Macross Δ (Delta) - NYE Special Talkback - READ 1st POST

[Einherjar]

Crap, forgot a very important milestone from the episode.

Not counting Max in Macross The First, probably for the first time in the franchise we finally have a decent Destroid pilot; Hayate Immelmann. I don't think Monster pilots really count since they pilot Monsters and they've been transformable since the 90's.

Edited January 2, 2016 by Einherjar

[Graham]

What if Basara shows up instead?

At this point, that would be a relief I think.

What if Basara shows up instead?

At this point, that would be a relief I think.

[kajnrig]

If he thinks IBO is good then maybe he does have bad taste...

It's better than Thunderbolt, at any rate. But anyway...

stay on topic and stop picking on others who dont like the series.

Not so much picking on as correcting a misstatement made to pick on others who do like the series, but as you say, sticking on topic.

(08MST is a great show. <--There, olive branch. )

I'm curious which version of Frontier they'll reference. Seems they're taking the tech from Frontier already, despite it being... what, barely eight years since that show/movie? They've played fast and loose with canon and galactic scale before, so it's plausible for Frontier tech to reach Al Shahal, so now the only question is who's dead, Michel or Brera?

EDIT:

Watched it again, with subs. Far more understandable than my limited Japanese would allow me otherwise. Looking forward to the love dodecahedrons that'll be cropping up. I'm not relishing keeping track of everyone's relationships, though it would be really neat if it turns out some of the idols/pilots are in LGBT/polyamorous and actually sexually active relationships. It would be a big deal, especially considering how oppressive the idol culture can be in Japan. /flashes back to the AKB48 girl who shaved her head in shame for daring to have a boyfriend...

Edited January 2, 2016 by kajnrig

[seti88]

Freyja has Synesthesia.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synesthesia

There seems to be a synesthesia connection with Var Syndrome as well.

Windermere was settled by one of two fleets in the prologue. Since it is said Human expansion led to first contact with alien races I assume the fleet assimilated with locals.

i didnt know that existed! Those having it must be 'hearing' music in a such a unique way, they probably can read sheet music easier!

Maybe thats the parallel delta is going for, to see a battle as a rhythm..(shades of ongoing gundam thunderbolt heh)

and so the conductor = commander (in the crystal cave) or roid in his yet to be seen winderemere HQ?/or isit a starship?

btw this scene made me lol a lil watching over the subs...

i dont imagine you would get away doing that gesture to the band in a concert in the west...

Or prob you could if you flashed a cute smile and blinky eyes..

[Graham]

OK, I'm going to revise my opinon on the mecha animation quality and detailing.

I watched the raw yesterday once only on my TV, while being distracted by wife and son.

I've now just been going through it on my laptop and freeze framing the mecha scenes, especially the VF-31s and yes, there is actually a heck of a lot of detail present on the mecha, more than I first thought.

Now, about the recharge pack it splits into two sections, the boxy structure on the right being the wireless recharge system for the boomerangs.

However, the long part on the left looks like some sort of gunpod. If you look at the attached pics there eve seems to be some sort of pistol grip, which I've marked with an arrow.

In fact I think on a recent magazine cover (Figure Oh magazine?), this gunpod(?) was even shown in the hand of the VF-31.

I'm guessing it's some sort of heavy beam cannon that can be fired when the pod is extended and perhaps the gunpod can be ejected into the hand of the VF-31.

However, judging from the animation, it cannot be fired from the fighter mode belly position, as the muzzle would apear to be blocked by the groin piece.

Graham

[wmkjr]

I wonder if it can also swivel too.

[Vepariga]

watched it again, i just love that Zentradi attack and then when Kingdom of the Wind mob show up. Joygasms everywhere.

I'm just so pumped for future eps!

[Vifam7]

I really wish Satelight would quit the whole CG-ified look for the mecha. It just looks cheap. I wasn't really impressed with the Valkyrie combat scenes too. Things were moving so fast, I could barely tell what's happening. On the positive side, I already like Freyja, Mirage, and Hayate as characters.

[Tochiro]

So now that we know Kawamori is trying to blend Macross 7 and Macross Plus when it comes to Delta, and that the balance of these elements will change each episode for at least the first 5 episodes, what are people's thoughts on the Plus elements in the Delta preview episode?

(I.e., recreation of Gulds flying at missiles head on to dodge them technique, etc).

With the stated aim of Valkyrie combat in the series being a return to one on one combat, combined with the speed on display in Delta, we may be in for some fairly spectacular dogfights in the future :-)

Edited January 2, 2016 by Tochiro

[Vepariga]

I loved those Mac Plus missile dodge moments, the whole combat scenes just,its excatly what ive been waiting for. I am so happy they have returned to Valk vs Valk dogfights,it just brings so much more danger and character to the battles.

[spanner]

I kinda got the gist of what was going on watching it the first time but then watching a subtitled version the rest of it made a more sense. I definitely enjoyed it a lot more 2nd time around! Really looking forward to seeing more!

[seti88]

So now that we know Kawamori is trying to blend Macross 7 and Macross Plus when it comes to Delta, and that the balance of these elements will change each episode for at least the first 5 episodes, what are people's thoughts on the Plus elements in the Delta preview episode?

(I.e., recreation of Gulds flying at missiles head on to dodge them technique, etc).

With the stated aim of Valkyrie combat in the series being a return to one on one combat, combined with the speed on display in Delta, we may be in for some fairly spectacular dogfights in the future :-)

image.pngimage.png

From the sequence of the screeching drakens entering for battle, and then a close up of the 262's before pulling into the 31's flying off to engage, felt it was well presented.

The 262's ghost boosters added a welcome dimension in dog-fighting. Really exciting to see them rotate, and give the supersonic drakens a real manueverabilty twist. Hopefully they will reappear in future episodes and are not just for subspace travel....

Also felt the 31's gerwalk mode kicked ass in this ep, and felt the punch/difference those tonfa's made in turning the tide during the battle's with the detached ghosts. The tonfa sound had quite a nice sound effect firing too.

Overall, thoroughly enjoyed the dogfights sequences and missile launch poses!

Hopefully. there would be battroid v battroid dogfights(?) ala isamu/guld ala M+!

Am just wondering who would be the main fight to see...we already saw keith vs messer as being equally matched....

keith/arad? keith/hayate? or maybe roid/hayate/arad when roid gets into action in a draken....

I kinda got the gist of what was going on watching it the first time but then watching a subtitled version the rest of it made a more sense. I definitely enjoyed it a lot more 2nd time around! Really looking forward to seeing more!

yes it did, definately merits a 2nd viewing!

[JB0]

As someone mentioned during the Podcast, why need Valks (apart for as wireless recharging stations).

For the same reason they didn't use unmanned drones, be it AI or remote-piloted, in Frontier, even though the X-9 was the equal of the YF-19 and YF-21, only smaller and without a soft squishy center.

Butts in seats is way cooler.

How do the boomerangs fly for one? I guess it has to be sub-miniture anti-gravity drives, as there are no thrusters, jets, verniers or propellers visible.

If anti-grav technology has advanced to that level, why do Valks still need Gerwalk mode, or even wings for that matter. You no longer need wings for lift if you have so efficient anti-gravity drives.

I'd argue that gravity controllers likely still have the same flaw they had all the way back in SDF Macross. They only affect a very small area around them.

A heavy object with high velocity changes will likely still see gravity controllers ripping loose just like they did all the way back in Booby Trap.

The boomerang drones can get away with it because they have such low momentum(and if something goes wrong, no one cares if a battery pack and a holoprojector dies. Flesh&blood pilots get more consideration for hardware failure).

So now that we know Kawamori is trying to blend Macross 7 and Macross Plus when it comes to Delta, and that the balance of these elements will change each episode for at least the first 5 episodes, what are people's thoughts on the Plus elements in the Delta preview episode?

(I.e., recreation of Gulds flying at missiles head on to dodge them technique, etc).

Well, I know everyone is all "singing to make zentradi go fight? Sounds like Macross II", but my response was more "Didn't Sharon Apple do that?"

And someone flying through a missile cloud will never NOT be cool.

[Scream Man]

OK, I'm going to revise my opinon on the mecha animation quality and detailing.

I watched the raw yesterday once only on my TV, while being distracted by wife and son.

I've now just been going through it on my laptop and freeze framing the mecha scenes, especially the VF-31s and yes, there is actually a heck of a lot of detail present on the mecha, more than I first thought.

Now, about the recharge pack it splits into two sections, the boxy structure on the right being the wireless recharge system for the boomerangs.

However, the long part on the left looks like some sort of gunpod. If you look at the attached pics there eve seems to be some sort of pistol grip, which I've marked with an arrow.

In fact I think on a recent magazine cover (Figure Oh magazine?), this gunpod(?) was even shown in the hand of the VF-31.

I'm guessing it's some sort of heavy beam cannon that can be fired when the pod is extended and perhaps the gunpod can be ejected into the hand of the VF-31.

However, judging from the animation, it cannot be fired from the fighter mode belly position, as the muzzle would apear to be blocked by the groin piece.

Graham

The may not need to fire from below the fighter, it could deploy over the top i would think. I'm guessing the arm guns under the wings are the primary main guns on the fighter mode.

[Graham]

The may not need to fire from below the fighter, it could deploy over the top i would think. I'm guessing the arm guns under the wings are the primary main guns on the fighter mode.

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking, if it is a gun, it will deploy over the top for Fighter and GERWALK modes and eject into the hand for Barrel is mode.

[Graham]

Ok, so after doing a lot of freeze framing of the mecha combat scenes on my laptop and watching the episode for a second time, but with subs, I have to say I'm more onside with Delta.

Still can't say I'm completely onside with the whole Walkure Sailormoon transformations and boomerangs, but at last my opinion has changed from negative to cautiously optimistic.

Oh yeah, and I'm betting on Arad dying soon, Mirage taking his place as leader of Delta Squadron and Hayate joining Delta to fill the empty space.

[joppewo]

[kajnrig]

I really wish Satelight would quit the whole CG-ified look for the mecha. It just looks cheap.

That's because it IS cheap, at least compared to doing the same kind of animation with cels, or even cel shading (though cel shading tech has improved significantly since 2008). Though I agree that the number and level of effects is a bit garish and dizzying. It's a complaint I often had with both Frontier and Zero, too. Another reason why M+ is still the epitome of the franchise.

[Scyla]

I don't know why but the preview episode had a Macross Plus vibe to it. Maybe it is due to the fact that it is set on a planet and that they are similar to the New Edwards Airbase on Eden. Also the dogfights are part of that vibe.

I'm calling it now. The Flower Girl from M7 is the mysterious Lady M.

[edit:]

OK, I'm going to revise my opinon on the mecha animation quality and detailing.

I watched the raw yesterday once only on my TV, while being distracted by wife and son.

I've now just been going through it on my laptop and freeze framing the mecha scenes, especially the VF-31s and yes, there is actually a heck of a lot of detail present on the mecha, more than I first thought.

Now, about the recharge pack it splits into two sections, the boxy structure on the right being the wireless recharge system for the boomerangs.

However, the long part on the left looks like some sort of gunpod. If you look at the attached pics there eve seems to be some sort of pistol grip, which I've marked with an arrow.

In fact I think on a recent magazine cover (Figure Oh magazine?), this gunpod(?) was even shown in the hand of the VF-31.

I'm guessing it's some sort of heavy beam cannon that can be fired when the pod is extended and perhaps the gunpod can be ejected into the hand of the VF-31.

However, judging from the animation, it cannot be fired from the fighter mode belly position, as the muzzle would apear to be blocked by the groin piece.

Graham

Good catch with the gun-pod Graham. Here is the magazine cover. It seems that the gun on the container is the same as the gun-pod that the VF-31 holds in the image:

Edited January 2, 2016 by Scyla

[Graham]

The context I got from watching the subtitled episode was that Lady M is Mirage.

[Tochiro]

Alright folks, now that Ep.1 of Delta is out, SpeakerPODcast is looking for recordings of ppls impressions!

We want to splice together an episode of what YOU think, so I urge anyone who is interested to send us an audio recording of your impressions!

Please try to keep it to 5-10 mins at max, in MP3 format.
​Please send all impressions to Speakerpod(AT)gmail.com.

Be sure to say your forum handle so we know who you are :-)

[Karaoke Ninja]

The boomerang technology seems too advanced for the Macross universe, unless there has been some rapid breakthoughths in miniturization since Frontier.

As someone mentioned during the Podcast, why need Valks (apart for as wireless recharging stations).

How do the boomerangs fly for one? I guess it has to be sub-miniture anti-gravity drives, as there are no thrusters, jets, verniers or propellers visible.

If anti-grav technology has advanced to that level, why do Valks still need Gerwalk mode, or even wings for that matter. You no longer need wings for lift if you have so efficient anti-gravity drives.

After re-watching the preview episode I noticed that the drones do have small thrusters on the bottom/top and corners.

Edited January 2, 2016 by Karaoke Ninja

[Bariaburu Faita]

They showed exactly why in that episode. The forcefield and antigrav tech is very power hungry. They run out of power quickly. Where wings provide lift with low energy. You can even shut off the engines and glide if you have wings.

The boomerang technology seems too advanced for the Macross universe, unless there has been some rapid breakthoughths in miniturization since Frontier.

As someone mentioned during the Podcast, why need Valks (apart for as wireless recharging stations).

How do the boomerangs fly for one? I guess it has to be sub-miniture anti-gravity drives, as there are no thrusters, jets, verniers or propellers visible.

If anti-grav technology has advanced to that level, why do Valks still need Gerwalk mode, or even wings for that matter. You no longer need wings for lift if you have so efficient anti-gravity drives.

[Ganbare]

Gira gira awesome !!! Now, that's what I call hype

[Bariaburu Faita]

look at the products sold here:

http://search-fn.p-bandai.jp/?lang=ja&page=1&q=&C1=c000702

I believe its mostly targeted at japanese young women. And I have attended several Oshare Macross events and saw that it was mostly japanese young women spending huge amounts of money for high end products.

I have been to several concerts and saw that attendance was about 50% women. I have seen many women buying manga cds and dvds and blurays in denden town and various events.

I have not, however seen many young women buying valkyrie toys, that was mostly older men.

At the talkshows, Kawamori mentioned that they were surprised by the amount of product that young women were buying.

I'll be very interested in any data that shows that the japanese young women actually purchased more Frontier and Delta merchandises (concerts, manga, cd's, dvd's, valks, etc) and stuff.

Edited January 2, 2016 by Bariaburu Faita

[Renato]

Yeah it got stupid in season two when it became a harem show and had a talking penis become part of a love triangle with the main character.

Ah. Yeah, that took me by surprise, but I actually thought it was awesome. It's amazing how the writers and animators made it so that a talking penis can help you care about whether the characters live or die in a battle situation.

Don't get me wrong, but let's try not to kid ourselves.

All the different series in Macross were/are marketing ploys.

I fully agree that M+ maybe the pinnacle for some of outside of Japan), but tragically, that alone did not make it a runaway financial success in Japan like M7 and Frontier did.

Macross Plus had zero merchandise, though, other than the CD and VHS/LDs themselves.

[Renato]

Crap, forgot a very important milestone from the episode.

Not counting Max in Macross The First, probably for the first time in the franchise we finally have a decent Destroid pilot; Hayate Immelmann. I don't think Monster pilots really count since they pilot Monsters and they've been transformable since the 90's.

Hikaru Ichijo!

[Guest davidwhangchoi]

Mirage is my favorite valk, i'm in love. can't wait till it comes out for pre-order. hopefully by then she'll learn how fight.

[jvmacross]

Hikaru Ichijo!

Ace Destroid pilots?

Don't forget those old Destroid pilots shown in M7 that actually survived being Destroid pilots through to the M7 era....they were either ace pilots or extremely lucky!

More evidence to your repeated assertion that M7 has already shown and done everything!

[technoblue]

Well, I know everyone is all "singing to make zentradi go fight? Sounds like Macross II", but my response was more "Didn't Sharon Apple do that?"

And someone flying through a missile cloud will never NOT be cool.

Flying through a missile cloud at high speed and not being damaged at all is sort of cool, if a little fantastic. ; )

I may have to watch M+ again, but I don't remember Sharon Apple's AI voodoo working the same way as the Var Syndrome. IIRC, she was the one hacking into every system and fighting Isamu and Guld.

The one parallel I do see is that Sharon's music did pacify anyone who could potentially resist her.

[Renato]

Ace Destroid pilots?

Yeah, Hikaru was in a Spartan once

[Gubaba]

Yeah, Hikaru was in a Spartan once

I'm watching that episode right now...

[sketchley]

The first episode is much, much better on second viewing - at HD resolution (the Youtube version's down-scaling to 480p definitely hurts the viewing experience). Perhaps it was from knowing what to expect, but it was much more enjoyable, too. Nevertheless, it still feels more MF-ish than any other preceding series.

About the plot - there appears to be at least one visual nod to MII, but in both viewings I'm feeling a very strong influence from the "Macross 7th Chord" manga - more to do with the whole Var Syndrome, its effects, and how they are alleviated. The main heroins are also quite similar (though there's a Ranka vibe to her, I was reminded more of M7C).

[Guest davidwhangchoi]

I figured it out:

Mirage = Misa's personality + Rookie Hikaru's piloting skills

i think she's going to be my favorite character development.

Edited January 2, 2016 by davidwhangchoi

[Roy Focker]

RedWolf: Yes, Macross II came off as too derivative. But it's still in my opinion the sequel that has come closest in finding the feel and tone of SDF Macross and DYRL. Macross II had most of the elements that made the previous installments great, it just did a poor job with them. The main failing was yet again the mediocre character drama. Delta did not start out convincing on that front either, but we'll see in the end.

Macross II was the Force Awakens Sequel remake..

Cute sells and don't act like the original was devoid of this. Minmay's cutesy songs contributed a lot to SDF's popularity.

Saying Minmay was cute is such a weak argument. Every previous Macross series had a variety of different elements. The amount you got was in much lower does. If Macross Delta was surreal and dream like you could easily say remember that episode when Hikaru was in a coma and hallucinating. Macross has always been like a drug trip! Minmay's cuteness was never in the same the same degree or scale of cuteness. She sang or did something cute for like 20 seconds in every other episode. Delta is like 20 minutes of cutesy.

No, they're aiming the show first and foremost at young women. It's been this way for quite a while now.

Which is why it is so unusual to see some of you grown men love shows aimed at little girls. It is easy to understand why grown men might still enjoy show aimed at little boys. All grown men were once little boys. Since when were grown men once little girls?

People have very interesting concepts of what Macross has always been about. Delta, good or bad, certainly doesn't FEEL like SDF Macross. I'm not saying it has to, I'm just saying the reaction of "You don't like Macross!" when people say they don't like Delta's Sailor Moon dancing mecha bit is a little over-the-top.

Blind devotion isn't necessary for Liking Macross. I'm afraid the mentality of some fans here are the same as fans of other fandom. The mentality is this: "It has a been years since we got anything new. Good or bad we have to support it or we'll get nothing. If you don't support it like us then you're not a fan."