Aircraft Super Thread Mk.VII

[Knight26]

The J-20 design appears optimized for front quarter stealth and high speed. It's a missile truck. Run in fast with minimal detection, drop your load into the AWACS, tankers and front line bombers then beat feat out of there. It doesn't matter if they see you on the egress because you're running behind a wall of radar, sam and AAA.

[Sildani]

Wonder how big its main weapons bay is. If it can stuff a couple anti-ship missiles in there like the Harpoon, it might be a credible threat to a carrier group.

[electric indigo]

Have a look:

[grigolosi]

MechTech, that's awesome!

Miles316: the Tomcat has two engines but when landing, only one is needed to maintain hydraulic pressure so the other is usually shut down. It's always only the same specific one, from what I can recall. I think it has to do with which systems that engine runs.

Anyway, with the other engine shut down, the nozzle "relaxes" if you will, and (I think) opens fully, while the other one stays puckered like you see.

Any twin engine jet probably does the same, it's just the earlier Tomcat engines, as depicted here in the Tamiya kit, have a much more extreme look to them when fully opened or fully closed. Check out Wikipedia for some general info on the Tomcat - it's a great read and might just get you hooked on the old 'cat.

The newer engined Tomcats have a much more silver nozzle and whilst they too exhibit this half open, half closed look on the ground, it's nowhere near as extreme to look at.

In other news, pre-ordered that kit from HLJ today!

Build the 2 Hasegawa kits that I've semi started or sell them along with all the extras and just build the Tamiya...?

The engine nozzles open to 100% when the engine is at Idle. When the pilot throttles up the nozzles close down to help increase the thrust, it essentially works like a nozzle on a garden hose until the pilot goes to AB. The nozzle then opens to 100% to keep from blowing the augmenter off the aircraft. The nozzle will be open to 100% on engine shutdown. The upgraded F-14D's and later all F-14's in service were equipped with the F-100GE110-400 engines. They were essentially the same engine mounted in the F-16 except they were bigger in diameter. The turkey feathers are titanium and usually a light bronze in color but appear to silver'ish in sunlight. I have never heard of any twin engine fighter shutting down one of the engines for landing except in the case of an engine IFEs and as notoriously finicky as the old TF-30's were I would've wanted both engines running.

[electric indigo]

Insane 1/144 kit:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvL2RlvUkAApqoO.jpg

[spanner]

Insane 1/144 kit:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvL2RlvUkAApqoO.jpg

very lovely indeed!!

[mickyg]

Thanks Grigolosi, I probably explained that poorly. Here's an article about the engine operation (for both types) as it relates to nozzle position: http://www.anft.net/f-14/f14-detail-engine.htm

Incidentally, I didn't mean shutting one down for landing, that was badly worded. I meant during the process of shutting down, after landing. Trying to land a tomcat on one engine, especially with the P&W engines would be extremely tricky. Though I'm sure there are plenty of stories about exactly that scenario.

Anyway, always good to hear from someone who knows these things firsthand. Thanks for clarifying.

The engine nozzles open to 100% when the engine is at Idle. When the pilot throttles up the nozzles close down to help increase the thrust, it essentially works like a nozzle on a garden hose until the pilot goes to AB. The nozzle then opens to 100% to keep from blowing the augmenter off the aircraft. The nozzle will be open to 100% on engine shutdown. The upgraded F-14D's and later all F-14's in service were equipped with the F-100GE110-400 engines. They were essentially the same engine mounted in the F-16 except they were bigger in diameter. The turkey feathers are titanium and usually a light bronze in color but appear to silver'ish in sunlight. I have never heard of any twin engine fighter shutting down one of the engines for landing except in the case of an engine IFEs and as notoriously finicky as the old TF-30's were I would've wanted both engines running.

Edited November 4, 2016 by mickyg

[grigolosi]

No problem Mickyg. Yeah you are correct about that after landing. F-15's shutdown one engine as they are taxing in from the runways, it helps the ground crews who by EPA standards are supposed to catch the fuel dumped out of the engine scavenge drain. When P&W's shutdown the pilot or ground crew operating it are required to throttle up to 75% then position the throttle to off if for 7 seconds to scavenge the fuel out of the lines. Fuel still comes out but not as much as would normally come out when the engine isn't scavenged. GE's have a scanvenge pump on them that prevents having to do this. Most twin engine fighters have 3 or more hydro systems and each of them operates certain systems on the aircraft. Usually there is one primary that operates most of the essential systems: Flight controls, landing gear etc. So the pilots can shutdown the non essential engine prior to pulling into chocks.

The newer PW's have the Secondary mode also. The older PW F-100PW200's had a BUC (Back Up Controller) that worked don the same principle but it was far more complex to do the check in chocks. The SEC Sceondary Mode check is simply done by placing the SEC switch to on and then running the engine up to 70%. The GE's have a problem that arises when in flight from time to time if the FLCC is getting bad air data information or if the DEC goes bad. We call it an Auto SEC transfer. This means the MEC (Mechanical Engine Control) takes over and closes the nozzle to prevent the pilot form selecting AB. The MEC controls all engine functions from Mil to Idle while the DEC handles functions in after burner. Also if the pilot of Crew Chief shuts the engine down and goes electrical power off before the engine drops below 55% RPM than the nozzle closes even if there is nothing wrong. GE's also develop a minor problem sometimes that causes the nozzle to close down of shutdown regardless of RPM to electrical power shutdown. It is caused by a minor disagreement between the engine hydraulic and electrical system caused by the RPM's dropping on shutdown and the engine hydro (fuel) system pressure dropping as it normally does. It is not a safety of flight issue so the engines are left alone until they are removed for either maintenance or time change.

What is funny is that the FFP (Fuel Flow Proportioner) gauge in the cockpit on the GE doesn't have a set consumption rate. It literally just jumps around. So according to the book the only reading you should get is the numbers changing.

Edited November 5, 2016 by grigolosi

[ErikElvis]

Just bought my first 1/72 die cast. F-14a. Have to say I'm pretty impressed. It's a hobby master air power series. I may be hooked on these and I really don't need to be collecting anything else.

[Dobber]

I've been a fan of Hobby Master for several years now, but I just don't like their F-14. The windscreen/canopy section is so squashed. The whole nose section just looks too wide...likely due to canopy proportions. There is a new company that is bringing out some F-14's called Calibre Wings. I think their overal sculpt is much better than the Hobby Master or Century Wings, which appears to be the same sculpt, but the Calibre seems to have some issues of it's own...mainly seems around the gun section of the nose to allow for variant correct gun vents. So far only pre-pro's can be seen of their first 2 models. There are other incorrect things on them, but if the paint apps are good on the final product I think they are still the superior model...if you can over look the panel seems for the gun-vents.

Chris

This picture demonstrates what I'm talking about with the HM canopy

Edited November 5, 2016 by Dobber

[grigolosi]

I barely have patience for 1/72 scale, I can't imagine trying to detail out a 1/144 like that. I tried building that scale when I was in Japan in the 90's. Beside the small size our dog at the time ate the wheels on me ( I am not going to go into how that happened). I have mainly stuck with 1/48 with a few 1/72 thrown in from time to time. I own both the Hasegawa 1/72 VF-1 and VF-0B but still haven't had a chance to build them. Have a walk in closet shelf stacked with unbuilt kits. Looking forward to eventually getting some space to build again, once the oldest kid finally moves out.

[NZEOD]

The engine nozzles open to 100% when the engine is at Idle. When the pilot throttles up the nozzles close down to help increase the thrust, it essentially works like a nozzle on a garden hose until the pilot goes to AB. The nozzle then opens to 100% to keep from blowing the augmenter off the aircraft. The nozzle will be open to 100% on engine shutdown. The upgraded F-14D's and later all F-14's in service were equipped with the F-100GE110-400 engines. They were essentially the same engine mounted in the F-16 except they were bigger in diameter. The turkey feathers are titanium and usually a light bronze in color but appear to silver'ish in sunlight. I have never heard of any twin engine fighter shutting down one of the engines for landing except in the case of an engine IFEs and as notoriously finicky as the old TF-30's were I would've wanted both engines running.

in fact that was the cause of the Female Carrier pilots death as she came in to trap in an f14... single engine stalled out and the F14 slicing to the side and into the drink behind the carrier. Both engines are on until landed,

Edited November 5, 2016 by NZEOD

[NZEOD]

I want a ride for that takeoff

[ErikElvis]

I've been a fan of Hobby Master for several years now, but I just don't like their F-14. The windscreen/canopy section is so squashed. The whole nose section just looks too wide...likely due to canopy proportions. There is a new company that is bringing out some F-14's called Calibre Wings. I think their overal sculpt is much better than the Hobby Master or Century Wings, which appears to be the same sculpt, but the Calibre seems to have some issues of it's own...mainly seems around the gun section of the nose to allow for variant correct gun vents. So far only pre-pro's can be seen of their first 2 models. There are other incorrect things on them, but if the paint apps are good on the final product I think they are still the superior model...if you can over look the panel seems for the gun-vents.

Chris

This picture demonstrates what I'm talking about with the HM canopy

I can def see what your saying for the pics but I took a look at mine today and have to say it looks fine in person. That's not saying the others don't look better.

I think I'm in for a A10 next.

[miles316]

I got a new Cat last night and its already shot down my SV-51 mass production type lost a elevator and one of my canards.

[Shadow]

More upgrades for the F-15C.

http://www.scout.com/military/warrior/story/1697094-air-force-revs-up-f-15-electronic-war-tech?s=10

These updated EW capabilities replace the Tactical Electronic Warfare Suite, which has been used since the 1980s, not long after the F-15 first deployed. The service plans to operate the fleet until the mid-2040’s, so an overhaul of the Eagle’s electronic systems helps maintain U.S. air supremacy, the contract announcement said.

“The Air Force plans to keep the F-15 fleet in service until the mid-2040’s. Many of the F-15 systems date back to the 1970’s and must be upgraded if the aircraft is to remain operationally effective. Various upgrades will be complete as early as 2021 for the F-15C AESA (Active Electronically Scanned Array) radar and as late as 2032 for the various EW (electronic warfare) upgrades,” Air Force spokesman Maj. Rob Leese told Scout Warrior a few months ago.

Because we can't replace the Eagle fleet with Raptor's so we'll keep upgrading them till a 6th generation fighter comes along.

[F-ZeroOne]

Psst... wanna buy some Typhoons...? Going... well, not cheap, but...

Hang on - that article also says that the F-15 is getting a fly-by-wire control system? Really? Thats the first I've heard of that one...

Edited November 8, 2016 by F-ZeroOne

[grigolosi]

I know for the past 20 yrs most of us F-16 guy's have always asked why they haven't upgraded the Eagles to fly by wire systems. In actuality they could eliminate part of the hydraulic system by integating a fly by wire system. The newest ISA's (Integrated Servo Actuators) have their own self contained hydraulic reservoirs. The only other systems that would require hydraulics would be the landing gear, start system and gun. The ISA's also react faster than boost cable systems and would eliminate the issue the F-15's had with the flight control cable connection rods which cost the pilot at Spanghalem AB his life. Currently F-15's have 4 hydraulic systems. They could probably reduce that down to 2 maybe less with FBW systems. Hell the Koreans got smart and had their new Strike Eagles equipped with GE engines instead of PW's. I think its a good idea to finally upgrade that frame with newer systems and see how much teh frame can possibly improve.

Edited November 8, 2016 by grigolosi

[F-ZeroOne]

I know that the South Africans got a computer-controlled rudder onto their Cheetahs, but I always imagined replacing the entire FCS would be a fairly major job on a (sort of) legacy bird.

[Sildani]

Still cheaper than designing and buying a whole new one.

[Shadow]

It would be interesting to convert the F-15 into what we saw in Patlabor 2.

That said with the AIM-120D, the Eagle will have twice the reach by 2018. Doesn't F-15C use the older P&W F100 -220s where the Strike Eagle got the more powerful -229? I do like the idea of creating an F-15C+ with GE F110s or even P&W -229s.

Edited November 10, 2016 by Shadow

[grigolosi]

Yeah the Charlie models were equipped with the 220's along with a lot of the A's. The Strike Eagles are currently using either 220's or 229's.. If I remember right the older Echoes are using the 220.

Replacing the older boost systems would be a major job. The older cables and hydraulic components would have to come out and then the Flt control harnesses would have to be routed. Then a FLCS computer would also have to be installed. In the Eagles case it would also have to tie in with the vari-ramps.

On another note since it is Veterans Day, Here is a video honoring the unsung folks who keep them flying......

https://www.dvidshub.net/video/492050/maintainers-driving-force

Edited November 11, 2016 by grigolosi

[spanner]

my father worked for a computer/electronics company in the UK back in the late 60's to mid 70's (before we moved to Australia ) which supplied components for the RAF Vickers VC-10 which quickly became his favorite aircraft.

So for his upcoming 70th birthday I bought him a Gemini Jets 1/200 scale RAF VC-10! which im sure he'll love!

beautiful planes they are!

[NZEOD]

[grigolosi]

Nice video NZEOD. It looked like a local area fam flight. The visiting units at RF-Alaska would do the same on the first day of flying. Mainly to get the lay of the land and local area navigation landmarks for low level missions. Cruising through valley's like that is fun as hell. On my ride back in 93' my pilot took us through the local valley's in northern Japan and simulated bombing bridges that spanned the valleys.

[Sildani]

Moment of silence, please.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/14/asia/china-woman-fighter-pilot-killed/index.html

[Shadow]

That sucks. I kinda like the J-10 design as it reminds me alot of the X-31.

Edited November 14, 2016 by Shadow

[Firefox]

J-10C

Concept J-10?

Edited November 15, 2016 by Firefox

[Shadow]

Russia's Admiral Kuznetsov seeing action for the first time.

I had thought the navalized Flanker was phased out of service for the Mig-29K already. Guess not.

[electric indigo]

Apparently, they emptied their AA-missiles on the terrorists...

[Shadow]

Any more weight and they probably run the high risk of plunging into the drink.

[captain america]

Any more weight and they probably run the high risk of plunging into the drink.

The Sea Flankers don't seem to have any trouble at either takeoff or landing, based on the above video. Granted, this was in daylight and good weather. Still, I've seen much rougher US Navy carrier arrests.

[NZEOD]

Funny you should mention ditching... one did a day or two ago coming in to trap on the Kurnetsov.

https://theaviationist.com/2016/11/14/russian-mig-29k-from-adm-kuznetsov-aircraft-carrier-has-crashed-in-mediterranean-sea/

Edited November 16, 2016 by NZEOD

[Beltane70]

I thinks that it's pretty amazing that they're launching without catapults.

[NZEOD]

Still my favourite video of all time!