Macross Δ (Delta) - Mission 6 - READ 1st POST

[seti88]

episode 6 was pretty good! this may sound a little silly to some but I found watching Delta at about 90% playback speed helps keep track of the subtitles and still keep an eye on the action! and the characters voices don't sound slow or slurred at all.

much easier to watch.

Lol must try that the next time..for this episode i watched the whole show in RAW, and i relied on spoilers + the podcast to basically tell me the whole story..

tried your advice and watched the valks scenes at 60% which see all the valks animations but when it was over and the dialogue started proper, i was laughing cos they sounded extremely grumpy!

Edited May 9, 2016 by seti88

[RedWolf]

http://macross-matome.net/delta-chat/1927/

・1話の戦闘中フレイアが駆けだしたのは違和感を持った人がいるかもしれないが

あれはウィンダミア人は寿命が短いので一瞬一瞬を大切に生きてるから

外国に行くと違和感を覚えることがあるがそれはその国なりの習慣や合理性があるからで

そういう違和感を体現していきたい

・たまたま現在の日本が文化的に恵まれているだけで文化が規制されている国も世界では珍しくない

フレイアはそういう国から飛び出していったわけでマクロスは現実世界の縮図感を意識している

Crude google translation.

1 episode of the battle in the Freya was fledgling is not Some people who have a sense of discomfort

That was because Windermere who are important to live every moment because life is short

Because you may feel uncomfortable to go to foreign countries , but it is in the habit of and rationality of Nari the country

I want to embody the kind of sense of discomfort

And countries not uncommon in the world that happens only in the culture of the current Japan is blessed with cultural are regulated

Freya is Macross in not went jumping from such country is aware of the microcosm sense of the real world

From the gist of it Windermere is pretty much like Japan that they regulate what culture they take in. They are a bit uncomfortable of going outside the box as they have short lives.

Earlier info from 2ch about anime magazine .

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Ftoro.2ch.sc%2Ftest%2Fread.cgi%2Fanime%2F1462500115%2F&sandbox=1

河森監督インタ

ウィンダミア人にしてみると、約40年前に地球人類と接触する前は、自分たちの寿命が短いとは思っていなか ったんです。

ところが突然、進んだテクノロジーを持ち、なおかつ寿命が長い種族がウィンダミアにやってきた 。

でも、身体能力は高くないし、『ルン』も持っていない。この差は何なんだと。

なぜ自分たちは早く死ななくてはいけないんだろうかと。彼らは複雑な思いを感じているはずなん ですね。

ワルキューレが歌う新曲は1話ごとに1曲に近いペースで投入します。

Shoji Kawamori

From the Windermereians' point of view 40 years ago, before they encountered humanity, they did not think that their life spans were "short." However, out of nowhere, a race with advanced technology, as well as a long lifespan arrived onto Windermere. However, their physical abilities weren't high, and they did not possess "run." They must have had confusing and complex thoughts such as why did they (the Windermereians) have to die so quickly.

Windermereans were once blissfully ignorant of the outside then comes in the humans who are physically weak but way more advanced than they are and longer lived. This is their Culture Shock not in a Zentradi sort of way as they have their own culture.

Freyja may be a country girl but she is willing to make that leap out of her comfort zone.

[guyxxed]

With the preview for next episode asking the Delta Platoon to investigate Voldor and the protoculture ruins, it makes me wonder if Windermere's objective isn't actually control of the sector. I wonder if the war and the 'kicking out of NUNS' is actually just a cover for a bigger purpose involving control of all the ruins. The fact that neither Heinz nor Roid seem too keen on destroying their enemies and focusing on data gathering instead of domination makes me think they have a different aim. The scar may imply an experiment gone wrong or a desperate measure enacted that's had lasting consequences. I wonder if that's why Windermere is snow covered? Planet freezing over as a result of whatever happened?

[Rbstr]

Poor random Windermere kid.

Mirage and Hayate are really starting to build some good wingman-type-chemistry. It's clear that Messer is actually having the intended effect of driving them to improve. All Mirage really needs in order to be the ace is to get a bit more flexible and to worry less about being as good as her grandparents, I think. But her talk with Hayate at the end, I think, shows she's not just trying to blindly live up to expectations.

I'm really digging the cast over all. Hayate is being a bit less of a jerk, Freyja is hilarious and genki with a good measure of conflict thanks to the war, overall the rest of them are shaping up to be more than just a pile of extras hanging around. Mikumo is kind of hilariously mysterious.

Except the Windermerians are a bit one-dimensional so far. I imagine that will start to change as we learn more about their situation. They've clearly got an interest in finding more protoculture ruins and they seem to be looking for something in particular in that regard...probably to keep their planet from blowing up (figuratively or literally).

Next week promises to be a bit wacky with the costumes. I can't wait. I'm especially excited to see another planet's settlements.

Edited May 9, 2016 by Rbstr

[azrael]

... it makes me wonder if Windermere's objective isn't actually control of the sector.

That's just the cover story. They're looking for something among the ruins on each planet.

I wonder if the war and the 'kicking out of NUNS' is actually just a cover for a bigger purpose involving control of all the ruins.

Likely. As I mentioned a few episodes ago, the Windermerans may not have know what the hell these artifacts truly were until the UN showed up. When the UN showed up, everything changed for them.

The fact that neither Heinz nor Roid seem too keen on destroying their enemies and focusing on data gathering instead of domination makes me think they have a different aim.

I don't think Roid cares whether people live or die. He seems more interested in the device.

The scar may imply an experiment gone wrong or a desperate measure enacted that's had lasting consequences. I wonder if that's why Windermere is snow covered? Planet freezing over as a result of whatever happened?

The planet was already snow covered before the UN arrived. The crater was likely a self-inflicted incident. I'm thinking of Windermere being a ticking time-bomb. Maybe whatever they blew up the plug to the well. Now that power is leaking and will make a bad mix with the fold fault surrounding the planet.

[guyxxed]

Good point on Roid, it's true he's never shown direct worry about casualties himself. He mentioned it this episode, but only in passing along the concerns of Heinz. I'm with you on this one.

I'm looking forward to finding out the details about the fold fault. A lot hinges on whether the scar and fault were self inflicted or not, and also on whether whatever happened was done in self defense or as an act of aggression/hubris.

It would be interesting if the Windermerian campaign was to gather control of the ruins in order to combat a greater threat, and it's just their superiority/inferiority complex that's preventing them from telling anyone else about it. Or maybe the time factor compels them to act this way rather than try to convince others. Pure speculation, but something along those lines would tie into the Macross trope of redeemable villains much better than the (mostly) bloodthirsty war mongers we've mostly been shown so far.

[d3v]

Wasn't it mentioned that they detonated a dimensional weapon or something in the previous war?

Edited May 9, 2016 by d3v

[azrael]

Wasn't it mentioned that they detonated a dimensional weapin or something in the previous war?

The only thing mentioned a few weeks ago was Windermere used a dimensional weapon at the end of their revolution. After that, hostilities ended. I assume Arad and Cpt. Johnson know more to the story than the rest.

[RedWolf]

Updated list of planets in Macross:

Airberl (Protoculture ruins- Ruins of Stig Stania, Invaded by Windermere)

Alfhiem

Al Shahal

Anthem III (Invaded by Windermere)

Avalon

Avemaria

Banipal(?, there are coal mines there, so presumably some settlement exists)

Bellfan

Beneb

Cristania

Dahan

Eden

Eden 3 (not the same star system)

Elysium (abandoned)

Endebald

Ganymede (also a moon)

Gregor

Hue (Basara visited this planet on a Tousugeki Love Heart video)

Hydra

Ionideth

Iota

Jupiter (multiple satellite cities)

Listania (Invaded by Windermere)

Luna (technically a moon, but hey)

Mars

Neo York

Neptune (satellite city)

New Asia (Declared bio hazard)

Ragna( Homeworld of Ragnans)

Randall

Rax (Supposed to be colonized by Macross 5 but blew up.)

Salvation

Saturn (satellite city)

Sephira (Leon Sasaki's home colony)

Susia

Ouroboros

Vajra Homeworld (Colonized by Macross Frontier)

Varauta colony

4th "Ice" Planet in Varauta system. Formerly Arsenal Planet and origin world of Protodevlin and Supervision Army turned prison world.

Veil

Venus ("satellite city" orbital colony)

Voldor (Homeworld of Voldorans, Invaded by Windermere)

Vulcan

Windermere (Homeworld of Windermereans)

Zola (Homeworld of Zolans)

[Windrider]

Voldor (Homeworld of Voldorans, Invaded by Windermere)

Maybe we can call their race the Voldori instead. It sounds better in my opinion. What do you think?

[UN Spacy]

Wonder what it'll take for NUNS to send in reinforcements.

Arad did mention that NUNS had their own problems arm...wonder what he was talking about there.

[Rbstr]

We know, via Mirage, some kind of rebel group took over an Island-class not too long ago and she fought to retake it in the Spacy. I'm sure they have all sorts of that kind of thing. Emigration fleets getting at each other over planets, human supremacy groups, anti-human groups, pirates, uncultured Zentradi. It's a big galaxy out there and NUNS authority is probably not around all the time. I'm sure if you pick a plausible problem that they've had it.

Edited May 9, 2016 by Rbstr

[azrael]

Wonder what it'll take for NUNS to send in reinforcements.

Arad did mention that NUNS had their own problems arm...wonder what he was talking about there.

Probably if Windermere has a deployable WMD.

This isn't the only conflict the NUN gets themselves into. If you had a conflict to deal with every week, at some point, you start cherry-picking your battles. Terrorists attack over here, pirates attacking trade routes there, civil war there, humanitarian crisis over there, crazy people running for elections, etc. If the NUN starts getting too heavily involved in what would be "local" conflicts, then they would appear overbearing. Look at the world you live in. There's a problem everyday.

[Alberich]

Updated list of planets in Macross:

Airberl (Protoculture ruins- Ruins of Stig Stania, Invaded by Windermere)

Alfhiem

Al Shahal

Anthem III (Invaded by Windermere)

Avalon

Avemaria

Banipal(?, there are coal mines there, so presumably some settlement exists)

Bellfan

Beneb

Cristania

Dahan

Eden

Eden 3 (not the same star system)

Elysium (abandoned)

Endebald

Ganymede (also a moon)

Gregor

Hue (Basara visited this planet on a Tousugeki Love Heart video)

Hydra

Ionideth

Iota

Jupiter (multiple satellite cities)

Listania (Invaded by Windermere)

Luna (technically a moon, but hey)

Mars

Neo York

Neptune (satellite city)

New Asia (Declared bio hazard)

Ragna( Homeworld of Ragnans)

Randall

Rax (Supposed to be colonized by Macross 5 but blew up.)

Salvation

Saturn (satellite city)

Sephira (Leon Sasaki's home colony)

Susia

Ouroboros

Vajra Homeworld (Colonized by Macross Frontier)

Varauta colony

4th "Ice" Planet in Varauta system. Formerly Arsenal Planet and origin world of Protodevlin and Supervision Army turned prison world.

Veil

Venus ("satellite city" orbital colony)

Voldor (Homeworld of Voldorans, Invaded by Windermere)

Vulcan

Windermere (Homeworld of Windermereans)

Zola (Homeworld of Zolans)

All official material can be used to add planets to the list? as there are some other planets named in the Squadron Section of the Variable Fighter Master Files of the VF-19 and VF-25 and they are:

Gaia (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Megara (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

El Dorado (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Triton (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Valhalla (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Supika 3 (Incident with casualties in 2037-Glassed like Earth by a Zentradi Fleet)

Sagres (Home of the SVF-1429 that use the VF-25C/Sg by 2062, also visit of Ranka Lee)

And well... Earth is also missing in the list

Edited May 9, 2016 by Alberich

[sharky]

Updated list of planets in Macross:Airberl (Protoculture ruins- Ruins of Stig Stania, Invaded by Windermere)AlfhiemAl ShahalAnthem III (Invaded by Windermere)AvalonAvemariaBanipal(?, there are coal mines there, so presumably some settlement exists)BellfanBenebCristaniaDahanEdenEden 3 (not the same star system)Elysium (abandoned)EndebaldGanymede (also a moon)GregorHue (Basara visited this planet on a Tousugeki Love Heart video)HydraIonidethIotaJupiter (multiple satellite cities)Listania (Invaded by Windermere)Luna (technically a moon, but hey)MarsNeo YorkNeptune (satellite city)New Asia (Declared bio hazard)Ragna( Homeworld of Ragnans)RandallRax (Supposed to be colonized by Macross 5 but blew up.)SalvationSaturn (satellite city)Sephira (Leon Sasaki's home colony)SusiaOuroborosVajra Homeworld (Colonized by Macross Frontier)Varauta colony4th "Ice" Planet in Varauta system. Formerly Arsenal Planet and origin world of Protodevlin and Supervision Army turned prison world.VeilVenus ("satellite city" orbital colony)Voldor (Homeworld of Voldorans, Invaded by Windermere)VulcanWindermere (Homeworld of Windermereans)Zola (Homeworld of Zolans)

Don't forget good ol' Earth.

[Strumvogel]

Up to ep.6 and I'm still wondering why I should care for the Aerial Knight's faction.... This is not good writing. Competent but after the amount of money they threw at it, competent isn't going to cut it with the sponsors. And it's showing in the ratings. It's hovering at no.5 and it's numbers are half of Kabaneri, the top rated show(by a magazine pool) of the season (which happens to have Mikimoto as it's character designer).

They're no going to do a Macross 7 and not get to the point till ep 14 again are they?

This has to be the lowest investment I ever had with a world in the Macross series after viewing the initial episodes.

[Bariaburu Faita]

If you are number 5, out of 5, its time to throw in the towel. If you are number 5, out of 61. Then its time to celebrate, and sign up more sponsors.

Up to ep.6 and I'm still wondering why I should care for the Aerial Knight's faction.... This is not good writing. Competent but after the amount of money they threw at it, competent isn't going to cut it with the sponsors. And it's showing in the ratings. It's hovering at no.5 and it's numbers are half of Kabaneri, the top rated show(by a magazine pool) of the season (which happens to have Mikimoto as it's character designer).

They're no going to do a Macross 7 and not get to the point till ep 14 again are they?

This has to be the lowest investment I ever had with a world in the Macross series after viewing the initial episodes.

[RDX17]

Messer to Hayate: "You're not even worth talking to."

It's comments like this make me loathe Messer, especially considering he can't/won't admit to his own problems when asked directly. I'm even more convinced his pride is going to lead to something tragic at some point in the series (either to him or someone else).

No doubt Hayate, Mirage, and Freyja still need guidance, which they're clearly up for...but they deserve better than Messer/Mikumo.

Overall, this was a great new episode and makes me even more curious about where the series is going.

What's the connection between Windermere and the artifacts on the other worlds?

Is Keith pushing his brother (Heinz) too far? Does he have ulterior motives?

What caused the crater on Windermere?

Is something sinister going on with Mikumo (her curiosity with Heinz's song feels somehow suspicous)?

How will the death of Lieutenant Uroh (the "Rune-shirt" - nice!) affect Herman Cross, if at all?

Next Sunday can't come soon enough.

edit: Unfortunately I think Arad is going to be the casualty at this point. I hope I'm wrong, as he's my favorite Delta member.

Edited May 10, 2016 by RDX17

[Seto Kaiba]

All official material can be used to add planets to the list? as there are some other planets named in the Squadron Section of the Variable Fighter Master Files of the VF-19 and VF-25 and they are:

Gaia (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Megara (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

El Dorado (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Triton (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Valhalla (YF-19 Galaxy demonstration tour-2042)

Supika 3 (Incident with casualties in 2037-Glassed like Earth by a Zentradi Fleet)

Sagres (Home of the SVF-1429 that use the VF-25C/Sg by 2062, also visit of Ranka Lee)

And well... Earth is also missing in the list

Master File isn't, strictly speaking, "official material"... the books are disclaimed with a statement that they're not official setting material.

Probably shouldn't count Supika III either, as it was destroyed.

Don't forget good ol' Earth.

The listing, which I compiled a while back, is of colonized worlds... Earth isn't a colony, it's the homeworld. That's why the moon, which was colonized, is listed but not Earth.

As far as the episode goes, I was reasonably satisfied by this one. Mirage and Hayate have a few good moments together (go Team Mirage!), and we got some good mecha action. Feels a bit like Ep7 of Frontier, though it looks like next episode is going to be the point where the real meat of the plot is going to be laid bare.

[Valkyrie Driver]

Can it be next week yet...

[Alberich]

Master File isn't, strictly speaking, "official material"... the books are disclaimed with a statement that they're not official setting material.

Probably shouldn't count Supika III either, as it was destroyed.

Is there some list of what is considered "official material", I was really thinking that things like master files are, but now that you tell me that they are not, is even more difficult to know what can be considered an official statement in a universe where even the series and movies are both considered canon.... and not. They really need to do something to get more setting materials as the Macrossverse is so rich and diverse.

C'mon Kawamori let the ideas flow or give some restrain and let other people make more material (a la Star Wars) D:

[Seto Kaiba]

Is there some list of what is considered "official material", I was really thinking that things like master files are, but now that you tell me that they are not, is even more difficult to know what can be considered an official statement in a universe where even the series and movies are both considered canon.... and not. They really need to do something to get more setting materials as the Macrossverse is so rich and diverse.

C'mon Kawamori let the ideas flow or give some restrain and let other people make more material (a la Star Wars) D:

Nope... not as such. Usually stuff that Kawamori directly contributed to is considered to be "official", but Macross runs mainly on broad strokes continuity rather than any kind of rigidly defined canon.

The Variable Fighter Master File books are unusual in that they explicitly disclaim their status as not being part of the Macross official setting on the credits page of each book. Various details in the books have been independently corroborated in official sources, but the lion's share is unofficial. (Some consider these highly detailed sources that are occasionally corroborated by official sources to have a kind of unofficial expanded universe status.)

[Strumvogel]

If you are number 5, out of 5, its time to throw in the towel. If you are number 5, out of 61. Then its time to celebrate, and sign up more sponsors.

Well, you can of course always try to sign up more sponsors but the initial sponsors that were brought into the show from the ground up can't be too happy(they rarely are by their very nature) since it's not doing Frontier levels of business.

And when they're no happy, there's the danger of them starting to insinuate themselves into the production more, which as we all know, does wonders to a show someone is trying to make...

[Graham]

My view on the VF Master Files books, is that they are full of nice pretty pictures, which are great to look at, but any written information, unless taken from an official source is nothing more than unofficial fanfic. So personally, I tend to ignore them as a source of info.

[sharky]

The listing, which I compiled a while back, is of colonized worlds... Earth isn't a colony, it's the homeworld. That's why the moon, which was colonized, is listed but not Earth.

Ah, I see. I thought you were simply listing named planets in Macross based on the title you put on the list in this thread. It did seem like a glaring oversight if that was the case.

[Graham]

Still going through the episode frame by frame trying to see where Mirage got the beamgun pod from or whether she actually had it mounted somewhere on her VF-31.

I really hope it wasn't an animation error.

Wondering what the size of Alpha & Beta platoons is and how any of them actually got destroyed by the Aerial Knights?

I think we only see two onscreen deaths, Alpha 01 and maybe one other IIRC.

[seti88]

Still going through the episode frame by frame trying to see where Mirage got the beamgun pod from or whether she actually had it mounted somewhere on her VF-31.

I really hope it wasn't an animation error.

Wondering what the size of Alpha & Beta platoons is and how any of them actually got destroyed by the Aerial Knights?

I think we only see two onscreen deaths, Alpha 01 and maybe one other IIRC.

there was the CF-171 who got blasted by a VAR controlled 171 whilst talking on the 171 control screen...

As for the gunpod...hmmm does that look like a gunpod under the 31S after launched?

It looks like the gunpod is somehow mounted underneath, even tho there is a projector deployed topside!

Edited May 10, 2016 by seti88

[UN Spacy]

Still going through the episode frame by frame trying to see where Mirage got the beamgun pod from or whether she actually had it mounted somewhere on her VF-31.

I really hope it wasn't an animation error.

Wondering what the size of Alpha & Beta platoons is and how any of them actually got destroyed by the Aerial Knights?

I think we only see two onscreen deaths, Alpha 01 and maybe one other IIRC.

Bogue and the Twins are also shown wiping out the rest of Beta Squadron.

[Einherjar]

From the gist of it Windermere is pretty much like Japan that they regulate what culture they take in. They are a bit uncomfortable of going outside the box as they have short lives.

Windermereans were once blissfully ignorant of the outside then comes in the humans who are physically weak but way more advanced than they are and longer lived. This is their Culture Shock not in a Zentradi sort of way as they have their own culture.

Freyja may be a country girl but she is willing to make that leap out of her comfort zone.

Geez, all this time I thought they were channeling North Korea combined with chivalry.

Edited May 10, 2016 by Einherjar

[Valkyrie Driver]

Geez, all this time I thought they were channeling North Korea combined with chivalry.

Nah, more like pre-war Japan. Winderemere actually seems like it can hold the ground it takes,and tenaciously so... NK would just retreat to the 38th parallel when crap looks grim...

[Graham]

Bogue and the Twins are also shown wiping out the rest of Beta Squadron.

I'll have to rewatch, but I think we only see two VF-31A destroyed onscreen.

there was the CF-171 who got blasted by a VAR controlled 171 whilst talking on the 171 control screen...

As for the gunpod...hmmm does that look like a gunpod under the 31S after launched?

It looks like the gunpod is somehow mounted underneath, even tho there is a projector deployed topside!

vf31_launch.jpg

Was referring to Alpha & Beta platoon VF-31A deaths only, not CF-171s.

Hmm interesting, that's definitely the beamgunpod there on that 31

[Seto Kaiba]

Wondering what the size of Alpha & Beta platoons is and how any of them actually got destroyed by the Aerial Knights?

I think we only see two onscreen deaths, Alpha 01 and maybe one other IIRC.

They're flight platoons, so presumably not more than 4-5 aircraft apiece.

When they're shown coming up from the vicinity of the Aether, there appear to be six of them in total (3 in each?).

Related to that... I noticed that the name of the long-range radar window is "HIBIKI.SYS". I wonder if this is a Macross II nod?

[Windrider]

Bogue and the Twins are also shown wiping out the rest of Beta Squadron.

Only one of them was seen being shot down. The VF-31A dodged Bogue's shot but then Theo and Xao followed up and killed him.

EDIT: Oh wait you're right. I thought they were just dodging the AA guns but were also fighting the other VF-31As. It was happening too fast.

Edited May 10, 2016 by Windrider

[David Hingtgen]

I still think she got it from the destroyed VF-31A, off-screen. It literally appears out of nowhere from one scene to the next.

PS---Lady M? I currently vote Mylene. Who else who would have the interest/pull to create "Sound Force 2.0"? (and have an M-name)

[sharky]

Still going through the episode frame by frame trying to see where Mirage got the beamgun pod from or whether she actually had it mounted somewhere on her VF-31.

I really hope it wasn't an animation error.

As for the gunpod...hmmm does that look like a gunpod under the 31S after launched?

It looks like the gunpod is somehow mounted underneath, even tho there is a projector deployed topside!

vf31_launch.jpg

I think it can be mounted underneath. Here's another pic looking at it from another angle. Yes? The real question is did Mirage have a similar loadout? I could never get a good view of that area on her particular valk, so it's possible I suppose. I didn't think Hayate had the gunpod. Where does it go when in battriod mode if it's not being held in it's hand?

Edit: also I don't think the bottom gunpod is the same as one that would be mounted on the weapons rack on top. From googling pics it looks like the bottom mounted gunpod is smaller then one that would go on top. I don't know, maybe it's the same one.

There's a pic at taghobby showing the gunpod underneath.

http://www.taghobby.com/1-0/1-2/tomytec-2016%E5%B9%B48%E6%9C%88%E7%99%BC%E5%94%AE-%E6%8A%80mix-series-mcr10-1144%E3%80%8Amacross-delta%E3%80%8Bvf-31j-siegfriedhayate-immelman%E6%A9%9F-fighter-mode-4000yen/

Edited May 10, 2016 by sharky