Macross Δ (Delta) Mecha/Technology Thread - READ 1st POST

[sketchley]

I was initially turned off by the "magical suits" the singers are wearing in the series, but while contemplating them I've come up with an in-universe explanation that makes them plausible (aside from the lack of a helmet, but that's forgivable - we've gotta see their faces in their big introduction after all).

The outfits appear to be a next generation type of EX-Gear (able to perform superhuman acrobatic leaps, etc, sustained high G maneuvers, and protection from falling concrete), with the miniaturized anti-gravity mechanism (from the boomerangs, used for hovering, anime leaps and so on).

Despite the implied titillation, it's pretty much a given that they're using the same holographic emitters Sheryl used over her concert bodysuit (or Minmei and Hikaru used in the shop in DYRL), and there appears to be a Fold Wave (I believe that's what I hear them saying repeatedly) emitter amplifying their singing (the episode pretty much indicates that more than a few people naturally produce them like Ranka did). And if they're using Fold Waves, it's a short skip and a hop to Fold Barriers (which can explain away the aforementioned lack of a helmet and negigible effects from blast waves and so on).

An alternative explanation for the visual and auditory effects would be the SES system from M7 sound and holographic emitters used in the Sound Force Valkyries.

[Bariaburu Faita]

I would say that is very likely. Their actual suits being full body leotards, with some thin metal exoskeleton.

I was initially turned off by the "magical suits" the singers are wearing in the series, but while contemplating them I've come up with an in-universe explanation that makes them plausible (aside from the lack of a helmet, but that's forgivable - we've gotta see their faces in their big introduction after all).

The outfits appear to be a next generation type of EX-Gear (able to perform superhuman acrobatic leaps, etc, sustained high G maneuvers, and protection from falling concrete), with the miniaturized anti-gravity mechanism (from the boomerangs, used for hovering, anime leaps and so on).

Despite the implied titillation, it's pretty much a given that they're using the same holographic emitters Sheryl used over her concert bodysuit (or Minmei and Hikaru used in the shop in DYRL), and there appears to be a Fold Wave (I believe that's what I hear them saying repeatedly) emitter amplifying their singing (the episode pretty much indicates that more than a few people naturally produce them like Ranka did). And if they're using Fold Waves, it's a short skip and a hop to Fold Barriers (which can explain away the aforementioned lack of a helmet and negigible effects from blast waves and so on).

An alternative explanation for the visual and auditory effects would be the SES system from M7 sound and holographic emitters used in the Sound Force Valkyries.

[Renato]

But if you look closely, just before the girls eject from the valks, their seats ARE already equipped with the EX-gears, in the interface mode. It's sort of weird that they would eject and leave the gear in there. Or that they would have them in the cockpit in the first place if they are already wearing an advanced version. :/

[Bariaburu Faita]

if they are based on the YF-25 airframe, they would have the EX-gear as the default controls, even the throttle and joystick is a part of it. so you couldnt easily get rid of it. They just dont need it if they are not in the fighter. The conjectual EX-gear they wear would have to be even thinner than previously thought, maybe nanotech cloth instead of metal exoskeleton.

But if you look closely, just before the girls eject from the valks, their seats ARE already equipped with the EX-gears, in the interface mode. It's sort of weird that they would eject and leave the gear in there. Or that they would have them in the cockpit in the first place if they are already wearing an advanced version. :/

Edited January 3, 2016 by Bariaburu Faita

[JB0]

I did feel it was weird that their spacesuits and helmets apparently evaporated during the transformation. In honesty, that's the only part of the "magical girl" routine that really bothered me. I think it's gonna take some good technobabble to explain that away, and I want to see them try.

My first thought was holographic overlay erasing the helmet/spacesuit's visible presence, but it is a justification with a lot of issues.

[RedWolf]

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. Remember in Macross Zero there were floating rocks and pillars. It isn't just Sara singing as people thought but it is the Bird Human reaction to her song.

Bird Human is one of the more advanced bio-weapons of the Protoculture.

What the Wulkure do seemingly magical is tech.

[JB0]

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. Remember in Macross Zero there were floating rocks and pillars. It isn't just Sara singing as people thought but it is the Bird Human reaction to her song.

Bird Human is one of the more advanced bio-weapons of the Protoculture.

What the Wulkure do seemingly magical is tech.

But it's HUMAN technology. Of the near-future, even. Certainly, they've gotten a leg up on us stuck hear in the real world due to reverse-engineering of alien tech, but it should still be recognizably technology.

And Walkure is surprisingly grounded in other respects. They aren't freely dancing through the air, even though gravity control IS a technology that exists in the setting. They're standing on forcefields, rocket-assisted jumps taking them from place to place. They don't carry forcefield generators and hologram projectors ON them, they rely on external devices that are recognizably technological in nature.

If they don't try to explain the costumes, I'll be very disappointed.

Unrelated: Did anyone else notice that the tattered Walkure audition flyier Freyja pulls out of her cloak isn't actually printed on paper? It's got animation, so it's some sort of active display device.

I thought that was a pretty cool touch, and ALMOST doable now with OLED or e-ink(albeit not at anything near throwaway costs, nor that level of durability).

[kajnrig]

Unrelated: Did anyone else notice that the tattered Walkure audition flyier Freyja pulls out of her cloak isn't actually printed on paper? It's got animation, so it's some sort of active display device.

I thought that was a pretty cool touch, and ALMOST doable now with OLED or e-ink(albeit not at anything near throwaway costs, nor that level of durability).

There are iterations of that in Frontier, too, and in sci-fi in general. I was a bit put off by how floaty it looked, like someone had done a bad Photoshop copy-and-paste instead of contouring the image to the folds and crinkles of the page. It could just be that it was way higher resolution than I was expecting, though.

[JB0]

I should clearly rewatch Frontier.

Usually, sci-fi embeds the document in something thicker than a sheet of paper, and I don't think I've ever seen one that was ragged and torn before.

[sketchley]

But if you look closely, just before the girls eject from the valks, their seats ARE already equipped with the EX-gears, in the interface mode. It's sort of weird that they would eject and leave the gear in there. Or that they would have them in the cockpit in the first place if they are already wearing an advanced version. :/

Hmmm... maybe the EX-Gear is for the pilots (or for combat that needs the flight/combat/armour capabilities of EX-Gear proper, and the girls are wearing the micro-EX-Gear?

Maybe EX-Gear isn't the right way to describe the girls' suits. Didn't the Quadolun pilots have something akin to a low-grade power suit?

I should clearly rewatch Frontier.

Usually, sci-fi embeds the document in something thicker than a sheet of paper, and I don't think I've ever seen one that was ragged and torn before.

Perhaps their taking the development of screens on clothing (screens made from fabric) in reality and applying it to paper?

[VF5SS]

Unrelated: Did anyone else notice that the tattered Walkure audition flyier Freyja pulls out of her cloak isn't actually printed on paper? It's got animation, so it's some sort of active display device.

That happens in DYRL too when the bridge girls are reading about the SCOOP DA scandal. The magazine they have has some animated photos.

[JB0]

It's official: I suck as a Macross fan. Never noticed.

[RedWolf]

What about those bracelets in Sharon Apple's concert that materialize on the wrist?

Could it be part of the tech progress used with the Walkure?

[azrael]

Hmmm... maybe the EX-Gear is for the pilots (or for combat that needs the flight/combat/armour capabilities of EX-Gear proper, and the girls are wearing the micro-EX-Gear?

Maybe EX-Gear isn't the right way to describe the girls' suits. Didn't the Quadolun pilots have something akin to a low-grade power suit?

EX-Gear without the exo-skeleton features. Basically a jetpack and drone interface.

[sketchley]

EX-Gear without the exo-skeleton features. Basically a jetpack and drone interface.

That's not quite what I was saying - in that that there is some muscle/movement enhancements (like the suits in Appleseed) and enhanced protection (like the leathers a biker wears - great for stopping road rash, but not much else).

I was thinking more along the lines of they're wearing a power suit in something much more form fitting than what we've seen before. Like the next generation of the suits used in VF-X2 or something like that.

[Bariaburu Faita]

Something that we have been assuming is that the superhuman feats we saw them doing was due to a suit. A simpler reason may be that they ARE superhuman. Be it cyborg enhancements, or genetic modification, or alien crossbreed.

[Graham]

Good point.

[JB0]

Well, there's definitely some technological enhancement. We SAW the exhaust from the underskirt rockets boosting their jumps.

[Guest davidwhangchoi]

you guys think there's some yf-21 mental imagery going on? the whole sphere flashed a vector mapped gird before the singers went into action.

[wmkjr]

Something like Muv Luv's fortified suits would be interesting to see as their exo suit.

[sketchley]

you guys think there's some yf-21 mental imagery going on? the whole sphere flashed a vector mapped gird before the singers went into action.

Which raises the possibility that the "girls" that we see on the battlefield aren't really girls, but remote controlled cyborgs?

There's also the question of what those egg-like cocoons are on the enemy command bridge - are they, also, where the real people behind the pilots of the SV-262 are? (If the pilots are remote controlled cyborgs, as well?)

Lastly, the enemy fighters appear to be using the YF-21 BDI system - all we really see of the cockpits are the seats. And given that they have enclosed cockpits and the precedent set by previous Macross series on enemies using BDI...

[Zinjo]

Miniturized anti-grav tech I imagine. Way back in Macross 7 they had flying mics. Between anti-grav, barriers and holography these things have a low battery life.

It seems by 2067 micro-gravity control devices are commercially available everywhere. The drone seeking out our heroine used the same tech. So it seems like common tech available to everyone by this point. The Walkurie drones are clearly militarized with the ability to generate barrier shields upon command.

[Zinjo]

That's not quite what I was saying - in that that there is some muscle/movement enhancements (like the suits in Appleseed) and enhanced protection (like the leathers a biker wears - great for stopping road rash, but not much else).

I was thinking more along the lines of they're wearing a power suit in something much more form fitting than what we've seen before. Like the next generation of the suits used in VF-X2 or something like that.

I am hoping you are on to something there. I don't want another rehash of rainbow song energy stopping Macross Cannon blasts, like 7.

They could be prototype combat suits that have all the bleeding edge tech UNS has been developing for UN Marines and ground forces. Couple that with a state of the art interface between the suits and the boomerang drones and you have a formidable system.

[Graham]

Lastly, the enemy fighters appear to be using the YF-21 BDI system - all we really see of the cockpits are the seats. And given that they have enclosed cockpits and the precedent set by previous Macross series on enemies using BDI...

I don't think it's a BDI system in the Sv-262, or at least not a full BDI system.

To me it looks more likely curved monitors on the inside of the cockpit that conform to the shape of the cockpit (see attached screenshots).

Also, seems like they are using traditional throttle and stick to control the SV-262 (see attached screenshots).

Apologies for the ads on the attached pics but the screenshots were taken on my phone and the adds pop-up on the MX Player app when I pause the video to take a screenshot.

Graham

[kajnrig]

Is it just me or are cockpits generally more spacious in these newer shows? Maybe it's just perception, but I seem to remember the YF-19/YF-21/VF-1/etc. looking more claustrophobic.

[d3v]

Is it just me or are cockpits generally more spacious in these newer shows? Maybe it's just perception, but I seem to remember the YF-19/YF-21/VF-1/etc. looking more claustrophobic.

They've been more spacious since 7 which had to somehow fit things like a whole drumkit inside a cockpit.

On a related note, it's nice to see 360' monitor cockpits again. That was one thing that was missing from Frontier that made me scratch my head.

[kajnrig]

What about the VF-27? Well, I suppose it has more of a cyborg interface altogether that goes all neon-green (or at least that's the most prominent image in my brain), but still, it's an enclosed space with opaque walls and cameras that see the outside world.

[Major Focker]

Something that we have been assuming is that the superhuman feats we saw them doing was due to a suit. A simpler reason may be that they ARE superhuman. Be it cyborg enhancements, or genetic modification, or alien crossbreed.

Mikumo is Grace v2.0 atoning for her/their past misdeeds

... or doing field tests for another mind control/manipulation scheme

[seti88]

Meanwhile, in my fertile imagination...

Animator 1: which mechs are supposed to get destroyed (big space battle scene cel)?

Animator 2: this guy gets a stomach shot and implodes, that guy turns right into a gunpod blast, and all of these unlucky sobs in the bleachers get mowed down by a laser volley from 5 cruisers.

Animator 1: what do we call those mechs again?

Hey, weirder stuff has gone down before... XD

animator 1: ok i have done the design for the enemy commander suit.

animator 2: congrats. lets celebrate!

animator 1 and 2 in bar: bottoms up! glug glug glug glug..

animator 1: writes name of mech on napkin............glaug........*passes out*...

Edited January 6, 2016 by seti88

[sharky]

After watching a 3rd time it's clear that Walkure have some kind technology (probably built into their costumes) that emit some kind of force field that causes them to illuminate. I noticed that when they stopped illuminating they were able to be hurt, knocked down, etc. Not 100% clear if song energy activates it only. They're able to leap and such, but often they were either riding a Valkyrie or were using the boomerangs to "fly". All the fast paced action scenes only started to click on the 3rd viewing when I could focus on the Valkyries and "Walkure-ies".

Edit: It's gotta by those belt thing-ies they wear around their waist. They all have some kind of device around their waist. Looks like they can be used to emit bursts of energy to leap or flly a little.

Edited January 6, 2016 by sharky

[kajnrig]

I'm sure others have mentioned the tethers or "reins" the girls (or at least Mikumo, I think) use to ride their respective Valkyries. I wonder if it's literally just a length of string attached to the Valkyrie, or if it's a holographic thing, or what.

[azrael]

What about the VF-27? Well, I suppose it has more of a cyborg interface altogether that goes all neon-green (or at least that's the most prominent image in my brain), but still, it's an enclosed space with opaque walls and cameras that see the outside world.

A VF-27 was no more spacious than a VF-25's. The virtual cockpit just provides the illusion of a more spacious cockpit...it the pilot's head and cybernetic eyes. Wrap-around imaging provides an optical illusion just like Gundam's linear seat+panoramic monitors. In reality, if you try to stick your arm out in any direction, you wouldn't be able to fully extend it.

Speaking of cockpits, the Sv-262's cockpits don't appear to use EX-Gears, or use any EX-Gear of UN-design.

[kajnrig]

A VF-27 was no more spacious than a VF-25's. The virtual cockpit just provides the illusion of a more spacious cockpit...it the pilot's head and cybernetic eyes. Wrap-around imaging provides an optical illusion just like Gundam's linear seat+panoramic monitors. In reality, if you try to stick your arm out in any direction, you wouldn't be able to fully extend it.

Speaking of cockpits, the Sv-262's cockpits don't appear to use EX-Gears, or use any EX-Gear of UN-design.

Sorry, that post was in response to d3v's second point (in his response to my initial inquiry, which WAS about the spaciousness of cockpits), where they said:

d3v: "On a related note, it's nice to see 360' monitor cockpits again. That was one thing that was missing from Frontier that made me scratch my head"

me: "What about the VF-27? Well, I suppose it has more of a cyborg interface altogether that goes all neon-green (or at least that's the most prominent image in my brain), but still, it's an enclosed space with opaque walls and cameras that see the outside world."

Edited January 6, 2016 by kajnrig

[d3v]

Sorry, that post was in response to d3v's second point (in his response to my initial inquiry, which WAS about the spaciousness of cockpits), where they said:

Missed that reply. But yeah it's more a cyborg version of the BDI than the "transparent cockpit" of the M7 era craft.

[UN Spacy]

Gonna need some explaining how Mikumo's drones were able to deflect a dozen micro missiles at point blank range.

One or two yeah...but she took a damn Itano Circus in her face.

Edited January 6, 2016 by UN Spacy