Guest davidwhangchoi Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) i hope this gets developers off their butts knowing they can lose money, you hear that EA and Ubisoft? http://www.polygon.com/2015/6/23/8832209/batman-arkham-knight-refunds-steam-valve i think this is a good policy. Edited June 23, 2015 by davidwhangchoi Quote
azrael Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 Yeah. It's bad when WB and Rocksteady had to modify the PC reqs cuz of drivers (http://community.wbgames.com/t5/Official-Announcements/Update-on-PC-Minimum-Specs/m-p/569523). Oh and the game has memory leaks. Oh and the 3.5GB 0-day patch for PS4 is not helping. Quote
Duke Togo Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 Pre-ordering any game is a real crap shoot. Quote
mikeszekely Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 Pre-ordering any game is a real crap shoot. I almost never do it. In fact, I usually wait for big sales. There's a ton of great games out there I want to play, but very little I want to play at $60. Arkham Knight was one of them I love the Arkham series, and I was thinking this would be my last major gaming binge sort of game before my in-laws arrive and my daughter is born next month. I really don't play games on consoles anymore, and I own all the other Arkham games for PC. I decided to preorder on Steam for the pre-order bonuses. I guess my mind must have blanked out what a mess Arkham Origins was when it came out on PC. I haven't asked for a refund, at least not yet. Like I said, I have all the other Arkham games on PC, and I really don't play consoles anymore. I haven't tried to play it yet... for all I know, it'll run fine on my GTX 970. But I'm kind of nervous to. I might find something else to do for a few days and see if it gets patched. Quote
Guest davidwhangchoi Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 Yeah. It's bad when WB and Rocksteady had to modify the PC reqs cuz of drivers (http://community.wbgames.com/t5/Official-Announcements/Update-on-PC-Minimum-Specs/m-p/569523). Oh and the game has memory leaks. Oh and the 3.5GB 0-day patch for PS4 is not helping. yeah, i think when i first got my gaming laptop and new to pc gms, i read about your user purchase of EA's battlefield... ever since then i've stayed away from pre-ordering any games. now even consoles i wait (except fallout 4, i wanted that pipboy arm bonus ) Pre-ordering any game is a real crap shoot. agree with you I almost never do it. In fact, I usually wait for big sales. There's a ton of great games out there I want to play, but very little I want to play at $60. Arkham Knight was one of them I love the Arkham series, and I was thinking this would be my last major gaming binge sort of game before my in-laws arrive and my daughter is born next month. I really don't play games on consoles anymore, and I own all the other Arkham games for PC. I decided to preorder on Steam for the pre-order bonuses. I guess my mind must have blanked out what a mess Arkham Origins was when it came out on PC. I haven't asked for a refund, at least not yet. Like I said, I have all the other Arkham games on PC, and I really don't play consoles anymore. I haven't tried to play it yet... for all I know, it'll run fine on my GTX 970. But I'm kind of nervous to. I might find something else to do for a few days and see if it gets patched. well at least it's risk free for 2 weeks or a few hours into it. so you're in the drivers seat. Quote
azrael Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 Steam reviewers are tearing Batman: Arkham Knight apart Console port? Check. Skip QA? Check. Offer a bunch of "special offers" at launch? Check. Profit? Check. What did I hear about E3 2015? PC gaming is making huge splashes again? Not when you have a 3rd party port the game to PC. Quote
Duke Togo Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) I can't even remember the last game I pre-ordered, and I haven't seen a game out of stock on a release day in a very long time. Edited June 23, 2015 by Duke Togo Quote
TangledThorns Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 I'm sure the game will be 'rocksteady' once the drivers and game patches are all released. Till then, I'll be waiting for a Steam/Origin sale as the game is too expensive even if it was working fine. Quote
azrael Posted June 23, 2015 Posted June 23, 2015 I'm sure the game will be 'rocksteady' once the drivers and game patches are all released. Till then, I'll be waiting for a Steam/Origin sale as the game is too expensive even if it was working fine. Wait for the GOTY edition. All patched and all the DLCs at a non-sacrifice-your-1st-born price. Quote
JB0 Posted June 24, 2015 Posted June 24, 2015 (edited) i hope this gets developers off their butts knowing they can lose money, you hear that EA and Ubisoft? http://www.polygon.com/2015/6/23/8832209/batman-arkham-knight-refunds-steam-valve i think this is a good policy. Expected result: Now that the customer has a basic level of protection, the quality of games on offer rises significantly. Actual result: Big publishers become even more leery of porting games to Windows. And do a big dog&pony show about piracy and market shares when the real problem is that they're actually accountable for their failures. Pre-ordering any game is a real crap shoot.Pretty much. The article acts like pre-ordering is a vital necessity of the games industry, but... why does anyone have to preorder anything? Because Colonial Marines made a "real" weapon out of a one-line joke? Because your character wears a custom tattoo? Edit: Actually, it occurs to me that the best part of Steam doing refunds now might be the reduced chance of people buying games and never playing them. Since you have two weeks to decide if it's crap... you gotta fire it up in those two weeks! Edited June 24, 2015 by JB0 Quote
VF-19 Posted June 24, 2015 Posted June 24, 2015 Wait for the GOTY edition. All patched and all the DLCs at a non-sacrifice-your-1st-born price. This is pretty much what I do with game purchases these days. I haven't preordered (or day one purchase) a game since Fallout 3. I'm sure the game will be 'rocksteady' once the drivers and game patches are all released. Till then, I'll be waiting for a Steam/Origin sale as the game is too expensive even if it was working fine. Steam's sales are easily the best part of the platform. To be fair, however, due to inflation, games have gotten cheaper for the most part. I remember how 20 years ago games were $49.99-59.99, for the most part. Quote
mikeszekely Posted June 24, 2015 Posted June 24, 2015 To be fair, however, due to inflation, games have gotten cheaper for the most part. I remember how 20 years ago games were $49.99-59.99, for the most part. To be fair, when you bought a game then you bought the whole game. $60 for a new release today doesn't get you the Season Pass for all the DLC that would have just been part of the game prior to the Xbox 360/PS3. Quote
VF-19 Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 I do wonder if the amount of DLC would have been in the game in the first place in the pre digital marketplace. I remember when DLC used to be called expansion packs and be something very different. Quote
mikeszekely Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Well, apparently Arkham Knight is so busted that WB stopped selling it. Quote
Guest davidwhangchoi Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Well, apparently Arkham Knight is so busted that WB stopped selling it. lol, that's pretty funny Quote
azrael Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Official statement: https://community.wbgames.com/t5/Support-for-PC/June-24-Update-on-PC-Version-of-Arkham-Knight/m-p/575332 Again, developers, TEST. YOUR. SH*T. WB should offer all their launch DLCs for free to PC players when it comes back on sale. Quote
mikeszekely Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 lol, that's pretty funny It'd be funnier if it wasn't my most-anticipated game of the year (at least until Transformers Devastation was announced) and the mess wasn't on my chosen platform. Official statement: https://community.wbgames.com/t5/Support-for-PC/June-24-Update-on-PC-Version-of-Arkham-Knight/m-p/575332 Again, developers, TEST. YOUR. SH*T. WB should offer all their launch DLCs for free to PC players when it comes back on sale. At the very least! IIRC, Ubisoft gave away their first major paid DLC campaign for Unity players who bought the game before a certain date, and Unity was arguably less broken. Quote
JB0 Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 I do wonder if the amount of DLC would have been in the game in the first place in the pre digital marketplace. I remember when DLC used to be called expansion packs and be something very different.Pre-download marketplace. 99.99% of all commercial video games ever released are digital. I'm making a stand here. This is the hill I've chosen to die on. Digital will not become a meaningless buzzword. Quote
GU-11 Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 I just googled Arkham Knight regarding the day 1 patch for the PS4. 3.5 GB?! Really?! That's almost a quarter of my monthly internet quota right there. Now I've read the usual, "then get a better internet package!" posts on countless game forums whenever someone brings this up, but still. At over 60 USD retail (more like 70-75 USD in Malaysia), you'd think they'd bother to give you a polished/finished product. With that said, several reviewers stated that their test copies ran perfectly well even without the patch, so I might just get the game and skip the patch altogether. I don't need the DLC setup or the silly TV show skin, so I guess it should be fine. Quote
Keith Posted June 25, 2015 Author Posted June 25, 2015 Always patch your games, always! Trust me, day one patches aren't just for fun. Quote
GU-11 Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 I'd hate to waste 3.5 GB on a patch (not to mention the time it takes to download it...God help me if a thunderstorm suddenly hits before it completes downloading) but if it's got to be done, it's got to be done. What worries me is that these damn day 1 patches are starting to become a trend. Quote
azrael Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 What worries me is that these damn day 1 patches are starting to become a trend. We're way past that point. With that said, several reviewers stated that their test copies ran perfectly well even without the patch, so I might just get the game and skip the patch altogether. I don't need the DLC setup or the silly TV show skin, so I guess it should be fine. The issues are affecting PC gamers. Console players haven't had the issues PC gamers have. Quote
Guest davidwhangchoi Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 (edited) new persona 5 trailer leaked http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2v9zfj Edited June 25, 2015 by davidwhangchoi Quote
technoblue Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 That stinks about Arkham Knight. i have Rocksteady's other Batman games and was looking forward to adding this to my Steam queue. I think the first game that really taught me to be picky about my purchases was Sword of the Stars II. I still have fun playing the original, but buying the sequel on release day was a tough lesson. As an RTS, SotS2 needed another year of development and testing. Quote
mikeszekely Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 That stinks about Arkham Knight. i have Rocksteady's other Batman games and was looking forward to adding this to my Steam queue. Well, if it helps, after some hemming and hawing I decided to give the game a go. I mean, if it really ran like garbage I could still get a refund, as long as I kept it under 2 hours. I played for 67 minutes, according to Steam. Some background: I'm running a Core i7-3770K, 16GB of RAM, and a GeForce GTX 970. Windows is running off of an SSD, but Steam and the installed Arkham Knight are running off of a 1TB WD Black mechanical drive that is used entirely for game installs. I'm playing with a wired controller (specifically a Razer Sabertooth), and my display is a 27" Samsung @ 1920x1080, 60hz. I have GeForce Experience installed. I started the game, then shut it down and let GeForce Experience optimize the settings, although I turned off pretty much all the GameWorks options back off upon restarting. I did NOT modify the ini file that locks the game at 30fps. I played enough to beat some guys up, use detective mode, grapple around, drive the Batmobile, and blow up some tanks. And you know what? The game was totally playable. I had some screen tearing (Vsync is off), but no detectible dips in framerate, even in the Batmobile (which is where most people seem to be complaining). Now, I'm not totally bug free. Every time I quit the game I get a Windows pop up that the program didn't close correctly. And the second time I started the game I had sound but the screen was black aside from a spinning cursor. I had to open Task Manager, kill the game, and restart it, and it loaded normally the second time. Also, even though the non-GameWorks options are technically set as high as they go, I think the game looks pretty ugly with lots of muddy textures. I'd have to go back and replay one to see, but my gut reaction is that Origins and City look better. I'm told that the PS4 version supposedly looks better than the PC version, and I can totally believe it. I guess another way of putting it is that, yeah, Arkham Knight is clearly a shoddy port, but it's a playable shoddy port. At least for me. Quote
Guest davidwhangchoi Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 (edited) Well, if it helps, after some hemming and hawing I decided to give the game a go. I mean, if it really ran like garbage I could still get a refund, as long as I kept it under 2 hours. I played for 67 minutes, according to Steam. Some background: I'm running a Core i7-3770K, 16GB of RAM, and a GeForce GTX 970. Windows is running off of an SSD, but Steam and the installed Arkham Knight are running off of a 1TB WD Black mechanical drive that is used entirely for game installs. I'm playing with a wired controller (specifically a Razer Sabertooth), and my display is a 27" Samsung @ 1920x1080, 60hz. I have GeForce Experience installed. I started the game, then shut it down and let GeForce Experience optimize the settings, although I turned off pretty much all the GameWorks options back off upon restarting. I did NOT modify the ini file that locks the game at 30fps. I played enough to beat some guys up, use detective mode, grapple around, drive the Batmobile, and blow up some tanks. And you know what? The game was totally playable. I had some screen tearing (Vsync is off), but no detectible dips in framerate, even in the Batmobile (which is where most people seem to be complaining). Now, I'm not totally bug free. Every time I quit the game I get a Windows pop up that the program didn't close correctly. And the second time I started the game I had sound but the screen was black aside from a spinning cursor. I had to open Task Manager, kill the game, and restart it, and it loaded normally the second time. Also, even though the non-GameWorks options are technically set as high as they go, I think the game looks pretty ugly with lots of muddy textures. I'd have to go back and replay one to see, but my gut reaction is that Origins and City look better. I'm told that the PS4 version supposedly looks better than the PC version, and I can totally believe it. I guess another way of putting it is that, yeah, Arkham Knight is clearly a shoddy port, but it's a playable shoddy port. At least for me. return it. lol i wouldn't pay the full pre order price for that. (unless they promise all the dlc content,season pass i'll wait till it goes back up and on sale. Edited June 25, 2015 by davidwhangchoi Quote
mikeszekely Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 return it. lol i wouldn't pay the full pre order price for that. (unless they promise all the dlc content,season pass i'll wait till it goes back up and on sale. No. What's the point? I think enough people have returned it and left bad reviews that the message was sent. And when the refund is in my Steam Wallet, then what? Buy some other game I don't really want? Leave it languish and spend another $60 on the PS4 version, knowing full well that at some point I'd end up buying the Steam version again anyway? It'd be one thing if I couldn't play it, but I apparently can play it just fine. I just happen to have the crappier version. Quote
Guest davidwhangchoi Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 No. What's the point? I think enough people have returned it and left bad reviews that the message was sent. And when the refund is in my Steam Wallet, then what? Buy some other game I don't really want? Leave it languish and spend another $60 on the PS4 version, knowing full well that at some point I'd end up buying the Steam version again anyway? It'd be one thing if I couldn't play it, but I apparently can play it just fine. I just happen to have the crappier version. i thought they refund you via paypal in the form of original payment. well if that's the case it's only store credit then it's not really a refund. but if it's money back, i'd take it. Quote
technoblue Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 Well, if it helps, after some hemming and hawing I decided to give the game a go. I mean, if it really ran like garbage I could still get a refund, as long as I kept it under 2 hours. ... Thanks for the mini-review! I'm not a die-hard keyboard and mouse player. For most third-person adventure games, like those in the Batman series, I prefer using a controller too. Hopefully it won't take long for Rocksteady/WB to iron out the lingering bugs and offer a twice-baked PC version for sale. Quote
GU-11 Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) The issues are affecting PC gamers. Console players haven't had the issues PC gamers have. Thanks for the heads up! The thing is, there's still a required day 1 patch for the PS4 version. I'm not sure just how serious are these "stability and performance issues" the patch is supposed to fix, but I just don't like the fact that I have to waste 3.5 GB and spend at least 2 hours staring at a download bar before I can even play the damn game. Either way, I'll see if I can play the game without the patch. And if it turns out that I do need it after all, I'll just uninstall the game, get the patch and re-install. I only recently found out that Bloodborne also required a day 1 patch which was 4 f**king GB. But aside from being unable to get a certain piece of garb after defeating an NPC enemy, it works fine. Hopefully, it's the same case with Arkham Knight. Edited June 26, 2015 by GU-11 Quote
mikeszekely Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 i thought they refund you via paypal in the form of original payment. well if that's the case it's only store credit then it's not really a refund. but if it's money back, i'd take it. I haven't looked into Steam's refund policy, but why would the refund be via PayPal? I've NEVER bought anything on Steam with PayPal. Usually I use a credit card, but in this case I'd loaded up my Steam Wallet during the summer sale and paid for AK with that. I assumed refunds would be in the form you paid, which would mean money back into my Steam Wallet. Thanks for the mini-review! I'm not a die-hard keyboard and mouse player. For most third-person adventure games, like those in the Batman series, I prefer using a controller too. Hopefully it won't take long for Rocksteady/WB to iron out the lingering bugs and offer a twice-baked PC version for sale. I like a controller for games that play better with a controller, and I like a mouse and keyboard for games that play better with a mouse and keyboard. Like you said, third-person adventure games, platformers, racing games, stuff like that I usually play with a controller. Shooters, strategy games, most RPGs, and similar stuff gets m+k. About 4 hours in now, and the game's getting pretty good. I still feel like they're leaning a little to heavily on the Batmobile gimmick, but the story is getting pretty interesting. On the downside, though, another glitch has popped up. Twice now, the analog sticks would still be working but the game wouldn't accept any button inputs. The first time it happened, hitting a corresponding control on the keyboard made all the controls start working again. Second time, most of the lights went off on my controller and I had to unplug it and plug it back in. Actually, I really hope that's a glitch, and not the controller. That Sabertooth wasn't cheap. Quote
azrael Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 Thanks for the heads up! The thing is, there's still a required day 1 patch for the PS4 version. I'm not sure just how serious are these "stability and performance issues" the patch is supposed to fix, but I just don't like the fact that I have to waste 3.5 GB and spend at least 2 hours staring at a download bar before I can even play the damn game. Either way, I'll see if I can play the game without the patch. And if it turns out that I do need it after all, I'll just uninstall the game, get the patch and re-install. I only recently found out that Bloodborne also required a day 1 patch which was 4 f**king GB. But aside from being unable to get a certain piece of garb after defeating an NPC enemy, it works fine. Hopefully, it's the same case with Arkham Knight. As I've mentioned, console players don't appear to have the issues that PC players have had. Nearly all the gameplay vids on Youtube were recorded from the console versions. Which is why they've pulled the PC version from Steam and stores have been told to pull copies from the shelves until further notice. But yes, this day-1 patching nonsense really needs to be reigned in. It screams "we didn't test it" and only reinforces the fact that no one should ever pre-order. EVER. If people cannot play the game the day it comes out, why should anyone pre-order? It doesn't help that people keep doing pre-ordering. Quote
GU-11 Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 As I've mentioned, console players don't appear to have the issues that PC players have had. Nearly all the gameplay vids on Youtube were recorded from the console versions. Which is why they've pulled the PC version from Steam and stores have been told to pull copies from the shelves until further notice. But yes, this day-1 patching nonsense really needs to be reigned in. It screams "we didn't test it" and only reinforces the fact that no one should ever pre-order. EVER. If people cannot play the game the day it comes out, why should anyone pre-order? It doesn't help that people keep doing pre-ordering. Oops. Sorry, I got a little confused going back and forth between this thread and some of the other game sites. At first, I thought cash-grab DLC's were becoming a nuisance during the PS3/XB360 era, and now we have day 1 patches. Quote
Keith Posted June 26, 2015 Author Posted June 26, 2015 Day 1 patches exist for many logistical reasons, and honestly, I wouldn't expect them to go away. Accept and love them. The bigger problem is that there are still areas metering out hardline internet usage. That's a problem that needs to stop. Quote
Old_Nash Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 I know WiiU don't have a strong base, but Like me, much WiiU users donate for this game. And after they released, and a "no more WiiU port" They replied it to a WiiU owner... http://wiiudaily.com/2015/06/project-cars-dislikes-nintendo-users/ This is how a company that says it's serious that donated much for this game to be done? If so, better to give to small studios which I know will honor his word. Quote
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