Macross Plus in BD!!! OVA w/ English Dub & Movie w/En

[Isamu Dyson]

Ultimately we finally have Macross Plus on bluray HD. It's already released and really there isn't anything we can do about it to make it better straight out of the box. It's cool to vent our frustrations in regards to either the poor subbing or the out of the blue dubbing for Episode 4. This venting procedure may help others who haven't purchased it to think twice before shelling out their money. However, it's too late with the should have, would have and could have. I always knew the English options was something of an add on for the Japanese fans and was never intended for sale internationally. If you think about it that way, things start to become clearer in regards to the whole English fuss issues.

[Keith]

I really can't imagine going through life with such low standards and exceptions on what you spend your money on, but if it's gotten you this far, more power to you.

Which would be a valid arrgument if this was a release meant for the U.S., but it's not. BV is quite adept at contracting full proffessional sub translations, when they actually intend to release a product in those markets. This however wasn't such a case, with the inclusion of subs and a dub being little more than for novelty.

[VF5SS]

It really wasn't out of the blue dubbing. It's been like that since 2000.

[technoblue]

So, remixed subtitles are now available for the movie. Unfortunately, I've only seen them available with the complete Blu-ray disc--all 44GB--so it is a bandwidth intensive download. Anyway, it is an option for those who want to look for it.

As for the other stuff, it would be ideal if Macross had a true international release with all sequels getting something of a Ghibli treatment with multilanguage tracks. I know that isn't realistic, but I keep hoping that the situation will change. Until that mountain moves, I'll do what I can to support the content, the artists, and its creators.

[Rabidweezil]

Which would be a valid arrgument if this was a release meant for the U.S., but it's not. BV is quite adept at contracting full proffessional sub translations, when they actually intend to release a product in those markets. This however wasn't such a case, with the inclusion of subs and a dub being little more than for novelty.

People here keep saying the release wasn't meant for the US. Is that official information or just more speculation?

I understand they cannot officially "release it in the US" because of the Harmony Gold crap. But does anyone here actually know what the intentions where toward the English speaking market?

Edited July 28, 2013 by Rabidweezil

[VF5SS]

Uh there hasn't been a new US release of post SDF Macross stuff in the US in oh almost 15 years?

[Rabidweezil]

Uh there hasn't been a new US release of post SDF Macross stuff in the US in oh almost 15 years?

Uh, the US isn't the only place where people speak English. Besides, in these wonderful times were the internet allows us to purchase things from all over the world, something doesn't have to be "officially released" in one particular place to be purchased. So unless someone has some hard evidence, I don't believe the English market was considered as insignificant as some of you are matter-of-factually stating it was.

Edited July 28, 2013 by Rabidweezil

[EXO]

People here keep saying the release wasn't meant for the US. Is that official information or just more speculation?

I understand they cannot officially "release it in the US" because of the Harmony Gold crap. But does anyone here actually know what the intentions where toward the English speaking market?

From what I heard and read (so obviously it's not official), while some people involved in production are interested in adding english subs, Big West has no interest in the market outside of Japan whatsoever. That's where the buck stops as far as Macross.

[Bahamutzyro]

so is this in english or japanese?

[Keith]

People here keep saying the release wasn't meant for the US. Is that official information or just more speculation?

I understand they cannot officially "release it in the US" because of the Harmony Gold crap. But does anyone here actually know what the intentions where toward the English speaking market?

Again, BV has pjlut out kany releases at this point with regars to exporting to the U.S. their work on Plus doesn't reflect those efforts

[technoblue]

so is this in english or japanese?

Both discs are in Japanese. The four-episode OVA has an English dub with a remix of episode four and the the movie has new English subtitles. The debate is about the quality of the subtitles and the new dub. Episodes one through three use the familiar Manga dub.

The market angle makes sense, but why go to the expense of redubbing episode four and rescripting subtitles in house?. Why care about the English tracks at all? The DVD remaster of Plus was a Japanese only release, correct? Licensing and reusing the Manga subtitles seem an easier effort, but I admit I am out of my element here.

* edited tired wordy brain *

Edited July 29, 2013 by technoblue

[sketchley]

The market angle makes sense, but why go to the expense of redubbing episode four and rescripting subtitles in house?. Why care about the English tracks at all? The DVD remaster of Plus was a Japanese only release, correct? Licensing and reusing the Manga subtitles seem an easier effort, but I admit I am out of my element here.

I believe that's been mentioned earlier in this thread: they already had them from releases dated 2000 or earlier.

[technoblue]

Thanks. I'll have to go back and read that again.

[Bahamutzyro]

Ok so is this in English or Japanese? I wana buy but only if I can read subs or its in english

[sketchley]

Ok so is this in English or Japanese? I wana buy but only if I can read subs or its in english

It's in Japanese, with either a bonus English dub or bonus English subs.

[Bahamutzyro]

So I can watch in English and understand?

[TheLoneWolf]

From what I heard and read (so obviously it's not official), while some people involved in production are interested in adding english subs, Big West has no interest in the market outside of Japan whatsoever.

Heh, after reading some of the childish reactions on here, I can't say that I blame Big West.

[technoblue]

So I can watch in English and understand?

Yes.

Disc 1 (OVA) has both Japanese and English audio

Disc 2 (the movie) has Japanese audio with optional English subtitles

[UN Spacy]

Anyone know how well this sold?

[oshanmacross]

It looks great to me,

D2 or Betamax source:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D-2_(video)

The Japanese are notorious for not saving masters.

This totally blows away the manga entertainment sources.

As for the translation difference.

Bake a Pie, Eat a pie.

TL:DR:

If you are into macross plus, BUY IT!

[Isamu Dyson]

So unless someone has some hard evidence, I don't believe the English market was considered as insignificant as some of you are matter-of-factually stating it was.

I don't have any hard evidence to support that "theory" nor do I personally support it as a fact. However in the past we have had examples of these issues. Take Final Fantasy X International version or Final Fantasy VII International version for both PS2 and PS1 respectively. Both versions were re-released a second time around for Japan and was region coded for Japanese Playstations only. The Final Fantasy International wasn't made for International purposes as only the English audio was added. The in-game text was all in Japanese at least for X and XII. In FF7 the North Americans got 2 specials bosses not present in the original Japanese version. The Japanese fans cried foul on that one stating why they got the short end of the stick. So Square at the time gave back a more complete version for the Japanese fans with an International version filled with the 2 bosses, English tracks a bonus disc - the works.

See the common trend here? Personally, I never expected it to be spelled checked or even audio checked properly from the get go. I knew the moment when this bluray was released it had a certain market to target and it goes without saying this English option was an extra bonus for the Japanese fans first and foremost. I don't believe they stated that the English market was "insignificant" however it would be more like a secondary priority.

In all fairness can anyone prove that the English market was significant or even intended? Heck living in Canada, every bluray has to have french writing on the bluray with description of the movie at the back and french audio.

There isn't any English Summary on my MacPlus Bluray aside from the title and specs. HHHHhhhhmmmmm......

[Castel]

That's something about Japanese that lot of people keep forgetting but it's a fact that they make anime, manga, game and all that kind stuff for their market, for their local customers and have very little interest in foreign markets and even less about what foreign audiences can think about their products.

And when you know them a bit it's really not all that suprising.

Edited August 18, 2013 by Castel

[jvmacross]

http://www.shop.dynit.it/macross-plus-the-ultimate-edition-eps-1-4-2-blu-ray.html

[Zhou]

Some pics of the Italian release:

http://animeonbluray.blogspot.com.br/2014/01/gallery-macross-plus-ultimate-edition.html

I have to wonder how they got away with it. Is Italy somehow exempt from Harmony Gold's stranglehold on everything Macross in the West? Even though I own the Japanese release, that translated booklet fills me with envy.

[Renato]

Could be. Italy also released "Macross 7 Trash" officially back in the day.

That does not look to be a translated booklet, though, it seems they have compiled their own material.

I'm wondering if this is an upscale or actually the same restored footage that was released here.

And look at the back of the BD case. There's the VF-2SS again!! Why oh why do the foreign distributors insist on slipping in Macross II stills in all the Macross Plus packaging, always??

Edited January 26, 2014 by Renato

[TheLoneWolf]

I have to wonder how they got away with it. Is Italy somehow exempt from Harmony Gold's stranglehold on everything Macross in the West?

The only two Macross videos that Harmony Gold doesn't block are Macross Plus and Macross II. In fact, Manga Entertainment still actively markets the two videos here in the US.

I'm wondering if this is an upscale or actually the same restored footage that was released here.

My guess is that that italian Blu-ray is just an upscale. I don't see any mention of it being a remaster, just that it's in high-definition. They probably didn't think it was worth the money to license Bandai's new remaster and just upscaled their existing film.

[Tochiro]

The Macross Plus BDs get a mention in this weeks Answerman column.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/answerman/2014-03-14

[Renato]

So, he's not recommending the BD set because of the "issues", and he's also saying there is little chance for a state-side BD release. I don't see how that really helps the poor guy who asked the question.

[Tochiro]

Yep. And heaven forbid Sevakis be positive about anything in his life (that doesn't include the 90's or happily reminiscing about how goth he was).

Feedback went from interesting (guy on page 5 giving his thoughts on the HG issue) to ludicrous (someone inferring in a round about manner they 'Fire Bombers' are on the same level of licensing cost as a Johnny's band).

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2826061&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=45

[megaprime]

That's something about Japanese that lot of people keep forgetting but it's a fact that they make anime, manga, game and all that kind stuff for their market, for their local customers and have very little interest in foreign markets and even less about what foreign audiences can think about their products.

And when you know them a bit it's really not all that suprising.

Yeah, it is a real shame. It is that sort of close-minded mentality that has thwarted their economy and been a barrier to the in-house brands from exploding into the rest of the world. Even well established brands like Sony, Panasonic, Toshiba, Pioneer, etc have suffered because of their rigidness and inability to adapt to the new market trends. No wonder they lost so much ground to competitors such as Samsung, LG, etc.

Japan has a really beautiful culture and Japanese products are much coveted in the rest of the world (especially the West). Bandai and other Japanese companies would make so much more profits (easily double them) if they opened up and stoped ignoring the international customers. I hope one day they wake up and realise that.

[Gubaba]

And when they do target the US market, they get lawsuits. Seriously... what would YOU do...?

[VF5SS]

Bandai has opened up to the western market. It's just that it's all products the west already likes such as Dragonball Z, Super Sentai, and Sailor Moon.

For example their Saint Cloth Myth line is incredibly lucrative thanks to the popularity of Saint Seiya all over the world (except America).

[sketchley]

(...)

I can appreciate your attempts at rationalizing why things are the way they are, but let's not confuse apples and oranges: entertainment products are not the same as the devices used to play them on, and the manufacturers of one are on a completely different scale than the other - the reasons why the major electronic manufacturers suffered is far more complicated than mere close-mindedness and rigidity (the effects of the Leeman Shock come first to mind).

Nevertheless, if it was so easy to double their profits, why hasn't anyone already done so? Maybe its not as easy as you think, and maybe the so-called international market is no where near as big as you perceive it to be?

It's probably for the best if you keep in mind that the producers of anime and manga do not have the finances to do anything BUT release domestically. History also shows us that they are willing to licence their products to foreign distributors. So, it's more relevant to ask why distributors in your country have stopped, or reduced the amount of anime and manga they import, then putting the blame on companies and individuals that aren't in a position to do that.

Edited March 15, 2014 by sketchley

[technoblue]

Hm. I guess it's a damned if you do damned if you don't scenario. Thankfully, there are some Americans (even in the U.S.) who are not so spoiled to demand instant gratification day in and day out. And when something is out of their reach (that is, too expensive or just unavailable in some way), they either save up, bank on the generosity of a friend, or move on.

As Mick Jagger wisely once put to song, "You can't always get what you want."

[megaprime]

And when they do target the US market, they get lawsuits. Seriously... what would YOU do...?

If using the name Macross is the problem then rebrand the product.... that is one of many solutions possible (in my opinion) There have been plenty of ocassions where the same product has been given different names in different coutries for various reasons.

Bandai has opened up to the western market. It's just that it's all products the west already likes such as Dragonball Z, Super Sentai, and Sailor Moon.

For example their Saint Cloth Myth line is incredibly lucrative thanks to the popularity of Saint Seiya all over the world (except America).

If Bandai has already got a stronghold in the market and they are seen as a strong brand (which they are) then they are able to introduce new products in that market with more ease. How do they know if the new market will like a product or not if they dont give it a chance?

I can appreciate your attempts at rationalizing why things are the way they are, but let's not confuse apples and oranges: entertainment products are not the same as the devices used to play them on, and the manufacturers of one are on a completely different scale than the other - the reasons why the major electronic manufacturers suffered is far more complicated than mere close-mindedness and rigidity (the effects of the Leeman Shock come first to mind).

Nevertheless, if it was so easy to double their profits, why hasn't anyone already done so? Maybe its not as easy as you think, and maybe the so-called international market is no where near as big as you perceive it to be?

It's probably for the best if you keep in mind that the producers of anime and manga do not have the finances to do anything BUT release domestically. History also shows us that they are willing to licence their products to foreign distributors. So, it's more relevant to ask why distributors in your country have stopped, or reduced the amount of anime and manga they import, then putting the blame on companies and individuals that aren't in a position to do that.

It's not confusing apples with oranges. I'm not talking about what products a producer makes but rather their attitude toward promoting those products in a new market. If the attitude is similar to what Castel describes in post 477 of this thread then .....

If producers do not have the financial means to do anything internationally then how did hundreds of other mange products, etc make it into the International market? Today's emerging markets and technologies create an excellent environment and give the means for the underdogs to compete. Projects like Kickstarter (for example) are an excellent way to address insecurity regarding wider markets and even legal issues that may result (from HG and greedy companies like that).

Hm. I guess it's a damned if you do damned if you don't scenario. Thankfully, there are some Americans (even in the U.S.) who are not so spoiled to demand instant gratification day in and day out. And when something is out of their reach (that is, too expensive or just unavailable in some way), they either save up, bank on the generosity of a friend, or move on.

As Mick Jagger wisely once put to song, "You can't always get what you want."

From what I can see people are not demanding at all. They are simply asking for something basic (i.e. English subtitles). And frankly it is quite a confusing situation. On one side you hear that Big West etc produce Macross for the domestic market only and they dont care for the international one. So if that is the case then why do they bring out releases that contain English subtitles? That conveys a confusing message to the fans.

You can put people in three main categories:

those who demand instant gratification (I want it here, I want it now-generally an attitude that plagues the majority of the West)

those who gratefully accept any little bone that is thrown to them now and again and accept anything said company does without questioning it (hardcore Apple fanboys come to mind)

those who question and try to do something to contribute towards change ( like quite a few members here who have very generously provided translations, etc)

That third group is the most valuable for any company.

I've never complained about prices personally although I have questioned the reasons why they are high in comparison to the West. I've never complained about availability either ( since I have been able to get the English subtitles for all the releases thanks to those kind people on the net who made the effort to help).

You may not be able to get what you want all the time but I bet you can most of the time. It just depends how hard you work towards it.

Dont get me wrong I am not someone who likes to whine. I came accross Macross by chance and in a strange way. Initially I liked the Bandai Valks and once I found this forum I learned more and then started to watch the films/series. And I really like Macross and enjoy watching it (although I have never enjoyed watching Dragonball Z or Pokemon). Maybe it is because I like Star Wars, or because I'm a bloke and like war stories. I dont know why, but I certainly do hope that Macross continues with new releases and increases in popularity.

Edited March 23, 2014 by megaprime