Macross Δ (Delta) - Mission 2 - READ 1st POST

[Rbstr]

Nah, it's definitely a Macross Quarter-class ship and no mistake...

It's way different than a Quarter, though.

[Seto Kaiba]

It's way different than a Quarter, though.

It's not identical in every respect, but then it doesn't appear that any two Macross Quarter-class ships are truly identical... and we've seen four or five already, but all of the key structural elements and shapes are the same right down to the positions of the gun turrets. As the arms are separate ships even on the Macross Quarter in Macross Frontier, the arms being different is no big deal. A couple angles have been squared off, but under the more detailed textures she's obviously Macross Quarter-class.

[Rbstr]

My main argument is the huge disparity in head proportion between the two.

[Einherjar]

Team Mirage, First Strike.

I will be disappointed If the big bad isn't Notorious B.I.G.

Edited April 12, 2016 by Einherjar

[RedWolf]

Yeah I was discussing that with Tochiro last night. She seems bigger than the Quarter to my eye, but then we almost never see the Quarter with people just milling about or near windows, so scale is hard to judge. I dont think she's as large as Macross or Battle 7.

The heel of Elysion does resemble that of a Battle class.

No one wants to talk about how Windemere looks like a frozen Tundra?

That is like saying our entire planet looks like the Antarctic. They have apple exports remember.

It's way different than a Quarter, though.

The Quarter class is modular composed of five ships. We've seen variants from Macross 17 and Macross 23 in Wings of Goodbye. The Macross Quarter there cosmetically looks different with different armaments. Edited April 12, 2016 by RedWolf

[d3v]

I'd say the Elysium is a new class of ship that just borrows design cues from the Quarter class. There's a shot of it where you can see it to scale with some other buildings and it seems to be way bigger than the "Empire State sized" Quarter.

A key detail is that the deck of the CV/C-109 seems to be larger than that on the Quarter's ARMD-L, with a much bigger area for parking planes.

Edited April 12, 2016 by d3v

[JB0]

That is like saying our entire planet looks like the Antarctic. They have apple exports remember.

Ice apples, obviously!

[Seto Kaiba]

My main argument is the huge disparity in head proportion between the two.

The sensor mast on top of the head definitely seems to be smaller, though I don't know if we can say that about the whole bridge tower since we don't get a good look at it. We always see shots from below where the bulk of the bridge is obscured by the front of the chest.

I'd say the Elysium is a new class of ship that just borrows design cues from the Quarter class. There's a shot of it where you can see it to scale with some other buildings and it seems to be way bigger than the "Empire State sized" Quarter.

A key detail is that the deck of the CV/C-109 seems to be larger than that on the Quarter's ARMD-L, with a much bigger area for parking planes.

I'm just not seeing it... the buildings down there, from the earlier scenes, seem to be 2-3 story affairs, maybe 4-5 tops. The Quarter-class is roughly equivalent to a 90-story building. It'd dwarf those small buildings even if weren't also standing on a raised platform that, itself, appears to be several stories tall. The problem is that Frontier never really showed us the Macross Quarter herself next to any buildings of normal scale.

The carrier ARMD arms seem to be narrower but deeper than the traditional Macross Quarter-class's, and the elevators seem to be a lot smaller. The ones that the normal type from Frontier had were sized to take a Konig Monster. These seem to be sized for a normal fighter only, and lack the offset recovery area.

[sh9000]

It looks really cool.

[barurutor]

Also second to whoever said Kanno would be hard to follow. This is like going from Plus to 7

Them's fighting words right there . Clown valks and space whales aside, 7 had awesome (if not repetitive) music.

Edited April 12, 2016 by barurutor

[d3v]

I'm just not seeing it... the buildings down there, from the earlier scenes, seem to be 2-3 story affairs, maybe 4-5 tops. The Quarter-class is roughly equivalent to a 90-story building. It'd dwarf those small buildings even if weren't also standing on a raised platform that, itself, appears to be several stories tall. The problem is that Frontier never really showed us the Macross Quarter herself next to any buildings of normal scale.

The carrier ARMD arms seem to be narrower but deeper than the traditional Macross Quarter-class's, and the elevators seem to be a lot smaller. The ones that the normal type from Frontier had were sized to take a Konig Monster. These seem to be sized for a normal fighter only, and lack the offset recovery area.

Some of the building down there are way taller than 2-3 storeys, especially the trapezoidal ones.

What's not evident in the image is the fact that the CV/C-109 has a covered rear area similar to what you'd see on M7 era ships (Uraga class, New Macross Class in cruiser mode). There's an entire rear hangar area there that wouldn't fit in the Quarter's ARMD-L. The CV/C-109 looks to be, at the very least, much longer than the latter. Yet at the same time, the scale to the rest of the ship seems different - you'd expect the CV/C-109 to be much longer compared to the rest of the ship if it were just a upgraded Quarter class.

[Mommar]

I have nothing to add other than I like the eay this Macross ship looks compared to the Quarter. I hope carrier mode isn't similar because I despise the Quarters carrier look even more.

[azrael]

I'm inclined to agree with Seto regarding the height. Quarters are suppose to be 400m-class ships (meaning they are >= 400m). When transformed, they hover around the 300m range. It's on a hill and on a platform. So it's being propped up higher. Until some data says otherwise, I'm inclined to go with it being a Quarter-class. Keeping in mind Battle Frontier and Battle Galaxy are still considered New Macross-class yet they are bigger.

[d3v]

I dunno, there seem to be alot of distinct details that the Elysium doesn't share with the Quarter class, such as the legs, arms that go beyond the usual variations in class. Even the Battle Frontier and Galaxy don't differ that much.

Also, even the main torso section, which at first seems to be similar to that of the Quarter class, has some notable differences as well.

It's more squared off than the pointy Quarter class. And, as previously mentioned, the head/bridge tower is much smaller in relation to the body.

[ManhattanProject972]

Maybe Its a slightly bigger Macross Quarter called the Macross Three Eighth?

Edited April 12, 2016 by ManhattanProject972

[RedWolf]

Max better not be the one who gave Mirage this creature. Gubaba may be a hairball but its cuter.

Edited April 12, 2016 by RedWolf

[d3v]

I wonder what Millia thinks of Mirage's love life. I'm guessing that the moment she hears about her having a rival and punching him down, she's already started planning the wedding and sent the knife she used on Max in the mail.

Maybe Its a slightly bigger Macross Quarter called the Macross Three Eighth?

Sizes are now defined in Decultures. So if the Elysium is a "Deculture and a half" (based on the gg sub), then maybe the Quarter is just a Deculture and a quarter.

Edited April 12, 2016 by d3v

[anime52k8]

Maybe Its a slightly bigger Macross Quarter called the Macross Three Eighth?

Maybe their on the metric system, Macross 10mm?

I wonder what Millia thinks of Mirage's love life. I'm guessing that the moment she hears about her having a rival and punching him down, she's already started planning the wedding and sent the knife she used on Max in the mail.

She probably thinks Mirage isn't trying hard enough considering she hasn't tried to actually murder him twice in their first three encounters.

Edited April 12, 2016 by anime52k8

[ManhattanProject972]

Max better not be the one who gave Mirage this creature. Gubaba may be a hairball but its cuter.

Pets of Zentradi hybrid girls.jpg

I think its just a toy or something cause a who would own as a pet something that creepy looking. Then again it is Mirage and if her demeanor is any indicator she may have weird tastes and there are people in this world who own pugs.

And on a different note, What if Gamlin is Mirage's father and Mylene was the one who introduced him to her sister? That could explain her seriousness.

[calubin_175]

Is it same to assume that Delta is about NUNs imperialism and the Windermere's resistance to it leads to mutual cultural(song) exchange?

Is NUNs more like Star Wars' Galactic Republic or the one in Star Trek?

[RedWolf]

Is it same to assume that Delta is about NUNs imperialism and the Windermere's resistance to it leads to mutual cultural(song) exchange?

Is NUNs more like Star Wars' Galactic Republic or the one in Star Trek?

The NUN is more of a Federation now a days with granting fleets and planets sovereignty.

Between a monarchy and knights it isn't farfetched that Windermere practices feudalism.

Which could be the reason why the revolution and independence war started. Nobles were losing power to this joint government with aliens that insist human rights and democracy,

[d3v]

She probably thinks Mirage isn't not trying hard enough considering she hasn't tried to actually murder him twice in their first three encounters.

In fairness, the stabbing only comes later on in the courtship ritual, right before the ceremonial setting fire to boiling water.

[anime52k8]

In fairness, the stabbing only comes later on in the courtship ritual, right before the ceremonial setting fire to boiling water.

cooking with gas!

[Graham]

Actually do we know if Elysium and Walkure have anything to do with NUNS? the only fighter markings are the Delta Squad ones... I don't think we have seen a single NUNS or SMS logo on anything at all.

Yes, we have seen the NUNS logo on the VF-171.

Attached screenshot from Mission 0.89. I haven't gone through mission 1 and 2 to check yet.

Graham

[RedWolf]

Interesting theory on why some Winderemereans hate Earth culture. Humans were engineered to be powerful fold wave transmitters, hybrids also have this potential as shown with Emilia and Mylene, as seen with the Vajra they can't normally communicate with Humans as they are not receivers. Windermereans Fold Receptor Factor is based on their Runes, organs that can transmit and receive fold waves or Space-Time Resonance energy.

In short Humans are loud uncultured primitives to them.

[sharky]

OP theme song? Thumbs down. This one is gonna take a while to get use to. ED theme song? Thumbs up.

My sentiment as well. The opening song was very forgetable. I knew the music wasn't going to be as good the minute I learned Yoko Kanno wasn't doing it.

Still, there's plenty to like about the series than dislike, and I'm definitely leaning more to an overall thumbs up.

Edited April 12, 2016 by sharky

[Roy Focker]

Are the Wind people a human colony or a different humanoid species like the Zolans? If human than I'm a tad confused on how an apparent aristocratic society can spring up 60 years after the near destruction of the Earth on its own.

[d3v]

Koi Halation the War has been growing on me after this episode, especially...

Freyja's version from her "final audition"

Here's hoping for a full length version of it.

[Rbstr]

My sentiment as well. The opening song was very forgetable. I knew the music wasn't going to be as good the minute I learned Yoko Kanno wasn't doing it.

Still, there's plenty to like about the series than dislike, and I'm definitely leaning more to an overall thumbs up.

I dono, a couple listens and I'm hooked, especially that "Todoke!" part.

[RedWolf]

Are the Wind people a human colony or a different humanoid species like the Zolans? If human than I'm a tad confused on how an apparent aristocratic society can spring up 60 years after the near destruction of the Earth on its own.

The later and it seems the NUN has found a number of Sub-Protoculture races at the Outer Rim. Note according to Egan Loo's Macross Chronology there were Protoculture remnants at the edge of the galaxy. In MD7 Zola was located at the Rim.

While the Galaxy Treaty forbids invasion of planets with intelligent life it doesn't mean you can't offer a tech uplift for that race to join in.

In Windermere and Ragna's case they allowed colonist to migrate to their planets. Windermere though had a revolution for independence seceding from the NUN which led to policies of banning interstellar travel for Windermerean citizens and crack downs on Earth culture.

Windermereans

Ragnan

Unidentified races.

Fin ear girl at the left.

A Catgirl.

[Rbstr]

I think it turns out there's simply a ton of protoculture-derived races all over the galaxy. All you have to do is get to space and start exploring and you'll find them.

Humanity just happened to be the lucky* ones to get to space on a somewhat faster timeline thanks to the Supervision Army ship crash landing on Earth.

*Actual luck may be debatable...given it nearly caused our extinction too.

Edited April 12, 2016 by Rbstr

[RedWolf]

I think it turns out there's simply a ton of protoculture-derived races all over the galaxy. All you have to do is get to space and start exploring and you'll find them.

Humanity just happened to be the lucky* ones to get to space on a somewhat faster timeline thanks to the Supervision Army ship crash landing on Earth.

*Actual luck may be debatable...given it nearly caused our extinction too.

Which makes me wonder if traumatized humanity and Zentradi developed an Earthman's Burden over fellow Sub-Protoculture races. Handing over Overtechlogy and having their fleets defend these worlds. For example Ouroboros' entire native population disappeared with only one known survivor.

Decentralization makes sense if you are giving these races a voice in your Federation. We do know there are reactionaries on Earth's side. Lactence was a pro-Earth supremacist group that had Humans, Zentradi and Zolans in it. Naresuan leader of Fasces and member of Lactence was not only pro-Earth but saw Earth's culture as the second coming of the Protoculture. So he'd like all races to unify under Earth.

Richard Bilrer transport mogul also wanted to unify what he call the Children of the Protoculture by cutting travel time and communication lags using Fold Quartz.

Todo from Macross 30 was racked with guilt over the genocide of the Human race that he wanted to change history. But as Leon pointed out if that didn't happen they wouldn't have an interstellar civilization.

Edited April 12, 2016 by RedWolf

[d3v]

Honestly, I'm just happy we have a series that shows these other races. Both 7 and Frontier happened at the fringes of human expansion, so we never really got to see alot of what this fledgling galactic civilization or protoculture touched races was like.

[Valkyrie Driver]

I think it turns out there's simply a ton of protoculture-derived races all over the galaxy. All you have to do is get to space and start exploring and you'll find them.

Humanity just happened to be the lucky* ones to get to space on a somewhat faster timeline thanks to the Supervision Army ship crash landing on Earth.

*Actual luck may be debatable...given it nearly caused our extinction too.

Luck isn't always good. However, what does not kill you...

Honestly, I'm just happy we have a series that shows these other races. Both 7 and Frontier happened at the fringes of human expansion, so we never really got to see alot of what this fledgling galactic civilization or protoculture touched races was like.

Agreed.

[Mr March]

Was nice to see a VF-31A Siegfried. Could that possibly be what Hayate will pilot? As a way to visually distinguish his mecha from the VF-31's piloted by the other characters?

I got a laugh out of Hayate using the bras d'honneur behind Mirage's back. I never expected to see something like that in a Macross anime. But then again, it's likely a gestural curiosity to Japanese culture and doesn't carry any kind of obscene weight like it does to European cultures.

I think the Macross Elysian is a Macross Quarter type ship, even inspite of some rather extensive differences. Aside from most of the points previously discussed about similarities/differences, the Walkure and Delta Squadron forces sure seem to act like - and are uniformed like - an SMS style para-military group outside the New United Nations Spacy forces. Some of them even mention a dislike for the military, just like the SMS personnel did in Macross Frontier. So it would make sense that the ship is a Quarter-style vessel being run by an unconventional military group. They certainly recruit in an unconventional way, for both Walkure personnel and Delta Quadron personnel

Edited April 12, 2016 by Mr March