TRAN5FORMERS: The Last Knight

[areaseven]

Another problem that has been addressed time and time again: Why does Earth always have to be the source of the Transformers' issues? Case in point:

Transformers (2007)

The Allspark is jettisoned out of Cybertron by the Autobots to keep it out of Megatron's hands. It lands on Earth.

Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (2009)

The Elder Primes build a giant laser in Ancient Egypt to "harvest" Energon from the sun, but because they discover that Earth has life, they prevent The Fallen from activating it by hiding the Matrix of Leadership from him.

Transformers: Dark of the Moon (2011)

An Autobot ship carrying top-secret cargo leaves Cybertron and crash lands on the Moon. Cargo turns out to be components of the Space Bridge. Sentinel Prime devises a plan to enslave the human population and make them rebuild Cybertron.

Transformers: Age of Extinction (2014)

The "Creators" of the Transformers supposedly lead the dinosaurs into extinction by turning them into "transformium" for harvesting.

Furthermore, the first and fourth films contradict each other over what created the Transformers - Allspark vs. Transformium.

[JB0]

Another problem that has been addressed time and time again: Why does Earth always have to be the source of the Transformers' issues?

Because it's destiny. The fates of Earth and Cybertron are inextricably linked, and have been since 1984.

Clearly, this should've been considered before they imploded Cybertron, as it means the Earth is now doomed in no uncertain terms.

Furthermore, the first and fourth films contradict each other over what created the Transformers - Allspark vs. Transformium.

I didn't see it a a contradiction. Transformium is what their bodies are made of, but the Allspark is what imbues that shell with life, reason, and soul. Without the ability to infuse machines with a spark, transformium constructions are just that: machines.

...

Which makes the sparkless Galvatron problematic, but less so than he may at first appear.

I am going to claim he's not, strictly speaking, alive. But there's enough data recorded that Megatron's thought processes can be emulated by the lifeless machine that is Galvatron.

It's artificial intelligence.

(I still think he's highly problematic. While his sparkless sentience can be worked around and justified, it was a bad narrative decision that causes a lot of trouble with the whole premise.)

Edited May 27, 2015 by JB0

[mikeszekely]

I remember thinking at the time that DotM contradicted RotF, too. It had something to do with Megatron serving the Fallen and the Fallen's plans vs his partnership with Sentinel Prime and Sentinel Prime's plans not being compatible, but I can't remember the specifics without re-watching the movies... something I'm not really inclined to do.

[JB0]

In fairness, in Dark of the Moon, The Fallen is dead and Megatron's spirit is broken. Hell, he needs a peptalk from a squishie to even work up the gumption to try and shoot Optimus again.

The mighty Megatron, so lost that he's reduced to moping in the corner, a coward lacking the spinal motivators to act on his designs. Even STARSCREAM had more nerve than that!

It's kind of a low point for the character. I almost felt bad for the poor guy.

[Thom]

If anything needs a reboot it is this!

Go right back to the G-1 storyline, with less hoomans, more robots, a Megatron who was actually a villain to fear... But oh, all the hopeless dreams...

I'm glad to say I DID NOT WATCH the last movie. If I ever see it, I will watch it on TV and not waste anymore money than is already being paid to the cable company..

The first was okay. I think it was a good basis to improve, but sadly what I wanted and what the director (and I use this term loosely for Bay) differed. He wanted crap. He got crap. Money too apparently, but it does stink like turd whenever he counts it.

I actually have some interest in hearing that Bay might not be in the D seat. But Bring Shia and Megan back..? I'd say no. They've run the characters out, and not in a good way.

With the thirds movie, I would have gone in a different direction for them. Megan Fox was off anyway. So I would have killed her character outright! In a preview before the credits, I'd film a death scene for her, which changes Shia's character's motivation for the whole movie. A darker twist as he's now out for revenge, rather than lumping us with the super stupid super model girlfriend from out of nowhere!

Oh Hell, just change everything! But keep the voice actor for Optimus. The voice from my youth, when Transformers was good and fun and the highlight of a kids life!

If there is anything good about these movies, it's that Peter Cullen is being paid WELL!!

[areaseven]

If there is anything good about these movies, it's that Peter Cullen is being paid WELL!!

Actually, we're not sure about that. Maybe the TV shows, but the movie?

If Hugo Weaving received only US$200,000 to voice Megatron, how much did the other voices get?

Michael Bay Hits Back at Hugo Weaving Over Transformers Comments

[VF-2SS-BloodPhoenix]

I think these guys explain that best.

Go to the 5 minute mark when they talk about it.

The question I have is why was this crap even in the film in the first place? What purpose did it serve?

With Michael Bay, nothing makes sense, and there's no point in getting an answer from Bay himself. For example, in the commentary track of the DVD release of Armageddon, Ben Affleck said he asked Michael Bay what the whole point was about training oil drillers to become astronauts instead of the other way around. Bay simply told him to STFU.

Especially since they use the big complicated explanation instead of just "Dude. Age of consent is 16 here. Now suck me Lucky Charms!"

[areaseven]

Transformers 5: Robert Kirkman to write Optimus Prime's journey to outer space; Bumblebee in spin-off movie
Transformers 5 plot, cast, release date: New robots coming, will Michael Bay helm the fifth film?

[Dio]

Transformers 5 plot, cast, release date: New robots coming, will Michael Bay helm the fifth film?

That article was painful to read. "Scrounge?" Sounds like a rejected Dinobot. Unicron sending "another group of Decepticons to Earth to consume it?" I wasn't aware he had a presence in the first films. This is the consequence of blogs replacing proofread news, you get someone throwing a bunch of words out just to see what sticks.

The list of contributing staff is also a disaster - a mix of writers writers and creators from projects which are so convoluted they implode under their own pretense, with just a couple of gems that I hope are in charge for the sake of it just being understandable (Iron Man, X-Men Last Stand).

AoE left my brain feeling like jello from the action overload, and I think pretty much closed the door on the live-action franchise for me. I had hopes for it after DotM was pretty enjoyable, but for the good stories these days I stick to the comics.

[JB0]

"Scrounge?" Sounds like a rejected Dinobot.

In fairness, Scrounge isn't completely pulled out of their backside. He's one of those comic-book-only characters that never had a toy.

But at least he was an AMERICAN comic book character instead of one of those weird british ones like Impactor. And he had a special arm!

[David Hingtgen]

Scrounge is G1 Scavenger's original name, and even made it to animation.

[JB0]

Also that.

[areaseven]

Transformers 5 Spoilers: Plot Inspired by Transformers Toys and Visual Artists

Transformers Movies Could Expand to as Many as 12 Sequels, Spinoffs, Etc.

[David Hingtgen]

So tempted to rename the thread "Tran5formers".

[areaseven]

[JB0]

So tempted to rename the thread "Tran5formers".

Do it!

[areaseven]

So tempted to rename the thread "Tran5formers".

Do it!

[mickyg]

Oh. My...

Haven't laughed that much in the early morning, in, well, ever!

[sh9000]

Change the character designs.

[peter]

God's balls, WTF did I just watch?

Edited December 10, 2015 by peter

[M'Kyuun]

Change the character designs.

That is the tip of the iceberg of things to change. While I'm not a fan of the designs, I could have tolerated them better if the story and characters were decent. As such, the only positive to come out of the designs were a few years of really complex and interesting transforming toys that also indirectly informed the Animated toy designs.

Someone mentioned the weakness of Megatron's character in the last movie or two; I submit that Optimus Prime's character has become so evil and bloodthirsty , and just plain psychopathic, that Megatron is no longer necessary. Prime's sociopathy has negated the need for any further bad guys in this film franchise. Honestly, was there anyone in the last film he didn't threaten to kill? In Bay's universe, freedom is no longer the right of all sentient beings.

I often wonder how a set of films, based on a cartoon/toyline with no small amount of nostalgia, which has departed so vastly from its origins, can continue to make money. My theory is that despite how remarkably terrible and disappointing these films are, rabid fans continue, against all demonstrable odds and evidence to the contrary , to hold out hope that 'the next one will be better'. But it won't be better, and so long as those fans pay to see these reprehensible films, Bay will remain a large part of the live action franchise, even in spite of the fact that he's turned one of my greatest childhood heroes into a terrorist. The saddest thing to me is that Hasbro not only lets him continue, but endorses the bastard. I guess money means more than protecting the integrity of your brand.

That Robot Chicken vid is great, and so right on target. Such a douche.

[mickyg]

Did you say "Prehensile films"?

[Sandman]

Someone mentioned the weakness of Megatron's character in the last movie or two; I submit that Optimus Prime's character has become so evil and bloodthirsty , and just plain psychopathic, that Megatron is no longer necessary. Prime's sociopathy has negated the need for any further bad guys in this film franchise. Honestly, was there anyone in the last film he didn't threaten to kill? In Bay's universe, freedom is no longer the right of all sentient beings.

That Robot Chicken vid is great, and so right on target. Such a douche.

This completely. As much as the bay films get bashed i surprised how little this comes up. They have Optimus so out of character. In the last movie when he awakens the first thing out of his mouth is "KIll, kill kill you". Sure the last thing he probably remembers is being hunted but still it's something that Optimus would ever say. I'm surprised Cullen didn't have any objections. Didn't he refuse to voice characters in shows with too much violence. They must be paying him a lot.

[M'Kyuun]

I saw a video of Mr. Cullen at a convention (I think it was BotCon, but I'm not certain) where he mentioned a line, which he wouldn't repeat, but only said to the audience, "you know what line I mean", that he didn't agree with and argued with the filmmakers over. But in his words, the "big boys" got their way, and he said the line. I can only infer he was referring to one of the many lines where Optimus threatens to kill someone. I saw the video before I saw the movie, so I was wondering . After I saw the movie, I was a bit dumbstruck by just how extensively out of character Optimus was in the last movie, in both word and deed. I already knew Bay didn't get it, nor did he care, but Prime was still previously portrayed as a fairly good guy.

So my thinking is, Mr. Cullen had to have read the script prior to accepting the job, and presumably had the choice to back out, unless they have him tied to the films by an ironclad contract. I imagine he's getting paid well for the role, esp given the money the movies are generating. He's been a part of this franchise long enough to understand Bay's inclinations, the overall feel and direction of these films, and the questionable portrayal of his character, and other characters, in these films to make an educated judgement call. I'd say the money talks over any objectionable script content.

I guess it rubs me the wrong way that, when questioned by fans about objectionable dialog and actions, he cops to 'they made me do it', rather than just being honest and saying ' sorry, but the money's too good to turn down'.

Edited December 11, 2015 by M'Kyuun

[anime52k8]

Personally, I like 'give me your face' prime. It's amusing,and it makes the character unique.

[JB0]

Crazimus Prime is definitely distinct. I'm honestly not even bothered how out of character he is, precisely because of how out of character he is.

You get far enough away, and there ceases to be any connection to the original beyond a name, and that's where Crazimus sits.

[peter]

TF needs a reboot.

[myk]

Does anyone consider the original animated "Transformers the Movie" to be "in line" with what the "true" fans want, enjoy and support? No of course not; it was a 2 hour commercial that crapped on G1 cartoon fans that had hoped to see their favorite bots on the big screen. Instead they saw their G1 faves gunned down and actually MURDERED, a big departure from the cartoon that spawned the movie.

Why do I bring this up? The point is money is king and everything else walks. The reason why Bay-Formers is a success and will continue to be so, is because his retarded formula actually connects with people, despite what we niche "true" fans think should be on the big screen. Optimus Prime the uber-nice guy had to die in the cartoon, and he couldn't be allowed to exist in the live action movies; it just doesn't sell...

[derex3592]

As someone who grew up with GI from day one, I actually loved the original animated movie. It's dark and well written. I loved it as a kid and I still love it today.

[M'Kyuun]

Likewise. Although, I could live without Wheelie, Blurr, and Hot Rod. But that movie still has an emotional impact. Lots of good quotes, too. and ...Unicron. But I do get where Myk is coming from as far as the Movie's being a vehicle to push new toys for Hasbro, hence the jarring demise of most of the original Autobot lineup, and a few Decepticons along the way. But, obviously, there's still an allure to those original characters, as the CHUG line, and the MP line, both seem to be doing well, not to mention IDW's comics. Generations/CW stuff doesn't warm the pegs like Bay's movie toys. In my area, the Generations stuff is almost always tough to find; the CW toys hang around a little longer, but they still sell. The RID stuff seems to warm the pegs a bit too. I've only bought a few of them, just b/c the designs appealed to me. I haven't watched the show.

In the right hands with a director who cares about the property and the characters, Prime and the rest of the Autobots could be noble characters who fight out of an obligation to defend themselves and Earth from the Decepticons, and any other threats. Bay's turned the Autobots into thugs who don't even like or get along with each other, led by a psychopathic version of Prime. It's like one of those mirror Earth stories where the good guys on our planet are the villains in their world and vice versa. I hope these movies falter in popularity and earnings, and we get a good reboot. I don't think it needs to be slaved to G1, but at least keep the fundamental essence of the original show.

[JB0]

Does anyone consider the original animated "Transformers the Movie" to be "in line" with what the "true" fans want, enjoy and support?

Actually, I think it is what the "true fans" want. It's not a bad movie, though certainly not without it's flaws.

... saw their G1 faves gunned down ...

Soundwave and Blaster both lived, and Shockwave was Sir Not Appearing In This Film.

...

What? I thought Blaster was awesome.

Modern Hasbro is definitely a lot more child-savvy. My understanding is it never dawned on them while doing the original movie that kids might see these characters as "people" instead of just their toys doing silly things on the TV.

Though of course, they've killed several characters off in the kid-oriented media since then, so in a way the original movie was groundbreaking for US children's entertainment. And, well, they didn't gun down half the cast in pointless stands of futility. EVERYONE goes out like Prime nowadays.

[Sandman]

Yeah count me in the camp that though Transformers the movie was awesome. I watched the G1 cartoon from the start and the movie really upped the storytelling of the fiction. I remember being shocked at the deaths and sad to see the characters go but thought it made for compelling storytelling. It would continue to pay off in some 3rd season episodes.

[Kanedas Bike]

TF:TM was awesome.

That is all.

-b.

Oh, wait - not all. I still remember this lady dragging her kid out after Spike said "Oh Sh!t" - so funny.

[M'Kyuun]

TF:TM was awesome.

That is all.

-b.

Oh, wait - not all. I still remember this lady dragging her kid out after Spike said "Oh Sh!t" - so funny.

Such corruption! Now they say that with regularity on the Sy-Fy Channel.

Taken as a whole, they did stuff in TF:TM that was unheard of in animation at that time in America. Japanese audiences probably found it comparatively tame. I remember finding Battle of the Planets (G-Force) fascinating at an early age, probably around 6 or 7. There was a lot of mature stuff, beyond deaths, going on. It was profound to me at such a young age. And of course, Speed Racer's enemies were often dispatched violently. The only American animation with maturity that I recall fondly was Johnny Quest. It was a cool show, but I fervently wished for Bandit to die in every episode. I hated that cartoon dog.

[jenius]

I saw TF:TM and left shell-shocked... but I loved it. Definitely hunted it down later and have it in my very small collection.