Anime Dubs

[Omegablue]

Can't help but wonder what kind of ass-backwards bootleg you've watched if you saw a paragraph of text on screen, but the logic in watching something subtitled over dubbed is simple.

-It's got the oriignal language that the property was made in.

-It's got the original direction of the actor's playing the characters, i.e. the characters are portrayed in the way that the creator's intend them to be.

-It's got the original dialogue, i.e. no "smart" rewrites by amature writers that are rampant in dubs, and no "localization" replacing something that was originally there with something more familiar (note, this does happen from time to time in subtitle scripts too, but the original dialogue is still present when that happens).

-We live in a world with many different languages, get used to it!

-You actually pick up important nuances about languages when you expose yourself to them.

-You'd be surprised abotu how much you start to pick up from just listening to the language with the subtitles, after a while you get to a point where you can spot "bad" subtitle translatesions when you come across them, but still understand what's actually being said.

But for me, and most importantly, if you're watching something dubbed into another language, you're not actually watching what was made, just someone elses version of it.

Pretty much doubt you can spot the errors in the subs by hearing a language you don't understand. Especially when it's complex language like Japanese.

Oh, I'm use to the many langauges, but don't have the time to learn more than the three I already know. I live in a world of modern technology, and that includes dubbing translation.

Oh well, each to his own I guess.

BTW, for your last point, then I guess we shouldn't read books originally written in another langauge. Cause it is someone else's literary version... which is much the same with the subbing.

It's been proven that verbal translations loose alot of expression from the original langauge.

[Keith]

Pretty much doubt you can spot the errors in the subs by hearing a language you don't understand. Especially when it's complex language like Japanese.

Initially no, but the more you watch, the more you pick up.

Oh, I'm use to the many langauges, but don't have the time to learn more than the three I already know. I live in a world of modern technology, and that includes dubbing translation.

No one says you actually "have" to actively learn the language, that is what the subtitles are for.

Oh well, each to his own I guess.

BTW, for your last point, then I guess we shouldn't read books originally written in another langauge. Cause it is someone else's literary version... which is much the same with the subbing.

It's been proven that verbal translations loose alot of expression from the original langauge.

Your analogy is pretty flawed. It'd be more akin to saying you should read a translation of a book, rather than listening to a re-written & localized book on tape version of the book.]

[Dynaman]

Omegablue, you have to understand, for Keith there is no such thing as a good dub, even when there is.

[Omegablue]

Initially no, but the more you watch, the more you pick up.

Very much doubt that. Looked into a Japanese basic course, and considering all the diffirent pronunciations for a single word, it's highly unlikely. Maybe one word liners, like "Nani."

A friend of mine use to believe he could understand Japanese from years of watching subbed anime. Years later into his Japanese course he admitted it was all fanboy wishful thinking.

No one says you actually "have" to actively learn the language, that is what the subtitles are for.

Again, what is the point of watching something subbed where the meaning of the words lose expression in written translation?

Your analogy is pretty flawed. It'd be more akin to saying you should read a translation of a book, rather than listening to a re-written & localized book on tape version of the book.]

No it's not. It's pretty much pointing out how your point regarding original work translated by someone else, loses it's intended feel. And with such a statement, it is also applicable with all other media forms.

Omegablue, you have to understand, for Keith there is no such thing as a good dub, even when there is.

I know. And in the 9 years on this forum, I've got nothing against him.

It's a topic that I also poke my hardcore subbing friends with.

I was brought up in a Italian home, then had to learn Dutch, but when English became my first language, I since find it difficult to watch anything that is not English spoken. (Eventhough I'm fluent in Italian and not too be bad in Dutch, read and write as well.)

My view is that if you enjoy watching Anime subbed, that greats. It's freedom to enjoy whatever you prefer and I encourage it. But to say you prefer subbed over most dubbings, cause the English translation is weak, and you're comparing it to a langauge you don't can't speak with, is just pretty biased devotion towards the original creators. And I feel these people are actually missing out on a lot of great dubbs, which would allow them to enjoy the full visual content without concertrating at the bottom of the screen.

With that said, the Millinium Trilogy is probably the only subbed series I enjoyed. And instead of an American remake by Sony, I would have re-watched a dubbed version of the original. But that's just me.

Peace.

Edited February 16, 2012 by Omegablue

[Keith]

If your point is hinging on claiming the original language + text translation is somehow less original content & meaning than a complete re-dub/localization, then you're point defeated itsef before you made it. Aside from that, I never claimed watching subtitled anime will make you fluent in Japanese, it will however give you a familiarity with the language & context that dubs won't.

[Omegablue]

We're going in circles and always will on this topic. It's all good, Kieth.

Returning to topic, probably the worst dubbing... erh, or should I say worst voice over, was that of of Darth Vader and Boba Fett in the re-re-released special edition of Empire Strikes Back .

Edited February 17, 2012 by Omegablue

[CoryHolmes]

I think I prefer the show in whatever language I see it in first. I saw Robotech first, so to watch any of its 3 parts in the original Japanese is quite jarring. As a counter-point, I saw GITS SAC in the original language in subtitles and I find the English dub to be annoying, regardless of the quality.

[pfunk]

I am not sure

I think I prefer the show in whatever language I see it in first. I saw Robotech first, so to watch any of its 3 parts in the original Japanese is quite jarring. As a counter-point, I saw GITS SAC in the original language in subtitles and I find the English dub to be annoying, regardless of the quality.

Dude, I watched Clash of the Bionoids in english,, and then watch DYRL subbed,, sorry man the first was a train wreck,, I thought Robotech wasn't that bad honestly except the Minmay whining was a bit excessive

[Keith]

I think I prefer the show in whatever language I see it in first. I saw Robotech first, so to watch any of its 3 parts in the original Japanese is quite jarring. As a counter-point, I saw GITS SAC in the original language in subtitles and I find the English dub to be annoying, regardless of the quality.

So you prefer Reba West's drunken warbling? Ok....

[johnkillingsworth]

I just watched Macross II dubbed last night after reading this thread and it's baaaaaaaad. The dub was awful too.

The dub vs. sub topic is a neverending debate. I think it depends on each individual's viewing preference and how they consume anime. Often I'll put on a show while working on something else and have it playing within sight, but in the background. I prefer dubs because I don't have to stare at the screen and can concurrently accomplish something else.

In the back of my mind I know the original language + subs are more appropriate, but it doesn't fit my consumption method. I totally agree original language and voice actors are better (with some exceptions) than different language script + dubbing.

When I have time to focus on just watching anime then my preference is subs, but that happens less often with kids (and they can't read yet). Of course the way the industry is going these days we may be watching all of our new anime with subs only.

[Penguin]

I tend to prefer dubs to subs, just because I like to do other things at the same time, but I won't endure a crappy dub just because it's convenient (Macross II being a prime example). That being said, my preference is sometimes driven by how I encounter the anime first, like Cory mentioned. I first watched Escaflowne, War In the Pocket, and Stardust Memory on the original Anime Village sub-only VHS, and can't imagine listnening to any other voices (especially Escaflowne since I thought the English actor for Dilandau was atrocious). Same happened with watching the sub-only US Manga Corps Patlabor TV series VHS, although I have a strange fondness for the english voice of Gotoh on the old Manga Video movie dubs... and the fact that the subs on the Bandai Visual releases of the movies translate "-san" as "Mr." or "Miss." drives me disproportionately buggy. Cowboy Bebop and Escaflowne I watched dubbed with friends who weren't into subtitles, and that's how i've thought of them ever since.

I saw Robotech first, so to watch any of its 3 parts in the original Japanese is quite jarring.

I never think of watching Macross as watching Robotech in another language, despite Robotech being my introduction to Macross. They've become separate entities in my media consciousness.

So you prefer Reba West's drunken warbling? Ok....

Reba West is an integral part of the Robotech "experience". The immense popularity of an idol with no vocal talent crowns the surreality of the piece.

[Renato]

Reba West is an integral part of the Robotech "experience". The immense popularity of an idol with no vocal talent crowns the surreality of the piece.

Well, I would say that in that respect, Robotech is much more faithful to real-life Japanese idol phenomena than Macross ever was. Mari Iijima actually having talent forever impeded her from providing an accurate portrayal of Japanese pop performer idols. Thank God for Reba West. I wonder if she is available to do the dub for the upcoming AKB48 anime by Kawamori, to give it an air of authenticity.

And if you think I'm kidding.... ah, google it, I'm not so evil as to embed that stuff here.

[JTurner]

Castle in the Sky(disney dub)

I disagree. I think the Disney dub of Castle in the Sky is fantastic and in many ways better than the Japanese version. Yes, the leads sound like teenagers and the dialogue is chattier than necessary at times, but all in all it works quite well. And sorry, but I thought Mark Hamill was perfect for the evil character; he really made the dub come alive. So did the rest of the cast. And despite the leads sounding like teens, they really weren't terrible at all. A bit green compared to their co-stars, perhaps. But they were nowhere near bad. The older '80s JAL dub of Castle in the Sky was much more lifeless—seriously, one listen to it and I knew right away that Disney's dub was better.

And sorry to whoever said it up there, but I also loved the Kiki's Delivery Service dub. I thought Kirsten did a fine job as Kiki, and Phil Hartman was a great compliment.

Neither of these dubs are perfect, but they are nowhere near terrible IMO. They're both awesome. Oh, and I also loved Record of Lodoss War OVA dubbed. Sure, it has its stiff and/or awkward moments, however the characters are generally well cast and it holds up fairly well for a 1996 CPM dub.

Edited March 11, 2012 by JTurner

[pfunk]

watching Cowboy Bebop and have to say I am impressed with the dub quality

[Marzan]

watching Cowboy Bebop and have to say I am impressed with the dub quality

It is famously one of the best dubs in anime.

Edited March 12, 2012 by Marzan

[miriya]

Just today I was wishing that there was a Macross Zero Dub so that I could show it to my boy (who is still just learning to read). If anyone knows of one please message me. Thanks.

[Renato]

It is famously one of the best dubs in anime.

I thought it sucked.

[Kelsain]

I think the dubs of Miyazaki's films have been good over all. They're always brimming with top talent. However, I'll admit that I prefer Nausicaa's voice actress in Warriors of the Wind. Anna Paquin just didn't seem right to me - probably just bc I grew up w/ the voice of "Princess Zandra." Patrick Stewart was predictably perfect for Yupa, though.

(null)

[Gubaba]

I think the dubs of Miyazaki's films have been good over all. They're always brimming with top talent. However, I'll admit that I prefer Nausicaa's voice actress in Warriors of the Wind. Anna Paquin just didn't seem right to me - probably just bc I grew up w/ the voice of "Princess Zandra." Patrick Stewart was predictably perfect for Yupa, though.

(null)

I think the Disney dubs are the best English dubs ever... but really...if you go carrying pictures of "Warriors of the Wind," you ain't gonna make it with anyone anyhow.

[Keith]

I thought it sucked.

Saying a dub sucks is an infinity loop unto itself.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Keith

[pfunk]

Saying a dub sucks is an infinity loop unto itself.

Meh, sometimes I want to watch the action and its better then having your significant other reading the subs to you,,, better that is

[JTurner]

I think the dubs of Miyazaki's films have been good over all. They're always brimming with top talent. However, I'll admit that I prefer Nausicaa's voice actress in Warriors of the Wind. Anna Paquin just didn't seem right to me - probably just bc I grew up w/ the voice of "Princess Zandra."

Wrong actress; Alison Lohman voiced Nausicaa. Anna Paquin played Sheeta in Castle in the Sky, interestingly she uses her New Zealand/Canada accent for the character, which I personally thought was a nice touch to the character.