Secrets of the VF-14m7 P*L*U*S finally revealed!

[Mr March]

Thanks charger69.

dialNforNinja,

Okay here's an updated version with the blue "mohawk" on the head. I also modded your line art a little to accomodate some red coloring inside the "camera/sensor" in the center of the forehead.

[sketchley]

I don't understand. What is it about the hips you're seeing that makes them so crazy?

I believe he's referring to steps 3 and 4b in this image: http://www.macross2.net/m3/macross7/fz-109a/fz-109a-transformation1.gif

Specifically how the leading edges of the central wing (between the central hull and the engine nacelles) folds up with the rear parts of the nose section to form the back of the upper legs/hips.

[dialNforNinja]

Exactly. That wouldn't be so bad, but in gerwalk the leading edge part has to end up stacked vertically with the fusilage part, and fitting a linkage that allows them to work both ways into the limited space available is really rough. It's why I had the parts reversed on the Skate (see 'Macross-ish 3d models' thread) and did it as an original instead of a straight FZ-109 model - the hips just wouldn't work without being really complex the canon way. Reversing the arm let me give it forward lasers too

Edited September 24, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[dialNforNinja]

March - there was alwys supposed to be room for color in the third eye chakra gem, but the line to show it as inset was a bit too thick. I'm only working from normal sized paper and have worked all-digital for over a decade aside from napkin sketches until becoming computer-bereft, so a few slips were inevitable. As the shiny newness wears off I see more and more of them...

Edited September 24, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[dialNforNinja]

Another color tweak - on the near wing, the highlight that joins the leading edge should probably be on the upper side of the line, and definately follow the shape of the root piece rather than cutting across the outer panel. The little stub of the retracted inner panel at the top back is probably too farr back to get a highlight to separate it, but the current one makes it look like part of the root.

[dialNforNinja]

head antenna bases - no highlught on near, no shadow on far, those surfaces are flat.

Maybe highlights on the grey now that it's darker?

far leg, the highlight should have the left edge aligned closer to the 'fang' denoting the corner of the ankle fairing like the near leg, that curve is pronounced even if there's no actual creased edge

All just suggestions of course.

Edited September 24, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[Mommar]

I don't know, those Toy engineers are pretty creative. They might be able to come up with something pretty clever for that. I'd bet it's made of diecast, Whatever the solution is.

[dialNforNinja]

Oh, it certainly CAN be done, I had a 3d model for that assembly on the dead machine, but I wouldn't want to try supporting the weight of a figure with it at under 1/48, like I said, even assuming diecast main parts and the 9 piece version. Mechanical advantage is all the wrong way to ease along hips or the waist with weak/complex mechanisms, my main objection to the YF-24 family after the awkward VA-1MS style "angel wings."

[Mommar]

I still would like to see Yamato take a stab at it. It's an interesting problem. They'd have a template for four different Valks that way. The 109A and F, and the two versions of the 14 too. Maybe the AZ-130 as well but that one is a little bit crazier.

Edited September 24, 2012 by Mommar

[chillyche]

Mr March -- your coloring just keeps getting better. This stuff straight up looks like cels. Just add a little bit of grain, slap it over a painted bg, and I'd buy it was still.

[paramat]

Excellent work dNN and Mr. March. Hope to see the fighter and gerwalk coloured too,

[Mr March]

dialNforNinja

I'll fix the hip wing and ankles, but I can't spend too much more time on this piece cause I still have the Fighter and GERWALK modes to complete and I need to work on my website material. I'll post the three modes sometime this week.

chillyche

Thank you so much for saying and I definitely agree I've been able to improve as I've worked more and more. My original goal was always for the Macross mecha art to look as close to the animated show as possible, complete with shadow and light effects (perhaps more accurate to say as close to the "best animated episodes" as possible). Sadly my skill as a colorist, my access to quality line art, my scanner and accurate reference pictures were all lacking, so I couldn't make it work. Now most of that has been corrected

If you like my coloring for dialNforNinja's VF-14 Vampire, you're going to love the next update to the M3 website. The next update will feature dozens of profiles rescanned and recolored with 3-tone and 4-tone colors. I've only got about a dozen more pictures to color and the update can be posted. Working as fast as I can. Attached is little sample to satisfy you while you wait

http://www.macross2....-1d-gerwalk.gif

paramat

Thanks dude. And yes, I'm going to work on the other two modes next. Should have them done this week.

[dialNforNinja]

Don't worry too much about my nitpicking - I said from the very first one that they looked great, and that was no lie. I'd be fiddling endlessly in search of perfection, and that's no way to roll out an update in a timely manner.

WRT Yamato versions, I'd certainly be happy to see some if it's possible, and with the M7 blurays coming out now would be the time if ever... hint hint, guys!

Edited September 24, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[Mommar]

dialNforNinja

I'll fix the hip wing and ankles, but I can't spend too much more time on this piece cause I still have the Fighter and GERWALK modes to complete and I need to work on my website material. I'll post the three modes sometime this week.

chillyche

Thank you so much for saying and I definitely agree I've been able to improve as I've worked more and more. My original goal was always for the Macross mecha art to look as close to the animated show as possible, complete with shadow and light effects (perhaps more accurate to say as close to the "best animated episodes" as possible). Sadly my skill as a colorist, my access to quality line art, my scanner and accurate reference pictures were all lacking, so I couldn't make it work. Now most of that has been corrected

If you like my coloring for dialNforNinja's VF-14 Vampire, you're going to love the next update to the M3 website. The next update will feature dozens of profiles rescanned and recolored with 3-tone and 4-tone colors. I've only got about a dozen more pictures to color and the update can be posted. Working as fast as I can. Attached is little sample to satisfy you while you wait

http://www.macross2....-1d-gerwalk.gif

paramat

Thanks dude. And yes, I'm going to work on the other two modes next. Should have them done this week.

You added bullet damage to the 1D?

[Mr March]

dialNforNinja

Not to worry, as you can tell from the many times I've revised my website, I'm also more than a bit of a perfectionist. Perhaps it's a good thing our time is limited

Mommar

The battle damage is actually part of the original line art for the VF-1D Valkyrie in Battroid and GERWALK modes (the Fighter mode is undamaged). My website currently only has the original VF-1D Battroid art, but the battle damage will be much more pronounced after the next update because of a newly scanned version from a superior source book.

The VF-1D GERWALK currently on my website? Well...that was one of my dirty little secrets I started the Macross Mecha Manual with only three books of line art; the SK Macross Design Works, Macross Perfect Memory and The Gold Book. As such, I couldn't feature complete profiles of all the Macross mecha because the books I owned lacked the line art required. So I cheated. The VF-1D GERWALK currently on the M3 is heavily modified line art of the VF-1J GERWALK built to look like the "D". The line art I posted above is the original VF-1D GERWALK taken from This Is Animation Macross Volumes 1 and 2, two books which I only obtained this year. I suppose now that my secret is out, there's no harm showing a comparison picture (see attached).

If time permits I may remove the battle damage and post "clean" versions too.

[Zinjo]

Psst, I was referring to the Super Parts/Armour Packs there, not the VA-14 itself.

DOH!

[Zinjo]

Alrighty, here's a colored version of the VF-14 Vampire M7 PLUS. I created both a VF-17 Nightmare-style Blue/Black version and also created a Grey/Black using the colors found on the "logo" spread done by dialNforNinja. Comment, complain, cower

Always a begrudging fan march around the block ...

[Zinjo]

dialNforNinja

Not to worry, as you can tell from the many times I've revised my website, I'm also more than a bit of a perfectionist. Perhaps it's a good thing our time is limited

Mommar

The battle damage is actually part of the original line art for the VF-1D Valkyrie in Battroid and GERWALK modes (the Fighter mode is undamaged). My website currently only has the original VF-1D Battroid art, but the battle damage will be much more pronounced after the next update because of a newly scanned version from a superior source book.

The VF-1D GERWALK currently on my website? Well...that was one of my dirty little secrets I started the Macross Mecha Manual with only three books of line art; the SK Macross Design Works, Macross Perfect Memory and The Gold Book. As such, I couldn't feature complete profiles of all the Macross mecha because the books I owned lacked the line art required. So I cheated. The VF-1D GERWALK currently on the M3 is heavily modified line art of the VF-1J GERWALK built to look like the "D". The line art I posted above is the original VF-1D GERWALK taken from This Is Animation Macross Volumes 1 and 2, two books which I only obtained this year. I suppose now that my secret is out, there's no harm showing a comparison picture (see attached).

If time permits I may remove the battle damage and post "clean" versions too.

Why do I expect this art to somehow show up on official posters and such ... (yes I am resurrecting the old assertion that BW is stealing MM's coloring work to use in their ad campaigns!)

[Mr March]

Why thanks, that means a lot from you Zinjockey

I'd be truly honored if Big West felt my coloring work was accomplished enough to feature on their products. We did see my colored pictures used for a BW poster at a convention...I still have a photo of that poster kicking around my hard drive

Edited September 26, 2012 by Mr March

[Knight26]

Why thanks, that means a lot from you Zinjockey

I'd be truly honored if Big West felt my coloring work was accomplished enough to feature on their products. We did see my colored pictures used for a BW poster at a convention...I still have a photo of that poster kicking around my hard drive

really I did not know that, share brother, did you get any credit at least or did they pull a LucasFilm and claim intellectual property rights?

[Mommar]

really I did not know that, share brother, did you get any credit at least or did they pull a LucasFilm and claim intellectual property rights?

Has LucasFilm done that before???

[Knight26]

Has LucasFilm done that before???

Oh yeah, just ask the guys on sci-fi meshes a lot of talented 3D artists have given up star wars as a result

[Zinjo]

Oh yeah, just ask the guys on sci-fi meshes a lot of talented 3D artists have given up star wars as a result

Hmmm, I thought you might have been mistaking George "retcon" Lucas with Star Trek the "Berman years", where they tried to sue "fansites" for copyright infringement...

[Knight26]

Hmmm, I thought you might have been mistaking George "retcon" Lucas with Star Trek the "Berman years", where they tried to sue "fansites" for copyright infringement...

No not that, more like they took some fan designs and used them in official or authorized works and did not give credit to the creators, stating that lucasfilm owns all fan created derivative works.

[paramat]

Oooh that multitone VF-1D is so shiny it's gorgeous.

[dialNforNinja]

Technical question Sketchley - are you actually picking the highlight colors and painting them in normally, or using Soft/Hard Light layers and varying transparency to adjust the intensity? The first lets you do things with specularity, while the second makes changing the color layer underneath easier, so they both have their pros... I tend to use the latter myself, especially for things like 3d texture master files, precisely because it makes it so easy to swap out the base color scheme.

[sketchley]

Technical question Sketchley - are you actually picking the highlight colors and painting them in normally, or using Soft/Hard Light layers and varying transparency to adjust the intensity? The first lets you do things with specularity, while the second makes changing the color layer underneath easier, so they both have their pros... I tend to use the latter myself, especially for things like 3d texture master files, precisely because it makes it so easy to swap out the base color scheme.

I think you want to be directing that question at Mr.March.

Nevertheless, when I do coloured work:

After scanning and cleaning up the artwork (there's always something...), I keep the lineart layer on the top and put the blend mode to multiply.

Originally, I painted all the individual colours on multiple layers (though the tendency was to have many colours on one - you know, the whole artist in the zone thing) using soft round brushes at varying sizes and varying flows (usually from 5% to 25%). An example: (trying to mimic Tenjin Hidetaka with that one, but the brush strokes got too sloppy and the result was less than I hoped for.)

After reading an excellent tutorial by Genzoman(1) I switched to doing all the tones in greyscale under the lineart layer (multiple layers, see tutorial for ideas), and slapped on a couple of layers of solid paint below those. Example: (It's only really a two-tone grey scale, but I think the results came out a lot better than the preceding example. If I have more time, I'd like to experiment with the gradient tool and doing more with highlights and reflected colours, but that's not going to be happening for a while... especially because I've got a monochrome eye.)

(1) Tutorials

[Mr March]

really I did not know that, share brother, did you get any credit at least or did they pull a LucasFilm and claim intellectual property rights?

We must be careful not to misunderstand; we don't know for certain if the poster using my colored art was an "official" Big West production or just an individual vendor at a Japanese convention using internet pictures to advertise Macross merchandise. The property rights is a whole other issue. Technically, I can't own any rights to the images because the art is owned by Big West. Only the coloring is legally my own original creative content (at least according to Canadian law). So technically I can't use the images but neither can Big West. Of course, in REALITY, the one with the deeper pockets and the most lawyers can do whatever they want...which I assume is what happened in the Lucasfilm case you're describing.

Oooh that multitone VF-1D is so shiny it's gorgeous.

Yeah, I've completed all three modes in this style for the VF-1D Valkyrie (plus I now have enough line art for a VF-1D Color Code Transformation Guide, so I built one). I'm really happy with the coloring results. It's as close to the animated shows as I've been able to replicate...so far. I've got dozens of images completed for the next update using this style, from Valkyries to Gun Pods, to Vehicles to Enemy Mecha. It's gonna be full of bling

[Zinjo]

No not that, more like they took some fan designs and used them in official or authorized works and did not give credit to the creators, stating that lucasfilm owns all fan created derivative works.

So is Harmony Gold a subsidiary of LucasArts?

[dialNforNinja]

Yeah, I did meant to ask that of March, but got my names screwed up again somehow. I don't even have the excuse of them being similar this time...

For my own part, I'm pretty good about keeping only shadow on the shadows layer(s,) only highlights on the highlights layer(s,) and only white or black on the designated layers for cleaning line art/adding panel lines/etc, but yeah, anywhere that's actually intended for the multiply-on-color stage tends to get whatever's on the brush, unless I specifically need to do something different with it.

Even so, those are some good looking pieces as well, so I'm not sorry for that. Same question, Mr. March?

[sketchley]

Even so, those are some good looking pieces as well, so I'm not sorry for that. Same question, Mr. March?

No worries. It was a positive mistake and I hope that you've been able to get some new ideas on the process of making art.

[Mr March]

Damn dialNforNinja, you're making me feel like a one-night stand

My coloring was originally done in Photoshop CS using the multiply feature for the line art layer and then a sub-folder of various color layers. Currently I'm using Photoshop CS 5 (what an awesome program!) and pretty much use the same method. The line art layer is always on the very top of the layer stack, with all colors underneath. The primary color is stacked on the bottom, then comes a different solid color layer for the shadow on top, then followed by another solid color "deep shadow" layer on top of that and then followed finally by the solid color highlight layer on top of all that. The only thing that's changed much over the years are the number of color layers, improved software/hardware/technique. Generally, my goal is to recreate each piece as close to the best example of the "animated cell-shaded style" as it appeared in the original anime. There are examples of gradient shading shots and other more detailed paintings within the anime, but I want the best example of the "fully animated" version of the art for my website. Simple shadows, simply highlights and solid colors.

Previously I scanned everything at 1,200 DPI grayscale using the TWAIN support in Photoshop CS and saved it in .psd format. Now, I have a much better scanner, so I scan most art at 2,400 DPI grayscale using Epson software and save initially in .tiff format before converting to .psd. An individual piece of line art is typically 4,000 to 10,000 pixels in the largest dimension, the reason being to accomodate higher resolution displays in the future. With digital you can always scale down but you can't scale up

Typically I only use special effects when the individual piece of line art calls for it. The Hollywood Amusement Ship from Macross 7 was created using a single solid color layer and then a grayscale layer using the brush tool and selection tool. What you do is select the full color layer, then switch to your shading layer, choose the brush tool, make it VERY large and use a diffuse brush, shade outside the selected area so only the edges of the brush create a shadow and repeat as you see fit until you get a nice round, even and gradual shadow.

Lately I have been a limited number of transparency layers for glass highlights, especially on line art with a prominent piece of glass or cockpit. All I do is place a "white" layer over top of the line art layer (the only time I do this). I paint in the shape of the glass reflection that I want and then adjust the opacity of the layer so you can start to see the line art and colors underneath. The effect is very useful for giving the illusion of glass, at least in the simple style I'm using.

That's about it. If you need anything more, let me know. I'm happy to help.

[anime52k8]

Originally, I painted all the individual colours on multiple layers (though the tendency was to have many colours on one - you know, the whole artist in the zone thing) using soft round brushes at varying sizes and varying flows (usually from 5% to 25%). An example: http://studiootaking...g%2F142150&qo=9 (trying to mimic Tenjin Hidetaka with that one, but the brush strokes got too sloppy and the result was less than I hoped for.)

this is maybe a little off topic, but if you're interested in more naturalistic shading and achiving a painterly look, I highly recommend using the fallowing brush settings:

(fyi this will only work if you've got a tablet)

select a medium sized round brush with hardness set to 100% and spacing to 25%

disable shape dynamics completely.

enable Transfer (used to be 'other dynamics' prior to CS4/5) and set Opacity Jitter and Flow Jitter to pen pressure.

also enable airbrush mode, and depending on what you're working on enable wet edges.

now all you have to do is adjust the size of your brush as you work.

[sketchley]

t(fyi this will only work if you've got a tablet)

No tablet.

[Mr March]

This weekend got busy and I wasn't able to work as much on the art as I would have liked. I did manage to complete the VF-14 Fighter mode, but not the GERWALK as yet. I was also distracted from the VF-14 by a moment of inspiration I had for the final Varauta mecha to be updated. So I completed new scans and I am about half way done the Battroid mode for the FBz-99G Saubergeran. Going to work more this week and try to get all the Varauta pictures done and out of the way.