DX VF-171EX from Macross Frontier

[Lolicon]

If Bandai is so goddamn risk averse, they really ought to just allow Yamato to produce Frontier valkyries. Then Yamato takes the risk, Bandai gets to collect a % of the profits with little risk to themselves, and we might actually be able to buy without having to camp out websites in the hope of catching that tiny preorder window or dealing with scalpers.

I'd be willing to pay more for a VF-171/25/27 if the quality was on par with Yamato's VF-19.

[crasis]

This whole "limiting the numbers" game is utterly frustrating. Bandai DX valks never sold out within SECONDS before the VF-171EX and the reissue YF-29. And not on nearly EVERY import site. A few contacts from Japan have been explaining this disturbing trend in the collectibles market recently to me. Takara, Bandai, etc. have been DRASTICALLY cutting back their production numbers to avoid any potential shelf warming in this economy... but, more importantly, to also DRIVE UP DEMAND. This way, the reissue versions are released at a higher markup and still sell out in minutes--perhaps seconds--because consumers are so desperate. The thing I don't get in all this: it seems to be primarily helping scalpers make profit, and ultimately blocks consumers from purchasing the products from Bandai. Wouldn't THEY rather get the money than have some dude on ebay make hundreds of dollars reselling?

[Mommar]

the reissue versions are released at a higher markup and still sell out in minutes--perhaps seconds--because consumers are so desperate.

This is exactly what I was thinking this whole bs under-producing strategy is really all about.

[jenius]

You guys are insane. Damn u bandai for letting retailers jerk my chain! Be upset at the retailers, not bandai. U can't know if u'r even pissed with bandai until after the toy is released.

[Mechapilot77]

This whole "limiting the numbers" game is utterly frustrating. Bandai DX valks never sold out within SECONDS before the VF-171EX and the reissue YF-29. And not on nearly EVERY import site. A few contacts from Japan have been explaining this disturbing trend in the collectibles market recently to me. Takara, Bandai, etc. have been DRASTICALLY cutting back their production numbers to avoid any potential shelf warming in this economy... but, more importantly, to also DRIVE UP DEMAND. This way, the reissue versions are released at a higher markup and still sell out in minutes--perhaps seconds--because consumers are so desperate. The thing I don't get in all this: it seems to be primarily helping scalpers make profit, and ultimately blocks consumers from purchasing the products from Bandai. Wouldn't THEY rather get the money than have some dude on ebay make hundreds of dollars reselling?

here is a thought. maybe these scalpers ARE the very e-tailers we deal with or people they've contracted out to sell their stock. i would NOT AT ALL be surprised. why sell out retail when you can scalp?

[eugimon]

here is a thought. maybe these scalpers ARE the very e-tailers we deal with or people they've contracted out to sell their stock. i would NOT AT ALL be surprised. why sell out retail when you can scalp?

the ebay stores aren't scalpers. They're just regular retailers who are selling their stock on ebay with a mark up on it. That is to say, they aren't buying the items and then re-selling them, they're 1st party retailers.

As for blaming the retailers vs bandai. That's ridiculous. The retailers can't sell any more than what Bandai will deliver to them. Are you honestly saying that it's in HLJ's interest to send customers over to ebay? The only party that doesn't care would be Bandai who still gets to sell the same number of units, whether or not those units get sold on ebay, on HLJ or at the corner store, Bandai gets exactly the same amount of money.

If *anything* bandai would get a bigger cut if sales were diverted more to these small ebay stores since the larger stores like HLJ might have volume discount purchase agreements in place.

Edited March 1, 2012 by eugimon

[Kyp Durron]

Yeah, I'm going to echo some of the previous posters here by saying: "F U, Bandai. No, seriously, F U."

At this point, I'm strongly considering trying to trade my Alto for an Ozma in the for sale section, to have a second Ozma, and then walk away from the line permanently.

Oh, and I'd just like to say this again to Bandai-kun:

-Kyp

[valhary]

I start to tire of this actitude seem to be a conspiracy first with durandal and now with this nighmare ex I really like this bird but if bandai don´t want my money I suppose it would be for the yamato´s "D"

[jenius]

so... u guys know that bandai has communicated the shipping amount to the retailers huh? You don't think there is an incentive for retailers to jump the gun? It's too soon to say... it's too soon to even be angry yet.

[eugimon]

so... u guys know that bandai has communicated the shipping amount to the retailers huh? You don't think there is an incentive for retailers to jump the gun? It's too soon to say... it's too soon to even be angry yet.

Yeah, there's no way retailers would have information like how many units are available. I'm sure stores always operate by guess how much stock they'll be getting.

[jenius]

so ishoptogo knew the first day a pic was shown what their allocation was?

Edited March 1, 2012 by jenius

[Kyp Durron]

I'm pretty confident AmiAmi and HLJ have a damn good idea as to what their allocations are.

-Kyp

[eugimon]

... oh, good point. Because I shop2togo put up a for sale the second there was any sort of announcement while HLJ and ami ami put up their sales at the same time, along with other shops. That must mean ishop2togo and HLJ are running exactly the same type of store!

Nice try.

And gee, I guess all the backlash over the short sale windows on the renewal vf-25s and the yf-29 must have made HLJ and ami-ami sooo happy, that's why they're doing it again with the 171. Funny how none of their other pre-orders have 5 min windows...

[Rabidweezil]

Hobbysearch's pre-order started today and is already closed as well. I really don't think all these retailers just happened to all have small windows just because it seemed like the thing to do.

[Mechamaniac]

Oh, and I'd just like to say this again to Bandai-kun:

-Kyp

LOL, I almost spit coffee all over my keyboard.

[Mommar]

Hobbysearch's pre-order started today and is already closed as well. I really don't think all these retailers just happened to all have small windows just because it seemed like the thing to do.

I didn't even think to check them. They're already out too? Dang.

[Ignacio Ocamica]

Wouldn't THEY rather get the money than have some dude on ebay make hundreds of dollars reselling?

They are getting the money Bandai sells X number of VF-171 valks "wholesale price" to e-tailers/retailers. If the e-tailers sell above the suggested retail price is beyond bandai's control. Unless Bandai sells the VF-171 through their webshop directly to the fans (tamashii exclusive).

They should've made more units though...

[Chronocidal]

For what it's worth, I don't think HLJ has ever been officially up. They typically start their pre-orders later compared with other sites from what I've seen with the VF-25s. Given how fast we were all refreshing, I don't think they even officially opened the order. I mean, there was what, 30 seconds between the time it went up and the time it was sold out? They've done it that way before, so it wouldn't surprise me to see them open it up later.

The thing is, I don't even really care about getting a pre-order discount on this, even though it would be nice (especially from AmiAmi). I just want there to be enough production to actually get one once the shops have them for real, rather than this idiotic "we won't even make enough to fill the pre-order" malarchy.

I still half think they only put them up as an advertising stunt to get an estimate for demand.

I mean.. seriously. If it's going to be like this, we're probably all better off arranging a series of group buys directly from the Bandai Tamashii site. If they're so worried they won't be able to sell them, they might as well be web exclusives anyway.

[jenius]

Sorry, i didn't realize u guys were such industry insiders. I can try asking someone who does this stuff how it works but it looks like rage is a far more fun answer. Grrrrr! Damn u bandai!

[crasis]

You guys are insane. Damn u bandai for letting retailers jerk my chain! Be upset at the retailers, not bandai. U can't know if u'r even pissed with bandai until after the toy is released.

Retailers can only sell what they are allotted. The record sellout indicates Bandai limited production on this piece to a very small number, as has been a growing trend in the Japanese collectibles industry in recent months. I can absolutely be pissed at Bandai.

[Darth Mingus]

I have less problems getting the Tamashi Web exclusive stuff than the "regular" stuff. I lucked out on an VF-25f but nothing since.

[Old Man]

For what it's worth, I don't think HLJ has ever been officially up. They typically start their pre-orders later compared with other sites from what I've seen with the VF-25s. Given how fast we were all refreshing, I don't think they even officially opened the order. I mean, there was what, 30 seconds between the time it went up and the time it was sold out? They've done it that way before, so it wouldn't surprise me to see them open it up later.

Here's what I got from HLJ customer service early this morning (12:30 AM PST)...

Me:

Why was this item never available? It went from not existing on your site to Order Stop...

HLJ:

Wow, that was quick! I didn't even know it was up yet. It got slammed with orders almost instantly. Unfortunately, that happens a lot with hot new items. Hopefully we'll be able to get more and open it up again for orders.

Me:

Do you know if this was actually available for preorder? Many fans from Macross World Forums (including myself) were refreshing your site multiple times a minute, and they said it went from not being there to "Order Stop". Many fans are VERY upset! Do you know if the page was put up as a place holder, or did this item really sell out that quickly? Is there any way I can get in contact with someone who can tell me for sure if and when this will be available again?

HLJ:

We are indeed hoping to have it back open for orders soon.

Me:

When is soon? I really want this, but I can't stay up all night hitting the refresh button

HLJ:

Really sorry, but I can't say. It may be tonight, it may be tomorrow. It all depends on if we confirm that we can get more stock. I'm sure you understand that we don't want to take more orders than we can fill. That makes even more people angry!

The problem is that Bandai is simply not making enough product to meet the demands. We try to secure as much stock as we can, but with the shortages, we simply cannot get enough to meet demand. I think you will find the same situation on any website you go to.

We apologize for the inconvenience this situation has caused, and pledge to do whatever we can to get as much stock as possible, and open the item up for orders again as soon as possible.

[Rabidweezil]

Sorry, i didn't realize u guys were such industry insiders. I can try asking someone who does this stuff how it works but it looks like rage is a far more fun answer. Grrrrr! Damn u bandai!

You're right. It makes sense. Maybe HLJ decided they only wanted to sell a few of these so they closed their pre-orders after they got what they considered "enough" orders. Places like AmiAmi and Hobbysearch followed HLJ's lead and closed theirs early as well because selling small amounts of something for no reason is good business

[charger69]

Say "Hi!" to flippers

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=dx+vf-171&_sacat=0&_odkw=vf-171&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313

[Chronocidal]

Nice to see an official HLJ response, thanks for taking the time to talk with them.

Guess there's just nothing to do but wait and see then. I'll keep hoping the HLJ page opens up, but it's apparently up to Bandai now. Hopefully with all the sites getting such high demand, Bandai will realize there's good money to be made, and open up the production further.

[jenius]

Alright, I can't speak for HLJ, or amiami, or any toy retailers but I can say it's fairly common business practice to have an expectation of units you will receive and try to beat the market by selling them first. When you do something like that you have to be conservative with the amount you sell just in case your normally reliable wholesaler isn't able to get as many as usual and makes it so you screw your preorderers (BBTS). It's entirely possible that all allocations are out... but it's also possible they're not. I love the leap to blind rage, and the defense of blind rage. We also don't know that all production will be limited to the amount of people who preorder. I dunno, seems the anger is a bit early. I preordered my VF-25S like a couple weeks before it came out and now people act like it was impossible to preorder it.

[Mommar]

Alright, I can't speak for HLJ, or amiami, or any toy retailers but I can say it's fairly common business practice to have an expectation of units you will receive and try to beat the market by selling them first. When you do something like that you have to be conservative with the amount you sell just in case your normally reliable wholesaler isn't able to get as many as usual and makes it so you screw your preorderers (BBTS). It's entirely possible that all allocations are out... but it's also possible they're not. I love the leap to blind rage, and the defense of blind rage. We also don't know that all production will be limited to the amount of people who preorder. I dunno, seems the anger is a bit early. I preordered my VF-25S like a couple weeks before it came out and now people act like it was impossible to preorder it.

The thing is, if it were one time, like with the YF-29, we'd all wonder what was going on and bummed it turned out that way... like people on this webpage have been. But after that, this new instance has occurred and it's even worse then the YF-29 preorder sell outs. Now it's no longer a fluke, Bandai isn't doing something they should and we're being left in the clutch. That's different.

[funkymonkeyjavajunky]

Say "Hi!" to flippers

http://www.ebay.com/...6.c0.m270.l1313

How can you re-sell something that you have yet to receive. What if someone pre-sells an item on Ebay, but doesn't actually get the item? Their pre-order might get cancelled.

[Ignacio Ocamica]

There's only one thing for sure,

This thread is shaping up to be an instant macrossworld classic or/and it will get locked

[VF5SS]

How can you re-sell something that you have yet to receive. What if someone pre-sells an item on Ebay, but doesn't actually get the item? Their pre-order might get cancelled.

The seller can opt for a non-instant payment or refund the buyer since most of this is done with electronic money transfer like paypal.

I think these flippers need to be reported.

[Rabidweezil]

Alright, I can't speak for HLJ, or amiami, or any toy retailers but I can say it's fairly common business practice to have an expectation of units you will receive and try to beat the market by selling them first. When you do something like that you have to be conservative with the amount you sell just in case your normally reliable wholesaler isn't able to get as many as usual and makes it so you screw your preorderers (BBTS). It's entirely possible that all allocations are out... but it's also possible they're not. I love the leap to blind rage, and the defense of blind rage. We also don't know that all production will be limited to the amount of people who preorder. I dunno, seems the anger is a bit early. I preordered my VF-25S like a couple weeks before it came out and now people act like it was impossible to preorder it.

I'll be honest dude,normally I have nothing against you but you're coming across as a bit smug here. People are annoyed, I honestly don't blame them. When news of this being released hit, we were excited. Lots of us were waiting for pre-orders to show up. They did and then they were gone in a day. Sure they might open up again. But now, it's not just about getting a pre-order in and waiting for it to show up in the mail, it's about getting one in during a small window that may or may not actually open up. Otherwise, the option is to pay double or more for scalpers.

We're Macross fans. That's why we are here. Bandai is making nice Valks we want to our collection, but they are becoming unusually hard to come by. That makes people upset.

Not sure why our unhappiness bothers you so much there Mr Spock. I guess we're not all lucky enough to be as in control of our emotions regarding things we like to have as you are.

[Kyp Durron]

Here's what I got from HLJ customer service early this morning (12:30 AM PST)...

Me:

Why was this item never available? It went from not existing on your site to Order Stop...

HLJ:

Wow, that was quick! I didn't even know it was up yet. It got slammed with orders almost instantly. Unfortunately, that happens a lot with hot new items. Hopefully we'll be able to get more and open it up again for orders.

Me:

Do you know if this was actually available for preorder? Many fans from Macross World Forums (including myself) were refreshing your site multiple times a minute, and they said it went from not being there to "Order Stop". Many fans are VERY upset! Do you know if the page was put up as a place holder, or did this item really sell out that quickly? Is there any way I can get in contact with someone who can tell me for sure if and when this will be available again?

HLJ:

We are indeed hoping to have it back open for orders soon.

Me:

When is soon? I really want this, but I can't stay up all night hitting the refresh button

HLJ:

Really sorry, but I can't say. It may be tonight, it may be tomorrow. It all depends on if we confirm that we can get more stock. I'm sure you understand that we don't want to take more orders than we can fill. That makes even more people angry!

The problem is that Bandai is simply not making enough product to meet the demands. We try to secure as much stock as we can, but with the shortages, we simply cannot get enough to meet demand. I think you will find the same situation on any website you go to.

We apologize for the inconvenience this situation has caused, and pledge to do whatever we can to get as much stock as possible, and open the item up for orders again as soon as possible.

Like I said, they aleady knew how many they could get intially before putting up the preorder, and they've already ran through their allocation. You can't sit there and tell me that Bandai had no idea what kind of demand there would be before committing to making the 171 EX production run, they didn't just blindly do this wilst praying that there would be enough people to buy this thing.

Judging by how fast the preorders sold out everywhere, it's safe to assume that even if any of the retailers open their preorders back up, they're just going to close again just as fast, if not faster. In otherwords, unless Bandai decides to make another run of these later, we're pretty much SOL for the time being.

I for one, don't plan on playing the F5 game at my computer praying I'll make the ridiculous 30-120 second window of opprotunity just to get one of these Goddamned things, I'd rather give my money to Yamato, thank you very much. At this point, all I want is my second Ozma for the Super Parts that I've already bought, and that will do it for me.

-Kyp

[pud333]

Retailers can only sell what they are allotted. The record sellout indicates Bandai limited production on this piece to a very small number, as has been a growing trend in the Japanese collectibles industry in recent months. I can absolutely be pissed at Bandai.

Yes. There's probably more to the story than what it seems, but maybe there isn't. The 29 reissue sold out just as quickly. It is being released in May, so we'll find out then if more stock pops up or not.

I have less problems getting the Tamashi Web exclusive stuff than the "regular" stuff. I lucked out on an VF-25f but nothing since.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I'd almost be willing to pay a reasonable premium if it meant I was guaranteed an order. That way at least I could sleep and not worry. I've actually been very fortunate with my orders. I got the 25F, 25S, 29 and now the 171 all from Amiami. Hopefully I can keep my streak going. I think it helps that a) I am on the west coast, so I don't have to stay up all night, b) I tell my girlfriend beforehand not to expect me to even look her way between such and such a time on the day of preorder, and c) beer. Beer gives me strength to persevere!

Here's what I got from HLJ customer service early this morning (12:30 AM PST)...

Me:

Why was this item never available? It went from not existing on your site to Order Stop...

HLJ:

Wow, that was quick! I didn't even know it was up yet. It got slammed with orders almost instantly. Unfortunately, that happens a lot with hot new items. Hopefully we'll be able to get more and open it up again for orders.

Me:

Do you know if this was actually available for preorder? Many fans from Macross World Forums (including myself) were refreshing your site multiple times a minute, and they said it went from not being there to "Order Stop". Many fans are VERY upset! Do you know if the page was put up as a place holder, or did this item really sell out that quickly? Is there any way I can get in contact with someone who can tell me for sure if and when this will be available again?

HLJ:

We are indeed hoping to have it back open for orders soon.

Me:

When is soon? I really want this, but I can't stay up all night hitting the refresh button

HLJ:

Really sorry, but I can't say. It may be tonight, it may be tomorrow. It all depends on if we confirm that we can get more stock. I'm sure you understand that we don't want to take more orders than we can fill. That makes even more people angry!

The problem is that Bandai is simply not making enough product to meet the demands. We try to secure as much stock as we can, but with the shortages, we simply cannot get enough to meet demand. I think you will find the same situation on any website you go to.

We apologize for the inconvenience this situation has caused, and pledge to do whatever we can to get as much stock as possible, and open the item up for orders again as soon as possible.

Thanks for that.

[Chronocidal]

To be very fair to Bandai, the VF-171 is a gamble.. er, well, at least in their minds it probably is. Fans will want it like crazy, but this is where Bandai's experience with Gundam might really be hindering their marketing methods for Macross. See.. with Gundam, they really only seem to sell the hero units (the grunts sometimes break through, but it's not the norm that I've seen). The main character gets one nice shiny mech, slaughters countless enemy cannon fodder with it, and saves the day. Not many people want the ugly boring enemy mechs, unless they're piloted by some important character.

Well here's the fun thing about Macross.. even the ugly boring enemy mechs and cannon fodder are pretty darn awesome, and a significant portion of fans would love to have them.

I'd say it's nearly a miracle that Bandai even decided to make the VF-171 at all. Not trusting it to sell well is obviously a problem with the way Bandai views the Macross fanbase, but it's something they've had trouble getting over for a long time. Hopefully the crazy demand for this thing will knock some sense into the way they view the franchise.

As awesome as we all think it is, and as much as we want one, Bandai probably doesn't have any reason to expect the design to be that popular, so they don't want to risk a huge production. Hopefully, when they get word of the crazy rush to buy them, they'll realize they can sell a lot more.

[Dobber]

Damn, I really wanted to get this....but I too am tired of the "hoping to hit an incredibly small window of availability" that seems to be happening lately. The 29.....originally wasn't too hard to get. IIRC, you had a day maybe 2 to get the preorder in before it sold out. The 25S less so but still not too bad, I just saw the post on this site, went HLJ and ordered. They sold out quick but still had at least a few hour window. Then the 29 rerelease came and well.......I guess I got very lucky from what people are saying about the window. I got up 6:00am EST and around 6:45am checked HLJ and preordered. From what it sounds like that was at just the right time. But this nano second window is insane. I hope to get one but won't do the refresh game either....well not too much anyway. I agree that you'd think that Bandai would see the demand for Frontier balks and up the production at least a little bit.

Chris