Macross Δ (Delta) - Mission 20 - READ 1st POST

[Saruta]

That's right, the proper song of the wind is this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bigswc0BMvk

Can't. unhear. this is Heinz' voice instead of violin

IMO, it's pretty clear Xaos (official subs spelling) was an unholy mess even with Messer and Mikumo at the top of their game... they're not a super-elite unit, they're the Wal-Mart of mercenaries.

Name-dropping Messer will always fall flat. Kaname may care about him, but it's almost impossible for the audience to because his one character trait is that the stick up his ass had a stick up its ass.

I did not mean *that* sort of effect about Messer.

The context was, as far as I can remember: Arad says it's hard to handle pilots. Kaname says "Messer". I read it as "Messer actually knew how to handle pilots, now hes not here and Arad and Johnson have made a mess out of it".

[Aries Turner]

Oh and on that topic, it would really be great if Lady M was Myung. Because I'd totally love seeing her KICK ASS for once. She has the brains and she has the guts. She can do much more than just save one loose cannon pilot from her own Vocaloid. (As an aside I still think Sharon was more misguided and confused than malicious).

Working in a rival PMC than Isamu? Maybe. My bets are on Millia Fallina, though, as Mikumo appears to be so Sibyl-esque.

Berger dropped that bomb in #19. Also, that not only DYRL is a 2030 movie as stated in M7, but SDFM is also a drama series accounting of whatever is canon. Anything goes. Heinz singing anything different is a plus. Maybe even a change of character. I thought Freja would end with him after Hayate ditching her for Mirage, but he seems somewhat infatuated with Mikumo. However LGBT themes in this series, a first in Macross, between Makina and Reina, also Keith and Royd, made me suspect a real threesome for as long as Freja lived between her, Mirage and Hayate. Unlikely. Or not.

Edited August 18, 2016 by Aries Turner

[RedWolf]

Working in a rival PMC than Isamu? Maybe. My bets are on Millia Fallina, though, as Mikumo appears to be so Sibyl-esque.

Berger dropped that bomb in #19. Also, that not only DYRL is a 2030 movie as stated in M7, but SDFM is also a drama series accounting of whatever is canon. Anything goes. Heinz singing anything different is a plus. Maybe even a change of character. I thought Freja would end with him after Hayate ditching her for Mirage, but he seems somewhat infatuated with Mikumo. However LGBT themes in this series, a first in Macross, between Makina and Reina, also Keith and Royd, made me suspect a real threesome for as long as Freja lived between her, Mirage and Hayate. Unlikely. Or not.

If Berger is right that Lady M commissioned a study on music post Space War 1 then it eliminate Milia as a candidate.

Why? Unlike Max Milia never rose through the ranks of the military to have that influence. We know Milia was mother, a bike racer, special forces and flight instructor prior to entering politics.

Max on the other hand was involved with Project M, a secret project in UN Spacy that sought to recreate the culture shock success of the Minmay Attack. They found this in Basara Nekki whose accomplishments include helping lifeforce drained victims, freeing brainwashed troops, suppressing and giving the Protodevlin a means of survival so they wont have to hunt anymore, culture shock Zentradi which happened with the Chlore fleet and contact with Galactic Whales confirming they are intelligent. I find it more likely Lady M is not an individual but an organization that likes to keep secrets like Project M. When Gamlin was investigating the VF-19 Custom, how Basara got it, his hard drive got erased.

If Lady M is indeed from the SDF Macross cast I find it likely to be Shammy Milliome. Misa and Minmay are out due to being on Megaroad-1 which disappeared. Vanessa Laird and Kim Kabirov don't have an M on their initials. Vanessa quit UN Spacy getting married to Loli. Kim went to being unmarried but rose to the ranks to Lt. General. Shammy on the other hand went to live on the Moon with her parent who survived and got married to rich guy having 11 kids. Note rich guy. Shammy was also the comm officer of the Macross. Chaos is an interstellar telecommunications and media company primarily. Having capital could've started Chaos as a company.

Edited August 19, 2016 by RedWolf

[Roy Focker]

Interesting theory about Shammy. Would be cute if it was her.

[Ghostbear0]

I think it would be kinda disappointing. Shammy would be fun to have had around for more of the series but lacks impact as a reveal at this point. She would have bewn great 5 or 6 episodes ago though.

Edited August 18, 2016 by Ghostbear0

[kalvasflam]

The first half delivered so much more. By episode 20 people are expecting so much more.

All about the precedent; you got too used to the original and Mac F

[Zinjo]

If Berger is right that Lady M commissioned a study on music post Space War 1 then it eliminate Milia as a candidate.

Why? Unlike Max Milia never rose through the ranks of the militry to have that influence. We know Milia was mother, a bike racer, special forces and flight instructor prior to entering politics.

Max on the other hand was involved with Project M, a secret project in UN Spacy that sought to recreate the culture shock success of the Minmay Attack. They found this in Basara Nekki whose accomplishments include helping lifeforce drained victims, freeing brainwashed troops, suppressing and giving the Protodevlin a means of survival so they wont have to hunt anymore, culture shock Zentradi which happened with the Chlore fleet and contact with Galactic Whales confirming they are intelligent. I find it more likely Lady M is not an individual but an organization that likes to keep secrets like Project M. When Gamlin was investigating the VF-19 Custom, how Basara got it, his hard drive got erased.

If Lady M is indeed from the SDF Macross cast I find it likely to be Shammy Milliome. Misa and Minmay are out due to being on Megaroad-1 which disappeared. Vanessa Laird and Kim Kabirov don't have an M on their initials. Vanessa quit UN Spacy getting married to Loli. Kim went to being unmarried but rose to the ranks to Lt. General. Shammy on the other hand went to live on the Moon with her parent who survived and got married to rich guy having 11 kids. Note rich guy. Shammy was also the comm officer of the Macross. Chaos is an interstellar telecommunications and media company primarily. Having capital could've started Chaos as a company.

Yeah, I concluded that in another thread. She is the only one who would fit the parameters, unless they decide to include Macross the First characters into the continuity, which is entirely possible. The old standby of keeping games out of production continuities does not apply to the Macross universe, so manga would logically be included as well.

[Sandman]

I can't see Lady M being anybody who would be satisfying option.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Sandman

[UN Spacy]

So this is the Sheryl's panties episode for Delta.

Let's just move on...and to be honest THAT episode made me cringe much more than anything I've seen in Delta.

Edited August 19, 2016 by UN Spacy

[kalvasflam]

That would have been ep 17 with the Makina fan service. Unless we are thinking of the Jenius butt shot (but tastefully clothes)

[Saruta]

That would have been ep 17 with the Makina fan service. Unless we are thinking of the Jenius butt shot (but tastefully clothes)

The Makina fan service actually does not take up much screen time but makes a lot of sense in context. Though it does make Delta somewhat less child-safe.

The panties ep took huge screentime, did not make much sense, and made the series TOTALLY not child-safe.

[TehPW]

So this is the Sheryl's panties episode for Delta.

Let's just move on...and to be honest THAT episode made me cringe much more than anything I've seen in Delta.

just to remind me, which one is that?

[Heron]

I have a feeling we are starting to turn against this show out of frustration. I've made it clear I was never a big fan. I've tried to judge each episode own its own. I gave this episode a neutral vote. Right now the Positive side has the fewest number of votes. I think people who have been with the series are frustrated by how things turned during the second half. The first half delivered so much more. By episode 20 people are expecting so much more.

That would be me. I actually turned a few episodes ago, but from Post to Neutral but it seems to only get worse and now I'm a negative.

[Zinjo]

So this is the Sheryl's panties episode for Delta.

Let's just move on...and to be honest THAT episode made me cringe much more than anything I've seen in Delta.

Nah, this is an episode of talking heads and teenage angst aimed totally at the target demographic. Though the whole Kanami singing to Mikuno was a direct reference to M7 and Basara serenading a comatose Sivil, right down to the fetal position of Mikumo and her singing along when she begins to come to. This convinces me that this show is the spiritual sequel to M7, like MF was the spiritual sequel to SDFM, replete with its direct nods to that series.

This episode was written to advance the story a little but more, to flesh out the love triangle and the stoke the Mikumo mystery before the reveal in episode 21. There was also the character reference to Makina and Reina's shady past, when Kanami mentions them getting sent to the brig, "again" when they are hacking the NUNS hospital ship's network.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Zinjo

[Graham]

I personally doubt that Lady M will be Shammy, I've always felt that the SDFM bridge Bunnies were kinda throwaway, disposable characters of little consequence.

[RedWolf]

There was also the character reference to Makina and Reina's shady past, when Kanami mentions them getting sent to the brig, "again" when they are hacking the NUNS hospital ship's network.

It's a Chaos hospital ship actually. Reina was hacker caught hacking into Chaos. Yeah basically she is a boxed crook that was given a second chance by Chaos. Reina is good but not that good.

As for Makina all we know is she loves mechs and idols. Being a mechanic is in her blood. Probably making her Raizo Nakajima's descendant.

[squaresphere]

Nah, this is an episode of talking heads and teenage angst aimed totally at the target demographic. Though the whole Kanami singing to Mikuno was a direct reference to M7 and Basara serenading a comatose Sivil, right down to the fetal position of Mikumo and her singing along when she begins to come to. This convinces me that this show is the spiritual sequel to M7, like MF was the spiritual sequel to SDFM, replete with its direct nods to that series.

I don't think there's any doubt for long time macross fans that Delta is squarely on the M7 of the "seriousness" spectrum.

[This Confuses Gamlin]

just to remind me, which one is that?

Frontier 8.

[grigolosi]

Hell at least Frontier Ep 8 had someone, even if it was Sheryl, using some form of mech (Ex-Gear).........and she was wrecking something with it (the school but what the hell).......still better than this episode of Delta in my book.

Edited August 19, 2016 by grigolosi

[Sandman]

I personally doubt that Lady M will be Shammy, I've always felt that the SDFM bridge Bunnies were kinda throwaway, disposable characters of little consequence.

Yeah and every bridge bunnies since have been even more disposable. Delta's BBs are basically non-entities. At least frontier had that weird Cpt Wilder sexual harassment that one BB actually liked plot.

[Chronocidal]

If Berger is right that Lady M commissioned a study on music post Space War 1 then it eliminate Milia as a candidate.

I don't think you can really rule anyone out that simply, just because "post Space War 1" is so vague. There's no telling when this study even occurred.

Given the events of Macross 7, and Millia's political position? It would have been really easy for her to pull whatever strings she wanted to get such a study done. And given that music had just flat out saved the Macross 7 fleet, and possibly the universe in its entirety, it would have been extremely appropriate for her to do so.

However it goes though, I expect this is just going to wind up being another audience troll like the Minmay locket in Frontier. Who this mysterious Lady M is may not matter any more than the details of who Ranka's mother was. Was she important? Sure. Did she contribute anything to the plot besides being a background figure partly responsible for the situation? Not really.

I think ever since the original series, the people behind Macross have been well aware of just how desperate the fans are for any tidbits about how their favorite characters ended up years later, and they will use this sort of teasing to milk the fans for all the hype they can get.

Edited August 19, 2016 by Chronocidal

[azrael]

Delta's BBs are basically non-entities.

Yes. Even Frontier's bridge bunnies had more screen time than Delta's.

[Roy Focker]

Isn't the girl band the real bridge bunnies?

[Raptor One]

Sheryl's panties episode >>>>>> Delta episode 20

Yeah and every bridge bunnies since have been even more disposable. Delta's BBs are basically non-entities. At least frontier had that weird Cpt Wilder sexual harassment that one BB actually liked plot.

By definition it's not harrassment if she liked it

Edited August 19, 2016 by Raptor One

[azrael]

Sheryl's panties episode >>>>>> Delta episode 20

The worst episode of Frontier is still better than most episodes of Delta.

[valhary]

no mecha action is not macross

[guyxxed]

The worst episode of Frontier is still better than most episodes of Delta.

I'm definitely feeling the frustration with how Delta has gone off track, but I can't agree with this. The first half of Delta had some very strong episodes and did a very good job of setting up great character dynamics. The fact that it is failing to develop or pay off those setups now doesn't negate what it did right before.

Don't get me wrong, overall Frontier was a better package and I think that regardless of how it wraps up, Delta will ultimately go down as a missed opportunity, but the high school high jinks and Brera wrestling the purple winged lion were pretty freaking stupid. Delta hasn't given us what it should have, but it's been good at staying above that level of juvenile crap for the most part.

In my opinion, anyway. ;-)

[Master Dex]

Brera's poorly animated fight with the Hydra was actually in episode 10, during the shooting of the Birdman movie.

[RedWolf]

Speaking of Macross Frontier it is implied Mao Nome didn't survive the Vajra attack.

Sketchley's Translations: Macross Chronicle Revised Ed. - History Zero 02B: The Struggle For The Birdman

Down: Mao Nome

[F] Dr. Mao engaged in research that was concerned with such things as alien biology and songs, and she also participated in the 117th Investigation Fleet. Dr. Chiba studied under her

Could Lady M be Mao Nome? Or she is the one who started Project M and they carried on her work?

[Master Dex]

I generally don't understand why people keep bringing up Mao as an option. It isn't just implied she died in the Vajra attack, it was pretty much spelled out.

Besides.. people make comments about how old Max or Millia would be... consider Mao! She was already in a wheelchair by the looks in Ranka's flashbacks.

[Roy Focker]

Last hours predictions. Episode #21 better, same or worst than episode #20?

I vote same. There will be singing. Runes will be stimulated. Hayate will stand near a VF but will never climb in.

[guyxxed]

Brera's poorly animated fight with the Hydra was actually in episode 10, during the shooting of the Birdman movie.

Yes, I know. The point was that Frontier did dumb things, too, and that some of them were easily on the same level of dumb as what Delta has done. Delta's first half was arguably stronger than Frontier's, and while it's second half is winding rapidly toward disappointment, that shouldn't negate the things it got right.

Last hours predictions. Episode #21 better, same or worst than episode #20?

I vote same. There will be singing. Runes will be stimulated. Hayate will stand near a VF but will never climb in.

I'll vote better, but only because I'm an incurable optimist. ;-)

[Aries Turner]

They will do with Delta what they did with Frontier: keep what worked for the movies. Destroy the memory of the rest.

I expect #21 to hit big and hard: all the conspirators will be uncovered, Keith will confront Roid, someone would answer about what Mikumo really is, all in the middle of a counter-attack by federal forces against anyone and everything in the sector now that they gathered most data and are ready to reap the product. Nobody would hit the cell, because there will be no time to jail anyone.

[half-joking]

Oh, and the VF-28 would be the production version of the federal YF-24, as a obscure reference to "Top Gun" MiG-28.

[/half-joking]

Edited August 21, 2016 by Aries Turner

[Master Dex]

Yes, I know. The point was that Frontier did dumb things, too, and that some of them were easily on the same level of dumb as what Delta has done. Delta's first half was arguably stronger than Frontier's, and while it's second half is winding rapidly toward disappointment, that shouldn't negate the things it got right.

I'll vote better, but only because I'm an incurable optimist. ;-)

Like the Doctor said, the good things don't always negate the bad things but vice versa the bad things don't ruin the good or make them unimportant, heh. Something like that anyway.

They will do with Delta what they did with Frontier: keep what worked for the movies. Destroy the memory of the rest.

I expect #21 to hit big and hard: all the conspirators will be uncovered, Keith will confront Roid, someone would answer about what Mikumo really is, all in the middle of a counter-attack by federal forces against anyone and everything in the sector now that they gathered most data and are ready to reap the product. Nobody would hit the cell, because there will be no time to jail anyone.

[half-joking]

Oh, and the VF-28 would be the production version of the federal YF-24, as a obscure reference to "Top Gun" MiG-28.

[/half-joking]

A bit much for one episode, lol. I know you are being a bit facetious but I doubt we'll see Federal NUNS bother to intervene. This whole thing can be solved locally and that is likely how they see it. Still just a border dispute. Now if Roid's galactic plan did start to work.. then they'd come and curb stomp. I doubt we'll get that far.

If only though, heh. Imagine the Bandai sales, lol.

[Seto Kaiba]

Last hours predictions. Episode #21 better, same or worst than episode #20?

I vote same. There will be singing. Runes will be stimulated. Hayate will stand near a VF but will never climb in.

Worse.

The Mission 21 preview on the official website has made this episode out to be a retrospective of Tactical Sound Unit Walkure's formative years, one narrated by the group's three useless members: Makina "Masturbation Material" Nakajima, Reina "Discount Yuki Nagato" Prowler, and Kaname "Broken Bird" Buccaneer. As a special bonus for the fans who sat through the last two boring exposition dump episodes, they're recounting all this from the comfort of the ship's brig as a result of their brilliant infiltration plan having been foiled by a rent-a-cop and a single locked door at the end of Mission 20.

Honestly, I've never felt more sympathy with Bogue than I do contemplating the summary of next episode. The second half of this series has been such a huge disappointment that I'm 200% on board if Bogue wants to liven things up a bit by vaporizing Walkure's deadweight so Freyja and Mikumo can get back to work.