Macross Δ (Delta) Mecha/Technology Thread - READ 1st POST

[azrael]

In regards to Mikumo, I'm in the "she's a cyborg, or something" camp. It would best explain how she could ride that valkyrie while in combat, and was so easily able to control the drones with a flick of her finger. Earlier in the episode, you could see that she was talking to her finger when communicating with her team members. Her hair is also pretty strangely-shaped in some of the pictures

Makina was also talking into her fingernail. Wearable tech. Gotta love how small it's gotten.

[frothymug]

Makina was also talking into her fingernail. Wearable tech. Gotta love how small it's gotten.

Well, that's what I meant by "things that can be easily explained". I expected that that kind of technology could be easily accessible in that time. I was just using it as an example of an assumption that doesn't need to be made when using the conclusion that she's some kind of android.

[Seto Kaiba]

Well, I think I should have used this sentence instead "...or an alien with similar abilities to Protodeviln.."

And its because of her movement, how she survived missiles attacks without any scratch and her unknown info

that made me think that she may not be just an ordinary human.

While it's perfectly possible that Mikumo either isn't human, isn't entirely human, or isn't entirely organic... the simplest explanation would be that, like the other members of Walkure, her actual clothes were an armored flight suit disguised by holography, and that her costume change was simply from one holographic costume to another. (Or that she did get scratched and the hologram that's presenting the illusion of bare skin is simply concealing it.)

WRT "an alien with similar abilities to Protodeviln"... the Protodeviln weren't a natural species, they were biological living weaponry created for the Protoculture's civil war, infested by energy beings from another dimension. We've never seen a natural species in Macross with abilities like that so I'd say that's fairly unlikely...

In regards to Mikumo, I'm in the "she's a cyborg, or something" camp. It would best explain how she could ride that valkyrie while in combat, and was so easily able to control the drones with a flick of her finger. Earlier in the episode, you could see that she was talking to her finger when communicating with her team members. Her hair is also pretty strangely-shaped in some of the pictures.

Wearable tech with gesture or haptic controls, most likely... remember that the other members of Walkure are also shown to be capable of manipulating the drones with simple hand gestures. Cybernetics were said to be relatively common in the Macross Frontier series, so it's certainly possible that she's a cyborg... though looking totally biological would mark her out as being very VERY high-spec for the cyborgs we've seen. On par with Macross Galaxy's tech from a few years prior.

What we've seen for "consumer grade" cybernetics seem to be more obviously artificial... like Oscar Brauhitsch's artificial arm that looks like he stole it from Fullmetal Alchemist, or Nicolas Berthier's visible neural implants.

[RedWolf]

Question is if the NUN is capable of producing an infiltration type Evil Series. They have the planet where they have been made. Technology has certainly leaked.

In Mylene Beat a Evil series was created by Col. Barton and Dr. Sazapi. In Macross the Ride the Queadluun Alma has a Protodevin type barrier able to no sell Macross Cannons.

[Seto Kaiba]

Question is if the NUN is capable of producing an infiltration type Evil Series. They have the planet where they have been made. Technology has certainly leaked.

Does the New UN Government go around creating biological weapons for proxy warfare? No. They wouldn't make a new Evil series for the exact same reason they don't make legions of Zentradi soldiers to do their fighting for them. Yes, they have what's left of the ruined planet where they were made, and the special prison where they were kept, but that doesn't mean there was enough technology or research data left to recreate an Evil series. Even if they could, why would they? Who would approve trying to recreate the weapons that accidentally destroyed the last major galactic civilization... especially when they've already seen firsthand that they're utterly impossible to control?

They're a lot of things, but they're not suicidal.

What with there only being four Evil series left in the entire universe, and all four having left the galaxy, it's a very safe bet that Mikumo is no more a Protodeviln than the last character this theory was voiced about... Macross Frontier's Ram Hoa, who turned out to be a perfectly normal woman of Indian descent.

In Mylene Beat a Evil series was created by Col. Barton and Dr. Sazapi. In Macross the Ride the Queadluun Alma has a Protodevin type barrier able to no sell Macross Cannons.

Well, yes... that's Mylene Beat, but even in that their effort to recreate the Evil series left them with a berserk monster that was only prevented from destroying the fleet by Mylene (and a lot of explaining to do), and promptly left for parts extragalactic once Mylene had calmed it down.

The Queadluun-Alma's astral system was only possible because someone pillaged bits of a Protodeviln's corpse.

[Karaoke Ninja]

Some please explain to me how these magical girls ride the valkries like chariots while telling the laws of gravity and Inertia to go F themselves, they need not apply....

Transforming fighter robot planes themselves already tell physics to go F themselves especially with 40+ G forces not turning them into cockpit goop.

[McFly!!]

I tell the laws of physics and economics to go f themselves daily, more frequently when looking at my finances. They don't listen. Sigh

And Mikumo is definitely a whole lotta something! I don't much care what, I just want some of it!

[RedWolf]

Does the New UN Government go around creating biological weapons for proxy warfare?

Bugs, New Asia 'nuff said.

What with there only being four Evil series left in the entire universe,

And yet one turned up on Ouroboros with Havamal studying it to rewrite history.

[jenius]

I think someone made a pretty good point earlier that it's not that the technology being shown is too crazy for Macross (though I'd say that I hope future episodes of Delta help take a bit of the crazy out of what was shown) but issues with the logic that if the technologies we see exist, then why isn't everything way better off? If you can make boomerangs that shield things then it seems you could builds shields around everything that's important. Why would Hayate pilot a loader instead of just floating apples to where they go by pointing a finger at their crates? Delta is playing an odd game of "It's similar to life as we know it" and "future tech makes anything possible." These notions need to be married for it not to seem like magical girl genre anime. I think it's going to be a very hard game for the writers to play if they're going to show us all tech after tech that makes us almost suspend our disbelief but then try to make the struggles of the characters seem relatable to the problems we face today because any momentary pause will allow the viewer to think "Why don't they just use that technology to..."

[Mr March]

In my opinion, I really don't think the Macross Delta technology is all that unusual or as nonsensical as all that. It's different and new, but I'm just not seeing any major leap. A very different change in style and the use of technology to suit that style is very apparent, but I think that's all.

I will say this; first (and this is rather critical), it's rather important to accept that in Macross Delta the setting, technology and action are being taken somewhat less serious than other contemporary Macross (or mecha anime) shows. If we can get past that, I think one can critique the technology of Delta more fairly.

I agree with those who have said the technology appears well-rooted in most of the Macross OverTechnology shown to date and certainly within capability. I also think some are objecting more to the implementation of said technology and trying to question the world-building fiction in Macross Delta simply because it's silly or weird. I don't necessarily disagree with criticizing that silliness/weirdness of the show, but I do object to criticizing the technology as it fits in the show on that basis. EX-Gear technoloy and the volumetric/holographic technology shown in Macross anime like Macross Frontier, DYRL, and particularly Macross Plus can all be utilized in ways to achieve most of what we see in Macross Delta. IMO, certainly none of the technology shown to date is so far removed from what OverTechnology can do as to be considered magic. These "pin-point barrier drones" might be able to fly around to shield a human-sized object moving at a human-capable pace. But moving at Mach speeds and shielding something as large as a valkyire (while NOT blocking the valkyrie's own weaponry) is something else entirely. And building powerful, specialized technology for an elite, special forces unit like the Walkure girls doesn't mean it's easy and cost effective to do so on a mass-production or commercial level.

I think there are as many reasons for the technology as people can imagine against it. For me, I was soured more by the implementation, not the function of the Delta technology. As far as the Macross science, I think the Delta technology is fine.

Edited February 20, 2016 by Mr March

[Seto Kaiba]

Transforming fighter robot planes themselves already tell physics to go F themselves especially with 40+ G forces not turning them into cockpit goop.

Well, yes and no... the human body can actually withstand a lot more than 40G in acceleration forces, but the structural problems are totally handwaved via overtechnology. The planes are simply built out of materials that are orders of magnitude better than the materials available today.

Bugs, New Asia 'nuff said.

Fair point, but those weren't sentient (or apparently even sapient), and they were nowhere near as powerful.

And yet one turned up on Ouroboros with Havamal studying it to rewrite history.

I'm not sure that's actually part of the Evil series... and it has a cockpit, which makes it something more like the Birdhuman. Rather than an independent biological weapon, a piloted biological mecha. Even then, it was still much too dangerous to exist, so the Protoculture hid it and covered the planet they hid it on with murderous bio-technological insectoid guardians.

I think someone made a pretty good point earlier that it's not that the technology being shown is too crazy for Macross (though I'd say that I hope future episodes of Delta help take a bit of the crazy out of what was shown) but issues with the logic that if the technologies we see exist, then why isn't everything way better off?

Really? It's already a pretty damn rosy future if you don't count the Var... and this line of reasoning really is just sour grapes that fails to take into account some fairly basic realities. For one, almost everything we saw is not new technologies or concepts for Macross, and for two not everything that's used by the military can be made economically viable for mass market consumption. A personal jet, for instance, is certainly out of the question for most people...

If you can make boomerangs that shield things then it seems you could builds shields around everything that's important.

So, first... the multidrones are equipment belonging to a special forces unit with a highly-specialized operational profile. There's no guarantee that they could be mass-produced on a scale suitable to defending a large area (say, if the design requires rare or impossible-to-replicate substances such as a fold quartz crystal) or that they would necessarily compare well to a conventional alternative like a pin-point barrier system. As we've known for ages, barrier technology in Macross is fabulously energy-intensive.

They clearly have significant shortcomings too... like the fact that they've got to depend on an external power source, and have a very limited operating time between rechargings.

Why would Hayate pilot a loader instead of just floating apples to where they go by pointing a finger at their crates?

Why would he be able to? The microdrones don't seem to be capable of lifting much more than their own weight, it takes dozens to get Mikumo airborne at a low speed and altitude, and she probably only weighs about 60kg. Even when they lift her, she has to be physically harnessed to them. Hayate's job is shifting shipping containers weighing multiple tonnes, which kind of immediately says "Hey, that's not gonna work."

Delta is playing an odd game of "It's similar to life as we know it" and "future tech makes anything possible."

Except, of course, that it's not actually doing the second part. Like all of Macross, it's doing "similar to life as we know it", but what's being done technologically in Macross Delta is demonstrably nothing new, or particularly unconventional in Macross's setting. Much of it has been part of Macross literally for decades both in universe and production history. Walkure's girls are no more magical than Sheryl, Ranka, Sharon, the members of Fire Bomber, or Minmay herself. Indeed, what they're doing is not really any different from what Fire Bomber, Sheryl, Ranka, (and maybe Sharon) did...

The problem you're citing doesn't exist, except in the minds of the old fans who are determined to whine about Macross Delta because it once again the new Macross show isn't the gritty, hardcore military drama Macross never was to begin with. The whole argument falls apart under the slighest examination.

Edited February 20, 2016 by Seto Kaiba

[jenius]

Doth protest too much about protestations. You like it, great, it's one episode, we all shall see. It seems awfully convenient to say only people with the need of the plot will have the tech as the plot dictates.

[Seto Kaiba]

Doth protest too much about protestations.

Y'know, I've yet to hear a sound justification for willful ignorance.

With maybe one or two exceptions, the technology we're seeing in Macross Delta isn't new. By in large, it's not even being used in ways that are unconventional in the Macross universe. These are things we have seen before in the same context, so why people whining about it now when they were fine with it in the most recent previous Macross title? It's no more magical now than it was in Macross Frontier, Macross 7, Macross Plus, Macross II: Lovers Again, or Macross: Do You Remember Love?.

You like it, great, it's one episode, we all shall see. It seems awfully convenient to say only people with the need of the plot will have the tech as the plot dictates.

You realize this stance borders on the nonsensical, right?

"If it exists, everyone must have it" doesn't work in the real world, so why would it work in Macross's world? Nor, for that matter does "if it's practical for one very specialized job it's practical for all jobs" stand up to a rational examination.

If a technology is prohibitively expensive, requires rare materials, is restricted by law, or of limited utility due to its specialized nature, then it makes sense that it won't be found in widespread use. It'll be used by the people whose needs it meets and who have the resources and legal authority to acquire and operate it... most of Walkure's equipment falls into one or more of those categories.

Edited February 20, 2016 by Seto Kaiba

[jenius]

Yeah, we get it, you've rationalized it and you're happy with your rationalizations. I'm happy to wait and see how it all holds up.

[JB0]

If you can make boomerangs that shield things then it seems you could builds shields around everything that's important.

With that battery life? Not likely.

Why would he be able to? The microdrones don't seem to be capable of lifting much more than their own weight, it takes dozens to get Mikumo airborne at a low speed and altitude, and she probably only weighs about 60kg. Even when they lift her, she has to be physically harnessed to them. Hayate's job is shifting shipping containers weighing multiple tonnes, which kind of immediately says "Hey, that's not gonna work."

Also, industrial labor does not always adopt the latest and greatest tech. They adopt the tech that gets the job done efficiently and cheaply.

Note that in the real world, despite the existence of very large airplanes, most cargo is still shipped by trucks on roads, or on honest-to-god TRAINS like they're stuck in the 1800s.

Really, I just wanna see the return of the robot coke machine.

[jenius]

I could have sworn Hayate piloted a glorified forklift, maybe I'll have to watch the episode again. I mean, sure, freight trains exist... but so do automated warehouses... TODAY. That's without 60 years of overtech. You would think tech similar to what the boomerangs use could be used in larger, stronger, vehicles for a million other purposes. Maybe it's too cutting edge, maybe it's too expensive, I get that we can come up with reasons to not be bothered by it. Generally though the amount of capital expended is related to the cost of labor. Are people so plentiful in the future that companies willingly substitute capital expenditure for cheap labor or, do you think in a future of massive cloning and post apocalypse there'd be huge investment in capital to make up for a shortfall of common workers?

As far as batteries go, I think that's only relevant if we're saying that the boomerangs should always be the source of shields and such. You'd think something like a ship would have something more permanently affixed. Think how amazing a few much larger boomerangs could be at doing a variety of things. Also, doesn't it even feel silly to be asking about batteries? You'd think with everything else going on they must have figured out some pretty amazing ways to store energy.

My intention was never to upset Seto by questioning Delta. My point was actually future-looking though I gave a couple examples of how the show may already open itself to some eyebrow raising. Delta is now WAY in the future and obviously there's a lot of integration of very fantastic tech happening so the writers are going to have a challenge writing a story that won't fall apart when viewers ponder why some of this amazing tech wasn't used in different ways. I'm curious to see if the writers can avoid the pitfall.

[JB0]

I could have sworn Hayate piloted a glorified forklift, maybe I'll have to watch the episode again.

He does, in keeping with the grand Macross tradition of deploying humanoid mecha all over the place like a robot isn't any more expensive or unreliable than a conventional vehicle.

He also dances in it, in keeping with the grand Macross tradition of casually doing silly things that ought to be impossible. No word yet if he can successfully dress one in an alien bathroom stall, but I await that test of his skills!

As far as batteries go, I think that's only relevant if we're saying that the boomerangs should always be the source of shields and such. You'd think something like a ship would have something more permanently affixed.

Much of the novelty of the boomerang drones comes from the fact that they ARE drones. Everything they do is stuff that we've seen in the franchise since the earliest years, but always in fixed, stationary, LARGE hardware.

If you take the shields out and slap guns on them, we'd call them ghosts. Adorably petite ghosts, admittedly!

(Gundam would call them funnels, and I remain unsure why they call them that.)

Think how amazing a few much larger boomerangs could be at doing a variety of things.

As long as those things involved forcefields and holograms.

If you start adding too much to them, you get into the out-of-universe problem of removing character agency by replacing most human tasks with robots. Same reason Macross doesn't have much in the way of remote-piloted drones, and heavily restricts the role of AI drones.

In-universe... I'm not sure what one WOULD add to them besides forcefield emitters and guns. Sound boosters?

Come to think of it, didn't they use a microdrone to run down Freyja at the loading dock? Just with a much smaller holoprojector and no forcefield. It was just handled so casually that we didn't blink(I only just made the connection now).

Also, doesn't it even feel silly to be asking about batteries? You'd think with everything else going on they must have figured out some pretty amazing ways to store energy.

From another point of view, these amazing ways to store energy are what enable tiny flying force-field generators in the first place. They ARE shown to have limited battery life in the show, so it is clearly an issue that needs additional work in-universe.

My point was actually future-looking though I gave a couple examples of how the show may already open itself to some eyebrow raising. Delta is now WAY in the future and obviously there's a lot of integration of very fantastic tech happening so the writers are going to have a challenge writing a story that won't fall apart when viewers ponder why some of this amazing tech wasn't used in different ways. I'm curious to see if the writers can avoid the pitfall.

Indeed. They're getting far enough removed from our everyday experience that making things both believable and relatable becomes difficult.

Traditionally, the franchise has simply treated advanced technology as ordinary and nothing even worth commenting on. The original series threw things like robot vending machines and automated public telephones in just to emphasize how crazy things got once overtechnology showed up on the radar, but these crazy things quickly became just an accepted part of the background as the characters treated them as perfectly ordinary.

[anime52k8]

What with there only being four Evil series left in the entire universe, and all four having left the galaxy, it's a very safe bet that Mikumo is no more a Protodeviln than the last character this theory was voiced about... Macross Frontier's Ram Hoa, who turned out to be a perfectly normal woman of Indian descent.

wait, this one is Ram:

I think you're talking about Mina

[Raptor One]

Nice discussion about consistency of technology use so far in Delta. I'm inclined to agree with Seto, and I'm not sure why in a narrative where these discrepancies can be easily explained simply by thinking about how things operate in the real world, one would choose to go with reasoning that draws the conclusion the writers are doing something simply for plot convenience while ignoring logic. I mean, this is a narrative of course, so pretty much everything is done for plot convenience or character building, the only problem is when the established framework doesn't support that convenience. If two interpretations exist, why not give the creators the benefit of the doubt and go with the interpretation that there are in-universe reasons why technology looks to be distributed the way it is?

But hey, we all approach these things differently

[jenius]

Sigh, it's like you guys think Delta exists in one episode. It will be a series in which it will need an over arching plot. I've said it's going to be hard to create a plot with tech as advanced as it is and not find lots of inconsistencies. The response 'I don't think that happened yet' is fine... but it doesn't mean it won't.

Edit - I think Mr March is right on if Delta plays more of a 'fun' or silly tone then there will be no problem because you shouldn't over think shows that don't take themselves very serious.

Edited February 21, 2016 by jenius

[Raptor One]

Sigh, it's like you guys think Delta exists in one episode. It will be a series in which it will need an over arching plot. I've said it's going to be hard to create a plot with tech as advanced as it is and not find lots of inconsistencies. The response 'I don't think that happened yet' is fine... but it doesn't mean it won't.

True. I misread your argument as being that it was already inconsistent.

[Mommar]

I still think the "girls" on the battlefield, minis lead singer lady (who is likely a cyborg) are all remotely controlled suits. There's a scene where a hologram-like image of the red head sitting at her computer terminal hovers behind and above her avatar on the battlefield and it looks exactly like the pose she eas holding when sitting at the computer terminal with the bad-ass pilot standing behind her at an earlier point in the episode prior to the battle starting.

Was that sufficiently non-specific as I can't remember any of their names nor do I have timestamps from the video to back up my unsubstantiated claims.

[Seto Kaiba]

I could have sworn Hayate piloted a glorified forklift, maybe I'll have to watch the episode again. I mean, sure, freight trains exist... but so do automated warehouses... TODAY. That's without 60 years of overtech.

... and yet, the false parallels continue to pile up.

Yes, automated warehouses exist... but they're not common by any means, and in case you missed it Hayate isn't stacking shelves at a supermarket or working in a fulfillment center for Space Amazon. Hayate's job is handling shipping containers at a space port freight yard. The handling and inspection of shipping containers like that is still done by humans with heavy machinery today. The reason for not going completely robotic there is easy to understand considering humanity's a bit gunshy about totally independent robots after the Sharon Apple incident and interplanetary security IS a concern.

You would think tech similar to what the boomerangs use could be used in larger, stronger, vehicles for a million other purposes.

... but it already is. The multidrones are just the latest expression of a technology that has existed at least since the First Space War.

There are robotic litter-picking machines, robotic payphones, robotic vending machines, robotic security cameras, unmanned space fighters, and all manner of other implementations of robotic technology. Just because it's appropriate for some jobs doesn't mean it's appropriate for every job though.

Generally though the amount of capital expended is related to the cost of labor. Are people so plentiful in the future that companies willingly substitute capital expenditure for cheap labor or, do you think in a future of massive cloning and post apocalypse there'd be huge investment in capital to make up for a shortfall of common workers?

I think it's more to do with the fact that there are some jobs where you just want a human eye... like on the security of a space port that's handling interplanetary imports and exports. It's probably also somewhat more cost-effective to use the destroids that are relatively cheap than come up with a fully-autonomous cargo-handling robot.

Also, doesn't it even feel silly to be asking about batteries? You'd think with everything else going on they must have figured out some pretty amazing ways to store energy.

We're never not going to need ways to store energy... whether you call it a battery or a capacitor, that's a requirement that's going to carry on into the indefinite future. The Macross universe has vastly improved battery and capacitor technology over what we have today, capable of storing vast amounts of power (by today's standards) in a relatively small space... enough to provide megawatts of power for short spans of time. The problem with the multidrones is that, canonically, barrier technology consumes a HUGE amount of power. The YF-19's pin-point barrier consumes 60% of its total reactor output... that's a continuous drawof hundreds (if not thousands) of megawatts for a shield roughly the size of a large-ish dinner table. Now stop and consider that we're shown these multidrones roughly the size of a backpack working together to put out a barrier that spans what looks to be an entire four-lane street to an altitude of maybe two to three stories. That's a LOT of juice to keep a shield like that up. It's no surprise their internal batteries or capacitors or whatever don't last very long.

There are all kinds of mentions of batteries and capacitors relating to mecha in Macross... like the VF-0's backup power it used for underwater operation, the "Mighty Wing" capacitor, the capacitors used on the VF-25's Armored Pack and Tornado Pack to power energy conversion armor and beam weapons, etc. etc. The Master File mentions of nuclear (or thermonuclear reaction) batteries that power various functions on the enhanced VF-1's like the VF-1P and -X...

My intention was never to upset Seto by questioning Delta. My point was actually future-looking though I gave a couple examples of how the show may already open itself to some eyebrow raising.

Oh, rest assured... you'll have to do a LOT worse to rustle my jimmies.

You just raised my eyebrow a bit with this insistence that technologies that are well-precedented in the Macross universe(s) already are somehow eyebrow-raising NOW when they raised no eyebrows over the last three decades of Macross sequels.

(Gundam would call them funnels, and I remain unsure why they call them that.)

Because the original ones were cone-shaped with a gun barrel in the middle... they looked like a funnel, so they called them funnels.

The VF-4 actually had funnels in Macross: Eternal Love Song and called them such.

[Vifam7]

Oh, rest assured... you'll have to do a LOT worse to rustle my jimmies.

You just raised my eyebrow a bit with this insistence that technologies that are well-precedented in the Macross universe(s) already are somehow eyebrow-raising NOW when they raised no eyebrows over the last three decades of Macross sequels.

Are you willing to accept anything in the series so long as it can be explained away as precedented or believeable technology "in universe"? The reason why I ask is because in the DX Chogokin VF-31 thread I suggested an episode in which the Walkure girls are surfing on top of VF-31s in macronized form. I believe such a scene is totally possible "in universe" but I got the feeling that most fans would balk at such a thing happening in the show.

I really do want to see something like this in Delta.

[jenius]

Oh, rest assured... you'll have to do a LOT worse to rustle my jimmies.

You just raised my eyebrow a bit with this insistence that technologies that are well-precedented in the Macross universe(s) already are somehow eyebrow-raising NOW when they raised no eyebrows over the last three decades of Macross sequels.

I think the strangest thing to me is that this entire conversation seems to stem from misreading my original post. I never inferred that any of the technologies in the first episode didn't fit Macross.

it's not that the technology being shown is too crazy for Macross

There seems to have developed since then a suggestion accredited to me where I had an issue with the technologies. My question all along has been rather simply "are the writers really going to be able to handle having super tech and all the possible plot problems that can lead to." You can say "Hey, I think they're off to a good start." After one episode I very much have doubts but you're optimistic and that's fine.

[JB0]

Because the original ones were cone-shaped with a gun barrel in the middle... they looked like a funnel, so they called them funnels.

Another mystery solved!

Thanks, I've been wondering that for about as long as I've been aware Gundam existed.

The VF-4 actually had funnels in Macross: Eternal Love Song and called them such.

That sounds awesome. But it's probably a good argument for maintaining creative oversight of licensed video games.

[Tochiro]

Are you willing to accept anything in the series so long as it can be explained away as precedented or believeable technology "in universe"? The reason why I ask is because in the DX Chogokin VF-31 thread I suggested an episode in which the Walkure girls are surfing on top of VF-31s in macronized form. I believe such a scene is totally possible "in universe" but I got the feeling that most fans would balk at such a thing happening in the show.

I really do want to see something like this in Delta.

Well, considering all the sort of things Frontier gave us, and provided there's a context given, i don't think that fans (here in japan at least) would have any issue with such a concept at all ;-)

[JB0]

I still love the Super-parts Klan, and I don't care how absurd it was.

[Seto Kaiba]

Are you willing to accept anything in the series so long as it can be explained away as precedented or believeable technology "in universe"? The reason why I ask is because in the DX Chogokin VF-31 thread I suggested an episode in which the Walkure girls are surfing on top of VF-31s in macronized form. I believe such a scene is totally possible "in universe" but I got the feeling that most fans would balk at such a thing happening in the show.

Well... yeah, I guess. If whatever it was were operating within the established principles of the Macross universe's technology, then I'd probably be OK with it. Having Walkure's members "surfing" VF-31's would be a little odd, but I suppose in GERWALK mode it'd be technologically plausible at least thanks to their obscenely high thrust-to-weight ratio.

We saw the SMS Macross Quarter surf a chunk of starship into an enemy attack, and this is at least as plausible as that...

Klan Klan's little stunt with the VF-25's SPS-25 Super Pack still raises eyebrows, because I've yet to see ANY kind of explanation for how she was able to control it...

Another mystery solved!

Thanks, I've been wondering that for about as long as I've been aware Gundam existed.

It's a silly explanation, but hey...

That sounds awesome. But it's probably a good argument for maintaining creative oversight of licensed video games.

Actually, the Macross: Eternal Love Song game was one of the two Macross II prequel games for the PC Engine, and the creators of the OVA were involved in its development. Macross 2036 and Eternal Love Song were the first "canon" games in Macross, though they belong to the "DYRLverse" of Macross II.

The funnels on the VF-4ST Siren are basically a predecessor to the Auto-Attacker Bits on the VF-2SS Valkyrie II in the OVA's first episode. There's no psycommu, so they're computer-controlled instead, kind of like Luca's Ghosts in Macross Frontier or the GN Fangs in Gundam 00. The Gundam influence was a lot more evident in Macross II's timeline... the Daedalus II and Prometheus II were basically the Pegasus-class equivalent in Macross, and the VF-4ST also had a beam rifle that looked suspiciously like the one on the Zeta Gundam.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Seto Kaiba

[JB0]

Oh, the PCEngine games DID have some form of creative oversight? That surprises the heck out of me.

I played the heck out of 2036 in an emulator. It's a pretty sweet game.

[Zinjo]

Bugs, New Asia 'nuff said.

And yet one turned up on Ouroboros with Havamal studying it to rewrite history.

Is this official continuity or just "extended universe" stuff? Was it included in the Chronicles which are apparently the reference bibles to the Macross universe until SK retcons something else?

I am not a fan of the idea that humanity is able to so quickly decode the biotech of a civilization that existed for eons before it was destroyed by its own war tech. The AFOS looks to be clearly a bio-weapon and the Zentradi cap ships look as though they were "grown" and not really built. The PC tech should be so advanced that it would take humanity decades to decode even the basics of it. Stumbling over the use of Fold Quartz is one thing, being able to recreate the bio-tech that created the EVIL series is another IMO.

I still love the Super-parts Klan, and I don't care how absurd it was.

Me too! An "in universe" Valk Girl, you gotta love it!!

Edited February 22, 2016 by Zinjo

[Seto Kaiba]

Is this official continuity or just "extended universe" stuff?

All signs point to "official continuity" in both cases.

(Macross 30 in particular seems to have a very high visibility influence on Macross Delta, as the VF-31 Siegfried used by Delta Platoon is apparently a production version of the YF-30 Chronos developed by SMS Uroboros' Major Aisha Blanchett and named for the callsign of the pilot who used the YF-30 to foil the Havamal plot to use the ancient Protoculture bioweapon to alter history.)

Was it included in the Chronicles which are apparently the reference bibles to the Macross universe until SK retcons something else?

Yes, it was. In fact, both had featured articles on the cover of various Macross Chronicle volumes. (VF-9 and VF-14 for Macross M3, YF-30 for Macross 30.)

I am not a fan of the idea that humanity is able to so quickly decode the biotech of a civilization that existed for eons before it was destroyed by its own war tech. The AFOS looks to be clearly a bio-weapon and the Zentradi cap ships look as though they were "grown" and not really built. The PC tech should be so advanced that it would take humanity decades to decode even the basics of it. Stumbling over the use of Fold Quartz is one thing, being able to recreate the bio-tech that created the EVIL series is another IMO.

All told, humanity isn't very good at decoding the technology of the Protoculture. The Protodeviln were accidentally released by an ill-conceived experiment to figure out WTF the energy field on the Varauta system's ice planet was doing. Havamal was exploiting the ancient Protoculture ruins on Uroboros, but they'd spent years, potentially decades, sorting it out and dealing with the multitude of defenses the Protoculture left behind to keep meddlers out of their dangerous (rejected) weapon. Humanity had better luck with Zentradi overtechnology, which was deliberately kept simple and robust.

I always felt Mylene Beat was stupid for precisely the reason you cite... they try to clone a Protodeviln and it ends exactly as badly as you'd expect, with a giant, uncontrollable monster rampaging around the fleet. The same problem occurred in Macross M3 with the botched bioweapon experiments on New Asia, where the base was quickly overrun by bugs the size of a Monster destroid.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Seto Kaiba

[arcoregon]

Have the drones been referred to as Maelstrom here? I thought I heard Makina call them that when she called for a recharge.

A thought of projecting a hologram over the VF-31s in space for a combat performance would be a weird idea but hey, almost worked for Battle Galaxy...

[Seto Kaiba]

Have the drones been referred to as Maelstrom here? I thought I heard Makina call them that when she called for a recharge.

She calls them "multidrones".

[Primus1X]

Which variants of the VF-31 does each Delta Squadron member pilot?