DX VF-171EX from Macross Frontier

[valid]

but it will release early June rite? is it ? will it?

[CF18]

Better version of the test unit scan.

[PsYcHoDyNaMiX]

Is the red encircled part of the scan indicating that there's some sort of a rubber sleeve encasing the shoulder's joint? I can't read Japanese, but that's kind of what it looks like from the picture.

[DARKWIND]

I hope my kids get one for me when they visit Japan this summer!

[BlueMax]

but it will release early June rite? is it ? will it?

More like end June

[Pierre]

Rubber part is going to end up being the underside of the lerx in Fighter mode? ?? I wonder how that part will hold up to time.

[ShadowRaven]

preorder for 1 up at bbts

[Reïvaj]

Is the red encircled part of the scan indicating that there's some sort of a rubber sleeve encasing the shoulder's joint? I can't read Japanese, but that's kind of what it looks like from the picture.

I don't think so.

[Pierre]

The image in the red circle is showing something the grey area in the arm pit is either fabric or some other flexible material

[Reïvaj]

Mais non ! Why would they do that? It's only a piece of black plastic, just like the legs. They're probably just pointing out that the transformation process around that area will be easier than previous (Yamato’s) efforts.

[VF5SS]

http://www.tamashii.jp/00_CMS/cmsdesigner/data/entry/item_info1/item_info1.01723.00000010.jpg

Yeah it's just plastic. No crazy rubber.

[raptormesh]

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but have bandai ever said anything about a CF or recon version?

[confuseguy]

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but have bandai ever said anything about a CF or recon version?

Nope but I trust Bandai will come out with the recon at least......since the VF-25G is due in Autumn~

Happy waiting

[Renato]

http://tamashii.jp/item/item.php?eid=01723&pref=301

OK, let's analyze this, shall we. Who else thinks that they may have left out the backwards-swing motion in the heels? That Gerwalk is leaning way too far forward for comfort. And those "flying/hovering" poses they have put the Gerwalk into in those previous promo photos all have shown the heels pointing forwards... Is this going to be like Yamato's "pretty much ruined the whole toy" Fire Valk heels/ankles?

Argh. Only one way to find out -- GAMBLE SOME HARD-EARNED CASH.

[Mommar]

I think they're just showing off how deep it can turn down in Gerwalk mode. The 25's ankles had plenty of movement forward and back. I'd be surprised if they screwed this up (but Yamato would be wise to look at how the 25's ankles function and the fix their other Vf-19/17 releases later this year with Ankles that don't suck but I doubt they will because nobody will inform them the ankles are poorly designed.)

[eugimon]

What's wrong with the 17's ankles?

[Mommar]

Because of the design/weight distribution of the valk the 17's ankles are less of a problem however they're the exact same design as the 19's and as such need more dynamic range front to back. Like the 25, they would benefit from a joint higher up that handles motion left to right and then a lower click-able portion that handles front to back. That would greatly improve both the 17 and 19 overall.

Edited May 8, 2012 by Mommar

[VF5SS]

Argh. Only one way to find out -- GAMBLE SOME HARD-EARNED CASH.

or wait for some jackass on a review website to do that for you :v

[eugimon]

Because of the design/weight distribution of the valk the 17's ankles are less of a problem however they're the exact same design as the 19's and as such need more dynamic range front to back. Like the 25, they would benefit from a joint higher up that handles motion left to right and then a lower click-able portion that handles front to back. That would greatly improve both the 17 and 19 overall.

do you actually own a 17? The 17 and 19's ankles do have a joint that allows left to right motion and the front to back rocking motion is pretty damn deep. The 25's ankles have no ratchet's either, BTW.

[Mommar]

do you actually own a 17? The 17 and 19's ankles do have a joint that allows left to right motion and the front to back rocking motion is pretty damn deep. The 25's ankles have no ratchet's either, BTW.

The front to back on both the 17 and 19 is awful and can lead to the joint popping apart in some cases. If the 25 has no ratchets then I'm curious why the ankles on my F and S both click as I adjust them forward and back?

[pud333]

The front to back on both the 17 and 19 is awful and can lead to the joint popping apart in some cases. If the 25 has no ratchets then I'm curious why the ankles on my F and S both click as I adjust them forward and back?

Maybe that sound is stuck in your head, cause my 25 valks have no ratchets.

[Chronocidal]

Eh, I can't vouch for the 17's ankles, but the fire valk's were a disaster. Tons of side to side motion, but almost nothing front to back. Maybe 10-15 degrees each way at most? It's why so many people complained about gerwalk; the ankles aren't capable (without some tweaking) of pointing the toe enough to stand up in gerwalk. To get a good gerwalk pose, you have to stretch out the joints, which makes them completely loose anywhere near center.

The real problem though is just in the design of the ball joints. There's no reason a ball joint should have such an uneven range of motion, and it shouldn't get tighter depending on where you move it. Center the feet on my fire valk, and they'll spin like a propeller around the ball, but push them to their limits and they tighten up.

The VF-25's feet do have a good range of motion, but we all know the tendency of Bandai's ball joints to go limper than a wet noodle over time, so I don't expect them to hold out. The VF-171 will likely be the same. Bandai just has seems to have this stupid obsession with using metal for their joints, and while yes, it might have different strength than plastic, honestly? I've never had a problem with plastic joints, or plastic on metal, etc. It's always metal-on-metal joints that go limp, and Bandai seems to have this horrible fetish for them.

Really, I'm sick of die cast. I don't mind it for making certain parts stronger, but 90% of the time, it's more trouble than it's worth, and all it winds up doing is inevitably losing paint. There is no good reason for why they need to make JUST the hip joints on the VF-25 metal. It does nothing but give you a piece that will lose paint, has a stark contrast in detail (since they can't seem to finely mold diecast like they can plastic), gives you limp joints over time (because they can't seem to figure out how to make their metal joints last), and even winds up having a negative effect on the super packs, since I'm sure if they just made the hips out of plastic, it'd be an incredibly simple task to engineer hip armor that would snap on securely, instead of having to clip around an object with inherently rounded edges due to the casting.

[Renato]

or wait for some jackass on a review website to do that for you :v

You know that won't do -- by the time someone does a review there will be no supply of valks left.

Eh, I can't vouch for the 17's ankles, but the fire valk's were a disaster. Tons of side to side motion, but almost nothing front to back. Maybe 10-15 degrees each way at most? It's why so many people complained about gerwalk; the ankles aren't capable (without some tweaking) of pointing the toe enough to stand up in gerwalk. To get a good gerwalk pose, you have to stretch out the joints, which makes them completely loose anywhere near center.

The real problem though is just in the design of the ball joints. There's no reason a ball joint should have such an uneven range of motion, and it shouldn't get tighter depending on where you move it. Center the feet on my fire valk, and they'll spin like a propeller around the ball, but push them to their limits and they tighten up.

The VF-25's feet do have a good range of motion, but we all know the tendency of Bandai's ball joints to go limper than a wet noodle over time, so I don't expect them to hold out. The VF-171 will likely be the same. Bandai just has seems to have this stupid obsession with using metal for their joints, and while yes, it might have different strength than plastic, honestly? I've never had a problem with plastic joints, or plastic on metal, etc. It's always metal-on-metal joints that go limp, and Bandai seems to have this horrible fetish for them.

Really, I'm sick of die cast. I don't mind it for making certain parts stronger, but 90% of the time, it's more trouble than it's worth, and all it winds up doing is inevitably losing paint. There is no good reason for why they need to make JUST the hip joints on the VF-25 metal. It does nothing but give you a piece that will lose paint, has a stark contrast in detail (since they can't seem to finely mold diecast like they can plastic), gives you limp joints over time (because they can't seem to figure out how to make their metal joints last), and even winds up having a negative effect on the super packs, since I'm sure if they just made the hips out of plastic, it'd be an incredibly simple task to engineer hip armor that would snap on securely, instead of having to clip around an object with inherently rounded edges due to the casting.

Gotta agree with everything here.

[eugimon]

The front to back on both the 17 and 19 is awful and can lead to the joint popping apart in some cases. If the 25 has no ratchets then I'm curious why the ankles on my F and S both click as I adjust them forward and back?

Again, do you actually own the 17? And I'm curious why your 25's ankles are making noises as well. Maybe you got a rock stuck in there.

[Mommar]

And I'm curious why your 25's ankles are making noises as well. Maybe you got a rock stuck in there.

Bend the Ankle all the way back then all the way forward. You should hear three light clicks. Both of my 25's do this.

[eyesonme78]

This. Just get her something and you should be good.

Normally I will just get it first and when she is not noticing, I will put it in my display cabinet and said it has magically appeared.

Works 95% of the time, 5 % is when she caught me taking off my box

[Graham]

The front to back on both the 17 and 19 is awful and can lead to the joint popping apart in some cases.

There's only a few reported cases of the VF-19 joint popping apart and this only seems to happen when the ankle joint is deliberately forced past it’s range of motion limit.

Graham

[Mommar]

There's only a few reported cases of the VF-19 joint popping apart and this only seems to happen when the ankle joint is deliberately forced past it’s range of motion limit.

Graham

Which is easy to do because the design sucks and needs to be reimplemented.

[eugimon]

Bend the Ankle all the way back then all the way forward. You should hear three light clicks. Both of my 25's do this.

Huh, you're right. I do hear clicking when pushing them back. Never heard it before, thanks!

But you still haven't answered my question, do you actually own a vf-17?

[Chronocidal]

Actually, no, they don't exactly "pop apart"... but they will definitely loosen up severely if you try to achieve anything approaching the normal ankle range of any other Yammie.

I know they looked over it for the VF-19S, and it was improved, probably because they just decided to go with not painting the metal pieces. But for whatever reason, the ball joint still isn't round enough to be called a "ball joint."

It's probably due to the combination metal/plastic ball they use, which is a nice concept, but has one very serious result: you've got a heavy stress joint with inconsistent material properties. The plastic and metal will not behave the same way when put under stress, and you're going to get a very uneven distribution of friction, which is what I'm pretty sure causes the ankle problems.

Anyway, this isn't about the VF-19/VF-17. Given Bandai's past history with their stupid metal joints, I'd actually be thrilled to find out they used the same design as Yamato did on the VF-19 and VF-17, because it would mean that at least when the joint goes limp, there are screws to tighten it again.

Honestly, I'm beginning to think the reason Bandai always includes a stand is because they're fully aware of how little wear and tear their joints will take. Yamato's got enough faith in their ankle joints to figure you'll be fine without a stand, but I don't think Bandai has ever intended for these to be displayed standing on the ground.

[Graham]

Which is why all my Bandai's get displayed in fighter mode

Graham

[Mommar]

Huh, you're right. I do hear clicking when pushing them back. Never heard it before, thanks!

But you still haven't answered my question, do you actually own a vf-17?

I do and plan on getting the D when it's released as well.

[Reïvaj]

Still available here:

http://www.nippon-yasan.com/lang-en/figurines-autres/1688-dx-chogokin-macross-f-frontier-vf-171ex-nightmare-plus-ex-saotome-alto-custom.html

[anime52k8]

>snip<

Have you ever entertained the thought that there's nothing wrong with the toys themselves and it's really just you? Maybe the toys don't like you, or they think you have a bad haircut or something.

[Renato]

Have you ever entertained the thought that there's nothing wrong with the toys themselves and it's really just you? Maybe the toys don't like you, or they think you have a bad haircut or something.

Well, that's constructive.