The Unlicensed Third Party Transformers Thread

[mikeszekely]

4 hours ago, JB0 said:

I really like Cybertron Optimus, perhaps by way of my Powermaster Prime affection.

Then you'll be glad to know that MT is planning on doing Cybertron Optimus (and yes, I'll probably get him and write about him when it happens.

Also that Fans Hobby is doing Powermaster Op.  (And that I'm planning on getting that one, too.)

1 hour ago, Kuma Style said:

And honestly, I don't see MT going farther than mainstays like Prime, Megatron, Starscream (and redecos,) hot spot, etc. etc..

I guess that's less than ideal for Galaxy Force/Cybertron fans, but honestly, I hope you're right.  Me personally, I'd rather they did RiD Optimus, Armada Optimus, Starscream, and Megatron, and Energon Megatron (and Optimus, if they take enough liberties and make one that isn't fat and crappy) before they did someone like Landmine.

1 hour ago, no3Ljm said:

I can't help but notice, but that Leonidas kinda felt like a crossover between Zoids and Transformers. I'm really not a Transformers guy, well except for some G1 stuff. So basically, I can't keep track on who's who. But I like how it looks.

Ostensibly, Leonidas is Lio Convoy, a character from the Japanese-only Beast Wars II anime.  In the anime, just like the original Beast Wars cartoon (at least before Transmetals), Lio Convoy and the other Beast Wars II characters had mostly normal-looking, organic beast modes.

However, in more recent times, a fan created a pair of doujinshi called T-Beast.  In it, the artist reimagined some Beast Wars characters as well as some G1 characters with mechanical beast modes.  AFAIK, that's basically the version of Lio Convoy that Perfect Effect (and NeoArt) used as the basis for Leonidas.

Fun fact, it's also the basis for Generation Toys' upcoming Optimus Primal.  Apparently they're going to do a Sideswipe that turns into a bull and a Rodimus that turns into a mountain lion, too.

They're pretty cool art books, worth checking out.

(As for GT's figures, I'm down for Primal and would probably be cool if they did the main Beast Wars cast, but I'm not really interested in rebuying my G1 characters with funky animal alt modes.)

[no3Ljm]

29 minutes ago, mikeszekely said:

Fun fact, it's also the basis for Generation Toys' upcoming Optimus Primal.  Apparently they're going to do a Sideswipe that turns into a bull and a Rodimus that turns into a mountain lion, too.

Hey Mike! Thanks for the trivia. Good to know that I learned something about this new TF figures. Though I got lost on everything but this one piqued my interest since I only buy Hot Rod/imus. But just so you know not everything. Just the ones that I really like.  

Any chance that we have a sketch or drawing for that Mountain Lion Rodimus?

 

Edited October 4, 2017 by no3Ljm

[Scyla]

I still want a Big Convoy from PE in the style of Leonidas.

Kuma, do you know if there are recasts of the Leonidas swords available? They are the only thing missing from my Xerxes.

Maybe someone does a black and teal version of Origin Leonidas that comes with the swords and hilts.

[mikeszekely]

7 hours ago, no3Ljm said:

Any chance that we have a sketch or drawing for that Mountain Lion Rodimus?

[Scyla]

Diecst reviews MTs Meteor: 

 

Now I have to say I like what MT did here but there are a few things I don't comprehend. 

First, why is there nothing on the underside of the wings. I can't imagine that it would costs that much to produce two pieces more. On the other hand maybe the would need another set steel molds to cast those since the wings are fairly big. Nevertheless I would have paid the price.

This is a general issue with most of the 3rd party items I receive nowadays and across the companies. They start to implement engineering techniques to save money, something I usually see with HasTak. No trap doors to hide obvious robot elements, omitting parts, not painting areas, etc.

One of the reasons I was intrigued by the 3rd party movement was that they're not limited by the same restraints that HasTak has. However the MO nowadays seems to be: not just good but good enough. I can understand why they do it (to safe money) but I don't like it. Compared to my other collectible toy lines the Transformers always seem to be lacking in aspects that are important to me.

The other issue is that this Starscream follows the new animation accurate style of the recent Masterpiece releases by Takara. I know why they did it because it has a wider appeal now but here is my reasoning why this might not be a sound decision: I thing that Takara will release a new Masterpiece seeker mold since the MP-03 mold is that old. I believe this and a new Optimus Prime will be announced soon which will cut off the demand for Meteor. Also MT produced the MP Megatron for my collection. Despotron and MP-10 just look grand together. MP-36 not so much.

On the other hand you have a good chunk of the MP collectors that want their toys to follow the design aesthetic of MP-10 so there is a market for a new Seeker mold  that neither Hasbro nor the 3rd party market satisfy yet. Maybe MT thought that this market share was captured by the ToyWorld Seekers but ToyWorld seems to be in a though spot right now and while I like what they did with the Coneheads I think a majority of the collector scene things they are too big for their collection.

So everything they did has good reasons behind it. It just isn't aligned with my preferences so maybe my sensibilities are not representative of the market. 

Two other things. There seems to be an issue with the nosecone section not staying attached that well which is also a shame but maybe they will correct this with the main production run. I also wished they would have done something with the intakes on Meteors chest. Why not have them swivel to the side of the jet and flip the black bits so it doesn't look that obvious like a chest when looking at it from the underside. 

Well at least MT opted not to use the terribly swirly gray plastic for the main body (thank god) so maybe this is the Starscream for me.

[mikeszekely]

8 minutes ago, Scyla said:

First, why is there nothing on the underside of the wings. I can't imagine that it would costs that much to produce two pieces more. On the other hand maybe the would need another set steel molds to cast those since the wings are fairly big. Nevertheless I would have paid the price.

From what I was told MT tried to cast non-hollow wings and the plastic warped, hence the need to go to the hollow wings.  Now they could have made parts to fit on the underside, but yes, they'd have to have new steel molds for them.  Those molds are VERY expensive, and it was estimated that they'd add a minimum of $20 per figure, possibly more.  While it's easy enough for you or I to say that we'd pay it, the 3P market in general seems to be tighter with their money lately.  There was a lot of criticism that Downbeat was too expensive because the earlier official MP cars cost less despite the fact that most 3P toys that size had previously been around Downbeat's $99 price, and I've noticed that some of MT's other recent Re:Master figures have been discounted in MT's own store.  Galaxy Meteor dropped $40 everywhere before it was even released.  MT had to make a call, and it seems that they bet that most people wouldn't be willing to pay the extra, especially when they're competing against YesModel and BB7's cheaper MP-11 KOs.  Plus a lot of people are going to be thinking, "This looks good, but is it good enough to replace the MP-11 I already have?"

[Kuma Style]

3 hours ago, Scyla said:

I still want a Big Convoy from PE in the style of Leonidas.

Kuma, do you know if there are recasts of the Leonidas swords available? They are the only thing missing from my Xerxes.

Maybe someone does a black and teal version of Origin Leonidas that comes with the swords and hilts.

Not that I know of. I dig the xerxes claws but I wish he had the swords for a more complete look. I'll actually message perfect effect about it later.

@mikeszekely I don't see it as unfortunate as the majority of the fanbase doesn't wasn't,  let alone expect  third party company to do e very character of a given series. I don't know how familiar you are with UT but the cast got significantly larger compared to G1 with a ton more throwaway characters. 

 

[no3Ljm]

3 hours ago, mikeszekely said:

Wow! That's the first time I've seen that.   SOLD!

Not sure now if I'm mad at you for showing that to me. Hahaha! But man, thanks for that.   I don't care if he's the reason Prime got killed in the first place but he's going to be mine... soon.

Any more info about this toy if ever? And how good is Generation Toy as a 3P? Can you give me an idea how much their TF toys cost? Thanks!  

 

[Scyla]

2 hours ago, mikeszekely said:

From what I was told MT tried to cast non-hollow wings and the plastic warped, hence the need to go to the hollow wings.  Now they could have made parts to fit on the underside, but yes, they'd have to have new steel molds for them.  Those molds are VERY expensive, and it was estimated that they'd add a minimum of $20 per figure, possibly more.  While it's easy enough for you or I to say that we'd pay it, the 3P market in general seems to be tighter with their money lately.  There was a lot of criticism that Downbeat was too expensive because the earlier official MP cars cost less despite the fact that most 3P toys that size had previously been around Downbeat's $99 price, and I've noticed that some of MT's other recent Re:Master figures have been discounted in MT's own store.  Galaxy Meteor dropped $40 everywhere before it was even released.  MT had to make a call, and it seems that they bet that most people wouldn't be willing to pay the extra, especially when they're competing against YesModel and BB7's cheaper MP-11 KOs.  Plus a lot of people are going to be thinking, "This looks good, but is it good enough to replace the MP-11 I already have?"

See I would have paid the $20 extra to have the wings enclosed but I understand the reason for it. I just don't like it. Thank you for the info on that.

I feel like there should be a company catering to my likings given the plethora of 3rd party manufacturers but everyone seems to jump just as high as the limits Takara sets. Sometimes these culminate to a pretty abysmal collectible.

FansToys is pretty close to my preferences but then they have outliers  like Spindrift (no paint) and Tesla (all in all aweful). Now FansToys is having a "budget line" with their Perfect Fusion releases and reviews for their Cesium leave me worried about their Quietus release . MMCs OX line was also there but just with their first release Sphinx after that it went downhill. 

Maketoys is sometimes releasing great figures like Despotorn and than other like Downbeat could be perfect but they release it with missing paint on the shins, feet and weapons and instead give us that swirly plastic because apparently that is good enough since Takara used it on their MP-11 Starscream.

It seems that I'm rambling an awful lot here but I still enjoy my Masterpiece Transformers (otherwise I wouldn't buy them) but lately I have the feeling of disappointment more often than not. Which is a shame because none of the figures I bought are bad they are just lacking in one or more department of making them truly great. 

[Sandman]

5 hours ago, mikeszekely said:

I like this. They should a Rodimus Prime upgrade version who transforms into a bigger lion?

[Tking22]

I am getting VERY excited for Howling Meteor. I don't own a single MP seeker, not official, or KO, I've been waiting on something more, something better, and this guy looks like it. Oddly enough, I blatantly HATE the toon direction the official MP line is going in, and HM is clearly more toon accurate then MP-11, but I still think he looks superior in pretty much every way. Early reviews are solid, either the nearly 100% toon look is your thing or it isn't. As I said, for me, it USUALLY isn't, but once again, this guy looks leaps and bounds better then MP-11, so I'm excited to finally get some MP seeker action.

[no3Ljm]

Hey @mikeszekely. Is the Generation Toys Sideswipe figure really going to happen if ever? I saw a photo of the lineart and it looks cool. It's cool that they make it Bull for Lamborghini. If so, then it means I need to get an MP Sideswipe too.

 

[derex3592]

See--I'm on the other side of the fence...I think the MP-11 is waaay better in fighter mode, granted the MakeToys robot mode is more poseable, but ohh man...that one piece that kept coming off in the review...no thanks!  I'll keep my MP-11 Starscream.

 

 

[Ignacio Ocamica]

It's a pity but clearly Howling Meteor is not the Starscream for me. I understand the cartoon accurate fans, but it is too plain for my taste. I would like more surface details. 

[Chronocidal]

1 hour ago, derex3592 said:

See--I'm on the other side of the fence...I think the MP-11 is waaay better in fighter mode, granted the MakeToys robot mode is more poseable, but ohh man...that one piece that kept coming off in the review...no thanks!  I'll keep my MP-11 Starscream.

I'm on that oddball physically impossible third side of the fence that wishes everyone would go back to the MP-03 mold, clean up the blocky legs, and find a better way to stash the hip kibble, like the DX9 versions that fold it up behind the wings.  The pseudo-Strike Eagle frame just helped so much to hide the robot.  I absolutely love the RobotHero oversized MP-11, but I'd love to see someone bring back the clean profile from the original Greenscream.

It's weird though, almost like there's some underlying difference about transformers based on real aircraft... I feel like you can get away with artistic interpretations of cars and such pretty easily, as long as they look good, but the instant you make something modeled after an iconic aircraft design, you have to either go hyper-realistic with the styling, or just make a cool looking plane, and give up trying to look accurate.  There doesn't seem to be much middle ground. 

[mikeszekely]

2 hours ago, no3Ljm said:

Hey @mikeszekely. Is the Generation Toys Sideswipe figure really going to happen if ever? I saw a photo of the lineart and it looks cool. It's cool that they make it Bull for Lamborghini. If so, then it means I need to get an MP Sideswipe too.

 

They announced it as GT-11, but only as a silhouette. I'd expect their bomber Megatron first (soon, really), then either all of their Defensor and Optimus Primal or some of their Defensor, Optimus Primal, then the rest of their Defensor first. That's at least a year, probably more, before Sideswipe. And if I were a betting man, I'd say Primal is released in the middle of Defensor, and Primal's sales will determine if they go forward with the T-Beast designs or cancel it.

Edited October 4, 2017 by mikeszekely

[mikeszekely]

You guys wanted it, and here it is: my review of Meteor, Maketoys take on a masterpiece G1 Starscream.  And yeah, it's just Meteor on the box and instructions... MT must have ditched the Howling part somwhere along the way.

How you feel about Meteor, aesthetically, will probably be informed by how you like newer MPs like Megatron and Inferno vs Optimus and the MP cars.  Meteor is cartoon accurate to a fault.  He's lacking any detail inside his shoulder intakes, save for a pair of molded triangles that match the cartoon's animation model.  He's got some black paint in his chest vents, but no rotors.  Where the official MPs and even ToyWorld's coneheads have raised sections on the shins, similar to the G1 toys, Meteor just has painted trapezoids.  Meteor really looks like he jumped out of the cartoon, but I do prefer my MP toys to look like the robots the simplified animation models could have been based on, not the animation models themselves.  This is how Takara is doing things now, though, and I can't deny that it's a very spot-on Starscream.

The materials are quite good.  I think the plain look and the glossy paint MT used make him look a bit cheap in photos, but in hand the plastic feels great and he's got lots of paint and even some diecast.

Size-wise, he's basically the same size as MP-03 (and I think MP-11), and way shorter than ToyWorld's Coneheads.  If Starscream were shorter than Skywarp and Thundercracker that'd really bug me, but I guess I don't mind the Coneheads being bigger, as long as the Coneheads are the same size relative to each other.  But I digress...

I think he even cleans up on the back pretty well.  I don't know about the MP-11 mold, but even with some nosecone and a buttflap back there I feel like he's got less nose cone and less kibble than at least MP-03.  And yes, the wings aren't quite filled in back there, but I'm finding that it looks worse in photos than it seems in hand.  I think that's a running theme with this guy; pictures really don't do him any favors.  Really, I'm not even sure how well it's turning up in the photos, but most of Meteor isn't white but a very light gray.

Meteor doesn't come with a ton of accessories, but I don't really need him to.  You've got his null rays, which are the important thing.  You've also got two white bits that I wasn't entirely sure what they were for at first, and the instructions don't mention them.  You aslo have two alternate faces and an alternate head with a hand molded onto it.  The faces are a shade too dark, and they're tough to photograph.  You've basically got an open-mouth yelling/whining face, a neutral face, and a smirking face.  Again, photos aren't doing him any favors, as the smirking face looks pretty bad zoomed in like this but it looks perfect on the toy.

The extra head with the molded hand is half an accessory for Meteor, and half an accessory for MT's earlier Despotron figure.  Basically, you pop Meteor's head off the ball joint.  The replacement head pops onto the ball joint, but there's a slot at the wrist of the molded hand that fits onto the mushroom peg you'll reveal if you pop Despotron's left hand off.  When it's properly set up on both figures, what you have is Despotron choking Meteor.

If there's one thing that's going to set Meteor apart from other versions of the Seekers it's going to be articulation.  Meteor has it in spades.  His head is on a ball joint.  Rotating his head, looking down, and tilting his head is no problem.  He can't, however, look up.  Well, he's a flyer, not a minibot, so I'm not too fussed.  Moving along, his wings are hinged so they can fold back a bit, and another hinge lets them swing outward.  His shoulders can rotate and extend 90 degrees out to the sides.  He has bicep swivels and double-jointed elbows that don't quite fold all the way around but do get well over the 90 degrees most figures seem to get.  His wrists swivel.  His thumb is fixed, his index finger is individually pinned at the base with a second pinned mid-knuckle so he can point, while the remaining three fingers are molded together and pinned just at the base.  Unlike MP-03/MP-11, Meteor has a waist swivel.  Going one better, due to his transformation he has an ab crunch, too.  His hip skirts and butt flap are on hinges and can move out of the way so that he can 90 degrees backward and over 90 degrees forward on soft ratchets, and over 90 degrees laterally on a friction joint.  His thighs can swivel.  His knees are double jointed.  The upper joint is a very stiff ratchet that only seems to get maybe two clicks, while the lower joint is a strong friction hinge.  Combined, you get maybe 120-130 degrees of bend.  Hinges on the inside of his legs give his entire foot about 45 degrees of inward ankle tilt, but aside from that his foot is a little weird.  Due to his transformation, the blue part of his feet are on a double-jointed ratchet that allows him to bend his toes down, but also to move that whole part of his foot up and down.  In any case, it's not difficult to get Meteor into some very dynamic poses.

Of course, Meteor turns into an F-15.  I'm not going to judge it against any real F-15s for accuracy; MP-11 probably makes a better "realistic" jet.  What I will say is that the jet is pretty cartoon-accurate.  He's even got a pair of gray panels to match the cartoon, although they're sitting a bit forward.  I do wish they'd have painted the hinges in the middle of his vertical stabs, though, so the red stripes would have been continuous.  I'll also say that, while I know we have our aviation enthusiasts here that if what I wanted was a good-looking F-15 I'd buy a nice F-15 model kit.  If sacrifices are made to the alt mode to make a good robot mode, I'm ok with that.

The transformation is different.  It takes a little getting used to, especially the way his nosecone kind of explodes then reforms or the way his torso kind of folds in on itself to make room for his arms, but one you know what you're doing it's a much better experience than MP-03/11, and I think even better than ToyWorld's.  Just be advised that the front of the nosecone is connected via something like a c-clip, and it'll probably come off during transformation.  That's probably better than breaking off, and it's just during transformation; once you have him in either mode it's not going to come off during regular handling.

Size-wise, he again is extremely close to MP-03 (and by extension MP-11).  He's also pretty close in size to ToyWorld's Seekers in jet mode (which is another reason why I'm generally ok with their somewhat larger bot modes).

So about those white bits that I said I wasn't sure about at first?  What I figured out was that you can pull the barrels off of the null rays and peg the white bits in their place.  What you're left with is something that's not the missiles you get with other Seekers, but something akin to the G1 toy's swappable missiles.  The result is also some very cartoon-style weapons under his wings.  It's a nice touch, but without a place to store the smaller tips in bot mode or a place to store the null ray barrels in jet mode I and probably most people will just stick with the null rays and leave the smaller tips in the box with the extra faces.

The underside in general is a bit less tidy than some of the other Seeker options, but I find that sort of evocative of the cartoon as well.

While Meteor's got enough panel lines molded onto this mode, he's lacking some of the touches found on toys like MP-11.  He has landing gear, but it's molded into the shape of wheels and doesn't actually have rolling wheels.  He's lacking the air brake and radar inside the nosecone.  His engine nozzles do rotate for transformation, but they're not ball-jointed so you can't pretend he's got thrust vectoring.  His feet are also pretty noticeable back there.  You can open his canopy, but there's no seats or any cockpit details inside.  Speaking of the cockpit, MT eschewed the sort of translucent canopy you'd expect and instead put translucent gold plastic over silver paint.  It's a less realistic but more cartoony look, which goes back to what I said earlier about making sacrifices in alt mode for a better-looking bot.

I do indeed recommend Meteor.  He's a tad plain, especially in photos, but he really does look the part.  I think he's got better proportions, he's much more solid in robot mode, and he's got much better articulation than pretty much any other option you have.  I think a fair number of people are going to be turned off by the too-cartoony aesthetic, the unfinished underside of the wings, or the fact that he can't look up, though.  Personally, I think the better articulation, better robot proportions, and better transformation make up for the extreme cartoon look.  If you don't have an MP Starscream Meteor is unquestionably the best version of him currently available and as close to a no-brainer as you're going to get.  By now, though, a lot of you probably already have MP-03, MP-11, or one of the various KOs of MP-11 floating around.  You may be thinking that MP-11 fits better with the older MP aesthetic, and you might be thinking that Meteor has enough little flaws that it's not worth shelling out $120 to replace what you have (let alone replacing ALL of your Seekers with new ones).  And to you guys, say you should reconsider.  Meteor is that good in hand.

[Scyla]

It‘s funny that the fist accessory is for connecting and old MP style toy with a new, super cartoon accurate MP style toy.  

[JB0]

Does this mean that Howling Meteor and Despotron are now a combiner?

[Scyla]

Sure, why not.

[JB0]

In seriousness, I think that the "choked by not-Megatron" head is a brilliant accessory... which makes it more a pity that Howling Meteor is so bereft of detail that he looks like a vinyl statue instead of a "proper toy".

[Scyla]

I have trouble to understand why anyone would champion the cartoon only aesthetic.

The G1 cartoon was produced on a budget and the models don’t look intriguing and are not interesting to look at.

I myself prefer the ideas behind the MP-10 approach. 

[mikeszekely]

15 hours ago, Scyla said:

I have trouble to understand why anyone would champion the cartoon only aesthetic.

The G1 cartoon was produced on a budget and the models don’t look intriguing and are not interesting to look at.

I myself prefer the ideas behind the MP-10 approach. 

I agree, but I'll say again that Meteor really does look better in person than he photographs.  The red paint on his torso is almost metallic, and he does have a fair bit of panel lines on his wings.  I'd have preferred more detail, sure, especially in the chest vents and shoulder intakes, but I think Meteor has MUCH better proportions than MP-03/11 and I'm still very happy with Meteor.  I've had him on the shelf next to Despotron for awhile, and Meteor really doesn't look out of place.  In fact, with Despotron's extra beefy silhouette, together they kind of remind me of the old Revoltech figures.

Well, I'm not in the business of telling people that they're right or wrong regarding their own personal collection.  If people think Meteor is too plain, and that bothers them more than MP-11's offish proportions, lack of ariculation, and floppy torso then they gotta do what's right for them.  My opinion, though, is that Meteor is excellent despite his overly cartoonish appearance.  I still recommend him.

[nhyone]

15 hours ago, Scyla said:

I have trouble to understand why anyone would champion the cartoon only aesthetic.

Because they look nice? 

HM is very cartoon-like, but he looks fine to me -- he's not too bland. Iron Hide and Inferno are too bland, especially in their lower legs.

Why do they have to use a black face? Should have it in silver.

The toys, especially 3P ones, were often too "busy" with panel lines and detailing. There's a middle ground somewhere. Takara has gone too far into the cartoon aesthetic, but HM does it well, IMO.

[mikeszekely]

21 minutes ago, nhyone said:

Why do they have to use a black face? Should have it in silver.

The original G1 toy, the G1 Pretender, and the G1 Action Master all have a black face.  His face isn't silver in the cartoon, either.

That said, I think the glossy dark gray that MT used for Meteor is too dark.  A couple of people have repainted him with a metallic gunmetal, and that works really good.  I'm not doing anything now since I'm going on a long business trip early next week, but when I get back I'm going to buy an airbrush and, when I feel comfortable with it, repaint at least one of Meteor's faces as well as Despotron's shins.

[Scyla]

8 hours ago, mikeszekely said:

I agree, but I'll say again that Meteor really does look better in person than he photographs.  The red paint on his torso is almost metallic, and he does have a fair bit of panel lines on his wings.  I'd have preferred more detail, sure, especially in the chest vents and shoulder intakes, but I think Meteor has MUCH better proportions than MP-03/11 and I'm still very happy with Meteor.  I've had him on the shelf next to Despotron for awhile, and Meteor really doesn't look out of place.  In fact, with Despotron's extra beefy silhouette, together they kind of remind me of the old Revoltech figures.

*snip*

Well, I'm not in the business of telling people that they're right or wrong regarding their own personal collection.  If people think Meteor is too plain, and that bothers them more than MP-11's offish proportions, lack of ariculation, and floppy torso then they gotta do what's right for them.  My opinion, though, is that Meteor is excellent despite his overly cartoonish appearance.  I still recommend him.

For me the added lines makes it even more difficult to accept this design choice. It is the same with MP Ironhide and Inferno. They want to make it so it looks like a real car in alt mode (Inferno fails here) and like the G1 cartoon in bot mode. This is an interesting take but to me it looks like the toy has schizophrenia; make up your mind! For Ironhide you have this super bland robot with a realistic looking chest, that doesn't capture the cartoon model.

For Meteor it is the same. The legs have no detail on the front or the outside but on the back and on the inside -> ?!?!?!?!  It also draws attention to the lines where the two halves of the  leg (and arms) meet. This makes them super obnoxious to me since there is nothing else for your eyes there to focus on.

If you want to go with realistic (licensed) alt-modes you can't go with a cartoon accurate bot-mode in my opinion. It will just look weird. No matter now much details Takara tries to drown in paint on Lambor/Alert they will never fit into the post MP-22 line to me. 

I think I could go for a Masterpiece line that goes full out cartoon aesthetic but consistency is key for my toy collection and I subscribed to the design ideas that MP-10 and onwards brought to the table and I want the rest of my MP collection to follow suit. The lack of consistency from Takara is driving me mad to a point where I'm thinking about selling my whole MP collection and focusing on other stuff. 

Funny enough I have less problems with the new Transformers from the movie and season 3 having less detail. Probably because they have futuristic alt-modes and the movie is a mental divider between S1/2 and S3. This makes it easier to accept them in my collection.

 

[David Hingtgen]

For being so "toon-accurate", it's odd that Howling Meteor has such MP-ish engine nozzles, nothing like the original toon or toy.  (I'd bet a lot of money they just looked at MP-03 and said "I guess that's what early 1980's F-15 nozzles look like") 

It'd have been so much easier and better-looking, to do a simpler typical nozzle, like the G1 toy/toon/real early 80's F-15's had.    

[mikeszekely]

2 hours ago, David Hingtgen said:

For being so "toon-accurate", it's odd that Howling Meteor has such MP-ish engine nozzles, nothing like the original toon or toy.  (I'd bet a lot of money they just looked at MP-03 and said "I guess that's what early 1980's F-15 nozzles look like") 

It'd have been so much easier and better-looking, to do a simpler typical nozzle, like the G1 toy/toon/real early 80's F-15's had.    

Do you have a pic of the kind of nozzles you mean?

[nhyone]

This has not been brought up here, but if you like G1 toys, you might like Transformers G1 Unofficial Photographic Archive Vintage Toys: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1052752228/transformers-g1-unofficial-photographic-archive-vi

8 more days to go. Pricey, though.

Edited October 8, 2017 by nhyone
Change to link

[Silverstreak]

On 07/10/2017 at 1:48 PM, mikeszekely said:

I agree, but I'll say again that Meteor really does look better in person than he photographs.  The red paint on his torso is almost metallic, and he does have a fair bit of panel lines on his wings.  I'd have preferred more detail, sure, especially in the chest vents and shoulder intakes, but I think Meteor has MUCH better proportions than MP-03/11 and I'm still very happy with Meteor.  I've had him on the shelf next to Despotron for awhile, and Meteor really doesn't look out of place.  In fact, with Despotron's extra beefy silhouette, together they kind of remind me of the old Revoltech figures.

Well, I'm not in the business of telling people that they're right or wrong regarding their own personal collection.  If people think Meteor is too plain, and that bothers them more than MP-11's offish proportions, lack of ariculation, and floppy torso then they gotta do what's right for them.  My opinion, though, is that Meteor is excellent despite his overly cartoonish appearance.  I still recommend him.

Your write-ups are always a good read. Have you considered a way of indexing them? Once or twice I've wanted to go back and read your thoughts on something I was thinking of getting but it's buried in the vast depths of this thread.

 

And while I agree with you that Meteor looks superior to the MP-11 mould, and might be worth the extra, I, like many, many other masterpiece collectors are already at least 6 versions deep in the seeker mould. So it's not a decision of simply replacing one character in your collection, but the possibility of replacing a significant portion of our collections. MakeToys have also only released Starscream. There is no guarantee that they will make the rest. Also, Takara may have another crack at the seekers in the future, and with so much other product competing for our money,  you can then understand why people are hesitant to dive in on Meteor.

[Scyla]

8 hours ago, nhyone said:

This has not been brought up here, but if you like G1 toys, you might like Transformers G1 Unofficial Photographic Archive Vintage Toys: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1052752228/transformers-g1-unofficial-photographic-archive-vi

8 more days to go. Pricey, though.

What really kills this for me is that shipping to Europe will cost the same amount of money than the two books.  

Edited October 8, 2017 by Scyla

[nhyone]

2 hours ago, Scyla said:

What really kills this for me is that shipping to Europe will cost the same amount of money than the two books.  

There are two ways about it.

First, if you could find someone in the same vicinity (e.g. city), you could pair up with him. That would bring down the shipping drastically, well, US$45 per person.

Second, look for a shipping forwarder. They have cheaper rates, but it would still be US$30+ (plus the local US$15 shipping).

I was going to use option 2 (there is a relatively cheap shipper to Singapore), and I estimated the shipping to be US$25 (so total of US$40). But then I found someone local who had ordered it, so I asked him to order two sets instead, and he agreed to help me. 

However you slice it, overseas shipping from US is not going to be cheap...

Edited October 8, 2017 by nhyone

[nhyone]

On 10/7/2017 at 11:14 AM, mikeszekely said:

The original G1 toy, the G1 Pretender, and the G1 Action Master all have a black face.  His face isn't silver in the cartoon, either.

That said, I think the glossy dark gray that MT used for Meteor is too dark.

It's not about accuracy. Black / dark faces don't show up well, unless they are very well lit -- to the point of overexposure. Their expressions are just lost. Faces should be light / bright.

Edited October 8, 2017 by nhyone

[David Hingtgen]

15 hours ago, mikeszekely said:

Do you have a pic of the kind of nozzles you mean?

 

They are very typical jet exhausts---you don't need much more than a slightly-tapering cone, with some grooves.   Identical to all F-16A's and B's, and similar to many other jets. 

The later F-15A-E exhaust, as the MP mold has for some reason, is unique to that and looks like no other jet exhaust I know of.  (Because it's actually the original exhaust with all the outer plates stripped off, revealing the internal supports and mechanism itself, which is a nightmare to model accurately---and looks funky when simplified for toys etc) 

Every jet with a variable nozzle---from the SR-71 to the F-104 to the MiG-25 has roughly the same design/look.   Except modern F-15's....

[Kuma Style]

In regards to Howling Meteor, I don't think there have beeb any true, hi-res pictures taken by anyone. It's not to down anyone's effort, but there's a real difference between call camera pics and actual, focused photography. Hopefully Meteor and its face in particular can get some better exposure once in more suitable hands.