Macross Δ (Delta) - Mission 2 - READ 1st POST

[Roy Focker]

Another neutral review from me. I like the pace of the episode. Much better than the first and there was actual story. The episode also downplayed super hero antics of the girl band. I'm not that keen on any of the characters. Everyone just seems like one-dimensional anime stereotypes. Still way too many characters for all of them to have time to develop beyond their stereotype. Maybe half of them get killed off half way through allowing the others time to grow.

[kajnrig]

And Hayate's allergic to them. I'm not even sure how that works, shouldn't the waterlogged fur keep the fish dander out of the air? Dear god, fish dander? What am I even typing?

There was some seal in there too, no? Seal fur. Super thick, waterproof, and it sheds on land and dries and voila, catfish dander.

Edited April 11, 2016 by kajnrig

[Sildani]

In the sub I watched, they were called mercats.

I'll be honest. I'm in this for the Valkyries, Mirage, and an explanation of what the Aerial Knights are doing. The songs don't do much for me at all, not even Ikenai Borderline... but few people can follow up Yoko Kanno, so I kinda expected that.

The story and the setting have hooked me. Most of the characters I don't mind, which might be damming with faint praise, but aside from Mirage, and possibly Kaname, I don't have much investment with any of them yet. I rather like Messer, though, hopefully he won't simply be a rules-bound cold fish. His small sequence in the opening credits give me hope he won't.

By the way: OP? MD? Huh?

[Rbstr]

I haven't been able to watch a sub yet, couldn't be up all night

Was that the GG sub? I dono why they'd not go for the pun-y and literal translation of "Seacat" except to troll a bit.

I've found the characters to be pretty interesting so far. With the large number of them it's pretty early in the show to have a deep grasp on them. They simply aren't going to reveal everything in the first two episodes anyway. Maybe lots of them will be undeveloped maybe not.

I think people tend to compare finished series, where all things are known and experienced, to stuff that's currently airing without considering the gap in knowledge. There could be a ton of foreshadowing that is unrecognizable except in hindsight ect.

Edited April 11, 2016 by Rbstr

[azrael]

Disliked the ending animation as no VF stuff going on.

None of the other TV series had much VF-action, if any, going on during their ending themes so there's no big lose there.

I rather like Messer, though, hopefully he won't simply be a rules-bound cold fish. His small sequence in the opening credits give me hope he won't.

Messer v. Keith is what the story is pushing so I would expect some epic dogfighting scenes when they 2 face one another.

[Raptor One]

He can like whatever he wants to like about the show. If it's only Kawamori's fighter designs and the choreography of the fights involved that's his prerogative.

This

By the way: OP? MD? Huh?

OP = Opening Credit Sequence. ED = Ending Credit Sequence

Not sure what MD is or where it was mentioned

[Zinjo]

The whole Winderian "Revolution" will be interesting. It feels very much like the Russian revolution where they closed their borders after they won. It will be interesting to see how SK characterizes it.

[d3v]

Is it really Ragna, or Laguna? I've seen the former used more, but the latter seems to make more sense.

[Lakan]

Oh my! So much moe on this episode! I can't~~~

The planet looked absolutely stunning! Reminds me of the setting on Macross Zero. Tropical paradise!

[kajnrig]

Covering the topics of the last three pages:

- OP and ED were both forgettable, but then so was Triangler at first (Triangular?), despite Maaya Sakamoto. I warmed up enough to that, no reason I won't do the same with these. (Also second to whoever said Kanno would be hard to follow. This is like going from Plus to 7.)

- Enjoying the literal atmosphere. Didn't see enough planetary backdrops in Frontier.

I'm not that keen on any of the characters. Everyone just seems like one-dimensional anime stereotypes.

I agree, a bit too trope-heavy. Again, not so much that I can't stand it, but still. Cocky reluctant hero who will learn to apply and dedicate himself. Antagonistic/caustic ice queen who will learn to loosen up over the course of the season. Messer getting irrationally worked up over Hayate's smartass attitude.

If they really eschew the love triangle, I will truly be impressed with the novelty.

Is it really Ragna, or Laguna? I've seen the former used more, but the latter seems to make more sense.

Been wondering this myself. I like Laguna more.

The whole Winderian "Revolution" will be interesting. It feels very much like the Russian revolution where they closed their borders after they won.

There are also shades, intentional or otherwise, of isolationist Japan pre-Meiji. This might be a subtle analysis/critique/etc. of that era of Japanese history... but it probably isn't.

[azrael]

Is it really Ragna, or Laguna? I've seen the former used more, but the latter seems to make more sense.

The map and Frejya's poster say "Ragna".

[Nazareno2012]

Is it really Ragna, or Laguna? I've seen the former used more, but the latter seems to make more sense.

If it was Laguna it will be funny if there is a town there called Calauan whose main produce is pineapples, and expect some pineapple salad!

(in real life Calauan is a town in Laguna Province known for pineapples)

[anime52k8]

Ragna makes more sense with the Norse naming scheme they've got going on already.

[PrimumMobile]

He can like whatever he wants to like about the show. If it's only Kawamori's fighter designs and the choreography of the fights involved that's his prerogative.

Sure, bit for me its a particularly shallow eay of watching any form of media.

I think most of you got Messer all wrong. He's prety chill and a man of few words but generally agreeable. That smile he cracked in the OP was pretty telling. Mirage will be the only problem Hayate will be facing from the Delta Squadron.

Edited April 11, 2016 by PrimumMobile

[Seto Kaiba]

So... I just finished watching the episode a few minutes ago. Here's some thoughts:

The OP... I'm torn on this one, and will have to wait for a full version of the song to properly judge it. It has a nice bounce to it though.

On its own, the animation of the OP seems to have answered a few questions. The Sv-262 seems to have a virtual cockpit like the VF-27's, and the reason that it looks like the pilots aren't wearing helmets is because it's being edited out by the virtual cockpit. Drawing the gun pod seems to be a rather involved process for the VF-31 as well.

As for the substance of the episode itself:

Wow... first time in a long time we've seen Zentradi corpses strewn around like that. I think the folks who were hoping for a little less sunshine and lollipops and a little more "hey kids, welcome to the war" are going to get their wish.

Mirage REALLY tore into Hayate too... I don't think we've seen a woman in Macross go upside a protagonist's head like that. I guess they're going the belligerent sexual tension route. She has a hair-trigger temper and he apparently has an instinctive grasp of exactly which buttons to push to set her off. Things seem to be off to an excellent start for Freyja though... getting a nod from all four members of Walkure.

Also, what the hell is that carrier? That's new. I wonder if that's the Elysion's cruiser mode? It kind of reminds me of some of the fan art sketches for ships like the Kaga-class, which was a sort of super-sized Guantanamo-class with conventional carrier decks on all four sides. Loving the Aerial Knights hangar though... that's some inspired architecture. From the way the GERWALK mode is shaped, I'm suspecting the Sv-262 has a similar backstory to the other enemy VFs that we've seen so far. Seems a safe bet the stolen (N)UNS VF that was used as the basis for the design was a Nightmare Plus.

I guess they weren't kidding that Lloyd was a bit of a glasses otaku. Did anyone else see the HUGE DISPLAY CASE full of pairs of glasses in his room?

The arrival on Ragna is interesting for a few reasons on its own. The first being that apparently the interstellar cargo haulers that we're only now seeing (even though multiple Macross Frontier-era characters owned or had ties to interstellar shipping companies) are also pulling double duty as passenger liners. More interesting is that Barrette City seems to be a New Macross-class City section and a surface city. I'd thought there were laws against colonizing planets which already had a native sentient species... though maybe they're there by the invitation of the Ragnans?

CV/C-109 Macross Elysion, huh? I guess they did decide to go with the Greek spelling... and speaking of, I can't believe I didn't notice earlier but it looks like the organization name is supposed to be in Greek as well (χάος, Kaos), that's the marking written on the VF-31's gun pod and a bunch of buildings around the feet of Macross Elysion as well.

I have to admit I got a chuckle out of Hayate getting distracted by the sexy... airplane, that is. My god the VF-31A looks GOOOOOOD. So much better than the forward-swept wings of the Delta Platoon ones. Some interesting tidbits dropped about Windermere. Looks like the Aerial Knights and whoever's holding their leash may be a relatively new government that's gone into isolationist mode and is now seeing to purge extraterrestrial culture from its own lands (and maybe everywhere else as well). Potential motivation for weaponizing Var syndrome...

Got another chuckle out of Captain Johnson's entrance too. He totally came in through the small door on purpose. Still, talk about being built like four brick sh*thouses stacked together. His biceps are bigger around than Kaname's waist!

The climax of the episode went really well for Freyja too... she's definitely got a lot more backbone than Ranka. I may actually like Love's Halation THE WAR better as an a capella song. Come to that, I think I like the low-key versions of the Walkure members better than their performance outfits. It'd explain Mikumo's really over-the-top hair if it's just a hologram rather than half her body weight in hair trailing around everywhere.

The ED just does nothing for me, I'm afraid...

Edited April 11, 2016 by Seto Kaiba

[UN Spacy]

Can anyone list the planets colonized in Macross?

Eden?

Alshalal?

Raguna?

They mentioned a few more at the end.

[EXO]

It's kind of a mix between the Norse and the Spanish word for Lagoon because it looks like a planet of lagoons. A bunch of islands with closed off coves.

[JB0]

Just once, I just want someone to pop up when Freyja's singing and they're metering her fold waves with that circle graph... someone to look at the graph and shout "ANIMA SPIRITIA!", just so I don't have to.

[Seto Kaiba]

Can anyone list the planets colonized in Macross?

Eden?

Alshalal?

Raguna?

They mentioned a few more at the end.

We've only actually seen a few... but the list includes:

Al Shahal

Avalon

Avemaria

Banipal(?, there are coal mines there, so presumably some settlement exists)

Bellfan

Beneb

Cristania

Dahan

Ebel

Eden

Eden 3 (not the same star system)

Endebald

Ganymede (also a moon)

Gregor

Hydra

Iota

Jupiter (multiple satellite cities)

Listania

Luna (technically a moon, but hey)

Mars

Neo York

Neptune (satellite city)

New Asia

Ragna(?, there's an emigrant ship there, at least)

Salvation

Saturn (satellite city)

Sephira

Susia

Uroboros

Varauta

Veil

Venus ("satellite city" orbital colony)

Vulcan

Windermere(?, like Ragna, but apparently abandoned)

There are a few that are not named... lke the abandoned colony planet to which the Milky Dolls were taken after being abducted, the former Vajra planet which the Macross Frontier landed on... and a few where it's not clear if the planet counts as a colony or not, like Galia 4.

[Duymon]

Only watched the opening and ending so far.

Hopefully will have time to download and watch episode 2 in the next few days.

Still don't like the songs. I just don't find them catchy at all. Far prefer the songs in Frontier to Delta.

Liked quite a bit of the opening animation, as quite a lot of VF stuff going on. The 31 is really growing on me, can't wait for the toys.

Disliked the ending animation as no VF stuff going on.

Graham

I think it prolly has to do with the fact that Frontier had Yoko Kanno behind all the new songs that appeared in Frontier. Add to that May'n and Megumi were a pretty slick combo.

Delta's music is pretty meh thus far. Like what the hell is with the cheesy playstation 1990's music that's playing in the very beginning of the episode? And why does the beginning of the OP sound like every other low-budget crappy moe harem show?

on a side note, Mac 7's silliness is forgiven because Fukuyama is badass

Edited April 11, 2016 by Duymon

[hulagu]

So did I hear that right? Is the Macross carrier Delta Squadron uses called the Macross Edition?

Macross Elysion.

Looks like a cross between the Quarter and the (Old) Macross class?

Edited April 11, 2016 by hulagu

[squaresphere]

Pretty much agree with all the sentiment. The ep is solid and helps provide a lot of background to the situation everyone is in while still leaving plenty of mysteries to be discovered. I just wish there were better encodes of the show

[BChoinski]

Just saw #2. I'm still jazzed fro the season.

The preview was good for music and mecha, #1 tightened it up nicely. Not as hip on the OP as I was for Triangular, but after the second or third play it's starting to grow on me.

Still high on the valk designs...the "max and millia" snap in the opening with Hayate and Mirage is nice, not sure if I want a blue or a red VF31.

The Elysium is awesome. I think it looks bigger than a quarter, though.

I liked the touch of the core city on Ragna being based on the colony city. It makes sense.

So far, no characters have rubbed me the wrong way. Freya has the personality Ranka SHOULD have had and does not seem like such a load, and Hayate is not as angsty as Alto, so he is on the plus side as well. Still neutral on Mirage, and most of the rest of the characters need to make their case, though the flight commander and the Captain of the Elysium have my nods so far.

Good counter-point to #1, and I can't wait for #3.

[Sandman]

Macross Elysion.

Looks like a cross between the Quarter and the (Old) Macross class?

Yeah when i first saw it i instantly thought of the original Macross. Then i was like no that's a quarter. Then i notice the arms look different. I'm looking forward to learning about this ship. Weird that they've chosen to have it stand up in is stationary position. You would think carrier mode would be the preferred choice. But like others have said the original macross sits in a lake.

[Rbstr]

Come to that, I think I like the low-key versions of the Walkure members better than their performance outfits. It'd explain Mikumo's really over-the-top hair if it's just a hologram rather than half her body weight in hair trailing around everywhere.

I'm pretty sure those were disguises, not Walkure sans-makeup, if you will.

[RedWolf]

We've only actually seen a few... but the list includes:

Al Shahal

Avalon

Avemaria

Banipal(?, there are coal mines there, so presumably some settlement exists)

Bellfan

Beneb

Cristania

Dahan

Ebel

Eden

Eden 3 (not the same star system)

Endebald

Ganymede (also a moon)

Gregor

Hydra

Iota

Jupiter (multiple satellite cities)

Listania

Luna (technically a moon, but hey)

Mars

Neo York

Neptune (satellite city)

New Asia

Ragna(?, there's an emigrant ship there, at least)

Salvation

Saturn (satellite city)

Sephira

Susia

Uroboros

Varauta

Veil

Venus ("satellite city" orbital colony)

Vulcan

Windermere(?, like Ragna, but apparently abandoned)

There are a few that are not named... lke the abandoned colony planet to which the Milky Dolls were taken after being abducted, the former Vajra planet which the Macross Frontier landed on... and a few where it's not clear if the planet counts as a colony or not, like Galia 4.

The planet where the Milky Doll's taken was Elysium. UN anandoned that planet as it had a freaking Main Fleet ship buried.

So... I just finished watching the episode a few minutes ago. Here's some thoughts:

The OP... I'm torn on this one, and will have to wait for a full version of the song to properly judge it. It has a nice bounce to it though.

On its own, the animation of the OP seems to have answered a few questions. The Sv-262 seems to have a virtual cockpit like the VF-27's, and the reason that it looks like the pilots aren't wearing helmets is because it's being edited out by the virtual cockpit. Drawing the gun pod seems to be a rather involved process for the VF-31 as well.

As for the substance of the episode itself:

The arrival on Ragna is interesting for a few reasons on its own. The first being that apparently the interstellar cargo haulers that we're only now seeing (even though multiple Macross Frontier-era characters owned or had ties to interstellar shipping companies) are also pulling double duty as passenger liners. More interesting is that Barrette City seems to be a New Macross-class City section and a surface city. I'd thought there were laws against colonizing planets which already had a native sentient species... though maybe they're there by the invitation of the Ragnans?

Well it seems the verbatim of the Galaxy Treaty on that refers to invading planets. Note the new UN got its fresh start by being a joint government between Humans and Zentradi.

Macross Chronicle mentions it is hard to find Earth-like Class A planets and some fleets had to resort to terraforming like Sephira or Eden 3. So I can see some fleets offering an uplift package if a planet joins the NUN.

The whole Winderian "Revolution" will be interesting. It feels very much like the Russian revolution where they closed their borders after they won. It will be interesting to see how SK characterizes it.

To me it sounds like the Meiji Restoration with the Kingdom of Wind going Tokugawa isolationism and Imperial Japan route at the same time in the present.

They are testing NUNS resolve as well as countermeasures they have for the Var syndrome.

The Kingdom of Wind must realize that on a straight fight they'd lose to the NUN. NUNS have too much military potential to be ignored.

Edited April 12, 2016 by RedWolf

[aerocombatpilot]

So....

the triangle thing was resolved pretty quick... now lets enjoy the music and robots thing

THE NEW MAX AND MIRIA?

[Seto Kaiba]

The planet where the Milky Doll's taken was Elysium. UN anandoned that planet as it had a freaking Main Fleet ship buried.

Ah, thank you! It's been ages since I last played the game, and I'd totally forgotten the planet even had a name.

Well it seems the verbatim of the Galaxy Treaty on that refers to invading planets. Note the new UN got its fresh start by being a joint government between Humans and Zentradi.

Macross Chronicle mentions it is hard to find Earth-like Class A planets and some fleets had to resort to terraforming like Sephira or Eden 3. So I can see some fleets offering an uplift package if a planet joins the NUN.

Well, yeah... on paper the little-n "new" UN Government was supposed to be a joint government between Humans and Zentradi, though there seem to be a fair number of Zentradi who feel that humans are a bit more equal than them in the new government.

Yeah, I could certainly see the New UN Government offering to extend technological aid to planets willing to join the government and permit humans and other species to settle there. So far, the Windermerians seem to be the odd men out in that they don't seem to be entirely cool with the idea of alien cultures mixing with theirs.

The Kingdom of Wind must realize that on a straight fight they'd lose to the NUN. NUNS have too much military potential to be ignored.

In that sense, I think the Kingdom of the Wind kind of has the New UN Government at a disadvantage. Yeah, the New UN Spacy probably outnumbers them to a colossal extent, but they can't force themselves on the Windermerians because it'd be an invasion and thus a violation of the galaxy treaty. So, as long as planet Windermere avoids attacking multiple planets directly, the numerical advantage is minimized because the NUNS spread out across an area over a hundred thousand light years wide.

[azrael]

In that sense, I think the Kingdom of the Wind kind of has the New UN Government at a disadvantage. Yeah, the New UN Spacy probably outnumbers them to a colossal extent, but they can't force themselves on the Windermerians because it'd be an invasion and thus a violation of the galaxy treaty. So, as long as planet Windermere avoids attacking multiple planets directly, the numerical advantage is minimized because the NUNS spread out across an area over a hundred thousand light years wide.

Keep in mind, most modern rules of warfare specify attacks on military targets is considered an attack on a nation itself. Al Shahal may not be forgiving of that when they find out Windermere is discovered as the attacker. The NUN may not be forgiving either.

[Scream Man]

Yeah when i first saw it i instantly thought of the original Macross. Then i was like no that's a quarter. Then i notice the arms look different. I'm looking forward to learning about this ship. Weird that they've chosen to have it stand up in is stationary position. You would think carrier mode would be the preferred choice. But like others have said the original macross sits in a lake.

Yeah I was discussing that with Tochiro last night. She seems bigger than the Quarter to my eye, but then we almost never see the Quarter with people just milling about or near windows, so scale is hard to judge. I dont think she's as large as Macross or Battle 7.

Keep in mind, most modern rules of warfare specify attacks on military targets is considered an attack on a nation itself. Al Shahal may not be forgiving of that when they find out Windermere is discovered as the attacker. The NUN may not be forgiving either.

An excellent point.

Actually do we know if Elysium and Walkure have anything to do with NUNS? the only fighter markings are the Delta Squad ones... I don't think we have seen a single NUNS or SMS logo on anything at all.

[d3v]

If it was Laguna it will be funny if there is a town there called Calauan whose main produce is pineapples, and expect some pineapple salad!

(in real life Calauan is a town in Laguna Province known for pineapples)

I am Filipino, and I approve of this.

[Rbstr]

Yeah I was discussing that with Tochiro last night. She seems bigger than the Quarter to my eye, but then we almost never see the Quarter with people just milling about or near windows, so scale is hard to judge. I dont think she's as large as Macross or Battle 7.

Is it maybe an updated Global class? It's definitely bigger than a quarter.

I wonder if Ragna is a pretty old colony/far away colony.

[Seto Kaiba]

Actually do we know if Elysium and Walkure have anything to do with NUNS? the only fighter markings are the Delta Squad ones... I don't think we have seen a single NUNS or SMS logo on anything at all.

Arad expresses that he has no love for the military, so I think it's a safe bet that Kaos (the organization running Delta Platoon and Walkure) is probably a PMC or, at most, regarded as irregulars by the NUNS.

Is it maybe an updated Global class? It's definitely bigger than a quarter.

I wonder if Ragna is a pretty old colony/far away colony.

Nah, it's definitely a Macross Quarter-class ship and no mistake... there's just too much design commonality for it to be anything else. Mind you, everyone forgets just how huge the Macross Quarter-class is. It's small by the standards of Macross-type warships, but it's still the size of the Empire State Building and this one is made to look even larger because it's sitting on top of a not-insignificant hill.

[PrimumMobile]

No one wants to talk about how Windemere looks like a frozen Tundra?

Edited April 12, 2016 by PrimumMobile

[d3v]

We've only actually seen a few... but the list includes:

Al Shahal

Avalon

Avemaria

Banipal(?, there are coal mines there, so presumably some settlement exists)

Bellfan

Beneb

Cristania

Dahan

Ebel

Eden

Eden 3 (not the same star system)

Endebald

Ganymede (also a moon)

Gregor

Hydra

Iota

Jupiter (multiple satellite cities)

Listania

Luna (technically a moon, but hey)

Mars

Neo York

Neptune (satellite city)

New Asia

Ragna(?, there's an emigrant ship there, at least)

Salvation

Saturn (satellite city)

Sephira

Susia

Uroboros

Varauta

Veil

Venus ("satellite city" orbital colony)

Vulcan

Windermere(?, like Ragna, but apparently abandoned)

There are a few that are not named... lke the abandoned colony planet to which the Milky Dolls were taken after being abducted, the former Vajra planet which the Macross Frontier landed on... and a few where it's not clear if the planet counts as a colony or not, like Galia 4.

You forgot Zola.