Robotech RPG Tactics Kickstarter

[CoryHolmes]

But that Spartan also had parts for chest-missles open or closed, hands empty or armed with a club or GU-11... So there will be a fair degree of customization per mecha, it seems.

[Mommar]

I'm willing to out on a limb and say roughly 85% of the backers are doing so specifically for Battletech's unseen. Maybe 90-95% if you take into conisderation there are a lot of overlap between battletech and macross/robotech fans like myself. I don't think there is much more than 5% that bought in specifically for macross or robotech to play the game.

As far as model complexity, like others have said the newer plastic GamesWorkshop figures aren't much different. The average space marine is about 15 parts, more if you add things like purity ribbons, auspixes, special ornaments, skulls, horns, etc.

Truth be told though I have to wonder if the models were designed that way specifically so they can be upsized later in a new scale.

I don't know about this, once the basic goal for Destroids had been met why would people keep piling money on top of it for things like the Glaug or the YF-4? Unless the Robotech fans are more affluent and that last 5-10% dumped crazy money in afterward for all the rest of the rewards.

[Dangard Ace]

Macross - Battletech

Glaug = Marauder

YF-4 = ?

The Marauder was a pretty popular Assault Mech.

[Einherjar]

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Unseen#From_Macross

There would be no other circumstances to ever see them outside of the Kickstarter, I guess.

Edited March 18, 2014 by Einherjar

[Mommar]

I didn't know the Glaug had been used in Battletech as well.

[cypherxv]

It would appear that those who would have liked a model that wasn't made in the 90's are going to be unhappy. This is from Kevin himself.

"We were very happy with the Destroid prototypes that arrived late last week. With but a few small tweaks, they are done! The Spartan with missile bays open, the Tomahawk and Phalanx were among my favorites. All looked excellent."

I know when the ks ended that I was told by others that he and PB in general go into self denial mode but I get why some would say that. I mean if you look at the comments on the ks page many legitimate concerns are being ignored. In fact the only time PB has commented was when they got into it with a disgruntled backer who wanted a refund.

[cypherxv]

But that Spartan also had parts for chest-missles open or closed, hands empty or armed with a club or GU-11... So there will be a fair degree of customization per mecha, it seems.

Maybe who knows. Ive seen enough models here that I'm inclined to agree with you. Here's a video from the gama show.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=share&v=pR-z5PBsJx4

Looks like most of the models will be split in half. The open cockpit Miriya looks pretty good as does the recovery pod. I noticed a huge seam line on the Gnerl and pretty much all the models. Talk about seamgate.lol

Edited March 21, 2014 by cypherxv

[Phyrox]

I gotta say, those look pretty good. Detail looks a bit soft, but overall sculpts and posability look alright. I'd pick some up.

[Dynaman]

I have to say they are terrible. Seams that you could stick a coin in are not a good sign.

[CrazyDude]

Those 3d printed figures look pretty good. Bit of modelglue(mentioned) and a dab of putty = good to go.

Looks like the were assembled on the quick.

[Phyrox]

Nasty seams with miniatures are certainly nothing unfamiliar to wargamers, and a modeller can fill/file those.

They don't look great, but with some work they'll be better than the old 1/200s which is their only real competition.

I wouldn't be surprised if some of those were stuck together minutes before the show

[cypherxv]

Do any of you experienced modelers have any constructive questions for PB about the quality of the models? One of the backers is going to be in communication with Kevin Seimbada of PB. Mike has asked if any members here would like to contribute?

Thanks

[Einherjar]

Remember the sandwich.

[1st Border Red Devil]

Well, if they don't change the scales, the Southern Cross and MOSPEADA miniatures will look like drek in comparison and not be pose-able. As it is they will have to re-scale the Spartas, Logan, Southern Cross Battloids, various Armo-Soldiers (well, except for the Tiger), Southern Cross Power Amplified Body Armor, Cyclones and leg infantry (really, who thinks a 7mm tall Cyclone will look like anything but pure shite?). Only the Beta, Condor, Alpha and Ajax will be decent looking if they keep them at 1/285th scale.

[AcroRay]

I don't understand the concern with gaps in the seams and other issues with the demo models. None of those come from injection-molded tooling. They're 3D printer outputs, or at best low-yield RTV mold casts from 3D printer outputs.

That's like crabbing at Bandai for all the little funny lines on some of their trade show samples... "That looks horrible. I hope Bandai fixes that, or I won't buy it. People will be mad."

Edited March 31, 2014 by AcroRay

[Einherjar]

After reading some of the recent fallout, it all sounds like unrealistic expectations everywhere and by everyone.

[Retracting Head Ter Ter]

Interesting. Can see why Battletech players would love it.

I would buy it too, but giving HG money is....just....repulsive...

[AcroRay]

Palladium mentioned a couple of days ago in one of their all-property updates that the steel tooling had just started being cut, and that the Valkyrie design was undergoing some revision. With that as the case, I'd estimate we're probably 2 or 3 weeks away from seeing press images of fully-assembled test shots (of earlier approved pieces, like the Destroids and Regults, but not the Valkyrie modes undergoing revision) at Palladium's offices, assuming there isn't some significant failure on the part of the manufacturing contractor.

Edited April 9, 2014 by AcroRay

[AcroRay]

They posted photos of the Missile/Cannon Regult test shot sprues today:

[CrazyDude]

Looks nice.

Always liked the Light & Heavy Artillery Regults as well as the Scout type.

[Einherjar]

So backers just overreacting over prototype models?

[CoryHolmes]

It does seem that way. Despite the captions in the original message saying just how often the 3D Printed prototypes were assembled, disassembled, then reassembled for photos, people just saw GAPS and went HERASY! WHY IS THIS NOT DONE MY WAY?!?!?!

Sigh. I'm beginning to remember the problems of having a fandom.

[AcroRay]

Corey's point is right on the mark. It's always risky to show process shots to fans. Some will really love & appreciate the look into the process. Others - usually the more vocal of them - will be just too d4mn dumb to understand what's going on and will wail about every little bug like it was a personal kick in the shin. Been there. It's nuts.

I can understand someone disliking one of these if it were off-model or poorly engineered. But these are all on-model from what I've seen. They've got pose options. They've got seams and small challenges for the builder's technique that aren't at all atypical.

If anything, people with plamo and gaming mini experience rooted in the most-recent decade might find the building requirements of these to be something of a culture shock. But I'm 45 and I've been building & painting gaming miniatures since the very late 1970s, hobby models since 1976, in all formats and materials. These guys aren't anything unusual, and the subject matter well outweighs any drawbacks (and I see none!) in their medium or engineering.

And I don't mind money going to Harmony Gold. What little (and perfectly legal, as much as that stings) skim they get out of the deal is minimal compared to the obvious high degree of love & respect & hard work the game's designers & craftspeople have for Kawamori's & Miyatake's design work and the combat SF of the Macross world. There are no 'protoculture fuel tanks' & other weirdness here. Even most nomenclature have been reverted to their Japanese originals, or developed for new mecha following the same apparent conventions. So, apart from a brand logo and a couple of character names, this all might have just leaped right out of MACROSS PERFECT MEMORY and into a bit game box. I will support that, because it comes from exactly the muse it should, even if the lawyers & accountants dictate one of the pockets a paltry few coins are paid to in the process. In the past I might have. Today I'm wiser, and more appreciative of where the real value in the venture is.

The thing that really, really concerns me is what my wife is going to say when a big box game with a bazillion little Macross robots shows up in the mail this fall and I spread it all out on the dining room table. "Oh, gawd. MORE robots..!"

Edited April 13, 2014 by AcroRay

[CoryHolmes]

Yeah, explaining it to his wife is a discussion my brother and I already had. We've agreed the best option is to build and house them at my place, and avoid the issue altogether :D

[Einherjar]

I get what you're saying. On one hand, they are not just vocal fans but significant financial backers as well in this situation, who feel they have the right to have their criticisms heard. But then again, since the beginning they seem to have been treated as glorified pre-orderers who were promised the bells and whistles on the Kickerstarter page, but little to no actual influence in the creative process. And setting aside Palladium's track record, after seeing the recent drama it was probably a good thing.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Einherjar

[CoryHolmes]

As I understand it, isn't Kickstarter just basically a preorder platform? I saw those same arguments by people whom bought the Oculus Rift that felt they had a say in the sale to Facebook. Or that had felt "betrayed" by Oculus selling out, and wanted to take their money back.

I put money into a Kickstarter project. As long as I get what I was promised for it, that's the end of my involvement. I'm not some kind of investor into the company itself.

[Dynaman]

As I understand it, isn't Kickstarter just basically a preorder platform? I saw those same arguments by people whom bought the Oculus Rift that felt they had a say in the sale to Facebook. Or that had felt "betrayed" by Oculus selling out, and wanted to take their money back.

I put money into a Kickstarter project. As long as I get what I was promised for it, that's the end of my involvement. I'm not some kind of investor into the company itself.

NO, it is not. Kickstarters are more of an investment - you send them money with the promise that they will produce what they say, and by kickstarter's rules they do have to attempt to do so. The problem is that by law it is neither a proper pre-order system where laws covering consumer rights apply NOR a proper investment system where laws covering investments apply.

It does seem that way. Despite the captions in the original message saying just how often the 3D Printed prototypes were assembled, disassembled, then reassembled for photos, people just saw GAPS and went HERASY! WHY IS THIS NOT DONE MY WAY?!?!?!

Sigh. I'm beginning to remember the problems of having a fandom.

I'm an old fart, back in the day pre-production models were usually NICER then the final product. Plus I have not seen anything from that particular game company that would tend to make believe them at face value.

[Mommar]

Corey's point is right on the mark. It's always risky to show process shots to fans. Some will really love & appreciate the look into the process. Others - usually the more vocal of them - will be just too d4mn dumb to understand what's going on and will wail about every little bug like it was a personal kick in the shin. Been there. It's nuts.

I can understand someone disliking one of these if it were off-model or poorly engineered. But these are all on-model from what I've seen. They've got pose options. They've got seams and small challenges for the builder's technique that aren't at all atypical.

If anything, people with plamo and gaming mini experience rooted in the most-recent decade might find the building requirements of these to be something of a culture shock. But I'm 45 and I've been building & painting gaming miniatures since the very late 1970s, hobby models since 1976, in all formats and materials. These guys aren't anything unusual, and the subject matter well outweighs any drawbacks (and I see none!) in their medium or engineering.

And I don't mind money going to Harmony Gold. What little (and perfectly legal, as much as that stings) skim they get out of the deal is minimal compared to the obvious high degree of love & respect & hard work the game's designers & craftspeople have for Kawamori's & Miyatake's design work and the combat SF of the Macross world. There are no 'protoculture fuel tanks' & other weirdness here. Even most nomenclature have been reverted to their Japanese originals, or developed for new mecha following the same apparent conventions. So, apart from a brand logo and a couple of character names, this all might have just leaped right out of MACROSS PERFECT MEMORY and into a bit game box. I will support that, because it comes from exactly the muse it should, even if the lawyers & accountants dictate one of the pockets a paltry few coins are paid to in the process. In the past I might have. Today I'm wiser, and more appreciative of where the real value in the venture is.

The thing that really, really concerns me is what my wife is going to say when a big box game with a bazillion little Macross robots shows up in the mail this fall and I spread it all out on the dining room table. "Oh, gawd. MORE robots..!"

It's nice to have the opinion of someone who has a lot of experience with miniatures. I backed the Kickstarter and was fine with everything going on and couldn't understand what all of the crying from these people was about. They looked like miniatures you had to assemble to me. And they did say the seams were from prying apart and reassembling them again.

NO, it is not. Kickstarters are more of an investment - you send them money with the promise that they will produce what they say, and by kickstarter's rules they do have to attempt to do so. The problem is that by law it is neither a proper pre-order system where laws covering consumer rights apply NOR a proper investment system where laws covering investments apply.

By your second comment there it isn't more of an investment. If there's no control like an investor, then it isn't an investment. It's more like a charity with the hope of a finished product, but you certainly don't make business decisions. It's like you meet someone on the side of the road who tells you some plan of theirs, you give them $20, and they promise if they make it they'll call you. Only it's formalized into a website now.

[Scyla]

But we all agree that it is not a preorder system right?

[Einherjar]

But we all agree that it is not a preorder system right?

And Kickstarter is not a store... even though it varies from company to company and what backers think.

[Dynaman]

By your second comment there it isn't more of an investment. If there's no control like an investor, then it isn't an investment. It's more like a charity with the hope of a finished product, but you certainly don't make business decisions. It's like you meet someone on the side of the road who tells you some plan of theirs, you give them $20, and they promise if they make it they'll call you. Only it's formalized into a website now.

In many ways investing is much like Charity, in my opinion. Hence why kickstarter is more like an investment- no guarantee of delivery and no legal recourse if no delivery is made, short of being able to prove it was a scam rather just bad/incompetent business practice. If you pre-order something and no delivery is made you must be refunded, that does not apply to an investment.

[CoryHolmes]

I think I want this to succeed, not just because of how awesome I think this Robotech game is going to be, but because of how much I want mecha from the other 2 generations.

I envision being able to set up VHT Hovertanks in Gladiator mode, with their long main guns, and raining indirect fire down from halfway across the map, AJAX hover copters nimbly darting in and out of combat... *happy fanboy sigh*

[cypherxv]

Latest update has the officers comand pod sprue and the recovery pod sprue. Seeing how small the recovery pod is I'm not looking forward to gluing the antenna to it. Happy to see some progress.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/rrpgt/robotech-rpg-tacticstm/posts

Also one backer is taking matters into his own hands. He already has 1/285 scale cyclones

http://www.battletechengineer.com/misc/cyclone/Cyclone_FaShih.jpg

http://www.battletechengineer.com/misc/cyclone/Cyclone_Max.jpg

Here's his thread on them.

http://palladium-megaverse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=97&t=143223&p=2782440#p2782440

[cypherxv]

I think I want this to succeed, not just because of how awesome I think this Robotech game is going to be, but because of how much I want mecha from the other 2 generations.

I envision being able to set up VHT Hovertanks in Gladiator mode, with their long main guns, and raining indirect fire down from halfway across the map, AJAX hover copters nimbly darting in and out of combat... *happy fanboy sigh*

I want to see that too but we'll be lucky to get everything PB promised. Here's the lates update. They finally have the vf-1 to show off. The F and G modes look a bit clunky, but the B mode looks alright.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/rrpgt/robotech-rpg-tacticstm/posts

[anime52k8]

I want to see that too but we'll be lucky to get everything PB promised. Here's the lates update. They finally have the vf-1 to show off. The F and G modes look a bit clunky, but the B mode looks alright.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/rrpgt/robotech-rpg-tacticstm/posts

I get that these are small but that's like the single least ambitious Gerwalk pose ever.