concerning Peggy/Sharon.  Flash back to Winter Soldier when Steve visits Peggy.  She still has a picture of Steve.  And she never mentions any additional husband.  Wouldn't that have been a dick move to marry some other dude but keep around a photo of an old flame?  If you consider Peggy had a picture of Steve on her desk at work in New Jersey in the 70's as well it seems pretty clear they were always married and she knew it.  So that Granddaughter of hers, Sharon, is very likely his Granddaughter.  Maybe that's why Steve didn't want to tell Falcon who his wife ended up being?  lol

To your second point, no, putting the Tesseract back would not have fixed Loki's escape.  They jumped to Jersey because Loki made off with the Tesseract in NY.  The situation with The Ancient One is different.  Returning the Time Stone at the point it was taken would mean The Ancient One would have been able to keep using it as she would have and she would have passed it down to Strange as was intended too.  There was no way to "return" the Tesseract at the point Loki grabbed it and teleported away, that was a deviation.  Unless Steve went back to that point and prevented Tony2 from getting smacked in the head by the Hulk coming out of the stairwell and then he slipped the Tesseract back into their hands then Loki still made off with it there and the timeline split.

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

So in the comics, at one point, Steve's Super Soldier Serum goes away and he quickly ages to an old man.  At that point he gives the shield to Falcon and he becomes Captain America.  He has both the shield and Falcon Wings.  His costume actually looks pretty cool IMO.  The decision to do that was political on Marvel Comics part and they screwed with his personality to reflect that decision as well, no doubt the same political thinking was made on the part of the MCU as well.  I said before it makes more sense for Bucky to have the shield since he's an enhanced human like Steve was (in the comics Falcon is enhanced too.)  I just happen to be okay with the choice in the MCU even if it makes less sense because I respect Anthony Mackie and would like to see him be Captain America.

 

Spoiler

I have half a theory that perhaps when future cap when back and settled in the past, he created his own reality.
And when he finally merged back to the reality of the bench scene,  my half baked quantum theory, suggests that all realities that do not conform to the singularity of that bench moment, are wiped out and thus maintaining only one version of everyone.

Oh well thats all i gonna think and talk abt it!

Oh and on iron man....

Spoiler

I just re-watched Iron man 1, and in starks last scene he said...I AM IRON MAN and everyone went gaga.....
And in endgame .... I AM IRON MAN! *SNAP* and everyone cried.....

Well played marvel, well played!
 

 

Edited April 27, 2019 by seti88

[Kanedas Bike]

Endgame was fantastic, between this, the Winter Soldier and Infinity War the Russo Brothers have directed the best of all of the MCU movies.

 

Spoiler

 

Guys, Sharon Carter is the niece of Peggy Carter, she has no blood relation to Steve, Future Steve, Past Steve or Quantum Steve.

 

 

-b.

 

[sh9000]

https://www.target.com/p/avengers-endgame-target-exclusive-4k-uhd-blu-ray-digital/-/A-54622698

[Black Valkyrie]

 

I really liked it and hated it at the same time but still I gave a A-. 

 

[kajnrig]

Saw it, enjoyed it massively.

Re: time travel shenanigans

I think of it as jumping into alternate universes rather than "traditional" looping back to an earlier point in the same timeline, and that solves pretty much any nagging issues I might have with it. I'm quite glad it wasn't a "simple" case of go back, prevent something from happening, and return to the future with everything "corrected." Going to alternate universes, borrowing their gems, and still having to come back and resolve things in your time/world, keeps things nice and neat.

Except for...

Re: Steve Rogers's ending

Obviously, the alternate universe idea doesn't hold water if Steve is able to jump to an alternate universe yet remain in this timeline. So... But meh. I won't stress the details. Wibbly-wobbly, timey-wimey stuff. The important thing was that the character finally got the happy ending he deserved.

Random points:

- Got a kick out of the "Hail Hydra" and the thing y'all were talking about about there being two Captain Americas, mostly because "Hey that's a nod to the comics! I get it!"

- Didn't enjoy quite so much Thor being played for laughs, but I knew that would be something I'd have to put up with since Ragnarok. Would have liked for him to reach out for the hammer, and it not come for a long time and he get dejected until it finally shows up. As much as Marvel is lighthearted this and that, the idea of "worthiness" is still a strong dramatic tool that the Russos could really have used to strengthen his character.

- By that same token, I would have liked for Thor to casually toss Mjolnir to Valkyrie at the end and she catches it before realizing what it is. Steve didn't need to take it with him.

- Carol Danvers once had a thing with Peter Parker in the comics (until apparently one of the Bad Spidey Writers decided to axe it, or so I hear), so their little interaction elicited a chuckle in the back of my mind.

- Also, great use of Captain Marvel, and great portrayal of her. Weirdly, I feel like she had way more... personality? That's not the right word, but I can't think of it right now... in here than she did in her own movie.

- I'm glad they didn't make Gamora's return nice and neat. Her just up and deciding to help, that was a bit contrived, but the end being left unresolved was a good decision.

- Double-bladed swords like Thanos has are super dumb and ugly and their breath smells, no wonder he lost.