Star Wars VII - The Force Awakens, on BluRay and Dvd April 5th, 2016

[Kanedas Bike]

I find it highly unlikely that this is a retcon.

Logically it wouldn't make any type of sense for it to be one and I agree, but I've just learned to put nothing past folks in Hollywood and their "want" to put their stamp on a franchise.

It wouldn't make sense.

Unlikely that it is.

So just don't do it JJ or whomever.

That's all I'm saying.

-b.

[VF-15 Banshee]

I thought I posted this yesterday but Star Wars' twitter confirmed that this IS an X-Wing and not any kind of Z-95.

[Kanedas Bike]

I thought I posted this yesterday but Star Wars' twitter confirmed that this IS an X-Wing and not any kind of Z-95.

No arguments there.

If you're talking to me then my point is that this just be AN X-Wing and not become THE X-Wing.

-b.

[Duke Togo]

It's an advanced version of the x-wing. We see this with fighter jets all the time. No great mystery. The group developing this film aren't the type of people who do that sort of implied retocnning. Hell, they built a full scale Millennium Falcon, inside and out.

[Kelsain]

Indeed. The X-wing was a successful design - instrumental in taking out 2 Death Stars! Not surprising that it's format would live on.

I like the return to McQ's style, much better than anything we saw in Ep 2 or 3.

(I like the design in Ep1)

[electric indigo]

As much as I like McQuarrie, I think the X-Wing was Joe Johnson's creation.

[Duke Togo]

As much as I like McQuarrie, I think the X-Wing was Joe Johnson's creation.

Except McQuarrie

[electric indigo]

Johnson's design preceded McOuarrie's painting. It was decided that the bubble cockpit would cause too may reflection problems when filming the miniatures (apparently resolved later when the A-Wing appeared), resulting in the version in the McQuarrie painting. The filming miniatures actually had no glass in their cockpit frames.

[Duke Togo]

Johnson's design preceded McOuarrie's painting. It was decided that the bubble cockpit would cause too may reflection problems when filming the miniatures (apparently resolved later when the A-Wing appeared), resulting in the version in the McQuarrie painting. The filming miniatures actually had no glass in their cockpit frames.

Ah,very good then.

[Mommar]

Johnson's design preceded McOuarrie's painting. It was decided that the bubble cockpit would cause too may reflection problems when filming the miniatures (apparently resolved later when the A-Wing appeared), resulting in the version in the McQuarrie painting. The filming miniatures actually had no glass in their cockpit frames.

But does it matter who invented the design? McQuarrie took it and refined it, and that appears to be what they're basing it all off of here. Johnson gets the nod for the original concept, McQuarrie gets the nod for the design being more appealing.

[Duke Togo]

Whatever the case, the design comes from the pre-production period of the original film. It has a pedigree.

[The Old Man]

It looks like Star Wars. Something the prequels spectacularly failed at.

I like it.

[The Old Man]

I can't understand why it's being called an X-Wing though (sorry but that twitter link is dead).

Surely the defining thing with an X-Wing is the ability to split the wings to form the 'X'.

On this prop at least, there does not appear to be any kind of split on the wings or the engine intakes.

[Duke Togo]

The engine intakes are split along the horizontal axis. It's pretty clearly seen in the pic.

Edited July 23, 2014 by Duke Togo

[The Old Man]

Ah, ok. Maybe my iPad isn't giving me the clarity I need. It was the wings throwing me off but this looks like a reasonable explanation.

[RedLion]

Ah, ok. Maybe my iPad isn't giving me the clarity I need. It was the wings throwing me off but this looks like a reasonable explanation.

image.jpg

Agreed however I think the engine pods are the center for the wings rotation. I could be wrong.

[The Old Man]

Here's a clearer image

[Knight26]

There is a clear dividing line leading though wing root through the engine intakes, but not one through the leading edge, as The Old Man has indicated. But there is a line down the wing along the top, so his estimate there looks correct. So the question becomes, does the fuselage somehow open to allow the proper seperation, or is there some magic tiny pivot point right at the fuselage? I kind of hope that the fuselage opens somehow becuase otherwise those engines would rip free. Also, IIRC part of the justification for the openning S-Foils (Aside from looking cool) on the original X-Wing was heat dispersion, not just openning up to increase the weapons spread, a bad idea really, unless the shots can be angled off axis.

Of course having the wings split the way that The Old Man indicates makes those landing gear even more ridiculous.

This is what happens when your designers stop working with real props and do everything on computer, they don't seem realize how to make things fit together properly.

[Gakken85]

http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-28466562

Interview with Mark Hamill.

Also Karen Gillan is hot. haha

[Chronocidal]

Clearly, they didn't design the prop to actually have the wings separate.

I'm just... sad. Like, seriously, we've had years of people refining the old trilogy designs in various ways, with some fairly reasonable progressions for X-Wing designs..

Can we please not JJ-prise EVERYTHING?

There are actually a lot more valid reasons for the splitting wings on the X-Wing. Besides the obvious cooling idea from getting the engines farther apart, it also would increase maneuverability, since now you're spreading your thrust over a much wider area, and computer controlled throttle variation for maneuvering is going to be much more effective in the pitch axis. On top of that, since we never actually saw any kind of maneuvering thrusters, a lot of people theorized that the ships used arrays of internal gyros to generate maneuvering forces. Spreading the wings would spread those out further as well, since they'd likely be inside the wings, and while I can't personally quote any math that would vouch for that being helpful, it seems like it would be, on an intuitive level.

This design... just.. I don't know. It's not a bad progression mostly, but the engine and wing arrangement just looks silly compared to the original. All splitting the wings down the center will do is make the thing look entirely unbalanced with the wings spread. The original has a nice sense of symmetry to it, and this will absolutely kill that aesthetic.

What I'd love to see though? A simple auto-retracting boarding ladder like the F-15 or F-18 uses. The one there looks fairly well attached, but I can't tell if it's meant to collapse.

To be entirely fair though, the original X-Wing never had any space for the main landing gear either, unless those lower engines were just magically smaller than the upper ones, or the main "intakes" never really had any function to begin with. Could be, the entire engine was actually located in the J-79 afterburner section on the back.

Edited July 25, 2014 by Chronocidal

[Duke Togo]

Can we please not JJ-prise EVERYTHING?

What are you talking about?

[Chronocidal]

Heheh.. eh, that was an overreaction. Mostly, it's the "let's just make everything smoother and shinier" fad. The original trilogy stuff was all fairly rough and industrial looking, which fit the idea of a rebellion struggling to survive. Thing is, that look is so incredibly iconic now, making things look shiny and new just winds up looking out of place to me.

It's sort of the "why do you feel like you have to change everything?" feeling. The X-Wings were brand new in ANH, and sure, new models come out, but with the way ships in the Star Wars universe are treated, they cross the line from military fighter to something more along the lines of a personal car. Luke's X-Wing is one of those things I don't see why they'd need to change, and putting him in a new model gives me the same feeling as the new KITT made out of a Mustang.

Granted, there's no word on whether this is Luke's ship, or some other one, but I do hope they keep some famililar classics besides the Falcon in the new movies.

In terms of design, I just don't see why they feel the need to streamline anything, or change it so much, and it feels like they're changing it just because they can. Maybe there's more thought involved from the designers, but it feels like a completely unnatural design progression to me in terms of utility and function.

Forgive me by the way, I've spent far too much time making X-Wings over the years, and I've gotten way too into the details of the design. I just feel the same way about this design as I did about the JJ-prise, and while I know he probably isn't directly responsible for the design in any way, it still makes me think, "here we go again."

Edited July 25, 2014 by Chronocidal

[Duke Togo]

This X-wing isn't smoother or shinier. It's one of the original concepts from the 70s. Everything about it screams old school Star Wars. As does the fact that built a complete, 1:1 mockup of the Millennium Falcon, inside and out.

[Chronocidal]

Can't argue about the resemblence to the old design, but the wing mechanism is just what gripes me the most, assuming it is that weird mid-split. It's definitely more slicked-back and streamlined though, and the pseudo-chromed intake cowlings just look completely out of place for a fighter.

[Duke Togo]

By chrome you mean the unpainted metal which looks nothing like chrome?

What's next, are we going to start complaining about how unrealistic space travel is in Star Wars? I mean, come on. Hell, the X-wing design itself makes no sense. Wtf does splitting the wings do in space? How does it maneuver without thrusters? It's Star Wars, it's fantasy.

[Kanedas Bike]

By chrome you mean the unpainted metal which looks nothing like chrome?

What's next, are we going to start complaining about how unrealistic space travel is in Star Wars? I mean, come on. Hell, the X-wing design itself makes no sense. Wtf does splitting the wings do in space? How does it maneuver without thrusters? It's Star Wars, it's fantasy.

Suspension of Disbelief: INITIATE!

-b.

[hutch]

To be clear I was joking about a retcon, even though I would find it funny if it was one.

I like the ship design. There are a number of ways to explain it.

[CrazyDude]

I quiet like some of the early concept art of the designs from the original trilogy.

Some like the MF are way different.

[Chronocidal]

By chrome you mean the unpainted metal which looks nothing like chrome?

What's next, are we going to start complaining about how unrealistic space travel is in Star Wars? I mean, come on. Hell, the X-wing design itself makes no sense. Wtf does splitting the wings do in space? How does it maneuver without thrusters? It's Star Wars, it's fantasy.

Eh, any unpainted-metal-looking surface has left a bad taste in my mouth since Episode 1. And I mentioned the other things in my first post, but yeah, it's all made-up speculation by fans attempting to explain nonsense physics.

Probably nothing is going to make me like this one, because the old one is still my favorite sci-fi design period, and I don't see any reason why it needs to be overhauled into something so different looking. Why not just introduce a new design entirely? It's like trying to evoke nostalgia for it by saying, "Hey, it's an X-Wing!"... but it's got none of the charm the original design has for me.

Heh.. particularly, the fuselage rework just reminds me heavily of various bad reproductions of how the original fuselage is supposed to look. That overly stretched nosecone just looks ugly to me.

[The Old Man]

This image seems to support the wing split idea - looking at the where the lasers are attached.

I don't much like the new profile though, the nose doesn't look long enough.

[Chronocidal]

Ah... yeah, that just looks terrible... like it ran into a wall in the middle of a hyperspace jump. The pile of original style nosecones is interesting though.

Maybe they're designing an SD version ahead of time?

[renegadeleader1]

I'm not sure, but I think they might have extended the nose from when it was being built to when it appeared with JJ Abrams.

[jvmacross]

http://variety.com/2014/biz/news/significant-star-wars-presence-planned-for-disney-theme-parks-1201276296/

Best quote from the article....

When asked if Disney was looking to broker new licensing deals with other franchise owners for attractions the way it did with James Cameron’s “Avatar,” Iger dismissed the notion, citing properties owned by Marvel, Pixar and Lucasfilm,

“We don’t have to license from third parties,” he said. “We own them all.”

An all-Star Wars devoted section at the Disney Parks would mean a mandatory pilgrimage for many fans for generations to come.........arguably the best franchise purchase ever.

[Scyla]

Or an all Star Wars theme park. A pod racer fun ride would be cool.

[EXO]

A definite would be a Star Wars Cantina with Slave Leia servers would be awesome... Mos Eisley and Hooters all rolled into one.

On second thought that sounds absolutely disgusting. I'd still go though.