Macross Δ (Delta) Mecha/Technology Thread - READ 1st POST

[Zinjo]

Oh well. Then the sound boosters were just for extra bomba.

These sound boosters coupled with the resonance explanation of fold song makes them far less offensive than the ones in M7...

[Zinjo]

Not to mention Anti-UN sentiment became synonymous with Anti-Earth sentiment. In just a short time Neo York was colonized the Free York Liberation League showed up trying to steal VFs.

There is also that bunch of Anti-Earth Zentradi that left with their own emigration ships in 2031 and was never heard from again.

UN Forces generals in 2047 were probably facepalming at never keeping tabs on those ships as Zentradi engineers that stole the VFX-11 who left earlier in 2030 brought their technical skills to Lost Zentradi upgrading their gear.

OK, but it seems odd that an AUN movement would provide arms tech to a regional world and then allow it to become a NUN member world in good standing as opposed to remaining Autonomous. There is a bit of confusion there.

We pretty much gathered that the declaration of war was a smoke screen to cover the true nature of the regional invasions, but why be a member of NUNG at all if you are aided by an AUN movement?.

However all this still doesn't explain the SV series of fighters or their apparent derivative nature of the first gen Windermere fighters to the old SV-51/52 series of fighters

Edited May 11, 2016 by Zinjo

[Seto Kaiba]

OK, but it seems odd that an AUN movement would provide arms tech to a regional world and then allow it to become a NUN member world in good standing as opposed to remaining Autonomous. There is a bit of confusion there.

The Free York Liberation League probably wasn't an entirely native group, but in Windermere's case it would appear that they'd be the kind of party that renegade anti-government forces would WANT to support since they can present a credible threat to the New UN Spacy's regional garrison forces at the very least.

However all this still doesn't explain the SV series of fighters or their apparent derivative nature of the first gen Windermere fighters to the old SV-51/52 series of fighters

That is, of course, assuming that an unsubstantiated rumor from 2ch is actually accurate and the Windermerean fighters were in fact developed by engineers from Shinsei, General Galaxy, etc. who defected to anti-government forces in prior decades.

Perhaps "Sv" is just how the New UN Spacy designates the fighters that were developed by factions other than the New UN Gov't... something like how the US military classified US-operated Russian and Chinese fighters under Project Constant Peg.

[Rbstr]

OK, but it seems odd that an AUN movement would provide arms tech to a regional world and then allow it to become a NUN member world in good standing as opposed to remaining Autonomous. There is a bit of confusion there.

You're referring to Windermere here? I don's see how this applies given Windermere rebelled against the NUN and has maintained independence for a while now.

Seems like exactly what Anti-UN people would want.

It's not like anti-UN people were there before the Emigration fleet (presumably a NUN-governed operation) made contact with the natives.

However all this still doesn't explain the SV series of fighters or their apparent derivative nature of the first gen Windermere fighters to the old SV-51/52 series of fighters

Why doesn't it? There's a lineage of anti-UN scientist/engineer folks that develop things for anti-UN kinds of people. Seems pretty logical that existing anti-UN people would help (or even foment) an anti-UN revolution on a frontier planet where conditions are ripe.

Of course, like happens often around here, people might just be getting ahead of themselves. There's also the option that Windermere's stuff is indigenous and the SV- designation isn't a real descriptor of origin and is just the designation for non-NUN fighters. Perhaps they reverse engineered some VF-25s they captured or bought or "acquired" somewhat underhandedly. Or the uplift helped them understand the PC relics which gave them a big boost.

Edited May 11, 2016 by Rbstr

[Zinjo]

It is true that the the vintage fighter we have seen may not even be a variable aircraft, just a jet indigenous to Windemere.

I also realize that it is likely that any non-NUN sanctioned variable fighter may be given an SV designation by Spacy, though a question remains where Windemere (assuming that is how they designate the fighter) would get that from? This has not yet been revealed.

The disconnect is the technology where their fighters came from. They could very well be derivatives of an earlier generation VF-171 and the SV designator is either a Spacy one or they adopted it based upon their understanding of Earth history pre-Great Space War.

[Seto Kaiba]

I also realize that it is likely that any non-NUN sanctioned variable fighter may be given an SV designation by Spacy, though a question remains where Windemere (assuming that is how they designate the fighter) would get that from? This has not yet been revealed.

The disconnect is the technology where their fighters came from. They could very well be derivatives of an earlier generation VF-171 and the SV designator is either a Spacy one or they adopted it based upon their understanding of Earth history pre-Great Space War.

*nods* That's my pet theory, based on the Sv-262's GERWALK mode... I suspect it's based on the VF-171 units that were left behind when the New UN Spacy's garrison force pulled out.

We'll know for sure sooner or later... but right now the idea that it's something the anti-human Windermereans got from human anti-government forces strikes me as unlikely.

[RedWolf]

Given Aerial Knight mook Uroh said "Da" I can only speculate Megaroad 4 had Russians on it that they influenced spoken language on Windermere.

We know a good part of Anti-UN Alliance tech was Russian.

Windermere is using SV designated variable units.

[Zinjo]

Given Aerial Knight mook Uroh said "Da" I can only speculate Megaroad 4 had Russians on it that they influenced spoken language on Windermere.

We know a good part of Anti-UN Alliance tech was Russian.

Windermere is using SV designated variable units.

I caught that "Da" too, so it is possible that a Russian contingent could be the answer to these questions.

Well I wouldn't declare Windemere is using the "SV" designator just yet. I am waiting for dialogue or written verification "in show" first.

[mickyg]

...Or Romanian?

Seriously though, interesting that they threw that bit in there. Certainly makes you think there's some influence there.

[Seto Kaiba]

Given Aerial Knight mook Uroh said "Da" I can only speculate Megaroad 4 had Russians on it that they influenced spoken language on Windermere.

We know a good part of Anti-UN Alliance tech was Russian.

Windermere is using SV designated variable units.

It's certainly possible that there were Russians on Megaroad-04.

However... it wouldn't be entirely accurate to say that the Anti-Unification Alliance's technology was Russian. In truth, their overtechnology was acquired via two means: the UN Government-mandated sharing of technological advances between its member states, and UN Forces research data obtained via espionage or theft. That technology was packaged by companies in Russia, Germany, and Israel that were either friendly to the Alliance or unscrupulous enough to profiteer from the war or use the alliance as guinea pigs to test their implementations of overtechnology in live combat.

We know the New UN Gov't classifies the Draken III as "Sv-262", but we don't know how the Windermereans classify it... they don't seem to use English in their interfaces, so it's doubtful they use it in their designation systems.

[UN Spacy]

If you want to see how Macross Elysion will look in cruiser mode. Courtesy of Tochiro's Twitter:

https://twitter.com/gwyncampbell/status/730563468856676352

[azrael]

If you want to see how Macross Elysion will look in cruiser mode. Courtesy of Tochiro's Twitter:

How...triangular.

[guyxxed]

There's no elevators though. It seems to me that they come out from the rear hangar area similar to the Uraga or Battle Class, the only issue being that part of the deck is disconnected somewhat from the angled decks.

This popped out at me as well. They definitely don't come up on elevators, we were clearly shown last episode and in the load out sequence of this episode that the Delta valks are all kept in the central hangar on the main deck. There's no path for the launch cradles to get down to the angled decks.

For that matter, anyone else annoyed that the cradles weren't also catapults? There are clear channels down the runways for catapults, but when the squad was ready for launch, the cradles just released them and they flew off on their own power. Why not just lift them out on booms DYRL style, if that's the case?

Sorry, nitpick over...

Edited May 12, 2016 by guyxxed

[Raptor One]

If you want to see how Macross Elysion will look in cruiser mode. Courtesy of Tochiro's Twitter:

Ten times better than the Quarter

[Valkyrie Driver]

How...triangular.

I'd almost be tempted to buy a toy of it...

[d3v]

For that matter, anyone else annoyed that the cradles weren't also catapults? There are clear channels down the runways for catapults, but when the squad was ready for launch, the cradles just released them and they flew off on their own power. Why not just lift them out on booms DYRL style, if that's the case?

Sorry, nitpick over...

I'm assuming that those are for atmospheric launches.

[UN Spacy]

Wait a sec...have they shown inside the bridge of the Aether already?

Which bridge have we been seeing in previous episodes? That was the Elysion's main bridge...right?

I'd almost be tempted to buy a toy of it...

It's only 540 yen. It'll be out in September.

[akt_m]

If you want to see how Macross Elysion will look in cruiser mode. Courtesy of Tochiro's Twitter:

https://twitter.com/gwyncampbell/status/730563468856676352

So, it is definitely not a quarter class ship.

[JB0]

These sound boosters coupled with the resonance explanation of fold song makes them far less offensive than the ones in M7...

The 7 sound boosters were okay right up to the moment they started shooting lasers of song energy. Personally.

[Mit]

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/crossoverrp/images/5/5d/SV-51.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20150715003649

I have a question for the "theft of technology", or rather confusion around it.

On the "Macross Mecha Manual" is written that "Armed with OverTechnology illicitly obtained from the U.N.G.'s military programs, the A.U.N. developed their own variable fighter designated the SV-51."

But in the Anti-UN pilots dialogue set out opposite version:

"284
00: 23: 44.468 -> 00: 23: 46.219
The new fighter UN forces ...

285
00: 23: 46.720 -> 00: 23: 50.557
This is just a modification of the system, which they stole from us.

286
00: 23: 51.016 -> 00: 23: 52.309
It is not an obstacle to us.

287
00: 23: 53.143 -> 00: 23: 56.521
According to the Joint Institute, they did not kidnap her.

288
00: 23: 57.189 -> 00: 23: 59.649
All technologies must meet the needs of national relations ...

289
00: 23: 59.858 -> 00: 24: 02.444
And be open to the public.

290
00: 24: 04.529 -> 00: 24: 08.408
If they believe in this nonsense, then you must show it to them. "


So who, in the end, right?

Edited May 12, 2016 by Mit

[eko.prasetiyo]

If you want to see how Macross Elysion will look in cruiser mode. Courtesy of Tochiro's Twitter:

https://twitter.com/gwyncampbell/status/730563468856676352

where is macross cannon?

"https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CiN6o2xUUAAtLBg.jpg"https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CiN6o2xUUAAtLBg.jpg[/img]

[Scyla]

Ten times better than the Quarter

I agree. I hope they to a PT DX toy of the Elysion.

[Kcsquare]

kinda of reminds me of Dogosse Giar-class in Zeta Gundam

[d3v]

It's a much better looking transformation than the Quarter class.

[calubin_175]

Looks a bit busy in the middle, but looks much more cohesive than the Macross Quarter, even though the form is still prioritised in the humanoid form.

We still won't get proper looking cruiser that transforms into a robot. The last best one was the Battles class, in that it looks like a ship that doesn't necessarily look like to have a transformation gimmick.

Edited May 12, 2016 by calubin_175

[Scyla]

On a transforming toy you could probably get slimmer looking carrier arms by folding the launch decks down. That might look even better.

[anime52k8]

Looks a bit busy in the middle, but looks much more cohesive than the Macross Quarter, even though the form is still prioritised in the humanoid form.

We still won't get proper looking cruiser that transforms into a robot. The last best one was the Battles class, in that it looks like a ship that doesn't necessarily look like to have a transformation gimmick.

when you think about it, we've only had 4 types of ship that turn into giant robots (ok, 5 if you wanna count MacII). Of those the battle class is the only one that doesn't obviously look like it turns into a robot.

[JB0]

I feel the original Macross did not look blatantly as though it was going to transform, either. It is easy to pick the robot parts out once you know it turns into one, but it makes a cohesive "boat" for the most part. I feel that were I ignorant of the franchise, I would believe it was a single-mode vessel.

The giant shoulder booms and odd proportions also do a lot to stop it from looking too humanoid in robot mode, but that's neither here nor there.

The Quarter, though... there's just no helping that thing. The ship "mode" just looks like a robot tripped and fell. The transformation is bad enough to be used in a Gundam show.

[Nazareno2012]

I feel the original Macross did not look blatantly as though it was going to transform, either. It is easy to pick the robot parts out once you know it turns into one, but it makes a cohesive "boat" for the most part. I feel that were I ignorant of the franchise, I would believe it was a single-mode vessel.

The giant shoulder booms and odd proportions also do a lot to stop it from looking too humanoid in robot mode, but that's neither here nor there.

The Quarter, though... there's just no helping that thing. The ship "mode" just looks like a robot tripped and fell. The transformation is bad enough to be used in a Gundam show.

Regarding the Quarter, the initial design of it IMO looked better than the final one, and you can see it here: http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=42528&p=1197147

[squaresphere]

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/crossoverrp/images/5/5d/SV-51.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20150715003649

So who, in the end, right?

Pretty interesting in the fact that like most Macross cannon, it open to interpenetration but doesn't necessarily impact the down stream technological development.

[Mommar]

I am not feeling that cruiser mode at all. Maybe from a different angle I would appreciate it more.

[Seto Kaiba]

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/crossoverrp/images/5/5d/SV-51.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20150715003649

I have a question for the "theft of technology", or rather confusion around it.

On the "Macross Mecha Manual" is written that "Armed with OverTechnology illicitly obtained from the U.N.G.'s military programs, the A.U.N. developed their own variable fighter designated the SV-51."

But in the Anti-UN pilots dialogue set out opposite version:

[...]

So who, in the end, right?

Per Macross Chronicle, this is kind of an Obi-Wan Kenobi "from a certain point of view" thing on D.D. and Nora's part.

You see, D.D. and Nora are partisans opposed to the Unification Government, so they see the requirement that its member nations share technological advances derived from overtechnology with each other as the Unification Government stealing that technology from its creators. The technology was not truly stolen, it was simply shared with the other UN Government member nations.

Macross Chronicle's coverage of the Anti-Unification Alliance's mecha clearly indicates that they were developed using data obtained from the UN Government's military programs. Some of that data and technology was acquired by through legitimate channels by defense contractors in nations that just happened to be in the Alliance's sphere of influence, but much of it was acquired through espionage or stolen by defectors. The Sv-51 is noted to have been developed quickly as the result of D.D. Ivanov himself handing over development data he stole from the VF-0 program when he defected to the Alliance forces, and the Octos is also mentioned as having been fast-tracked through development using data and technology stolen from the UN Government's Destroid program.

It's rather unlikely that the engineers who defected from the UN Government to the various anti-government groups after the First Space War had any connection to the engineers who provided weapons to the Alliance "under the table" during the UN Wars. In all likelihood there is no actual direct connection between the old Sv-51/52 and the Sv-262.

[azrael]

I am not feeling that cruiser mode at all. Maybe from a different angle I would appreciate it more.

Better or worst?

[Zinjo]

Ten times better than the Quarter

AGREED!

[Zinjo]

Better or worst?

It really looks likes a compacted SDF Class Warship. The legs are compacted into the sides, the booms are compacted between the carrier ships.

The cannon(s) I still believe are the booms. She either fires them like the old school SDF Buster Cannon or individually like the gunships of the NMCV class carriers. This is definitely a warship design as opposed to the carrier type of the NMCV Class.