Bad Max! Bad!

[Hurin]

From here:

Hurin; As for your "Exhibit A" thread, I was referring to the fact that animation errors are a common occurence. Especially in the series that we all know and love. I find it quite amusing that you chose to take it personally, and apparently readily at hand.  Also, am I not allowed to have an opinion of my own? I am entitled to like and dislike whatever I choose for whatever reasons I choose, just as you are. Additionally in your thread, I made an effort to understand the purpose behind your posting so that perhaps you would be able to make me see things your way. Instead you chose to get upset, that's too bad. What's this banning business also? When has anyone been banned for disagreeing with a mod? Even when someone is being a complete dumbass(demonstrated in other threads), that still does not warrant a banning unless they break the rules. Unfortunately there is no rule against being a dumbass, but I'm working on bribing Shawn... PM me with your thoughts.

Max Jenius,

First, that's pretty weak to post your thoughts publicly, then ask me to respond privately. Even so, I was willing to do so. . . but then I went back here to look at the old quotes and found that you had even posted more there (using the term "dickface" no less). . . and then closed that topic!?!

Here's what you said over there before closing the topic. . . real classy. Real fair.

Hrm.. there doesn't seem to be a 'cry me a river dickface' emoticon...

Dude, I wasn't singling you out. So let the good times roll. Some peepz on this forum are soooooooo sensitive!

So, let me get this straight: After I ask everyone to stop criticizing the mods in this thread so that it won't be closed, you go to the original thread, essentially call me "dickface", say that I'm too sensitive, and close the thread after it had stood open and unanswered for three months?!? Then, you go to the thread on which I had just asked everyone not to criticize you, criticize me publicly, and then tell me to respond privately? What type of jacked up s--- is that?!?

Okay, here we go. . . starting from the top:

Additionally in your thread, I made an effort to understand the purpose behind your posting so that perhaps you would be able to make me see things your way. Instead you chose to get upset, that's too bad.

Coming into a thread and saying only. . .

ANAL.  What did you hope to achieve?

. . . isn't exactly a decent way of making "an effort to understand the purpose behind your posting so that perhaps you would be able to make me see things your way."

First, you shout "ANAL". . . which isn't exactly indicative of you having an open mind about what was posted. Then you ask what is (to my mind) obviously a rhetorical question intended to demonstrate that you can't possibly conceive of this thread being the least bit interesting to you.

Personally, I think it's laughable that you are now trying to portray your terse and rude post as though it was some sort of entreaty to have a conversation. Especially since you didn't ask anything other than, essentially, "so what? Oh, and you're anal." Since when is "so what?" conducive to a conversation. You knew exactly what my point was in that thread. I thought people might find the animation error interesting. The intent to your post was obviously to assert that I and those responding were anal and morons for finding it interesting. To me, it looks like you're trying --in a very disengenuous way-- to massage things retroactively to try to make it look less like you were just being an arrogant and condescending jerk.

Yet despite your claim that you were trying to start a conversation, you didn't respond to my post at all until tonight (three months later), at which point you essentially refer to me as "dickface", tell me I'm being too sensitive, and then close that topic. Again, here it is:

Hrm.. there doesn't seem to be a 'cry me a river dickface' emoticon...

Dude, I wasn't singling you out. So let the good times roll. Some peepz on this forum are soooooooo sensitive!

Uh, "dickface?" Seriously? You consider that appropriate? Oh, but wait, then you called me "dude" and told me to let the good times roll. . . so I guess everything is cool. . . right? Uh, no.

And, which is it? Are you singling me out or not? Again, you said:

I made an effort to understand the purpose behind your posting so that perhaps you would be able to make me see things your way

So, how are you asking me anything if what you wrote wasn't "singling me out?"

There is some intellectual inconsistency there that isn't easily explained. Am I to assume that (as you stated) you were asking me what I "hoped to achieve" and attempting to engage me in a meaninful conversation. . . yet somehow the preceding "ANAL!" was not directed towards me at all? Uh. . . sure.

Further, I was the person who started the thread, and your post immediately followed my concluding comment. So, was I not to assume that it was directed at me? Do you actually expect anyone to buy that?

Dude, I'll just come right out and say it: You're the closest thing I've ever seen to a troll actually moderating a discussion board. If anyone else just popped into a thread to say: "ANAL! What did you hope to achieve?". . . everyone in that thread would be like: "Dude, F--- off. Who asked you?" But since you're a mod, we have to sit here and take it. Or, at least, we feel like we have to do so because, between your bitter, arrogant attitude and your and Roy Fokker's signature, there isn't exactly a sense that talking back to the admins is tolerated (not that I've ever seen Roy do anything wrong. But that signature can give the humorless among us pause).

Also, am I not allowed to have an opinion of my own? I am entitled to like and dislike whatever I choose for whatever reasons I choose, just as you are.

Of course you are. But as a board moderator, you also have a responsibility to not blatantly antogonize your users. Let me be very clear: You were not involved in this thread. You did not post anything while it was active. Rather, you passed by after it had ran its course, and then came in to pronounce your arrogant judgement on its content and those who had partaken in it. You didn't offer anything to the conversation, nor did you ask any real question. Despite your (quite unconvincing and over-late) claims to the contrary, you just wanted to pontificate on the asininity of those in this thread for engaging in a conversation that you did not personally find interesting.

As a moderator, you have every right (and the obligation) to moderate the boards. But that doesn't entail adding your tag-line commentary to the end of every thread. Tell me, can I just drop by every thread I've seen and drop lines such as: "Moronic! I can't believe you all wasted your time!" or "Boring! What is the point here?!?" How long do you think it would take before I was labeled a troll and told to go to hell?

Of course you have a right to an opinion and being a moderator in no way negates that. Yet, being a moderator doesn't give you the right to be a condescending jerk. In fact, as a former moderator of several discussion boards myself, I always thought the exact opposite. I always felt my role as moderator/admin obligated me to be more polite, more fair, and more accomodating to everyone. . . especially to those with whom I disagreed. Indeed, I always went out of my way to make sure that I never even appeared to be having a power-trip or to be abusing my position. I didn't treat the users of the forum as though they were annoyances merely to be tolerated. I didn't treat them like they were intruding on a private club where anything that displeased me would be ridiculed (or deleted/closed). Nor did I butt my beak into threads to comment unless I actually had something substantive to say. And even then, I was always careful to not ruffle any feathers.

Essentially, you need to ask yourself this: Would you really come into threads and make snide, trolling comments like that if you weren't a moderator? If so, well, you lack basic civility. If not, then you've let your moderating powers go to your head. . . and you lack basic civility.

Truth be told, when I first saw your "ANAL!" post, I just couldn't believe anyone other than a troll would write that. I didn't at first notice that you were a moderator. Then I went back and looked at many of your other posts and got a feel for just the sort of posts you like to make. It was quite enlightening.

The more I think about it, and the more I look at your posts, the more I realize that I don't really even have a problem --for the most part-- with how you carry out your moderating duties. It's what you say when you're not actively using your moderating powers that are often the most arrogant, annoying, and offensive. So really, the problem isn't that you are a jerk when you are being a moderator. . . the problem is that --speaking as a forum admin-- it is generally not a good idea to enlist jerks and/or trolls as your moderators. So you see, I don't have a problem with you being a moderator. I just have a problem with you acting like a jerk. The fact that you are a moderator just makes it all the more galling.

I don't expect to win this fight. Nor do I expect you to actually reflect upon anything I've said here. I fully expect you to dismiss me as yet another "whining, annoying" user who just doesn't understand what a thankless job you do.

Though I doubt it will ever come to pass, I hope that (if this thread is allowed to stay), it will serve as a reminder to some who might already have noticed a pattern to your arrogant and borderline-abusive posts. And unlikely as it may seem, maybe someday someone in a position of authority on these boards will take you aside and tell you that perhaps it's time to let someone less embittered and more respectful of the community members as a whole take over moderating duties.

Cuz man. . . you may think that you're the brave, firm hand of authority standing athwart these boards and holding back the tides of chaos. But really, to me, you just seem to really think you're cooler, smarter, and better than just about everybody else here.

PM me with your thoughts.

Hurin

P.S. You said above that you do not ban people for disagreeing with mods or even being a-holes. Please prove it and let this thread (and me!) stay.

[DestroidsRage]

Lets all get along

-BEN-MAN-

Edited December 24, 2003 by DestroidsRage

[Nightbat]

Since when is MW a democracy?

Impeachement of a mod? w/hell I vote "Nay" anyway

"Mods: it's a dirty job but someone's got to do it"

Picking a fight with a mod is useless, they have carte blanche from the admins and it says nowhere in the jobdescription to be curtious

I remember this signature well "...and yes we are out to get you"

edit in:

Max Jenius,

First, that's pretty weak to post your thoughts publicly, then ask me to respond privately.

Seems like you were the first to post your thoughts publicly by pointing out "Look what Bad Max did in my thread here"

trying to make him look like a jerk

Just because Max is less sympathetic on his comments in threads doesn't make him a bad Mod

I guess you just keep ignoring him like you suggested in your post

Edited December 23, 2003 by Nightbat®

[robokochan]

Man this is a difficult subject. While I do feel as though the Mods should use alittle more "politeness" in dealing with certain situations....this is a difficult job for them. Reading through all of the posts to make sure everything is okay would be difficult for anyone. But they are Mods for a reason. I really don't think that Shawn just picked random people and said "By the power vested in me....you are a MOD." They had to earn it.

As for calling someone a "dickhe@d" that should be considered something that is not cool...whether it is a Mod or a regular user. Everyone is right by saying "They don't get paid to do this job." But as with any job if it gets to the point where you no longer enjoy it or the stress of it is too much...then maybe it is time to change jobs...or retire. It's what I have done on a few occaisions.

The only ones who really have the right to judge what should be done on this matter is Shawn, Graham and the other Mods.

Not that it matters much but just my 2 cents.

Rob MN

[Effect]

I agree that modding is a difficult job, I'm a mod myself on another forum so I know the type of work that a team can put in to keep things from getting out of hand but doesn't mean that one should go overboard in how they act. Like any position of power one shouldn't let things get personal. Its one thing to post your opinions on a topic, we all do it. Its another to use your postion to simply close down topics you personaly don't like or do other things just because you can all the while trying to correct others. After all they are still a member of the forum themselves and should not be above the rules. They set the examples members follow. Granted some more room might be given but even then you have to ask, if this person wasn't a mod and just a normal member how would they be handled? I've seen tons of mods removed from the modding position on other forums due to how they have conducted themselves. After all what they do reflects the site. As with any job, payed or a volunteer position people skills are needed. If it was a person just complaining much stock wouldn't be taken into this but several examples have been given. I'm sure many other people have seen Max act the same with others over the time he has been made a mod. Some have either moved on or just let things die not feeling it worthwhile to proceed in complaining about it. Others don't feel they should just let things drop. Closing a topic with a nasty comment or saying something in public and then telling that person to respond in a PM is wrong and appears to be an abuse of power to a degree.

Just posting my thoughts on the subject.

Edited December 23, 2003 by Effect

[tom64ss]

From here......:

Max Jenius............

Come on Hurin, aren't you doing exactly what Max said you'd do?

You're being overly sensitive and "crying him a river".

(Whoa, that's a big river. )

After reading everything you and he wrote, my two cents is he was just busting your chops and this is blowing it way out of purportion.

Max is a sarcastic wiseass, he's like that with everyone. If you just think that to yourself between the time you read what he writes and when you actually think about it, you'd probably take it less personally and understand his sense of humor a little better.

edit: editted out most of the quote. too long.

Edited December 23, 2003 by tom64ss

[Blaine23]

Folks, this all boils down to a fundamental difference in sense of humor between two parties.

I understand the nature of your complaints... but I personally am disgusted by easily you all ignore the actual work that goes into modding this board and the great job these guys do. Instead you all seem to think that mods should have a similar NICE personality. Which is silly, because these guys are people.

They're people who care enough about this site to give up their time monitoring the board and putting out stupid fires, trolls, etc. And 99.9% of the time, they do it without most of us knowing it.

But that doesn't matter, does it? The only thing that matters is people who dislike the guy's personality and a few remarks.

The fact is this - some of you folks and Max might not get along if you were both members. His sense of humor (which I and many others here find refreshing and witty) would rub you the wrong way. You guys might clash occasionally. Which is nothing new... happens to members all the time.

But because he's a mod and you're not, you feel as though he's got to act like you want him to? Because of obligation to his mod job? It's as if him having the power to close threads and what not bothers you. If he was just another member, you guys would agree to disagree or (hopefully) ignore one another. But instead we get threads with "Exhibit A", etc.

Why does this bother you so much? Are you that sensitive that some mod on a anime board can upset you this badly?

I think this is a silly waste of time on your point. You wish the guy was nicer to you? Okay. I, personally, don't care. It doesn't bother me that a mod can be smart-alecky. I think it makes this place more fun. And more importantly, I appreciate how much crap these mods have to deal with.

At the very least I think you guys should recognize that not everybody (even Mods) are going to be your bestest friends ever. Accept it, move on, and continue enjoying Macross, isn't that why we're here?

[Dangard Ace]

At the very least I think you guys should recognize that not everybody (even Mods) are going to be your bestest friends ever. Accept it, move on, and continue enjoying Macross, isn't that why we're here?

I'm here for the PRON. Aw crap there isn't any? I outtie.

[EXO]

I'm here for the PRON. Aw crap there isn't any? I outtie.

Alls you gotta do is ask! Awww. crap... my scanner doesn't work. Oh well I'm just gonna have to throw away my Minmay Hentai fanart!

You want pr0n, go to a steroids forum... right Agent One???

[Anubis]

I'm here for the PRON.  Aw crap there isn't any?  I outtie. 

Alls you gotta do is ask! Awww. crap... my scanner doesn't work. Oh well I'm just gonna have to throw away my Minmay Hentai fanart!

Don't you dare throw that away! If you don't want it I'll take it!

Seriously though. On topic, I don't think I've had any real problems with any mods. Sometimes one of them may be a little coarse, but really, I would be too on occasion. There have been a lot of OT threads lately, and I think they have been a little generous leaving some of them open. Some of them get a little out of hand. Add in the recent batch of Trolls, which were fed continually leading to 5 page arguments, and I would be annoyed too. The Secret Elves thread started innocent enough, then really has started to push it a little. Like Max and Roy said, if it weren't for x-mas the thread would have been closed loooong ago. I'm curious how it all turns out of course, and who's behind it all. They spend a lot of time here making sure things go somewhat smoothly, so I say give them a break. They haven't been directly targeting anyone.

Edited December 23, 2003 by Anubis

[Blaine23]

At the very least I think you guys should recognize that not everybody (even Mods) are going to be your bestest friends ever.  Accept it, move on, and continue enjoying Macross, isn't that why we're here?

I'm here for the PRON. Aw crap there isn't any? I outtie.

I said Max was the witty mod!

You're still the NEW guy... now go and act like I tell you to!

Edited December 23, 2003 by Blaine23

[Dangard Ace]

I said Max was the witty mod!

You're still the NEW guy... now go and act like I tell you to!

Nope. There be one other mod who got activated after me.

Besides, you ain't cute, and you ain't female therefore you can't tell me what to do!! (Unless you've got pr0n.....)

[Agent ONE]

I'm here for the PRON.  Aw crap there isn't any?  I outtie. 

Alls you gotta do is ask! Awww. crap... my scanner doesn't work. Oh well I'm just gonna have to throw away my Minmay Hentai fanart!

You want pr0n, go to a steroids forum... right Agent One???

Thats right!

Musclechick porn that is.

[Agent ONE]

Wow, that first post required a lot of reading... So you think Max is a jerk...

Well he isn't running for office, he is storm trooper in the service of Shawn. He does however have opinions.

I really don't see your gripe, he uses some harsh words, but that is just the way he is. He says crap like that to everyone. I do however think he may want to turn the carcasm down a little after seeing this thread, as his intention isn't to piss everyone off, but still keep in mind he doesn't care about popularity and he doesn't care if you don't like his atitude.

[wwwmwww]

but still keep in mind he doesn't care about popularity and he doesn't care if you don't like his atitude.

The same is true of most trolls. I don't know Max or Hurin but I do see why Hurin is upset. I've been here at MacrossWorld since just about day one and I suspect most of you know me. I can believe Max might tend to push things too far and that those that know him are use to it and accect it or maybe even enjoy it as they say it spices things up. But... I don't think a moderator should use that tone when he acts in that capacity. I don't believe it reflect well on the comunity. Maybe I could call Max ANAL for obsessing on a 20 year old cartoon and get away with it as he should know what a hypocrite that would make me but I don't consider it wise. I read Hurin's "exibit A" and the only reason I saw that it should have been closed was that it DID take a wrong turn BUT it was Max's post that CAUSED things to go down hill. It strikes me almost as a news anchor making the news instead of reporting it. If that's Max's personality and some of you like it I'm fine with it as long as he keeps it to his posts but I believe it has NO place in his moderating duties. This is a place for fans of Macross and I believe Shawn wants all his fellow fans to know they can come here and be treated with respect. He's never shown me anything less. Sure Hurin stood up and fought back but how many others wouldn't have and just decided MacrossWorld wasn't the kind of place they wanted to be. I'm very hard pressed to find it justifiable for anyone here to call someone else ANAL for posting a valid Macross observation. Sure maybe those that know him see the hypocrisy and laugh but his place as moderator is NOT to scare off fellow fans that may not be use to his "sense of humor". I'd like to believe that Max's intent wasn't to piss off and that this is just as case of heavy handed sarcasm and if that's the case I too would like to ask him to please turn it down atleast when acting in the capacity as moderator.

There this dickface has said his anal 2 cents... now play nice...

Carl

[DestroidsRage]

I still think we should all get along, I do, I do.

-BEN-MAN-

Edited December 24, 2003 by DestroidsRage

[Agent ONE]

LOL!!! This is freaking hilarious to me !!! I cant believe a number of you support Max so much!

" Max is a sweet cuddly bunny, its just that job stress gets to him! He's just like any one of us, he deserves to have his own oppinions and be a witty smartass!"

WOO! Max and all of you Mas Jenius Moderator supporters are ugly dickheads because of your oppinions! You all should go stuff your faces in the toilet and lick at the toilet scum because I do NOT agree with your posts.

What'cha gonna do? Cry me a river? Edit my post? Cant handle a little DISAGREEMENT? Cant handle my edgy witty humor?? Go drink my condensed smelly burger king crap GAS then.

Hell damn I love being funny and WITTY and expressing my oppinions.

Lets ALL be funny and WITTY and lets ALL be shitheads to eachother! Im liking this idea! Its just expressing our oppinions afterall!

-BEN-MAN-

Listen you little girly man! You are just crying because Max banned you once, and I'll have you know he then decided to give you a second chance when the new board was implemented... He obviously made a mistake.

If I were you I would shut your little girly mouth before Max posts the PM you sent him when he banned you, then we would all see who the shithead really is.

[Hurin]

Okay okay okay. If so many of you think it's just a sense of humor. . . I guess I'll have to take you all at your word. But for the life of me, I don't see the humor in Max's "ANAL!" post. If someone could explain the humor there, I'd love to hear it. But, as they say, if it has to be explained, maybe it isn't in very good humor.

I mean, just yesterday we have a thread where a lot had already been said by what seemed just about everyone, regarding who was leaving Secret Elf stuff on Mechamechanic's door. A good time seemed to be being had by all. . . so of course, Max drops in. . . not to close the topic, not to say anything really, except:

Does it matter who it is?

And that's. . . it.

Now, does anyone really think that he is actually asking why it matters? In the same way that he was really asking me what I "hoped to achieve?"

Or rather, was he (not so) subtley saying that he considered this topic inconsequential and beneath him, and that everyone who was interested in it was stupid as well. . .

My guess would be the latter, especially based upon prior behavior.

Again, anyone want to point out the humor?

Picking a fight with a mod is useless, they have carte blanche from the admins and it says nowhere in the jobdescription to be curtious

I don't feel like I've picked a fight with him. Rather, three months ago, he went out of his way to pick a fight with me. . . and only made it worse yesterday by his posts on the matter. So, I responded, just as I would with any MWer. Except of course, this one happens to be a Mod.

And, no. Being courteous may not be in the job description. But, shouldn't it be expected of all members unless reason is given to not be courteous? Especially for Mods?

The fact is this - some of you folks and Max might not get along if you were both members. His sense of humor (which I and many others here find refreshing and witty) would rub you the wrong way. You guys might clash occasionally. Which is nothing new... happens to members all the time.

Yeah, and I'd go after any other MWer who acted like this (especially when they directed it towards me) just as I'm doing now. It's only a big deal because I posted it in the feedback forum. . . because he gave me no other choice (by closing one topic and by the mods threatening to close the other one if Max or the Mods were discussed further).

For the record, I did not intend this post to become an "impeach Max" thread. I used no such language and was not attempting to put this to a "vote." I simply wanted to put down a record of the behavior in the hopes that someone consequential might notice and perhaps also notice a pattern developing. . . and then Destroids Rage took things a step further. Though, to be honest, I definitely would not be disappointed if Max was given a "time out" until he learned some basics rules of civility. I admit that I haven't always been a perfect angel in the forums and have engaged in some heated debates. But at least when I get my ire up, there is at least some evidence that I was provoked. I don't just waltz into threads and try to make everyone partaking in it feel like a moron with brief, dismissive, non-constructive posts.

While I don't intend this to become a "Impeach Max" debate, I will say this: I think it does harm to the atmosphere of a community when someone in power is considered to be an "arrogant jerk" by a signifigant portion of its members not because of how he handles his duties, but simply for how he behaves in general.

But because he's a mod and you're not, you feel as though he's got to act like you want him to? Because of obligation to his mod job? It's as if him having the power to close threads and what not bothers you. If he was just another member, you guys would agree to disagree or (hopefully) ignore one another. But instead we get threads with "Exhibit A", etc.

Uh, I've been known to point out (via links) prior posts by others to try to indicate that there is a pattern of behavior. Skull-1 in the toys forum comes to mind. He was not a mod. How is this different? This is only different because Max happens to be a mod, and has (seemingly) intentionally pissed me off. . . and I'm forced to bring my beef with him here because he closed the first topic and other mods threatened to close the "Secret Elf" thread. I don't "expect" him to behave the way I want. I'm just pointing out that he can be a real jerk. And, as I said, the fact that he is a mod only makes it more annoying.

As for this whole being ungrateful thing. . . we all owe Shawn, Graham, and the Mods a debt of gratitude for their efforts and outlays of time and even money (for some) in order that they can provide us with such a great community. I love Macross World (well, most aspects of it) and will always be grateful to those who make it possible.

But, I fail to see how all this hard work equates to me needing to overlook another member (who happens to be a Mod) acting like a jerk even when he's not acting as a moderator. You can't have it both ways: People can't say that I am only pissed off because he's a Mod and that if he was just a normal user, we'd just disagree and it'd be done. . . and then say that it's unfair or somehow unseemly to hash things out over here with him (after being forced over here by mod activity) because he works so very hard, and I'm therefore ungrateful. I'm treating him just like everybody else. . . and asking him why he thinks it's appropriate to drop in and drop little "F-- You, Losers" bombs as he does.

Look, they all work very hard. But in working very hard, sometimes a "bunker mentality" takes place. I've seen this as a moderator/admin, and I've seen it in my former profession as a phone tech support rep. Gradually, all the users become annoyances to be tolerated. . . because all they do is whine. . . hence, we get a post like this in response to someone just politely asking for a bit more info when a topic is closed without an obvious reason:

Or people could shut up with the bitching and move on with their "lives."

Hmmm, nice. And please note the intentional quotation marks around lives. . . nice subtle way of calling everyone who disagrees "losers". . . without quite saying so. But, of course, I'll just be accused of reading into it too much and not getting his "sense of humor."

Now, in Max's defense, later in that thread, he did actually come back, explain himself further, and engage in a very polite and interesting discussion of Mod duties. In fact, it was one of those rare times where I thought: "Wow, this guy can actually be kind of cool." All the Simpsons quotes also help.

Anyways, as I've said, I'm not trying to get an impeachment vote going here. . . I'm just bringing my beef with Max here because I was left with no other venue, and I wasn't about to just start PMing him after he started publicly criticizing me, and then began locking threads after doing so. I wouldn't let his snide-ass comments slide if he were just a regular MWer (and I doubt any of you would either). So why should I be expected to let them slide now?

If this truly can be handled as just an argument between two MWers, I'm sure it'll probably come down to this: Some will just say I'm a whiney loser. And some will say that Max can be an arrogant jerk and that he does deserve to be called out as one. . . even if many are too timid to do so given his position. At that point, maybe we'll reach the point of agreeing to disagree as most normal MW disagreements turn out. All I know is that I've said my piece, and since I'm leaving town tomorrow for the holidays, I most likely won't be saying any more.

Hurin

Milhouse: Yes, we have order! But at what price!?!

[the white drew carey]

I'll have to agree that Max can be an ass sometimes but this situation isn't one of them.

Many people here seem to think that the only purpose of the Mods is to moderate, which is completely wrong. First and foremost, they are Macross fans who have proven their worth to the Admins and have volunteered their time in order to try to make MW run smoother.

If you don't like the job that Max is doing, prove your value and try to convince the Admins and other Mods that you yourself are Mod material. Don't start fights with the Mod who mod'd you.

I know I disagree with many of Max's moderating decisions and think that there are a lot of times where he locks threads more on personal whim than any sense of rules or guidelines, but overall he is just doing what he thinks is best for MW. And that's something I can always get behind.

Edited December 23, 2003 by the white drew carey

[bsu legato]

Disappointing. I clicked on this topic believing it was a rant about Beyond Thunderdome.

[Hurin]

Don't start fights with the Mod who mod'd you.

Again: My primary beef isn't with the fact that he closed that thread or "mod'd" me (three months after the fact). . . Rather, my beef is just with him being an ass. Mod or not.

But, because he can be such an ass, and is in a position of authority on these boards, it is yet more annoying. And, left unchecked, this sort of behavior by someone in a position of authority can poison the atmopshere of the forums.

Heck, at this point, I don't even consider myself to have been "mod'd". . . I just consider myself to have been pissed off by an arrogant jerk who happens to be a Mod.

I just hope that someone whom he respects might just have a talk with him. . . no need for all this impeachment stuff.

H

Edited December 23, 2003 by Hurin

[Roy Focker]

(Note by the time I get this message posted I'm sure 50 others have already made a post here.)

First off:

Destroid Rage,

We all decided to ban you (for life btw) on the old forums. The only reason why your still here is because most people have been good and we're all in a good mood. I would be keeping a low profile if I were you. If the mood of everyone changes here then it's really smart for you to reminds us all that your still here.

Now for the rest of this:

I remember the good old days when I was only mod that everyone hated. It makes me sad that no longer that popular.

Mod leaving slightly to very rude comments before closing threads:

I'm guilty as well. I'm sure we all are. Typing things like, "Duh we already have 5 topics like this going already. Are we retarded or something?" is easy too do, when you have the time and you know others are thinking the same thing. Some mods don't have the time to post witty/smart ass lines like that all the time. When a liked mod does it they are witty. When an unliked one does it they are a jerk. There is often little difference in the tone (or sometimes the intent) of the comments but they can be perceived differently depending on who gives them.

As for Roy Fokker's signature,

That is bit of mod humor that some of older members get. As the original most hated mod I too was known for getting alot of complaints. I thought it would be funny to change the lyrics of a Basara song. The sig is making fun of the image that I had. It's (like everyone else sigs) are not to be taken literately.

Btw the way who is this Fokker guy?

I was a former Moderator over there and we never:

That has been used by others. 'There' and 'here' are two different places. The only people who really can use that agrument properly are former MW Mods. I believe their are 2 to 3 of them.

and I'm forced to bring my beef with him here because he closed the first topic and other mods threatened to close the "Secret Elf" thread.

Well the "Secret Elf' topic wouldn't be the place for it now would it. This thread is better place but I can think of other places that could beat it. Like Max's PM box, another Mods PM box or maybe even god's (Shawn's) PM box. Starting a topic like this in public is just trying to build public support and it may have been better if Max saved his last comment towards you in the "Elf topic" for your PM box. Sending complaints directly to Shawn would seem like people really have a complaint using the forums instead often seems petty. Even if that isn't your attention it is going to draw supporters for you or him that is going to make it look that way.

[Lightning]

this brings my rant from the other thread in the feedback forum to mind...."Cant we all just get along anymore???"

[Nightbat]

I don't feel like I've picked a fight with him. Rather, three months ago, he went out of his way to pick a fight with me. . . and only made it worse yesterday by his posts on the matter. So, I responded, just as I would with any MWer. Except of course, this one happens to be a Mod.

My comment was directed more towards DR, who to my opinion seems to have been waiting for a chance to get back at Max for some reason and hopes to have found an ally

and actually if you found yourself offended, the correct course of action was to PM Max or maybe another mod, not use the boards for your dialog

and immediatly not after 3 months

Your thead was closed after you brought it up in Mechamaniac's Christmas thread, so actually it's your own damned fault

Max probably never even read your reply to his statement untill that

so actually you may have been the one to bring up a 3-month old post

So you think Max is an ass? then you probably haven't met me in real life

same can be said for Duke Togo, Agent One, Vinnie, Destroids Rage and Me

As I stated "can be said" - it's all in your personal POV, if you happen to take offence of some of the postings, Yeah, you're right

Just because Max is a Mod it's a problem?

Heh, I'd probably act the same way, maybe even more "Zero Tolerance - and here's a kick in the butt to remember it"

then it would probably be my name up here in Neon

Edit: Roy beat me to it

Edited December 23, 2003 by Nightbat®

[Vostok 7]

Oh boy, not this crap again.

<_<

Vostok 7

[Hurin]

Your thead was closed after you brought it up in Mechamaniac's Christmas thread, so actually it's your own damned fault

Okay. . . one more time. I don't care at all that the thread was closed. The only effect that had was that I took things over here (after deciding not to PM Max considering he didn't extend the same courtesy to me, twice. . . while referring to me as "dickhead"). The only thing that bothers me about the thread being closed was that Max was so crass as to go back, post his crap three months later, then close the thread. But that thread was never near and dear to my heart. I couldn't care less that it's closed.

and actually if you found yourself offended, the correct course of action was to PM Max or maybe another mod, not use the boards for your dialog

and immediatly not after 3 months

I used the "report this thread" feature immediately, three months ago. I received not one response from anybody.

Max probably never even read your reply to his statement untill that

And yet, Max claims that. . .

ANAL.  What did you hope to achieve?

. . . was intended to begin a conversation. Odd that he never looked for a response!

And, that's also what bothers me about this. Max is actually claiming that this was his attempt to "understand the purpose behind your posting so that perhaps you would be able to make me see things your way." He actually expects me (and you, since he posted this in public) to believe that this was a valid attempt at engaging me in conversation. Does anyone really believe that? Is nobody bothered by such a disingenous attempt at re-writing what happened and turn it around on the person to whom he directed the invective?: "Instead you chose to get upset, that's too bad." Puh-leaze.

How about writing: "Am I missing something? These animation errors are commonplace. Is there something special about this one?"

But, I'm going to say this one last time: I don't care that he closed that topic last night. That topic was dead. I never said that closing the topic was a major issue. I just pointed out the classless and crass way in which it was done. I think it's funny how everyone is getting tunnel-vision on the closing of that thread.

H

[DestroidsRage]

Dude, lets just all get along.

-BEN-MAN-

Edited December 24, 2003 by DestroidsRage

[Hurin]

Starting a topic like this in public is just trying to build public support and it may have been better if Max saved his last comment towards you in the "Elf topic" for your PM box.

Point taken about the PM box. Though, I hope you can appreciate my desire to continue this in public since Max had done so to such an extent, and then asked me (the "dickhead") to send him my thoughts via PM only after thoroughly expressing his views publicly in both relevant threads. Again, I was going to PM him, until I saw his post in the thread that he closed. That just seemed utterly classless to me (the comment, not so much the closing).

Question: What exactly happens when you use the "Report this post" feature. To whom does that go?

H

[Vostok 7]

Vostok 7

[Hurin]

Mod leaving slightly to very rude comments before closing threads:

I'm guilty as well.  I'm sure we all are.  Typing things like, "Duh we already have 5 topics like this going already.  Are we retarded or something?"

I want to be very clear here: Max Jenius did not close the thread when he came by to pronounce the thread lame (and "ANAL!"). Rather, he just came by, made his pronouncement, and then left the thread open.

He was not carrying out any moderating duties. He was not behaving as a Mod. Rather, he was behaving as an ass and a troll.

He only closed the thread last night (three months later) after making yet another comment (". . .Dickhead. . ."). But I care much less about that.

Now, of course, he's dissembling things so that somehow we're supposed to interpret this as some attempt at conversation.

Utterly lame. But then again, I'm sure many think all of this is.

H

Edited December 23, 2003 by Hurin

[Dangard Ace]

Question:  What exactly happens when you use the "Report this post" feature.  To whom does that go?

H

Until recently, none of the mod team got those messages. Now that we have our full powers back again we get those messages. In other words we never receive your Report this post report from three months ago.

[Agent ONE]

Mod leaving slightly to very rude comments before closing threads:

I'm guilty as well.  I'm sure we all are.  Typing things like, "Duh we already have 5 topics like this going already.  Are we retarded or something?"

I want to be very clear here: Max Jenius did not close the thread when he came by to pronounce the thread lame (and "ANAL!"). Rather, he just came by, made his pronouncement, and then left the thread open.

He was not carrying out any moderating duties. He was not behaving as a Mod. Rather, he was behaving as an ass and a troll.

Sounds like he was just acting like a smartass member, which he is... Get over it.

[ewilen]

I wouldn't want to be a Mod, so as I see it that limits my rights to complain about the Mods. Not that I would complain much anyway. But I do hope that the mods would come away from this incident with an appreciation of the effect that "Moderator" title under their name has on how people react to them. Yes, it is intimidating, and it can be infuriating if you find yourself in an argument with a mod which turns into a battle of egos or a flamewar, since you feel like you're treading on thin ice while the mod can do whatever he wants. It doesn't help when the mod has intimidating slogans in his sig or elsewhere. (Not that I view sigs anymore, personally.)

I think a simple acknowledgment that the Mods understand this effect (whether they want to do anything about it is another thing) would go a long way to putting this argument to sleep and allowing all sides to retire and reflect.

[dna]

Question:  What exactly happens when you use the "Report this post" feature.  To whom does that go?

H

Until recently, none of the mod team got those messages. Now that we have our full powers back again we get those messages. In other words we never receive your Report this post report from three months ago.

You're kidding, right?

[JsARCLIGHT]

I've been on tons of different moderated message boards in my internet life and "a-hole" mods are just one of the commonly "encountered" things. We all have bad days, we all have quirky senses of humor that other people just don't "get" and we all have snapped someone's head off for something. It's the internet... It's not going to get any nicer. I myself would rather read people's honest responses to me than a bunch of sheltered, two-faced politically correct responses. Until someone invents the Compu-Mod 9000 that will police topics and respond in a pleasant phone company computer voice to all issues and problems we are saddled with human beings at the controls...

My advice: Grow a thicker skin and just ignore all the posts you see as "hostile"... mods and members alike make the odd comment from time to time that is guarateed to not sit right with everyone. If the mods somehow had the ability to please everyone all of the time then they would leave this message board and enter politics.

Now just imagine Moderator Max behind the podium of a presidential debate calling the other cannidate a dickhead.

I'd vote for him.