Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi, on home media Mar. 13, 2018

[jvmacross]

Only good scene in the movie was the obvious homage to this.......and what a missed opportunity.....

Spoiler

I can't believe how they actually managed to make Luke's "end" more disappointing than Han's.....he couldn't be bothered to show up?.....

And WTF is up with the rubber Yoda puppet?!!!?  Seriously?  The rubber Yoda puppet was one of the worse parts of the whole POS film....and there were several POS parts and moments.....2 hours of a Star Destroyer chasing down a rebel ship....huh????  

Disney execs:  OK, so what other iconic scenes can we take from the OT and add them to the ST cause people love that crap...

Disney yes man: Ummm...oh, how about the opening scene from ANH where we see a rebel ship get chased down by a Star Destroyer.....

Disney exec:  OK....yeah, keep talking....

Disney yes man: Well, if that worked for a few moments on ANH....what if we just kept it going for an entire movie.....

Disney exec:  Brilliant!!!

 

[Mog]

50 minutes ago, snakerbot said:

Before I give my thoughts on the rest of the movie, let me say that I thought TFA was alright, but not better than that. It's greatest sin was just being ANH again. If I wanted to watch ANH, I'd watch ANH, I don't need two of it.

Some thoughts on various spoilery bits:

  Reveal hidden contents

Stuff I liked:

• Rey's a nobody.
• Ben killing Snoke. Separates it from the Sith master/apprentice thing from the previous two trilogies, and it'll be interesting to see what happens next without a behind-the-scenes xanatos-gambit-running mastermind.
• Little details that, intentionally or not, called back to stuff from the old Expanded Universe, like the hyperspace ramming speed (although I feel like it shouldn't have taken out any ships other than the Supremacy), and Luke's force telepresence.
• The Mega-class star destroyer, for all the terribleness of its name, had a cool design.

Dislike:

• Rey seems to be getting too powerful too quick. She has like a day of training and Luke already feel comfortable leaving the Jedi Order in her hands.
• Why is it that fighters in this movie always seem to be able to fly right up next to the hull of ships that by all rights should have their shields up?
• The bridge tower on the Mandator-IV class dreadnought. What were they thinking?

Other thoughts:

I'm glad it wasn't just ESB again. It took details from ESB and RotJ, but for the most part handled them differently enough for my liking. Something about the whole thing just felt off, though. It just never captured me. Maybe I'm not letting it, since I still miss the old EU, but I never really could get invested in the story. It also definitely tried to do too much.

Overall, I'll rate it an "eeehhh".

I agree with a lot of your sentiments.

I went in expecting to absolutely hate Force Awakens, and I found it. . . okay?  Definitely was enjoyable enough, but too much of A Newer Hope and way too many annoying JJ Abrams' tropes.

With Last Jedi, I have some mixed emotions.  There's some good moments and good ideas in here, but it's frustratingly lacking too.

Other than Poe growing a little, I have no connection to any of the new main characters. 

I still don't buy the whole First Order/Resistence conflict either.  Still feels like they're forcing an Empire/Rebels template just for the sake of plot.

As for Luke

I hate how his story ends in this sequel trilogy.  I'll post my full thoughts when I have a chance, but for now, I'd rather have the Luke from the Expanded Universe than this guy.

Last Jedi had some interesting ideas for him.  But I just don't believe the Luke from the OT would hide away for 20-30+ years, ignore his beloved friends, and NOT have learned a damn thing (and need some young girl, Chewie, and FINALLY, Yoda to give him a swift kick in the ass to get back in the fight).

For a guy who kept seeing the good in his dad despite all his evil deeds, I thought the Sequel Trilogy made Luke far too cynical for my tastes

[Negotiator]

Felt like I got 2 movies worth.  Enjoyed. It a lot.

[Dobber]

I think my main issue is

despite the message of hope they were pushing at the end, I was left with very little. Not talking as a fan complaining about a franchise, but in universe. The Resistance military is completely DESTROYED. They only have the Falcon. The First Order still has a large fighting force. It just feels a little too hopeless to me. Take Empire, yes the Rebels got beat down pretty good and escaped by the skin of their teeth ect.  but  they still had something to go to, to rally with. This group has NOTHING.  Just felt very bleak.

like I said earlier, I need to see this again.

Chris

[captain america]

10 minutes ago, Dobber said:

I think my main issue is

 

  Hide contents

despite the message of hope they were pushing at the end, I was left with very little. Not talking as a fan complaining about a franchise, but in universe. The Resistance military is completely DESTROYED. They only have the Falcon. The First Order still has a large fighting force. It just feels a little too hopeless to me. Take Empire, yes the Rebels got beat down pretty good and escaped by the skin of their teeth ect.  but  they still had something to go to, to rally with. This group has NOTHING.  Just felt very bleak.

 

like I said earlier, I need to see this again.

Chris

Spoiler

Sometimes you need to shed the old things that weigh you down in order to move forward. You saw that with Kylo-->Snoke, Rey with her parents, Luke with the old Jedi teachings, the Resistance with their fleet. That was the over-arching theme of the film.

...And that scene on Ach-To where Luke tosses the lightsaber over his shoulder... Money shot that will live for ever as a gif! 

It's definitely worth seeing again.

Edited December 15, 2017 by captain america

[myk]

41 minutes ago, Dobber said:

I think my main issue is

 

  Hide contents

despite the message of hope they were pushing at the end, I was left with very little. Not talking as a fan complaining about a franchise, but in universe. The Resistance military is completely DESTROYED. They only have the Falcon. The First Order still has a large fighting force. It just feels a little too hopeless to me. Take Empire, yes the Rebels got beat down pretty good and escaped by the skin of their teeth ect.  but  they still had something to go to, to rally with. This group has NOTHING.  Just felt very bleak.

 

like I said earlier, I need to see this again.

Chris

How did that come to be anyway?  I thought in FA the Order was on the ropes?

[Sandman]

I'm not sure how I feel about this move. I think it was executed fine but some of the story decisions were odd and flat out wrong (especially for one character in particular)

[Kanedas Bike]

10 minutes ago, myk said:

How did that come to be anyway?  I thought in FA the Order was on the ropes?

 

Nope, they really only lost one planet/base in TFA, whereas the Resistance/Rebels was always a fringe element that needed the new Republic. So when the Republic fleet was destroyed, well...

 

58 minutes ago, Dobber said:

I think my main issue is

 

  Reveal hidden contents

despite the message of hope they were pushing at the end, I was left with very little. Not talking as a fan complaining about a franchise, but in universe. The Resistance military is completely DESTROYED. They only have the Falcon. The First Order still has a large fighting force. It just feels a little too hopeless to me. Take Empire, yes the Rebels got beat down pretty good and escaped by the skin of their teeth ect.  but  they still had something to go to, to rally with. This group has NOTHING.  Just felt very bleak.

 

like I said earlier, I need to see this again.

Chris

 

Those 'messages' that were received and not responded to where ignored by someone, hopefully that's addressed in Episode IX.

 

Seeing a lot of discussion about The Last Jedi confirms my thought that this would be another polarizing entry. I hoped, that because I didn't think people would be able to call this derivative, the movie would be more universally accepted. 

After thinking it over I still very much enjoyed it, flaws and all.

-b.

[peter]

Spoiler

Things I liked:

·         X-wings, A-Wings

·         Humour was an acceptable level.  Was really worried that the characters wouldn’t seem like themselves, but it actually worked out ok and didn’t distract me that much.  Then again, I probably ate crayons as a kid so I’m easily amused.

·         Some touching moments (don’t remember exactly which ones at the moment), pretty sure I saw people in theatres getting out napkins to wipe away tears….oh, wait, Leia’s hologram from ANH was a nice touch.

·         Puppet Ghost Force Yoda…..50/50 on this one.  I liked he came back, but wished he wasn’t based off the puppet from Empire and Jedi, but just an older version of ROTS.  As much as I hated Haydensen, it would have been cool to see Luke talk to his dad in this, or at least hear from ex-Vader.

·         Nice touch with Rey mirroring Luke’s words from Jedi on the way to see the Emperor

·         Despite some gripes about Snoke’s demise, I did like that scene where Kylo came around and turned on him.  The following fight scene was enjoyable as well.  Glad there wasn’t a significant amount of Wushu style lightsaber combat.  I studied Wushu for about 15 years and I’ve got nothing against it, but was really irked by the overly flashy style change in lightsaber combat.  Regarding Luke’s fighting style, see below in things I didn’t like.

 

Things I didn’t like:

·         Even though the new bombers probably carry more payload, I wish they brought the Y-Wings back….I know, these were already outdated by ANH

·         Didn’t like the whole tracking thing?  When I first heard of the evil BB8, droind, I was thinking maybe it was on the Resistance ships the whole time and was acting as an informant/saboteur?

·         The two hour chase scene seemed a bit retarded

·         Still not sold on the “Resistance”, but that’s JJ’s and crew’s fault.  What exactly were they resisting?  It sure appeared like New Republic had a handle on things and the First Order was hardly a visible threat until they blew them up with Starkiller.

·         Admiral Ackbar won’t be Admiral Obvious anymore.

·         Vice Admiral Holdo….pretty sure her uniform and haircut don’t conform to the grooming standard.  Okay, she got crap done, but doing it in an evening gown was a little retarded.  I get it, “muh vahginuh” feminism, but seriously, WTF. 

·         First Han, now Luke……...get rid of C3PO maybe, but should have left Luke and Han around until at least Rian’s new standalone series comes around.

·         I mentioned I studied Wushu for 15 years, well, after I stopped, I picked up Iaido and have been doing it for the last 12 years, so I noticed some pretty minor things……Luke used to hold his lightsaber like a katana, with his right hand above his left.  I guess it is possible Luke became ambidextrous in over the years, but in all honesty, I think it’s just Mark Hamill forgetting what he did in the original films.

·         Anikin’s lightsaber was broken in half by his squabbling grandkids.  I know, Rey isn’t his grandkid, but there were moments when I thought they were really close to going to go that way.  Anyway, hope it gets fixed because it seemed to hold a lot of symbology , like Narsil or Excalibur, but sadly, I have my doubts it will appear again.

·         Didn’t like the Crate skimmer things.  Would have been cool to see some beat up Snow Speeders, but I know, no snow, and folks probably wouldn’t want to see that either and would prefer something new and interesting.

 

Things that left me hanging:

·         Kylo faltering between the light and the dark,  and tells Ray that he things they should let both sides die, but is essentially still dark.

·         Leia getting blown into space….thought that’s where they would write her character out (RIP Carrie Fisher), but they brought her back and left her in for us to wonder what the hell are they going to do about her in the next film…..meanwhile, Mark Hamill is alive and well, but either out or coming back as a Force Ghost.  So, what’s going to happen to Leia?

·         Were those the Jedi books in the Falcon near the end?

·         So…..who the fuk is Snoke???  They made him out to be such a huge deal in TFA, and all this secrecy surrounding him only for him to go out like a *itch?  AND HE DIDN’T FORSEE IT??  Lol, he’s just as bad as Yoda for not seeing Darth Sidious when even my 5 year old nephew spotted him at the time, lol!  Buy to clarify, I did enjoy seeing him die.  But seriously, who was he?

·         So Rey really is a nobody?????  Just a couple of junkies that ended up getting buried on Jakku?

·         Did the Falcon lose its radar dish again?  I’m not really sure.

·         Did the kid on Canto Bight retrieve his broom with the Force or was that my imagination?

Overall, I liked it.  Going to see it again for sure.  Just going to jump into the spoiler tag for my whole post

[captain america]

55 minutes ago, peter said:

  Hide contents

Things I liked:

·         X-wings, A-Wings

·         Humour was an acceptable level.  Was really worried that the characters wouldn’t seem like themselves, but it actually worked out ok and didn’t distract me that much.  Then again, I probably ate crayons as a kid so I’m easily amused.

·         Some touching moments (don’t remember exactly which ones at the moment), pretty sure I saw people in theatres getting out napkins to wipe away tears….oh, wait, Leia’s hologram from ANH was a nice touch.

·         Puppet Ghost Force Yoda…..50/50 on this one.  I liked he came back, but wished he wasn’t based off the puppet from Empire and Jedi, but just an older version of ROTS.  As much as I hated Haydensen, it would have been cool to see Luke talk to his dad in this, or at least hear from ex-Vader.

·         Nice touch with Rey mirroring Luke’s words from Jedi on the way to see the Emperor

·         Despite some gripes about Snoke’s demise, I did like that scene where Kylo came around and turned on him.  The following fight scene was enjoyable as well.  Glad there wasn’t a significant amount of Wushu style lightsaber combat.  I studied Wushu for about 15 years and I’ve got nothing against it, but was really irked by the overly flashy style change in lightsaber combat.  Regarding Luke’s fighting style, see below in things I didn’t like.

 

Things I didn’t like:

·         Even though the new bombers probably carry more payload, I wish they brought the Y-Wings back….I know, these were already outdated by ANH

·         Didn’t like the whole tracking thing?  When I first heard of the evil BB8, droind, I was thinking maybe it was on the Resistance ships the whole time and was acting as an informant/saboteur?

·         The two hour chase scene seemed a bit retarded

·         Still not sold on the “Resistance”, but that’s JJ’s and crew’s fault.  What exactly were they resisting?  It sure appeared like New Republic had a handle on things and the First Order was hardly a visible threat until they blew them up with Starkiller.

·         Admiral Ackbar won’t be Admiral Obvious anymore.

·         Vice Admiral Holdo….pretty sure her uniform and haircut don’t conform to the grooming standard.  Okay, she got crap done, but doing it in an evening gown was a little retarded.  I get it, “muh vahginuh” feminism, but seriously, WTF. 

·         First Han, now Luke……...get rid of C3PO maybe, but should have left Luke and Han around until at least Rian’s new standalone series comes around.

·         I mentioned I studied Wushu for 15 years, well, after I stopped, I picked up Iaido and have been doing it for the last 12 years, so I noticed some pretty minor things……Luke used to hold his lightsaber like a katana, with his right hand above his left.  I guess it is possible Luke became ambidextrous in over the years, but in all honesty, I think it’s just Mark Hamill forgetting what he did in the original films.

·         Anikin’s lightsaber was broken in half by his squabbling grandkids.  I know, Rey isn’t his grandkid, but there were moments when I thought they were really close to going to go that way.  Anyway, hope it gets fixed because it seemed to hold a lot of symbology , like Narsil or Excalibur, but sadly, I have my doubts it will appear again.

-I suspect that the breaking of the saber is very much symbolic, but that it will be restored in Episode IX

·         Didn’t like the Crate skimmer things.  Would have been cool to see some beat up Snow Speeders, but I know, no snow, and folks probably wouldn’t want to see that either and would prefer something new and interesting.

 

Things that left me hanging:

·         Kylo faltering between the light and the dark,  and tells Ray that he things they should let both sides die, but is essentially still dark.

-Much like how his grandfather suggested the overthrow of the emperor so that he and Luke could rule together. Ambition eventually blinds, and those who do not understand the past are doomed to repeat it.

·         Leia getting blown into space….thought that’s where they would write her character out (RIP Carrie Fisher), but they brought her back and left her in for us to wonder what the hell are they going to do about her in the next film…..meanwhile, Mark Hamill is alive and well, but either out or coming back as a Force Ghost.  So, what’s going to happen to Leia?

·         Were those the Jedi books in the Falcon near the end?

-I had the very same thought! Maybe Rey "borrowed" them before she left.

·         So…..who the fuk is Snoke???  They made him out to be such a huge deal in TFA, and all this secrecy surrounding him only for him to go out like a *itch?  AND HE DIDN’T FORSEE IT??  Lol, he’s just as bad as Yoda for not seeing Darth Sidious when even my 5 year old nephew spotted him at the time, lol!  Buy to clarify, I did enjoy seeing him die.  But seriously, who was he?

-Seemingly just another force-adept that becomes blined by ambition/power and is overthrown by his even more ambitious apprentice. History, blindness, repeat, bla, bla, bla. I actually thought it was quite clever of the writers to use the character as a huge red-herring the way they did.

·         So Rey really is a nobody?????  Just a couple of junkies that ended up getting buried on Jakku?

-Yup. The heritage of the Jedi is not transmitted by blood, but by conscience.

·         Did the Falcon lose its radar dish again?  I’m not really sure.

-Yes! We saw it in the trailer, so that wasn't such a big surprise. The Falcon took a few hits too, so yet more blaster damage.

·         Did the kid on Canto Bight retrieve his broom with the Force or was that my imagination?

-Yes he did. I suspect that the new rebellion will be largely a grass-roots movement that will be spread-out everywhere and yet in no single place.

Overall, I liked it.  Going to see it again for sure.  Just going to jump into the spoiler tag for my whole post

My comments in blue.

[Kanedas Bike]

1 hour ago, peter said:

  Hide contents

Things I liked:

·         X-wings, A-Wings

·         Humour was an acceptable level.  Was really worried that the characters wouldn’t seem like themselves, but it actually worked out ok and didn’t distract me that much.  Then again, I probably ate crayons as a kid so I’m easily amused.

·         Some touching moments (don’t remember exactly which ones at the moment), pretty sure I saw people in theatres getting out napkins to wipe away tears….oh, wait, Leia’s hologram from ANH was a nice touch.

·         Puppet Ghost Force Yoda…..50/50 on this one.  I liked he came back, but wished he wasn’t based off the puppet from Empire and Jedi, but just an older version of ROTS.  As much as I hated Haydensen, it would have been cool to see Luke talk to his dad in this, or at least hear from ex-Vader.

·         Nice touch with Rey mirroring Luke’s words from Jedi on the way to see the Emperor

·         Despite some gripes about Snoke’s demise, I did like that scene where Kylo came around and turned on him.  The following fight scene was enjoyable as well.  Glad there wasn’t a significant amount of Wushu style lightsaber combat.  I studied Wushu for about 15 years and I’ve got nothing against it, but was really irked by the overly flashy style change in lightsaber combat.  Regarding Luke’s fighting style, see below in things I didn’t like.

 

Things I didn’t like:

·         Even though the new bombers probably carry more payload, I wish they brought the Y-Wings back….I know, these were already outdated by ANH

·         Didn’t like the whole tracking thing?  When I first heard of the evil BB8, droind, I was thinking maybe it was on the Resistance ships the whole time and was acting as an informant/saboteur?

·         The two hour chase scene seemed a bit retarded

·         Still not sold on the “Resistance”, but that’s JJ’s and crew’s fault.  What exactly were they resisting?  It sure appeared like New Republic had a handle on things and the First Order was hardly a visible threat until they blew them up with Starkiller.

·         Admiral Ackbar won’t be Admiral Obvious anymore.

·         Vice Admiral Holdo….pretty sure her uniform and haircut don’t conform to the grooming standard.  Okay, she got crap done, but doing it in an evening gown was a little retarded.  I get it, “muh vahginuh” feminism, but seriously, WTF. 

·         First Han, now Luke……...get rid of C3PO maybe, but should have left Luke and Han around until at least Rian’s new standalone series comes around.

·         I mentioned I studied Wushu for 15 years, well, after I stopped, I picked up Iaido and have been doing it for the last 12 years, so I noticed some pretty minor things……Luke used to hold his lightsaber like a katana, with his right hand above his left.  I guess it is possible Luke became ambidextrous in over the years, but in all honesty, I think it’s just Mark Hamill forgetting what he did in the original films.

·         Anikin’s lightsaber was broken in half by his squabbling grandkids.  I know, Rey isn’t his grandkid, but there were moments when I thought they were really close to going to go that way.  Anyway, hope it gets fixed because it seemed to hold a lot of symbology , like Narsil or Excalibur, but sadly, I have my doubts it will appear again.

·         Didn’t like the Crate skimmer things.  Would have been cool to see some beat up Snow Speeders, but I know, no snow, and folks probably wouldn’t want to see that either and would prefer something new and interesting.

 

Things that left me hanging:

·         Kylo faltering between the light and the dark,  and tells Ray that he things they should let both sides die, but is essentially still dark.

·         Leia getting blown into space….thought that’s where they would write her character out (RIP Carrie Fisher), but they brought her back and left her in for us to wonder what the hell are they going to do about her in the next film…..meanwhile, Mark Hamill is alive and well, but either out or coming back as a Force Ghost.  So, what’s going to happen to Leia?

·         Were those the Jedi books in the Falcon near the end?

·         So…..who the fuk is Snoke???  They made him out to be such a huge deal in TFA, and all this secrecy surrounding him only for him to go out like a *itch?  AND HE DIDN’T FORSEE IT??  Lol, he’s just as bad as Yoda for not seeing Darth Sidious when even my 5 year old nephew spotted him at the time, lol!  Buy to clarify, I did enjoy seeing him die.  But seriously, who was he?

·         So Rey really is a nobody?????  Just a couple of junkies that ended up getting buried on Jakku?

·         Did the Falcon lose its radar dish again?  I’m not really sure.

·         Did the kid on Canto Bight retrieve his broom with the Force or was that my imagination?

Overall, I liked it.  Going to see it again for sure.  Just going to jump into the spoiler tag for my whole post

Some pretty fair/valid points (biased because I share a lot of them ).

Was typing up a response, but Captain America beat me to it.

Although I'm not so sure about

Spoiler

Rey's parentage, I wouldn't be surprised about that being another big red herring - it's been stated that this new trilogy is still about the Skywalker family, but who knows - maybe this sets up new films to move past them. I also firmly believe she'll figure out how to repair or put together a new one out of Anakin's broken Light Saber.

Also yes - she took the books.

And yep - the kid at the end force grabbed the broom.

The entire sequence with Rey, Kylo and Snoke was awesome and the subsequent fight had me on the edge of my seat (even knowing that neither one of them would die).

ALSO???

Spoiler

What about the students that Luke says Kylo left with the night everything went down? I hope that's not left out in Episode IX.

 

-b.

 

 

Edited December 16, 2017 by Kanedas Bike
Edit to add content/question

[peter]

24 minutes ago, Kanedas Bike said:

Some pretty fair/valid points (biased because I share a lot of them ).

Was typing up a response, but Captain America beat me to it.

Although I'm not so sure about

  Hide contents

Rey's parentage, I wouldn't be surprised about that being another big red herring - it's been stated that this new trilogy is still about the Skywalker family, but who knows - maybe this sets up new films to move past them. I also firmly believe she'll figure out how to repair or put together a new one out of Anakin's broken Light Saber.

Also yes - she took the books.

And yep - the kid at the end force grabbed the broom.

The entire sequence with Rey, Kylo and Snoke was awesome and the subsequent fight had me on the edge of my seat (even knowing that neither one of them would die).

ALSO???

  Hide contents

What about the students that Luke says Kylo left with the night everything went down? I hope that's not left out in Episode IX.

 

-b.

 

 

Spoiler

Totally forgot about the Knights of Ren.....Did they end up as the red dudes maybe?  I'm thinking the kids training with Ben and left with him were supposed to be all force sensitive Jedi in training so probably not the guys in red?

What got me on the edge of my seat was ...

Spoiler

Seeing Luke's mirage emerge from the attack from the walkers.  I was waiting to see if he would light up his green light saber.  

 

Edited December 16, 2017 by peter

[peter]

27 minutes ago, captain america said:

My comments in blue.

Spoiler

The broken shards of Narsil...I mean Luke's lightsaber.....I mean, Vader's old lightsaber......I mean Anikin's when he became Vader....lol!

 

[Kanedas Bike]

Just now, peter said:

  Reveal hidden contents

Totally forgot about the Knights of Ren.....Did they end up as the red dudes maybe?  I'm thinking the kids training with Ben and left with him were supposed to be all force sensitive Jedi in training so probably not the guys in red?

 

See, that was my thought as well, but...

Spoiler

Then that fight would have been a lot more difficult. And in order for Rey and Kylo to win they'd have to be shown to be much more powerful than a room full of Sith. It would have also wasted a good future plot point, so I'm guessing not. But it's a plot point that Rian just left on the floor, hopefully for future movies to explore.

-b.

[Convectuoso]

Just watched it. Enjoyed it, but I feel like it didn't answer any of the questions raised by TFA. It dragged a lot for moments, but I still had a great time. 

[David Hingtgen]

1 hour ago, peter said:

What got me on the edge of my seat was ...

  Hide contents

Seeing Luke's mirage emerge from the attack from the walkers.  I was waiting to see if he would light up his green light saber.  

 

 

That stuck out at me immediately---"How is using the saber that just broke in half?  Where's his green one? I doubt he built an identical copy of Anakin's".  It was my first clue that "something wasn't right".  Even before he ignited it, it was very clear which saber he had.  

[captain america]

26 minutes ago, David Hingtgen said:

  Hide contents

That stuck out at me immediately---"How is using the saber that just broke in half?  Where's his green one? I doubt he built an identical copy of Anakin's".  It was my first clue that "something wasn't right".  Even before he ignited it, it was very clear which saber he had.  

Spoiler

And the fact that he looked younger, had a shorter beard and looked thinner was a pretty good clue as well. That being said, it looked to me as though the effort and concentration necessary to project himself in such a vivid manner may have been too much strain on his body. Could that have lead to a heart-attack of some sort that caused him to kick the bucket?

 

[azrael]

Judging by the comments, it's probably for the best that I don't have time to make it to the cinemas this weekend.

[Axelay]

Just saw this earlier, and am still processing. But, as a die-hard fan of the X-Wing and TIE Fighter games, I have to make one assertion which has driven me NUTS.

Spoiler

 

Yeah, you know what this is. And you know what it's for? Attacking capital ships. Apparently, the First Order doesn't know that. The whole plot element about a fleet of Star Destroyers attempting to chase down a lone MC80 (I presume) was like a slap in my face - especially when they just showed how TIEs were more than capable of overtaking it. Grand Admiral Thrawn would be utterly ashamed of every fleet tactician in the First Order. I can't even take the First Order seriously as threat any more.

[Sildani]

Loved it. Will see again. 

[peter]

1 hour ago, captain america said:

  Hide contents

And the fact that he looked younger, had a shorter beard and looked thinner was a pretty good clue as well. That being said, it looked to me as though the effort and concentration necessary to project himself in such a vivid manner may have been too much strain on his body. Could that have lead to a heart-attack of some sort that caused him to kick the bucket?

 

Spoiler

Now that you mention it, I remember it too.  His beard was almost completely brown, and he didn't look so bulky, and he didn't have his green saber hilt slung on his belt when he was approaching the walkers.

It was cool to see his X-wing at the bottom of the water, so at first, I thought he may have flown there in it.  I was disappointed they didn't show him raising it out of the water, but then it all quickly made sense.

Maz Kanata reminded me of Edna from the Incredibles.

 

 

[Mog]

My thoughts on Luke:

 

Understand, there's things in The Last Jedi  that I didn't mind about Luke's characterization:

• I don't mind that he's a cantankerous curmudgeon old man.  (I found it amusing that he was effing with Rey when she was reaching out for the Force.)
• I'm fine with his moment of weakness where he considers killing Ben Solo.
• And I love that he was more than willing to point out how spectacularly the Jedi failed in the past.

HOWEVER, I can agree with Mark Hamill's initial reaction ("I pretty much fundamentally disagree with every choice you’ve made for this character.") in that Luke's actions in the Sequel Trilogy don't jive with the Luke we saw in the Original Trilogy.

So, he makes a mistake and his apprentice falls to the Dark Side, killing all (or most) of his pupils in the process.  Sounds a lot like Obi-Wan to me, and we know what Obi did in reaction to that betrayal.

Luke of the OT was always the first to spring into action.  Whether it's to rescue a princess, sign up to fly straight at a Death Star, save his friends even if he hasn't completed his training, hatch a plan to rescue Han from Jabba, or volunteer to join a Rebel strike team to Endor.

So, to see him clam up after a major defeat doesn't sound like the Luke we know. 

And to those who want to point out how significant Ben's actions (and Luke's mistake) messed Luke up, I'm pretty sure ignoring your master, rushing off without completing your training, failing at rescuing Han, getting spanked by Vader, and then finding out that the murderous embodiment of evil that is Vader is actually your dear old dad was probably a bigger defeat for Luke. 

And despite all that, I don't remember the Luke of Empire and ROTJ wallowing in a bunch of self-hate and regret.  In fact, he pretty much jumped right back on the proverbial horse and planned Han's rescue.

Also, I didn't like that despite his friends telling him how bad the situation is in Last Jedi, this Luke still stays behind.  He sees Chewie, who tells him about Han's death, and he still doesn't spring into action.  R2 (once again showing how awesome he is) ignores Luke's self-pity and shows him that old recording of Princess Leia.  And still no actions from Luke.  For a guy who went to extreme lengths to protect his friends in the past, I didn't like this new development with Luke.

It takes bloody Force Ghost Yoda to get Luke to finally do something.  I didn't mind the lesson Yoda taught (that growth can come out of failure);  it's actually a great lesson.  And the scene sorta amused me.  But it really makes Luke look like a putz for not learning squat for the past 20-30 years.

I know the Expanded Universe has its detractors, but I'd rather have the Luke of the EU than what we wound up with in these sequels.  EU Luke may have made mistakes and faced defeats, but he lived a much richer and fuller life.

Edited December 16, 2017 by Mog

[peter]

Spoiler

Forgot to mention, I really wish they hadn't shown where blue milk comes from, lol!

 

[Black Valkyrie]

 

Saw it twice, either you like it or hate it and overall it was enjoyable as an entertainment  but still it wasn't wise to assign Johnson to write and direct the movie.  This time my favorite character was General Hux. 

Note.  Isn't SW about the Skywalker family ? 

[jenius]

I think the whole point is that SW WAS about the Skywalker family but their story is told so it's time for the series to move on. Kylo kept saying "out with the old" and I'm pretty sure a little of that was tearing down the 4th wall to tell the audience "This story needs to move on now". If they kill off Kylo in the next movie they will have successfully freed the SW story to go in any direction in a huge fun galaxy. I think that was what the last shot with the stable boy was implying also. Of course, they could always go back to the well and tell us Palpatine or Luke's mom had a huge extended family and start linking everyone up again.

[hachi]

Just saw it, and I liked it. Not mind-blowing but it's worth it for the last parts.

Spoiler

...with Luke in action. Was really wondering the whole time how Leia would die but well, I think they made me want to see episode IX now lol.

Anyway, without the jokes the whole movie would be darker (even depressing). The rebellion is down to a few people that would fit into the Falcon--that's not a good situation. It's like starting from square one. Nobody even heeded their distress call. You could think that the First Order has everyone too terrified to help. And, the addition of porgs wasn't that bad as I thought.

Take note, I'm just a casual fan. After the movie ended people were applauding it, so I like to think it's still ok over-all.

I see it as entertainment, so I'll probably watch again if I find the time.

[Sildani]

^That. Star Wars has never been high cinema or noted for its character development. It tells an epic story, with characters coming and going in the telling. And what this movie did was do a great job of continuing that story. 

[seti88]

10 hours ago, Axelay said:

Just saw this earlier, and am still processing. But, as a die-hard fan of the X-Wing and TIE Fighter games, I have to make one assertion which has driven me NUTS.

  Hide contents

 

Yeah, you know what this is. And you know what it's for? Attacking capital ships. Apparently, the First Order doesn't know that. The whole plot element about a fleet of Star Destroyers attempting to chase down a lone MC80 (I presume) was like a slap in my face - especially when they just showed how TIEs were more than capable of overtaking it. Grand Admiral Thrawn would be utterly ashamed of every fleet tactician in the First Order. I can't even take the First Order seriously as threat any more.

SO MUCH YES!! DARN mickey mouse writers....

 

Spoiler

- I couldn't believe my eyes watching a whole entire fleet playing turtle and shooting potshots behind a crippled rebel fleet for how long??

- At least make it seem like its a plan to turn rey by torturing the fleet, but no... its just how an entire first order fleet with that behemoth snoke's ship likes to waste time i guess...

- worse come to worse...just light jump in front or nearer to the darn capital ship!!! They have no defenses!!

rant over...

Buuut.....i enjoyed the 2nd half more than the 1st half and yes, its better than TFA but that's not really a high bar.

Spoiler

Rey and kylo's fight against the red guards was really nice tho....finally see them red's in action...

I would like to see more of a dark luke tho! bwahahaha...oh well.....

Edited December 16, 2017 by seti88

[Vepariga]

Saw it again today and was able to process a lot more comfortably. Many of the gripes I had from the first viewing sat alot better this time round. Still iffy on the pointless Canto Bight scene and the 'Target ad tier' ending but TLJ definitely benefits from a second viewing.  

[myk]

7 hours ago, Black Valkyrie said:

 

Saw it twice, either you like it or hate it and overall it was enjoyable as an entertainment  but still it wasn't wise to assign Johnson to write and direct the movie.  This time my favorite character was General Hux. 

Note.  Isn't SW about the Skywalker family ? 

Not for me, brother.  His loud, screaming, blustering presence makes him out to be the worst acting and/or written character that I can recall in a long time.  I mean....just shut up already.   In his own way he's as much a whiny b**ch as Kylo Ren is...

[ErikElvis]

I’m a huge Star Wars fan but I found myself eye rolling an awful lot  throughout  this movie. 

[ErikElvis]

19 hours ago, jvmacross said:

Only good scene in the movie was the obvious homage to this.......and what a missed opportunity.....

  Reveal hidden contents

I can't believe how they actually managed to make Luke's "end" more disappointing than Han's.....he couldn't be bothered to show up?.....

And WTF is up with the rubber Yoda puppet?!!!?  Seriously?  The rubber Yoda puppet was one of the worse parts of the whole POS film....and there were several POS parts and moments.....2 hours of a Star Destroyer chasing down a rebel ship....huh????  

Disney execs:  OK, so what other iconic scenes can we take from the OT and add them to the ST cause people love that crap...

Disney yes man: Ummm...oh, how about the opening scene from ANH where we see a rebel ship get chased down by a Star Destroyer.....

Disney exec:  OK....yeah, keep talking....

Disney yes man: Well, if that worked for a few moments on ANH....what if we just kept it going for an entire movie.....

Disney exec:  Brilliant!!!

 

I totally agree with this. I was not enthused with any of that.

 

I had to to edit this back because I don’t know how to create spoiler tags. 

Edited December 16, 2017 by ErikElvis

[tekering]

I thought it was as good as anyone could've expected a sequel to The Force Awakens to be...

Spoiler

...but damn Chewie for not eating that roasted porg!  

Also, the heavy-handed sociopolitical commentary represented by the Canto Bight sequence was almost as stupid as the sequence itself.

 

[Rogueload]

How do porg’s get more screen time then R2-D2!! Smh.  I’m very on the fence with this movie.  

[jvmacross]

3 hours ago, tekering said:

I thought it was as good as anyone could've expected a sequel to The Force Awakens to be...

  Reveal hidden contents

...but damn Chewie for not eating that roasted porg!  

Also, the heavy-handed sociopolitical commentary represented by the Canto Bight sequence was almost as stupid as the sequence itself.

 

Actually, the last 30 minutes or so of TFA was pretty good...the only good parts of the entire movie....I was expecting them to build on that....but nope....they totally wasted everything that could have been good for the remainder of the ST...

Spoiler

Just a few things that more or less have killed the possibility of rescuing the PT....

1) the return of living Luke....for the remainder of the ST....alive and well at the end of it...it was bad enough that they killed off Han so pathetically....and then the tragedy of Carrie Fisher's death, essentially killing off Leia...and now they get rid of Luke before the whole thing is over????

2) Rey is a "nobody"....really??? No...the way she was portrayed in TFA....she was supposedly the greatest Force wielder since Anakin....idiots.....

3) Snoke.....just a joke on all of us.....ridiculous....so now the bad guy we are left with is Emo Ren???  Seriously???????????  Snoke himself even said he was no Vader.....heck...even Rey said it......The fact that Snoke was going to be struck down while giving a long-winded speech about knowing and seeing everything was seen a mile away....Wake up "fans"...this actually went down exactly this way......LMAO........keep drinking the Disney kool-aid I suppose.......

4) a two hour chase......I already mentioned this....but I just can't believe they actually went with this....WTF?

5) Why even bring back Phasma if she was totally going to be bested by a janitor with, at most, basic combat training...

6) that asian girl should have bumped Finn and rammed straight into the cannon to destroy it....most annoying new character...can't even remember if she died or not....she should have....

7) the guy who "got them into Snoke's" ship.....hope he doesn't return...looks like they may be trying to create some Lando-like character....or just re-use actors across all their films...maybe Disney gets to pay less that way.....

8 )They did not kill off Leia because killing off three beloved characters within 2 movies would have been too much....but honestly, they should have left her floating in space....clearly, the intent was probably going to be Leia personally bringing back Ben from the Dark Side.......She is obviously the only person left that the "good" Ben cares about...if I remember correctly he thinks she is dead.....she clearly has developed her Force powers during the last 30+ years.....she was probably going to end up being in a big climactic scene where her powers are fully revealed......perhaps destroying Snoke....now...they are probably still scrambling to figure out what to do with her  character....additionally, without Leia...who's left that gives a shiit wether Emo Ren returns to the light???  Rey???  Maybe if they would have done the right thing and made her a Skywalker...but she is a "nobody"...why would she care about anything but destroying him?????  They have left nothing for the remaining characters to give a shiiit about other than surviving.....and that last scene with the "Force" sensitive kid.....well, I guess some of them have to go bad....so there goes the new cycle all over again.....jedi vs sith...because let's face it.....no one gives a shiit about the church of the force, guardians of the whils, or whatever other NON-JEDI and NON-SITH players are out there.......Star Wars without Jedi or Sith...is NOT STAR WARS...as the current 2 flaming turds have proven.....REBELS is good because we still had/have Jedi and Sith in it.......What this new reboot of the Star Wars franchise needs is a Vader movie and an Obi Wan movie.......the upcoming Solo movie.....let's just say I have "a bad feeling" about it....

I kept waiting for something great to happen....when that scene with Luke started...I actually had "hope"....then it just vanished as the scene played out...

I can keep going...but I am sure you all can think of more things that this film did that have ruined any hope of it all ending gracefully.....

 

Edited December 16, 2017 by jvmacross