Secrets of the VF-14m7 P*L*U*S finally revealed!

[dialNforNinja]

Despite years of watching, the Valkyrie spotter community has only ever caught glimpses of this rare bird, in the form of fuzzy fighter and battroid shots, and a few seconds of disputed video footage. But now, the M7 PLUS varient of the VF-14 stands clearly revealed for all!

Gerwalk:

Battroid (rear):

Surely new, clean replacements of the old fuzz-balls can't be far behind!

UNaltered REPRODUCTION and DISSEMINATION of this IMPORTANT INFORMATION is ENCOURAGED!

(Battroid redrawn from the partial sketches in Macross Design Works, with reference to a couple of screen grabs from Spiritia Dreaming. Obviously, there's some interpretation there as well, but most of the details are from Kawamori drawings and/or animation. The Gerwalk is more my own invention, layered onto the basic airframe at least. Since the wings sweep far more sharply than the FZ-109, they have to swing forward as well as retracting the aft root panel to make room for the arms. Details are again mostly adapted from canon images of the early VF-14 or the FZ-109. And yes, I do mean to do the same treatment for the existing battroid front and fighter mode shots, just not right now.)

And yes, the usenet homage line means you can post these about on web sites etc. as long as you leave the attribution or if scaled particularly small replace it with an equivalent that is readable. If you want to color them, just add another line to say who done it while leaving mine alone, and that's cool too.

- dNN

Edited September 15, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[dialNforNinja]

A late thought is that if you mount a thin fin like the YF-21's head spike on the little nubbin at the back of the cockpit/backs section, this unit would exactly match the unidentified plane from Macross Plus. It wouldn't exactly be a major modification... it could even have been done by the General Galaxy team to test whatever that spike is for, an antenna for the active stealth maybe? Or the traditional laser, and the 14 rig was to test the antimissile capability or something. Engineers are cautious,

in a bird as packed with cutting edge and beyond systems as the 21 they'd want to test them individually before integrating them into the full up platform, and that one at a time.

[Mr March]

Um, holy fracking hell this is awesome? Wow! If you're interested, do a front view of the Fighter and Battroid and I'll color it and post it on my site.

[paramat]

Good work.

[valk1j]

Nice work, interested to see more.

[anime52k8]

interesting. I don't really agree with the inclusion of the split heel though.

[dialNforNinja]

March - it's in the works, but I needed to get some sleep and my fingers were sore.

As for the heel, all the official art we do have gets very vague around the feet, but given the design of all the Varauta versions I used the dual heel. Making a varient image with UNS solid heels wouldn't be too hard, though. I'll pop a couple out while I'm doing the others. I actually favor that interpretation too now that I've (literally!) slept on it.

[Mommar]

Maybe a front, but higher, view of Gerwalk as well? I like what I see here.

[dialNforNinja]

Now with more magical feets! Note that I did not change the filenames, so you'll need to do so for your local copies if you intend to keep both. March, I'd prefer these as the "main" version when you get around to webbing it.

(edit: WTF? those don't look right... Let's try that again.)

(edit2: Still no good... I am baffled. Will try juggling them about first.)

(In the words of Frank Zappa from "Jam In Joe's Garage," ONE! MORE! TIME!)

(Theeere we go. Apparently there was something wonky with the .png transparency setting, but they aren't supposed to be transparent anyway so I flattened the images and resaved and now they're looking right.)

Old art has been blued, and will probably be redrawn for tomorrow.

Edited September 16, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[Kelsain]

Very nice!

(null)

[dialNforNinja]

Okay, done. B, F, and another G from above. It's almost obscene how awesome they look, but I won't be able to scan them until morning. I hope you all can make it a few more hours without your VF-14M "Seven Plus" Vampire fix.

[dialNforNinja]

I just figured out where those armpit thrusters that would block transformation of the arms in the location shown in B/G could come from - mount them on a hinge at the bottom of the little semicircular piece between the torso and the big shoulder pads, and they could rotate 180 degrees to lie flush with the underside of fighter mode. Give them a swing arm or second axis of rotation and they could be in operating position to help F maneuverability or STOL performance.

[dialNforNinja]

Here it is, the moment you've all been holding your breath for! Redrawn verisons of the original F and B mode art, an F with added dorsal fin to match the one shown in Macross Plus Movie Edition, and an all-new, top 3/4 view Gerwalk. Let's have a big cheer for my new favorite variable fighter!

Mr. March, take it away! (Please do include the uncolored line art as well, though, when you put it up)

Edit: same problem with the Dusky Shark as I had before. D'oh.

Edited September 16, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[dialNforNinja]

... I just realised that I've got the wings upside down on the front Battroid view. Grrr. Fix later.

[dialNforNinja]

Hey March, what do you say to a full armor/variable half-armored version? (or anyone else, but he's the one with a web site) It would be based on the VF-1 Armored Gerwalk from the same page of MDW with the VF-4SD, with bits of VF-0, -11, and -25 Armored thrown in. Because of course in those trouser legs of time where the VF-14 beat the VF-11 into general procurement, they'd need a maximum firepower variant as well...

Also, I have decided to keep the wing transformation the way it is on the front view battroid, making the rear view the one that was wrong, allowing the wings to be put in that configuration to free the arm mobility up in gerwalk. This has absolutely nothing at all to do with my thoughts of a full-armor gerwalk, of course

[paramat]

Excellent line art, well proportioned, and that's a gorgeous gerwalk mode. I know how good your armoured variants are from looking at your CG art so i would encourage you to design that too if you want. It's great too see attention given to the more obscure and neglected VFs. On the subject of missing gerwalk modes i've been thinkng how good a FBZ-99G gerwalk would look, even though it seems to be considered a 2 mode transformation.

[dialNforNinja]

I've pondered that as well, but nothing serious - it transforms similarly but even more simply than the VA-3 Invader, which was also thought to be a 2-modes-only design at first, so it's at least not impossible.

[dialNforNinja]

Another general question to solicit opinions on - should the VF-14 have carbine style gunpods in its side leg bays like its Varauta descendants, or missile racks? The two B rear sketches and the animated scene they were probably from the storyboard for have a gunpod too large to fit any such bay, but the fighters are shown launching without any external stores despite their only known weapons being the aft lasers and shoulder racks that can't possibly hold more than two or three per tube.

[charger69]

Here it is, the moment you've all been holding your breath for! Redrawn verisons of the original F and B mode art, an F with added dorsal fin to match the one shown in Macross Plus Movie Edition, and an all-new, top 3/4 view Gerwalk. Let's have a big cheer for my new favorite variable fighter!

Mr. Kawamori should be proud of you

Another general question to solicit opinions on - should the VF-14 have carbine style gunpods in its side leg bays like its Varauta descendants, or missile racks? The two B rear sketches and the animated scene they were probably from the storyboard for have a gunpod too large to fit any such bay, but the fighters are shown launching without any external stores despite their only known weapons being the aft lasers and shoulder racks that can't possibly hold more than two or three per tube.

How about two revolver style pistols on each side??

Or two medium sized rail guns, jut like VF-2SS had

Let's think out of the box

Edited September 17, 2012 by charger69

[anime52k8]

Let's think out of the box

how about not...

[charger69]

how about not...

[sketchley]

Another general question to solicit opinions on - should the VF-14 have carbine style gunpods in its side leg bays like its Varauta descendants, or missile racks? The two B rear sketches and the animated scene they were probably from the storyboard for have a gunpod too large to fit any such bay, but the fighters are shown launching without any external stores despite their only known weapons being the aft lasers and shoulder racks that can't possibly hold more than two or three per tube.

All you need to know about the VF-14 (and all their really has been said in detail about it):

http://nomansland.site.nfoservers.com/MRG-Active-Archive//forums/index.php?topic=2481.msg37207#msg37207

http://nomansland.site.nfoservers.com/MRG-Active-Archive//forums/index.php?topic=2264.msg35166#msg35166

In short: it's got missile launchers and gun pod racks built into the legs.

There are no FAST Packs/Super Parts/Armour Packs because, just like the VF-4, the VF-14 has enough internal volume to provide more than enough propellant for the majority of missions it's deployed on. The VF-1 and VF-11, on the other hand, don't have enough propellant to be able to perform missions in space, thus the FAST Packs/Super Parts. The reason why both have an armoured version is the same reason why they were the main fighters of the Unified Forces during their peak: they had more versatility than their competitor (the VF(-X)-2 and the VF-14).

[dialNforNinja]

No, dammit, there are NO missile racks in the legs, at least not the way the FZ-109F shows them. There are ENGINES in the legs taking up that space. As for super parts, I like designing them, and have five views roughed out, so while (as I knew all along) they're entirely non-canon, and as rough as the original B-Club sketches for that matter, you get super parts: the VF-14 Half-Armored.

Yes, that last one is a completely new view, crappy as it is.

Why only half? Because it ejected (or didn't install) the ones that block transformation, namely a heavy ballistic shield (left arm) and plasma/particle/film scratch projector (right arm), large thrusters and auxiliary fuel tanks (legs), and a dual rail cannon turret (dorsal) from the gerwalk mode. The turret has stubby legs ending in wheels of its own allowing it to move around on the ground like an Octos using a drone brain or under remote control, or with a few minutes can have the other parts attached and become a somewhat pokey and piggish but serviceable drone flier for zero G. Due to the expense of the turret in particular, if possible reattaching it later or at least programming it to attempt to return under its own power is always recommended procedure.

Back to questions of gunpods (and I do appreciate your weighing in on canon, Sketchley, it's important to know exactly what is and is not so it can be properly tagged) there's absolutely no way the gunpods the VF-14 is actually shown holding will fit in the legs, not even if it was a beam pod that splits into two pistols lengthwise like some AZ-130s have. I already know there's no more art to be had, so the question becomes, should the leg gunpods be straight imports of the Varauta one (really the other way around IC) degribbled a bit to look more UNS than those, or what?

Don't dis the Macross II gunpods, they actually look pretty good. They're too long and not the right style for this project, though.

[sketchley]

No, dammit, there are NO missile racks in the legs, at least not the way the FZ-109F shows them.

there's absolutely no way the gunpods the VF-14 is actually shown holding will fit in the legs, not even if it was a beam pod that splits into two pistols lengthwise like some AZ-130s have. I already know there's no more art to be had, so the question becomes, should the leg gunpods be straight imports of the Varauta one (really the other way around IC) degribbled a bit to look more UNS than those, or what?

I'd go with de-gribbled Varohta types - as a) the VF-14 is reverse designed from the Fz-109, and b) it's made by the same company as the VF-17, which also stores gun pods in the legs.

As for gun pod size/missile issues - the engines on the VF-14 are definitely a lot smaller than the girth of the legs. There's some anime magic going on to fit everything in (but the same can be said of ALL the other VFs that have missile launchers in the engine nacelles - guns OR missiles, logically not both). That said, it's best not to dwell on such things as logic when it comes to a transforming aircraft, lest one's head blows up.

I'd make the gun pod reminiscent of the VF-9's. Which is double plus good: on the one hand it's main by the same company (General Galaxy) as the VF-14 and VF-17, and on the other hand, it's also a smaller sized gun pod due to the smaller size of the VF-9. At the very least, it's reasonable to presume that General Galaxy has more experience with a smaller sized gun pod, and may be the main reason for the VF-14 to have such a small internal gun pod (that large external one? Strapped on the belly like a regular gun pod, of course).

The more I think about it the more I get the impression that the VF-14 relies on the beam guns (engine nacelle/shoulders or rear/chest) for ranged attacks, and the gun pod for close-range action. Almost giving the impression that the gun pod should be sub-machine gun-like in design and operation.

Hope this gives some food for thought.

Edited September 17, 2012 by sketchley

[sketchley]

PS the Armour Packs have to be rethought somewhat.

Besides significantly or completely obstructing the built-in weapons, they obstruct a large part of the cockpit's field of view.

I recommend applying the leg's ergonomically rounded design to the rest of the packs, and remove the nose radome. I can see where you're trying to go with it, but it doesn't work in either mode. Perhaps a radar array like the VF-25 Armour Pack or Destroid Defender will fit a bit better? [ultimately it's secondary to maintaining a consistent design pattern - rounded, aerodynamic edges - throughout the design of the packs].

[Mommar]

Don't listen to anime2k, I like your idea. At the very least the fact you tried to think of a solution.

[dialNforNinja]

I did say as how the armor was rather rough, the result of figuring out what it looks like while drawing it rather than concentrating on getting it smooth - also, my .8mm pen ran out of ink, my .5 is at that stage where the lines get thin and light before running out, so I have to buy more before continuing. If anyone's curious, they're a Pilot P-500 Extra Fine and Uni-ball Vision Elite, nothing fancy but cheap and effective for getting two line weights, a wrinkle I'd forgotten on the FZ-109 Kai. Oops.

[dialNforNinja]

The radome I was already waffling on and shortening the chest parts by a row of missiles will let the lasers at least get horizontal, sliding it further forward onto the belly in F frees them further but causes issues with the legs in G- my original VFs have such tight armor designs because they're made with them from the start like the VF-25, not later additions like this. I'm more inclined to put a solid canopy over the entire cockpit, use a B/Varauta/VF-27 style fully virtual environment, and make those

Edited September 17, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[dialNforNinja]

top/back units larger than the reverse. As for the shoulder tubes, the box launchers have those cutouts to keep from blocking them. The hip parts keep the added thruters from fouling the engines and are limited to a long narrow shape by the available space.

All of this discussion is exactly what I wanted with posting the roughs, though.

Multipost due to the psp browser's input field being text message sized

Edited September 17, 2012 by dialNforNinja

[dialNforNinja]

Along with takung up the full non-arm-cutout depth of the leg, a further problem with the FZ-109F leg missle racks is that that's the best place to put the landing gear. You could have it spider legs long from the center/back piece on either side of where the cockpit sits in B, but one of the 14's key points is that it's durable and easy to maintain, which long fragile landing gear is not. Maybe gear there, guns on the outside, and missiles on the inside? They could launch forward (down in F) like the VF19

[sketchley]

I did say as how the armor was rather rough, the result of figuring out what it looks like while drawing it rather than concentrating on getting it smooth - also, my .8mm pen ran out of ink, my .5 is at that stage where the lines get thin and light before running out, so I have to buy more before continuing. If anyone's curious, they're a Pilot P-500 Extra Fine and Uni-ball Vision Elite, nothing fancy but cheap and effective for getting two line weights, a wrinkle I'd forgotten on the FZ-109 Kai. Oops.

I recommend the Tachikawa School Pen. http://www.jetpens.com/Tachikawa-Comic-Nib-Fountain-Pen-School-Model-Nib-Extra-Fine-Black-Ink/pd/4578

Provides a decent variation in line weight, and are really excellent for their price (slightly above the disposable price point, but due to the replacement ink cartridges, if you do need to replace it, it doesn't cost an arm and a leg).

Of course, nothing beats a G-pen nib dip pen, but when it comes to detail, one doesn't need the 0.1 to 2.0 mm variation in line weight.

[paramat]

Nice wing folding idea on the gerwalk.

[dialNforNinja]

Nah, nib pens are a pain in the patoot, and I hate the kind you dip almost as much charcoal, which is right at the top the list. I don't even like technical pens, and get results about as good from the thin-ink kind of disposable ballpoint for a tenth the price... If I'm really being fancy or waterproofing matters for some reason I break out the Ultra Fine Point permanent markers, but the $2 disposables give a nice even line weight as long as you have a steady hand and put a couple of scrap sheets under it

[charger69]

Don't listen to anime2k, I like your idea. At the very least the fact you tried to think of a solution.

Thank you Mommar, you are a good man

As far as I understand, while transforming from fighter mode to gerwalk mode shoulder parts slide over to engine nacelles. It might be problematic while transforming, what if you just leave the shoulder parts over nacelles in fighter mode like VF-4?

Edited September 18, 2012 by charger69

[Mommar]

Everyone keeps talking about missiles in the legs but aren't those technically missile tubes in the shoulders? The elongated "gem" design has been the classic way Kawamori has always designated where internal missile holdings were.