Seto Kaiba Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 1 hour ago, Roy Focker said: Did you think that Tatsunoko would become friends with Big west again? The most logical approach would have been for Tatsunoko to pitch the idea of acting as international distributor for all Macross titles in exchange for clearing the legal obstacles... and there were some indications Tatsunoko was seeking a cordial relationship with Big West. Quote How many decades have they been suing each other? Approximately 0.133 decades... and that's counting the delays in the appeals process and court scheduling. There was a grand total of one actual lawsuit filed over Macross rights between Big West and Tatsunoko... Tatsunoko's 2004 claim that, for its role in producing the original series, it was entitled to a share of the profits from subsequent exploitation of the IP in the various sequels. The court unilaterally rejected Tatsunoko's claim on 1 July 2004, and again on appeal on 27 October 2005. The cases most fans refer to when they think of "Macross lawsuit" are voluntary copyright confirmation hearings that weren't instigated by either party... but rather, by Harmony Gold's false claims to have rights to all Macross sequels back in 1999-2000. That wasn't acrimonious, as such, that was simply due dilligence after one side's business partner (Harmony Gold) made a claim that didn't tally with what the two had understood their contract to be. That there is a long, arduous, and ongoing history of lawsuits between Big West and Tatsunoko is a popular but entirely false myth perpetuated by Robotech fans and Harmony Gold. The whole shebang, from copyright confirmation hearings to Tatsunoko's one and only actual lawsuit, only lasted four years (2001-2005). Quote How many decades have Tatsunoko been in partnership with HG? Too many, but their partnership has been an acrimonious one over the last several years given that Tatsunoko accused HG of skimming from royalties owed for home video and streaming and was firm enough in their belief to not only go to court over it, but defy a court order when the arbitration didn't find in their favor.
no3Ljm Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 58 minutes ago, akt_m said: Anyone who gives money to Harmony Gold and buy any Robotech merch should be considered a traitor. Ouch. Guess, I’m one of them since I purchased Minmay and Rick figure recently from KitzConcept and considering the Rick 1/6 figure from Kids Logic. Now let’s just hope that the other members who just bought a cool looking VF-1 cockpit centerpiece that lights up and play sound for $1400 and those cool $230 VF-1’s Head light-up display didn’t see your post.
no3Ljm Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 Next 35 years. Hmmm. By then, probably my grandchildren is already playing with cool looking next gen transforming planes, while HG still stuck promoting how cool the everlasting Veritech is. At this point, I’m already done hoping. Besides, the original creators already moved on. And we still able to get our SDF Macross fix somewhere, so it’s still good. As long that Kawamori still wants to make new Macross series and cool looking Valkyries, I’m pretty much still in.
Bolt Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 (edited) “Anyone who gives money to Harmony Gold and buy any Robotech merch should be considered a traitor.” I understand how you may feel. I don’t buy anything RT. But I won’t judge others for going there , just as I wouldn’t judge them for how they vote or worship. In my perfect world hg would lose out and BW would be Stateside.( That’s very simplistic but you get the idea.) I’m all about boycotting anything rt, and being in solidarity with others who feel the same, but won’t be wasting energy hating on others who don’t. Edited July 6, 2019 by Bolt
azrael Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 4 hours ago, Dynaman said: Did they still lose the rights to the fighting kite and the name Macross? If yes then their stranglehold on Macross other then the original show is done. If not then well... Or was that only in the UK? Only in the UK. Whatever was in effect before the announcement is still in effect after the announcement. We're exactly in the same spot we were before the announcement.
Seto Kaiba Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, akt_m said: Anyone who gives money to Harmony Gold and buy any Robotech merch should be considered a traitor. Eh... "traitor" is a bit childish and hyperbolic, but I do think we as a community should actively discourage discussion and promotion of the imitation-brand Macross goods produced by Harmony Gold and its licensees here and on Facebook. It's not real Macross merchandise and not only does it not support Macross's creators and the creation of new Macross products, it actively hurts Macross fans worldwide by directly putting money in the pockets of the people working to keep Macross products out of the hands of fans. There's no reason for the community to condone financially supporting a company that is deliberately trying to undermine Macross. I think just making it clear that this kind of thing hurts the fandom should be enough. Solidarity with our fellow fans is important, especially when we can't get direct support from the owners of the property. Edited July 6, 2019 by Seto Kaiba
davidwhangchoi Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 4 hours ago, seti88 said: and the invid hive grew stronger on protoculture and started their own band, the invoids, to counter sound force. invid will become varji. crystal earrings and a hobo prostitute nimp will beat them. then Minmay will come back from the center of the galaxy biologically create genetic clone singers while Max will have crappy offspring that can't fly or get a guy.
akt_m Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 IMO what BigWest should do is to rebrand the macross franchise as a whole, if they could create a good sequel with a new title without "macross" on it, then the rest of the macross could then be released worldwide under this new title. I have the impression what HG really wants is to profit anything from the macross sequels without doing anything.
jenius Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 Agreed, I still think they should animate Macross the First, come up with a new name for the series outside of Japan, then export the First and all the sequels under the new name.
Knight26 Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 30 minutes ago, jenius said: Agreed, I still think they should animate Macross the First, come up with a new name for the series outside of Japan, then export the First and all the sequels under the new name. I like this idea, let's come up with some names that would still be recognizable as Macross, yet thumb their nose at HG. I'll get started. Nothing too insulting, just enough to poke the bear. SDF-MacroTech SDF-Robocross SDF-Goldcross SDF-Macrogold SDF-MacroHarmony Sorry not feeling the most creative today, but it got me laughing. Or heck just go back to the original working title: SDF-Megalord/Megaroad
jenius Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 45 minutes ago, Bolt said: Isn’t part of the issue also the mecha designs? From a merchandising perspective, yes, so the question would be if new paint schemes would be enough if a differentiation to sell VF-1 toys. Since BW owns the IP it might be enough, I wonder if Jetfire's existence would help that argument, a lawyer would need to weigh in.
Seto Kaiba Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 1 hour ago, Bolt said: Isn’t part of the issue also the mecha designs? Yes, HG has trademarks on not just the title and certain key terms, but also certain pieces of key art like the characters from the original series and some of the mecha. The approach they're talking about here is not workable for that reason.
cjcastan Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 9 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said: Yes, HG has trademarks on not just the title and certain key terms, but also certain pieces of key art like the characters from the original series and some of the mecha. The approach they're talking about here is not workable for that reason. They should Yamato 2199 it but call it megaroad, and change the VF1 designs and call it a day.
jvmacross Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 So I guess KitzConcept's license to produce more awesome 1/12 figures from the "Macross Saga" line is no longer in danger? Robotech or not, they are making stuff Bandai and other Japanese licensees just do not seem to be interested in releasing. I don't care if it is a Robotech or Macross license....whoever makes stuff I actually want to buy gets a portion of my money.
Einherjar Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 For some reason I am much more interested what Kawamori’s the overall plan is for Lady M.
Seto Kaiba Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 52 minutes ago, Einherjar said: For some reason I am much more interested what Kawamori’s the overall plan is for Lady M. They were pretty open about not having one... they never bothered to even decide who she was when they were making the series.
no3Ljm Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 1 hour ago, cjcastan said: They should Yamato 2199 it but call it megaroad, and change the VF1 designs and call it a day. Isn’t that’s what Kawamori and the gang are doing moving forward on their Macross sequels? Besides, from our gurus here, they already mentioned that Kawamori is not a big fan of retelling or going back to old stories. Correct me if I’m wrong though. Anyways, I think it’s really about time for us to move forward on it too. Whether we like it or not. I mean, it’s already been signed and done — again. Now, it’s just up to us individuals. Don’t worry I’m not going to judge anyone here esp on how they spend their money.
no3Ljm Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 1 hour ago, jvmacross said: So I guess KitzConcept's license to produce more awesome 1/12 figures from the "Macross Saga" line is no longer in danger? Robotech or not, they are making stuff Bandai and other Japanese licensees just do not seem to be interested in releasing. I don't care if it is a Robotech or Macross license....whoever makes stuff I actually want to buy gets a portion of my money. Same here. I’m thinking the same thing. If Bandai’s not making it and it’s the only thing available in the market. And as long the quality is good and I like, I’m all for it.
JB0 Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 16 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said: They were pretty open about not having one... they never bothered to even decide who she was when they were making the series. Doctor Chiba in drag, I'm tellin' ya!
Seto Kaiba Posted July 6, 2019 Posted July 6, 2019 1 minute ago, JB0 said: Doctor Chiba in drag, I'm tellin' ya! That was my hypothesis as well.
Lolicon Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 4 hours ago, davidwhangchoi said: invid will become varji. crystal earrings and a hobo prostitute nimp will beat them. then Minmay will come back from the center of the galaxy biologically create genetic clone singers while Max will have crappy offspring that can't fly or get a guy. I nearly did a spit take when I read that.
Mommar Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 To be clear, precisely how does Tatsunoko gain money from Macross exactly? They own international rights for SDFM/DYRL but not in Japan proper?
jenius Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 21 minutes ago, Mommar said: To be clear, precisely how does Tatsunoko gain money from Macross exactly? They own international rights for SDFM/DYRL but not in Japan proper? As I recall it, they had limited Japanese rights when the show was released but those expired a long time ago. They have international rights to the animation and merchandising of SDF Macross outside of Japan in perpetuity. So BW makes no licensing fees on any DVD sales, TV broadcasting, or toy sales, just Tatsunoko (which they licensed to HG).
sketchley Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Mommar said: To be clear, precisely how does Tatsunoko gain money from Macross exactly? They own international rights for SDFM/DYRL but not in Japan proper? In short: they earn money by licensing SDFM to HG (who in turn licenses it to 3rd parties). They don't own domestic rights (in Japan), BW does. The international rights for DYRL are a mystery. While BW owns them domestically, no one really knows who owns what percentage internationally (if memory serves, there are more parties involved, such as the distributor, Toho). Edited July 7, 2019 by sketchley
Seto Kaiba Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Sandman said: Just heard the news. All hope is lost. You still have us fan translators plodding our way through books and magazines, and our boys from SpeakerPodCast reporting from Japan and working on official subs. It's inconvenient and frustrating, but not the end of the world.
sketchley Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 6 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said: You still have us fan translators plodding our way through books and magazines, and our boys from SpeakerPodCast reporting from Japan and working on official subs. It's inconvenient and frustrating, but not the end of the world. Yes. While things won't be getting easier for our overseas members, neither will they be getting more difficult. Status quo...
Hiriyu Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 (edited) I'm not very knowledgeable on the subject, but would the recent development of BW having registered trademark for Macross in the UK potentially open the door to western market (UK) releases of the sequels? I understand that SDFM would probably be off the table given the BW/Tatsunoko agreement, but nothing should be stopping marketing of the sequels and related merchandise in that market, right? Edited July 7, 2019 by Hiriyu
Seto Kaiba Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 6 minutes ago, Hiriyu said: I'm not very knowledgeable on the subject, but would the recent development of BW having registered trademark for Macross in the UK potentially open the door to western market (UK) releases of the sequels? I understand that SDFM would probably be off the table given the BW/Tatsunoko agreement, but nothing should be stopping marketing of the sequels and related merchandise in that market, right? The way anime distribution in the west is set up, releases usually flow through US distributors to their partners, affiliates, and local subsidiaries in other countries. Ordinarily, a UK home video release would probably be dubbed in the US... hence the problem.
Hiriyu Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said: The way anime distribution in the west is set up, releases usually flow through US distributors to their partners, affiliates, and local subsidiaries in other countries. Ordinarily, a UK home video release would probably be dubbed in the US... hence the problem. Right, but wouldn't BW still legally be able to release their own subbed versions (or dubs contracted to a UK production house), along with allowing say, Bandai, to legally sell their Macross toys in the UK market? My question is not really so much about how these things are usually handled in terms of distribution as it is about the basic legal distinction. Edited July 7, 2019 by Hiriyu
jvmacross Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Sandman said: Just heard the news. All hope is lost.
azrael Posted July 7, 2019 Posted July 7, 2019 44 minutes ago, sketchley said: In short: they earn money by licensing SDFM to HG (who in turn licenses it to 3rd parties). They don't own domestic rights (in Japan), BW does. And likely through that licensing, get a share of the profits from merchandise sales.
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