DX VF-25 Renewal Series (Part III)

[skullmilitia]

Yeah, I think Bandai is on to the fact they can sell more. Alto's has had what, 3 retail releases, and the most recent release saw 2 restocks. I'm not jumping into the panic tank on this one. It may not be as easy as this last Alto release, but I'm sure there will be ample

Stock at retail price.

[Gakken85]

what do you mean? Its order stopped on HLJ.

yeah, the yf-30 hasn't budged as in it hasn't opened back up.

People are saying it was limited too.

Yeah I think they will amp up and make more Ozma, but it might be a few months.

Edited August 5, 2014 by Gakken85

[ChaoticYeti]

Huh? Why Cancellation?

No idea. I didn't cancel it. I assume it was milliseconds after it sold out.

[Edi]

Idk, for something that's been selling for $400+ for over a year... a $30 dollar markup isn't much if you really want one. With registered air mail.. which is only about $30 bucks, it's right at $200.

Not insane for a hero Bandai Valk.

I agree it sucks, but it's either than or pray you're online when HLJ puts up their tiny stock.

Or pray they make more and flood the market like they did with Alto... which I personally think will happen.

This is why I decided to pay the NY markup price to snag a Ozma. As I've been waiting for a long time to get one, even close to paying those crazy $350+ ones, this was a good pickup for me.

Now if I can only find a good price for a armor pack for him, that would complete him up...

[SaitouSad]

There's no guarantee about HLJ, they open preorders for 90% of what they order because it's usually the percentage they get shorted

In the past releases by Bandai. That 10% if aquired hits on release day. Unless Bandai allows reordering, then they will put up more before then like the 25F.

That's a really interesting insight. I've always heard that Bandai kinda screws retailers over in terms of stock allocation, but I always wondered what the numbers were.

Where did you get this percentage from?

Also, like others, I think the VF-25S, like the VF-25F will undoubtedly get another reissue down the road. Only a matter of when.

[Kanedas Bike]

The whole argument, assumption or assertion of Bandai releasing more of the 25S at some point is logical and makes sense. But why not just do that to begin with instead of causing shortages and dissatisfaction among your customer base?

Just dumb, dumb, dumb on Bandai's part.

-b.

[Gakken85]

I think, again, as with most mech toys, you have to realize it's a niche thing. The guys in upper management see this figure, and this figure and then they print enough to make X amount.

Frontier hasn't been on the air in a long time. They know fanatical fans lap them up enough to make a profit, but they aren't betting the house.

Maybe there is a middle management guy at Bandai that knows what up, but maybe nobody listens to him.

Bandai's part is done weeks ago when they sold their stock to the middle men.

Maybe they look back at the numbers as with the Alto and they print some more.

Edited August 5, 2014 by Gakken85

[Kanedas Bike]

I think, again, as with most mech toys, you have to realize it's a niche thing. The guys in upper management see this figure, and this figure and then they print enough to make X amount.

Frontier hasn't been on the air in a long time. They know fanatical fans lap them up enough to make a profit, but they aren't betting the house.

Maybe there is a middle management guy at Bandai that knows what up, but maybe nobody listens to him.

Not buying it, or rather, not excusing it. There is risk adverse and there is what's happening with the Frontier line.

If retailers are asking Bandai, as I'm sure they are, to produce more because there is a demand then the "we, the company, only make X number of units because we only want Y dollars of profit" argument is stupid. Big businesses are in business to make ALL the money, not just a certain amount.

-b.

[brouken]

Toy manufacturing has gotten quite complicated throughout the years, same as with other consumer products. Whereas before, the whole product was built from the ground up in the country where the company is based, nowadays, manufacturing and materials have been outsourced. This brings into play a lot of new factors, such as international shipping, customs and taxation, rules of origin, international politics, and many other issues that the end-consumer may not know about.

I wish it were easy to just produce a product to meet market demand. But any experienced businessman will tell you that its never that easy in real life.

Anyway, for those who were able to get a pre-order on HLJ, were you all able to receive the email confirmation that your orders are being processed, and your HLJ accounts reflect these under your orders page?

[IXTL]

My guess is that Bandai has only so many Chinese factories to produce so many different toy lines.

Production scheduling is probably very tight and they can only produce a fixed number of figures in that time. Producing more Ozma 25s likely means another product from different line might not get made.

That's my take on it. Could be wrong though and Bandai just love teasing collectors.

[Gakken85]

Not buying it, or rather, not excusing it. There is risk adverse and there is what's happening with the Frontier line.

If retailers are asking Bandai, as I'm sure they are, to produce more because there is a demand then the "we, the company, only make X number of units because we only want Y dollars of profit" argument is stupid. Big businesses are in business to make ALL the money, not just a certain amount.

-b.

That's the thing though.. it's a SMALL part of their business, and I doubt retailers ask them to make anything. The whole point of my post is to make the point that transforming mech toys is a niche and it's not how they make ALL their money. It's a risk. Look at Arcadia.

Retailers are busying pushing naked chick statues that have a 50% markup and are easy to sell, paying their bills, and making sure people pay their PO's on time. Not to mention managing local sells, employees, overhead, and all manor of crap.

Big shops like HLJ and AMIAMI aren't collectors, they ARE businessmen. They have no passion for product other than making money, especially one certain subsection of an anime that isn't big anymore. They are selling Attack on titan patches, and naked swim doods beach towels. (My lady friend loves that crap.)

I seen those otaku towels sell for $50 bucks! they probably cost 3 dollars to make. haha

Anyway, you'll get one Kaneda

Edited August 5, 2014 by Gakken85

[Kanedas Bike]

Toy manufacturing has gotten quite complicated throughout the years, same as with other consumer products. Whereas before, the whole product was built from the ground up in the country where the company is based, nowadays, manufacturing and materials have been outsourced. This brings into play a lot of new factors, such as international shipping, customs and taxation, rules of origin, international politics, and many other issues that the end-consumer may not know about.

I wish it were easy to just produce a product to meet market demand. But any experienced businessman will tell you that its never that easy in real life.

Anyway, for those who were able to get a pre-order on HLJ, were you all able to receive the email confirmation that your orders are being processed, and your HLJ accounts reflect these under your orders page?

My guess is that Bandai has only so many Chinese factories to produce so many different toy lines.

Production scheduling is probably very tight and they can only produce a fixed number of figures in that time. Producing more Ozma 25s likely means another product from different line might not get made.

That's my take on it. Could be wrong though and Bandai just love teasing collectors.

If it's a logistical issue, then I can be more understanding.

But even with that, if there is demand then for a product (not just Macross Frontier, but Gundam, Hello Kitty or whatever) then do what you can to facilitate more production. Even if that means releasing a product further down the line so that production values are more in-line with what the market is asking for.

Gonna stop beating the dead horse (for) now. Congrats to those that their first 25S got one thru whatever retailer they were able, it's an awesome piece to have.

-b.

[skullmilitia]

My experience with past Bandai shortages lead me to conversation with Scott awhile ago where he somewhat spilled the beans.

This was back.. 4 maybe 5 years ago, when he was increasingly frustrated with Bandai shorting orders.

If you've ever dealt with manufacturing, there's no middle man. Bandai R&D's their product with the factory.

Test shots are made, once final tooling gets approval, they start manufacturing. Now as I imagine there maybe

100's of other items being made in the same factory, If I'm trying to fill a container to be shipped to my Dist warehouse.

I'm going to allot several different products in one container. Let's say Bandai's VF-25S order is 2000. Those 2000 maybe split up

Around 4 times, shipping finished product as available. It maybe 1-2 months before the next containers leave the factory.

That would be considered a restock, even though it's still part of the original order. Bandai opens orders up to retailers with

"We have 1500 units available". They sell out, the remaining orders will open up at tooling completion.

Remeber they are only selling what they think they will sell domestically in Japan.

Unless the retailers have shared they sell a decent amount of units overseas, I doubt they

Know there's any demand outside of Japan. Even though they could sell Macross F if they wanted to

HG doesn't own that, even though they think they do.

[brouken]

"Remeber they are only selling what they think they will sell domestically in Japan.
Unless the retailers have shared they sell a decent amount of units overseas, I doubt they
Know there's any demand outside of Japan. Even though they could sell Macross F if they wanted to
HG doesn't own that, even though they think they do."

I agree with this. That's why we have to buy the valks from third party retailers based in Japan in the first place. As far as Bandai is concerned, they're only selling to the domestic market and not to international markets. They're making zero profit from international buyers and therefore have no incentive to meet international demand.

[Guest davidwhangchoi]

hey guys! i'm about to be a bit snarky: to noobs and my long time boys, nothing is aimed at you. it's just general snarky.

wow... you guys are saying the same things without seeing the obvious. Bandai is doing this on purpose... they are aware of the domestic/international demand. they are trying to milk and string. and they can. and they will.

they are not stupid nor are they ignoring the demand. they are playing it up.

two things are possible.

-ozma 25s is printed large and over saturate the market. lose demand but bandai capitalizes on the sales in one big swoop.

-or ozma is limited to waves. 1st wave, sell out, 2nd reissue: a bit bigger sell out: 3rd re-issue TBD.

-they made the yf29 isamu web exclusive. that was the big capitalize in one big swoop method. thus the market will be over saturated with yf29 isamus's for a long length like former vf-1 yamatos valks and discounted on the second hand market. and no demand of those for a while... until a long fews years when the secondhand market dries out. then prices will slowly rise. Bandai collects data...

-ozma yf-29 is sold retail. sold out fast. bandai collects data...

-rvf 171 luca web exclusive bandai is collecting data (why is it web, can you take a guess? previously based on the 171 sales)

-ozma 25s is retail... why?

you have to be blind to not see that it does not matter whether they are selling domestic or international market. they are tallying the complete sales data of valks ordered and sold for those web exclusives which includes those that ordered through NY or proxy's. so they can see when bandai just prints for domestic sales and when they do web exclusives, they can compare the numbers and see the discrepancy. since the yf-29 isaume was all web they would see the number ordered included international demand because it was all sourced from web orders.

for their regular releases they also see if the B&M are selling out or not. thus amiami gets restocks of the yf-25 and the vf-171 cannon fodder.

.

what does all this data tell you: Bandai knows...

Bandai is releasing ozma in waves..

and make the 2nd wave a larger quantity that is not a long term over saturating of the market but enough to make a bigger profit than the last run. wait till the market dries again repeat.

do you think the vf-25f/g tornados were released with just a re-release of the 25f by accident?

why? bc the g alone is not a fast seller. but with the g tornados out without the reissue, the demand will increase with the purpose refusal to reprint the G while releasing the F the 25g will increase in demand. string and milk.

anyways, i'm sure you can see they are in it to make money but not going for the big all in one swoop. not at least until the end is near of the market for these valks.

[Gakken85]

That's what I'm saying. They just look at numbers. They make 2k. It sells. Then they maybe make another 1k. And let it slowly trickle down. And they strategically release other things.

A yf-29 that's sorta like Arcadias new mold. Ect.

Its like this guys said that runs a toy shop that I know, "people only buy SOCs (soul of chogokin) if they get them at PO prices. Anything you don't sell at that point is stock you're stuck with that barely sells. Nobody wants it."

They avoid that with Frontier by keeping a slow burn because profit margins on transforming toys is so thin.

Edited August 5, 2014 by Gakken85

[skullmilitia]

Your argument is completely void, you can't compare a general release with a web exclusive.

Bandai Made to order the YF-29 Isamu. It's market value is completely on those who bought it.

General release are directed at normal market release. They make general release items dependent on

The budget that was allowed for X number of pieces. They intend to do an X amount based on a per cost basis.

Those numbers are then set in stone for that run of the tooling.

If the retailers ask for more then available, during tooling run, they could essentially run more.

But the cost per order, will go up unless they renegotiate the purchase order with the factory.

Which is the reason why there are shortages. You lose profit when you renegotiate. Instead of just selling out

And then buying a second run, based on demand.

Bandai doesn't not care about sales outside of their distribution channels. This is how big business runs.

The numbers are in the protocol, not the objectified demand statistics. They go purely off pre-sold inventory

To retailers.

Edited August 5, 2014 by skullmilitia

[skullmilitia]

hey guys! i'm about to be a bit snarky:

and make the 2nd wave a larger quantity that is not a long term over saturating of the market but enough to make a bigger profit than the last run. wait till the market dries again repeat.

do you think the vf-25f/g tornados were released with just a re-release of the 25f by accident?

why? bc the g alone is not a fast seller. but with the g tornados out without the reissue, the demand will increase with the purpose refusal to reprint the G while releasing the F the 25g will increase in demand. string and milk.

anyways, i'm sure you can see they are in it to make money but not going for the big all in one swoop. not at least until the end is near of the market for these valks.

Na, this is just simple business planning. Bandai designers will have a catalog of goods that they intend to release.

Those releases are dependent on profits from previous releases. The Tornado parts in this perspective are just a simple rule of having the VF-25F sellout at retail multiple times. Those profits opened up the next release, which would be the Tornado parts WE.

The VF-25G version gets made simply by expense sharing and double dipping. It really doesn't cost much to change colors during a tooling phase. Sales numbers on these maybe of less importance, however if they didn't get enough pre-orders to make budget on the numbers they have already planned. It would get canceled. I'm not saying Bandai doesn't have a plan, but it's not as .. Conspirical as you've put it. The 25S will no doubt pace the way for a G reissue. Simply because it's proving demand for reissues, double that with the recent WE G parts and you have a crossroads for the next release. However.. It maybe delayed, if they have already chosen their next design, and that design maybe ahead, in the molding phase.

But.. We are reaching the perverbal end of the Macross F Valkyrie lauch bay. Outside of a few repaints like

Graces VF-27, and Berera's ghosts. After the next G reissue, there's really nothing left for Frontier. Sure some WE parts packs

Are probably on the table, not counting repaints of the limited YF-30.. I think Bandai might be getting ready to shift.

It's possible to get bundles, but I think those days are gone, they make more in pieces.

[erikos0311]

Ozma is up NY. Goo!

It's been up for 5 min.!!! Where is everyone ?!?!?

[Saburo]

There is at least 20 of them this round.

[wolfx]

Still 18,000 yen. Surprising.

[wmkjr]

Did Ozma's super parts increase 2000yen over at NY? Last time I checked I thought it was 12500ish.

[Valk-1S]

It appears they are marking up their shipping costs as well. If you put in a VF-25F, the shipping cost for EMS is 3,200 Yen while for the VF-25S its 4,000 Yen. No thanks. I just take my chances with HLJ or wait when it get released and try to get one then. If not, then just hope for another reissue.

[brouken]

Yes, NY increased the price for the super parts as well as the armored parts. Capitalizing on the VF-25s demand no doubt. :-)

[wolfx]

The armored parts in NY has been that high for some time. It wasn't a recent change.

[Falcon18]

Hope I'm able to get mine from HLJ. My order is still in my account page, so hopefully.

How does NY open up so many windows? Where are they getting their stock from if stores like HLJ aren't even getting more?

[chyll2]

NY got 25s now

18k

https://www.nippon-yasan.com/macross/8318-macross-f-vf-25s-messiah-valkyrie-ozma-lee-custom-renewal-ver-reissue.html

[wmkjr]

The armored parts in NY has been that high for some time. It wasn't a recent change.

Thanks for the info. Now they gotta reissue those.

[Valk-1S]

Thanks for the info. Now they gotta reissue those.

Chances are will be slim given that it was a Tamashii exclusive and I don't think they have ever reissued any of the Tamashii exclusive items.

[Chronocidal]

Down to 15, I've PM'd a couple people who wanted one on the off chance it might notify them, but dunno if they're even awake.

[brouken]

The armor parts in NY had been going down incrementally by a few dollars since the VF-25s announcement. It used to be USD315++. It had gone down to about USD310++ before going up again to 311++. I've been monitoring this because I was planning on getting the armored parts once I get the Ozma preorder. I guess they were waiting if Bandai would do a bundle/armor parts reissue. I was hoping that it would slowly go down to below USD300, but now that it's rising, I'm assuming that NY thinks that Bandai WON'T do a re-issue of the armor parts. For now at least.

[Valk-1S]

The armor parts in NY had been going down incrementally by a few dollars since the VF-25s announcement. It used to be USD315++. It had gone down to about USD310++ before going up again to 311++. I've been monitoring this because I was planning on getting the armored parts once I get the Ozma preorder. I guess they were waiting if Bandai would do a bundle/armor parts reissue. I was hoping that it would slowly go down to below USD300, but now that it's rising, I'm assuming that NY thinks that Bandai WON'T do a re-issue of the armor parts. For now at least.

Price movement in USD is most likely due to exchange rate movement as their primary pricing is in Yen. I bought the Armor set when the VF-25F was first announced to be reissued on the anticipation that the VF-25S will follow shortly so I got it at a good price at that time but waited for a long time for the VF-25S to be reissued.

[wolfx]

Hope I'm able to get mine from HLJ. My order is still in my account page, so hopefully.

How does NY open up so many windows? Where are they getting their stock from if stores like HLJ aren't even getting more?

They just choose to release in batches. Like 10 first batch at 14,000 yen, then 20 for 18,000 yen so on and so forth.

Thanks for the info. Now they gotta reissue those.

Chances are will be slim given that it was a Tamashii exclusive and I don't think they have ever reissued any of the Tamashii exclusive items.

What Valk-1S said. Tamashii exclusive stuff never got reissued ever. That's the reason i got the Ozma parts a year ago on the hope that the Ozma will eventually be released. And it did! Yay! As expected, the prices are skyrocketing now.

Down to 15, I've PM'd a couple people who wanted one on the off chance it might notify them, but dunno if they're even awake.

How do you see the stock available? Just brute-force the quantity and see how many they reject?

The armor parts in NY had been going down incrementally by a few dollars since the VF-25s announcement. It used to be USD315++. It had gone down to about USD310++ before going up again to 311++. I've been monitoring this because I was planning on getting the armored parts once I get the Ozma preorder. I guess they were waiting if Bandai would do a bundle/armor parts reissue. I was hoping that it would slowly go down to below USD300, but now that it's rising, I'm assuming that NY thinks that Bandai WON'T do a re-issue of the armor parts. For now at least.

It used to be 15,000 yen a year ago then it went up to 30,000 yen this year. Insane. Got mine from Mandarake for 10,000 yen last year.

[Chronocidal]

How do you see the stock available? Just brute-force the quantity and see how many they reject?

Exactly, yes. I just plugged in an order of 20 to see how many it would cut down to. They're down to less than 10 now though.

I'm a little surprised they're allowing more than one per person, but I guess they're not so worried about scalpers picking up cases of them at above retail price.

[chyll2]

tamashii online exclusive can be re-issued as long as their is something different/unique about it like special coating version. But thinking about macross, that just adds up to it being more slim to gets re-released as well