The Transformers Thread (licensed) Next

[mikeszekely]

I just saw the official pics at TFW. Arcee looks decent enough, but that Leader Megs looks killer in both modes. Brainstorm was a surprise, and he doesn't look too bad either.

That Leader Megatron looks ok. His legs are a bit smallish, and I'm not liking the head sculpt, but he's not looking too bad. I might pick him up, depending on how big he actually is. I'm thinking he'll probably be to big to fit with the other CHUGs, so I'm not really regretting that I have a preorder for the rerun of Hegemon.

Arcee looks like she's going to be a shellformer, with a feminine figure crammed under a car she wears on her back in bot mode. Frankly, I think that's the best we could have hoped for if we wanted something that looked G1. I'm kind of interested in Chromia, though. A remold of Prime Arcee, that turns into a Tron lightcycle... what's not to like?

Brainstorm seems pretty cool. It looks like a mix of G1 and IDW.

That new Voyager Optimus, though? Ugh. He's got a weird head and cartoonish proportions... he almost looks like he belongs in the Rescue Heroes line.

Some of the new Legends look pretty cool, too, but since I haven't seen any Legend-class CHUGs at retail since Optimus/Megatron/Bumblebee/Starscream, I'm not getting too excited.

[anime52k8]

pretty much agree on all points. Brainstorm seems the most interesting to me purely because it's a modern retail toy with an actual headmaster. Arcee and Chromia look cool enough that I might actually pick them up. But that prime is just sad.

As for Megatron, if I were to grab one, I'd be much more interested in grabbing the Armada retool/repaint vs the more G1 version.

Edited June 22, 2014 by anime52k8

[jenius]

It seems disingenuous to say "may or may not represent" when the 3rd party releases I'm thinking of all certainly go out of their way to do the best they can to represent the figure we all know and that's how they generate their sales. I also find it a little odd to complain about distribution given that legit releases have a chance at being at a local TRU, target, CVS, or Walmart whereas 3rd party releases almost certainly require some sort of online purchase. Is it harder to purchase legitimate releases then third party releases? No, NEVER. The worst case is that a third party release is EQUALLY hard to obtain as a third party release. 3rd party stuff is definitely a step above bootlegs though and more options is cool but not for me and definitely not for me when it's competing with the legitimate rights holder. Imagine having the rights to something and have somebody undercut you... you'd be pissed even if the person who undercut you put out junk.

[Kanedas Bike]

It seems disingenuous to say "may or may not represent" when the 3rd party releases I'm thinking of all certainly go out of their way to do the best they can to represent the figure we all know and that's how they generate their sales. I also find it a little odd to complain about distribution given that legit releases have a chance at being at a local TRU, target, CVS, or Walmart whereas 3rd party releases almost certainly require some sort of online purchase. Is it harder to purchase legitimate releases then third party releases? No, NEVER. The worst case is that a third party release is EQUALLY hard to obtain as a third party release. 3rd party stuff is definitely a step above bootlegs though and more options is cool but not for me and definitely not for me when it's competing with the legitimate rights holder. Imagine having the rights to something and have somebody undercut you... you'd be pissed even if the person who undercut you put out junk.

Not at all trying to get into this official vs. 3rd Party release debate, but I would take exception to the line highlighted in bold. From my experience of just looking it's very difficult to find (most)Takara or (damn near all) Hasbro Masterpiece items at retail. Hasbro obviously in Toys R Us stores or online.

Whereas I can look at a few online vendors and find 3rd Party stuff available. The only caveat being that I've never purchased a 3rd Party Transformer and while I see items available for purchase I wouldn't know if these are the "desirable" releases or the "undesirable" ones, but they've been easier to locate than a lot of official releases - and I would venture to guess I'm not the only one that's had a similar experience.

-b.

[David Hingtgen]

Know what's neat? When a 3P item sells out quickly in the first run, they will often do a second run.

And not for twice the price, 2 years later like "Hasbro's Asia division". The same price, like 2 months later. And then sometimes THAT still sells out, and they'll do a third run. Until they've made all that they can sell.

Hegemon and Green Giant are among the few 3P items that sold out decently quickly and had continued demand, yet took a while for re-issues. But they did come. But neither of those "sold out in a day" and had people scrambling to try to get one like a Bandai Frontier valk. Anyone who wanted one right at the beginning had plenty of opportunity.

[jenius]

You're adding the caveat "at retail" which I intentionally excluded because the pricing dynamics are screwy. True, it's hard to find the newest MP Grimlock at a TRU where you could potentially use a 20% coupon and get him for like $60... but how much does a 3P Grimlock cost? So if you had to pay DOUBLE that to get a 3P Grimlock but could easily find him just as easily as you can find a Hasbro Grimmy online that someone snatched at TRU and then put online for 2x MSRP then you're right back to my equal statement.

[anime52k8]

It's a matter of principle. People would rather pay a higher amount at retail price than pay the same amount knowing some of it is going into the pocket of scalpers.

[JB0]

DRAMA!

I think the unofficial Transformers are darn cool. Expensive as heck, but pretty darn cool.

And I don't think they're in competition with Hasbro or TakaraTomy... EXCEPT for the Masterpiece line.

I think it's... strange... that Stacks is adhering so closely to the original design.

Most of the unofficial toys I've seen have been unique takes on the character, or existed at a functionality/detail level that just isn't viable for mass-market. Stacks is neither from what I've seen.

This is one of the rare cases where I DO see a direct conflict between the official and unofficial toys, and it's KINDA IFFY, though I assume the current situation is just coincidence and not an active plan on anyone's part.

Regardless of coincidence or conspiracy, it's clearly a unique mold, so it's WAY ahead of the old iGear Masterpiece Prime. How did anyone ever defend that one?

My main thought, though, is that Hasbro and Takara have had THIRTY YEARS to milk this thing by now.

At this point any protections on the original character are long since past the point where they make any sort of rational sense, and I see nothing ethically wrong about someone else making a G1 Ultra Magnus toy.

I find it hard to be particularly heartbroken that two of the largest toy companies in the world might be missing a couple thousand dollars in sales because someone else made a toy that looks an awful lot like something they used to make.

...

Also, Stacks is supposed to be orange with a truck cab for a head. I can't believe they messed that up so badly.

[Kanedas Bike]

You're adding the caveat "at retail" which I intentionally excluded because the pricing dynamics are screwy. True, it's hard to find the newest MP Grimlock at a TRU where you could potentially use a 20% coupon and get him for like $60... but how much does a 3P Grimlock cost? So if you had to pay DOUBLE that to get a 3P Grimlock but could easily find him just as easily as you can find a Hasbro Grimmy online that someone snatched at TRU and then put online for 2x MSRP then you're right back to my equal statement.

It's a matter of principle. People would rather pay a higher amount at retail price than pay the same amount knowing some of it is going into the pocket of scalpers.

Sorry, I was just trying to do a SRP to SRP comparison. So sure, one could find just about anything at some over-inflated cost but that's not the point.

And I'm truly not trying to argue or anything, but real world experience has shown me (and again, willing to bet others as well) that most, non-shelf warming Hasbro MP releases are generally ridiculously difficult to find at their original release. And from what I've seen these 3rd Party releases are easy (relative or not) to find at their original price, but I'm not an expert on them at all.

-b.

[hutch]

At this point any protections on the original character are long since past the point where they make any sort of rational sense, and I see nothing ethically wrong about someone else making a G1 Ultra Magnus toy.

Any why is that? I have to believe that Takara and Hasbro have been keeping up with the trademarking for the name Ultra Magnus and his likeness...

If I understand you correctly, this is like saying "Batman is 75 years old, so anybody should be able to make Batman toys/comics/movies", which is silly.

[JB0]

Any why is that? I have to believe that Takara and Hasbro have been keeping up with the trademarking for the name Ultra Magnus and his likeness...

If I understand you correctly, this is like saying "Batman is 75 years old, so anybody should be able to make Batman toys/comics/movies", which is silly.

That's EXACTLY what I'm saying.

What makes anyone writing Dracula or anyone writing Sherlock Holmes less silly than anyone writing Batman?

Copyright law was meant "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries."

And at the end of that limited period of time, the work would belong to the public.

This benefit to the creator was weighed against the benefit to society as a whole.

The original law in the US was 14 years, with the possibility of requesting a single 14-year extension IF the original creator was still alive.

It was never intended to grant anyone sole control of a cultural icon in perpetuity, and the current state of copyright law is a twisted mockery of everything it was ever supposed to do.

Trademark is different than copyright, and ... well, equally ridiculous, with people trademarking random words out of the dictionary.

The moral of this story?

Plastic robots: serious business.

Or possibly...

Free the toys!

But probably just...

I'm gonna get in trouble for this, aren't I?

[M'Kyuun]

Interesting stuff about copyright.

As for third party, I own a few of IGear's Mini-Warriors, and I'm pretty happy with them. I appreciate Hasbro for giving us Transformers, and I mostly buy official products. But, if Hasbro/Takara don't produce a toy I want, or they do produce a version that I don't like for whatever reason, and a third party comes along with a version of the same that I do like, I have no qualms buying the third party's product. Moreover, as in most ventures, it's creative competition. I imagine the creative teams at Hasbro and Takara keep an eye on what all these third parties are doing, and not just over potential copyright infringement. Third parties are producing some very cool stuff, and if you have even an iota of enthusiasm about transforming toys, you have to admire some of creativity and problem solving that has gone into these things.

So happy they finally revealed Arcee. I think they could have trimmed some of her car parts, esp the part that forms the rear end of her car mode, to slim her up more and eliminate kibble, but overall very pleased to finally get her in official form. Chromia looks excellent, too. Nice retcon of Prime RiD Arcee. I'm also liking Bombshell and Powerglide, although PG's Warthog would have looked better with his arms turned 180 so his hands aren't showing. C'mon Hasbro/Takara! I'm on the fence about Chubby Prime and Leader G1 Megatron(those wonky legs and feet just kill the figure for me). Tank mode looks good though, and it looks like he has real treads. Awesome. Fatastic Prime's triceps form the truck's windshield, and that cab's sleeper has another sleeper beyond the smoke stacks. Weird. The guns in his hands look like they connect to form an engine block, so if he has a tip-up cab to see the engine, that'd be...a feature. No interest in the Headmaster. Sigh...Did I mention I like Arcee?

Edited June 22, 2014 by M'Kyuun

[M'Kyuun]

Mods..I can't edit my posts. It says edited, but it doesn't save my changes.

Edit to my last post: the backs of Prime's shoulders form the windshield, and his biceps form the grill.

[Gakken85]

Mods..I can't edit my posts. It says edited, but it doesn't save my changes.

Edit to my last post: the backs of Prime's shoulders form the windshield, and his biceps form the grill.

Clear your browser cache.

[David Hingtgen]

It's a matter of principle. People would rather pay a higher amount at retail price than pay the same amount knowing some of it is going into the pocket of scalpers.

Pretty much that. Scalpers vs the actual company getting the money. If a car is popular, and the dealership is "scalping" it at $10K over sticker---it may be 'easy' to get, but that sure doesn't make it equal to the alternative car that is inherently $10K more expensive, but still selling at "only" sticker price. (not the best example, but the best my brain can do right now)

Hey, a sealed G1 Starscream is "easy" to get---so long as you fork over a grand.

[eriku]

Woof, that new Optimus is a stinker. Alt mode looks like the front end of a bus. I love how the windshield on his chest has lines of rivets going through it. And are those clip wheels on a Voyager? Yuck. I think the worst offense is that it's offered as an "IDW" Optimus and looks nothing like that version of the character.

Brainstorm and Powerglide look great. The Megatrons look OK, although I'm not sure I really need either of them. Wish they would have actually showed Superion, I'm hoping he's at least better than that FOC Bruticus thing. Hard to imagine it being worse...

[RD Blade]

Bruticus had two big problems working against it.

First, Onslaught should have been at least Voyager sized.

Second, the limbs should not have been designed to be interchangeable.

Most of the upcoming figures are definite wants. Hope they're easy to find at retail.

[Mechapilot77]

from the recent reveals..

brainstorm, arcee, shrapnel, and powerglide are winners I think...brainstorm being better than the rest by far. chromia looks ok too, i'll probably pick those all up if i see them at retail. brianstorm and arcee are teh only ones i'd make a special effort or trip for.

the leader megatrons, look...."ok", but i can't ge past those legs and the overly short thighs are hard too. i still don't know why hastak can't give us an honest to goodness "good" megatron...the armada ones is the more interesting of the two, but tats probably just because i don't know armada well enough to be insulted (yeah i feel its a slight insult to fans of g1 megatron that they made him look that ugly and from a tank).

that voyager prime is a truckload of fail. proportions of a fat, squat gorilla. horrible head/face sculpt. i really hope taht is a one and done and not the default GHUG optimus for the next 8 years (classics prime came out in 2006). i don't get how they made the legends class one fairly well....and then crashed and burned so hard on the voyager one.

[jenius]

I think the 3rd party discussion got silly when people brought up principle of not paying secondary vendors when buying unlicensed products. It's illogical Jim.

Any good sdcc exclusives to look out for besides the arch?

[Guest davidwhangchoi]

i just looked at kfc and mp magnus looks better.

[Gakken85]

Lets get back on topic and talk about what we're all really here for:

[Guest davidwhangchoi]

is that ultra magnus's trailer floating above star brick?

[mikeszekely]

I think the 3rd party discussion got silly when people brought up principle of not paying secondary vendors when buying unlicensed products. It's illogical Jim.

We get it already. You're morally opposed to buying quality toys produced in small numbers for adult collectors from the people that designed and made those toys because they happened to be interpretations of another company's IP. That's totally the same thing as buying a kid's toy at 300+% markup from some neckbeard who makes a living by camping at Toys R' Us, buying up all the toys adult collectors want and flipping them on ebay.

Look, you have a thing against 3P toys, that's your thing. Don't buy 'em. The board members here that do, though, don't need to give you a better reason than, "because I feel like it," so let it go and move on.

[anime52k8]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought 'secondary vendors' was a funny way of spelling greasy neckbeards.

[eriku]

Lets get back on topic and talk about what we're all really here for:

I'm going to love that thing so much I'll have to carry it around in a Baby Bjorn.

[anime52k8]

I'm going to love that thing so much I'll have to carry it around in a Baby Bjorn.

reminds me of this:

[eriku]

Bramble is still my favorite Ashley Wood creation.

[Valkyrie2008]

is that ultra magnus's trailer floating above star brick?

It sure is, in prototype form!

Is Space Brick going to labeled as MP-23? if it is, then I must get one just to complete my Masterpiece collection line.

Edited June 24, 2014 by Valkyrie2008

[RD Blade]

MP-23 is Galvatron.

*crosses fingers*

[anime52k8]

I like Caesar just a little bit more, but the heavy brambs are very awesome.

[Valkyrie2008]

MP-23 is Galvatron.

*crosses fingers*

Oh I wish it would be MP Galvatron. This is one of many MPs that I've been waiting for, hopefully one day Tak will make it happen.

[Kanedas Bike]

F'it, I'm gonna get (2) of Space Brick. I've bought (2) of just about every other recent Masterpiece release.

If I end up liking it then great, I've got one. If not I can join the other "entrepreneurial souls" and sell them on eBay or something.

-b.

[Gakken85]

Space brick will be huge

Yeah I think that's Ultra Fattuss' trailer.

[Kanedas Bike]

Space brick will be huge

Yeah I think that's Ultra Fattuss' trailer.

Hey, Ultra Magnus isn't fat, he's big-boned.

-b.

[jenius]

We get it already. You're morally opposed to buying quality toys produced in small numbers for adult collectors from the people that designed and made those toys because they happened to be interpretations of another company's IP. That's totally the same thing as buying a kid's toy at 300+% markup from some neckbeard who makes a living by camping at Toys R' Us, buying up all the toys adult collectors want and flipping them on ebay.

Look, you have a thing against 3P toys, that's your thing. Don't buy 'em. The board members here that do, though, don't need to give you a better reason than, "because I feel like it," so let it go and move on.

You're taking my argument beyond where it went. I said 3P COMPETING with 1P seems uncouth. I still think 3P has value, particularly where 1P is ignoring something people want.

The thing against 'scalpers' is just an interesting study in where people are willing to draw their line in the sand. At the end of the day, you've spent $X and have Y. I imagine all of us on the board have made a profit on a toy at some point.

Anyway, water under the bridge, MP Galvatron is probably at the top of my list at this point. I'd say MP Megatron V2 but I just don't think there's any way it will happen. I will definitely by SpaceBrick because bot mode looks pretty cool. I suspect I won't keep him forever though since I won't have a sentimental connection.