Einherjar Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) So, it makes sense that they hyped up Shadow Chronicles as the answer to the "greatest mystery of a generation." Because, you know, when you think about your childhood from the 80s, the first thing you think of is " OMG Rick Hunter! What happened to him?!?!" And then I'd say "I liked him better when he was a pilot. You know, back when he actually did things that mattered. And before legalities forced him to get really old." Edited October 31, 2011 by Einherjar
Jasonc Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Isn't that exactly what the crappy Frontier is doing as well -- trying to emulate Macross (right down to the principal character archetypes) and failing miserably. Uninspired Imitation or Homage? Didn't the Robotech Novels (the Sentinels series) have a singing android (Janice Em?)? I believe they were published in the late 80s before Plus came out. To answer your first question, to say that Macross is emulating Macross doesn't really make sense. Is it attempting to recapture its original elements? That's a more accurate portrayal. As far as your comment about it supposedly "failing miserably", your assessment is pretty damn far off. I don't know if you've looked at the internet, or read anything, but when a series spawns two full length movies, and more toys and product in 2 years than Robotech has done in 26, that isn't failure. I will say this, your comments of "Crappy Frontier" and "Failing miserably" sound like they are stemmed from 100% your opinion, and Zero fact.
anime52k8 Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Isn't that exactly what the crappy Frontier is doing as well -- trying to emulate Macross (right down to the principal character archetypes) and failing miserably. Uninspired Imitation or Homage? Didn't the Robotech Novels (the Sentinels series) have a singing android (Janice Em?)? I believe they were published in the late 80s before Plus came out.
ps99042 Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 your comments of "Crappy Frontier" and "Failing miserably" sound like they are stemmed from 100% your opinion, and Zero fact. What else would you expect from member of rt.com? It's probably McKeevie, Memo, or Mav. Can we even include the rt novels in any discussion since HG ignores them too?
Aeternalis Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) Failure? I remember the response was overwhelmingly positive even outside this forum. It was always promoted as an anniversary production for the franchise, purposely making homages to the original but then deconstructing them over the course of the series. Sometimes viciously. Seriously?! To me it comes across as more of an extended J-Pop music video/soap opera with annoying, cliched and asinine characters. Yeah, Macross Plus *TOTALLY* ripped off the Robotech Novels!!!! Yeah, cuz that is *TOTALLY* what I meant!!! Reading Comprehension FAIL! I will say this, your comments of "Crappy Frontier" and "Failing miserably" sound like they are stemmed from 100% your opinion, and Zero fact. Errr... Where I did stipulate that "my" opinion was a universal "fact". Pray tell! Edited October 31, 2011 by Aeternalis
Einherjar Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) Seriously?! To me it comes across as more of an extended J-Pop music video/soap opera with annoying, cliched and asinine characters. Except for the J-pop music, all of those are common elements in the genre of a space opera. I feel like I'm going to regret this, but what did you want to see in a Macross and/or Robotech show? Edited October 31, 2011 by Einherjar
Aeternalis Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) Except for the J-pop music, all of those are common elements in the genre of a space opera. I feel like I'm going to regret this, but what did you want to see in a Macross and/or Robotech show? Hunh?! Umm... are you saying that annoying, cliched and asinine characters are a staple of "space opera"? If you meant Soap Opera however, you would be correct. Also, having a dissenting opinion doesn't automatically make one a "Robotech fan". I am certain this forum isn't meant to be some type of self-affirming circle-jerk. Edited October 31, 2011 by Aeternalis
Gubaba Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Also, having a dissenting opinion doesn't automatically make one a "Robotech fan". I am certain this forum isn't meant to be some type of self-affirming circle-jerk. You're absolutely right. And disliking Frontier is perfectly fine (although it's kind of a minority view here). But we've had problems before with Robotech fan trolls showing up just to stir up trouble, so everyone's a little cautious these days. Remember, this thread is just here to contain the Robotech insanity...you're probably better off spending your time in the "Movies and Series" forum, or the "Toys" forum. Those are where the REAL action is.
Einherjar Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Hunh?! Umm... are you saying that annoying, cliched and asinine characters are a staple of "space opera"? If you meant Soap Opera however, you would be correct. Also, having a dissenting opinion doesn't automatically make one a "Robotech fan". I am certain this forum isn't meant to be some type of self-affirming circle-jerk. Since it has sci-fi elements and it takes place in space, even though the ship they're on gives off the illusion that they're on a planet, I stand by calling it a space opera. It's just like Gundam, Votoms, Legend of Galactic Heroes, a lot of sci-fi themed anime out there, and Robotech. Not as hard core or epic as others, but still the same. Also, I bring it up because people tend to be too demanding about shows on the Internet. God knows we've seen a lot of people go nuts with it.
mrhillz Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 How come we can't vote posts down? Probably too much butthurtage, you should have seen it back in the day at tfw2005 when you could.
Jasonc Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Errr... Where I did stipulate that "my" opinion was a universal "fact". Pray tell! Isn't that exactly what the crappy Frontier is doing as well -- trying to emulate Macross (right down to the principal character archetypes) and failing miserably. Uninspired Imitation or Homage? Simply this statement here..."...and failing miserably." You wrote the first part of your sentence as opinion (which is fine), then created a fact based on your opinion (which is false). It's like me saying "Robotech sucks, and the entire series was a money pit." In any case, Macross Frontier isn't really the subject in here, unless you're going to attempt to lead in to a deep analysis of how it's so much worse than Robotech
Keith Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 http://boards.4chan.org/m/res/7019711 oh hey someone posted that treatment grab it quick, 4chan threads go fast~ The forgot to right "pause" at the end.
taksraven Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Yeah, cuz that is *TOTALLY* what I meant!!! Reading Comprehension FAIL! Chillax bro.
Renato Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 http://boards.4chan.org/m/res/7019711 oh hey someone posted that treatment grab it quick, 4chan threads go fast~ "Written by Steve Yun with Tommy Yune". Oh god. Seeing those words greet me at the very start of the page just reminds me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU5xdc-txPU&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9eDwHznMas Is that basically how the writing process went?
Keith Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) Regardless of the writing process, this should be the editing process. Edited October 31, 2011 by Keith
JB0 Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 "Written by Steve Yun with Tommy Yune". Truly the greatest minds of our time.
anime52k8 Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 How come we can't vote posts down? Speaking of which I'd like to know who keeps up voting my posts. Apparently the only person with more up votes than me is Gubaba and I find that rather disturbing.
Aeternalis Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) Since it has sci-fi elements and it takes place in space, even though theha ship they're on gives off the illusion that they're on a planet, I stand by calling it a space opera. It's just like Gundam, Votoms, Legend of Galactic Heroes, a lot of sci-fi themed anime out there, and Robotech. Not as hard core or epic as others, but still the same. Also, I bring it up because people tend to be too demanding about shows on the Internet. God knows we've seen a lot of people go nuts with it. I'm rather confused, where exactly did I express my disdain for the "space opera" conventions in Frontier? I have an issue with the characters and the narrative based on the motivations and actions of said characters. Simply this statement here..."...and failing miserably." You wrote the first part of your sentence as opinion (which is fine), then created a fact based on your opinion (which is false). It's like me saying "Robotech sucks, and the entire series was a money pit." No. The second part of my statement "qualifies" the opinion expressed in the first half of my statement, as in the show tries to be a homage but fails. The failing of said show is predicted on my belief/opinion that it was not effective in it's aims. In the phrase "Robotech sucks and the entire series was a money pit", the latter half of the sentence does not qualify the first. Conversely saying "Robotech was a money pit because the series sucked" is an opinion that can be debated. Why did Robotech suck? It sucked because the series was a money pit. How was it a money pit? Why was it a money pit? These are questions that can only be examined contextually via a subjective interpretation of facts aka opinions. An opinion by it's very definition can never be a fact. One might have an opinion which coincides with a fact but then you still need the fact to back it up and even then two people looking at the same "facts" might have diverging perspectives aka opinions. In any case, Macross Frontier isn't really the subject in here, unless you're going to attempt to lead in to a deep analysis of how it's so much worse than Robotech LOL! I would only go that far if I had a penchant for playing devil's advocate. Chillax bro. LOL! It's cool dude! Some people however did presume to take your reply rather seriously which led to reinforcing their biases. Edited October 31, 2011 by Aeternalis
Einherjar Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) I'm rather confused, where exactly did I express my disdain for the "space opera" conventions in Frontier? I have an issue with the characters and the narrative based on the motivations and actions of said characters. Then I really want to know what exactly you wanted from Frontier instead. There are threads about people not liking it somewhere else in the forum. It seemed like you were trivializing some of the sci-fi elements at forefront of the show because you couldn't get past the characters. Problem with Macross Frontier As Gubaba said, you are entitled to your opinion, but this tread is about Robotech unless you really want to make a comparison between the two these days. Edited October 31, 2011 by Einherjar
Jasonc Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 No. The second part of my statement "qualifies" the opinion expressed in the first half of my statement, as in the show tries to be a homage but fails. The failing of said show is predicted on my belief/opinion that it was not effective in it's aims. In the phrase "Robotech sucks and the entire series was a money pit", the latter half of the sentence does not qualify the first. Conversely saying "Robotech was a money pit because the series sucked" is an opinion that can be debated. Why did Robotech suck? It sucked because the series was a money pit. How was it a money pit? Why was it a money pit? These are questions that can only be examined contextually via a subjective interpretation of facts aka opinions. An opinion by it's very definition can never be a fact. One might have an opinion which coincides with a fact but then you still need the fact to back it up and even then two people looking at the same "facts" might have diverging perspectives aka opinions. I understand what you're trying to do, but you're still trying to validate your opinion with a false fact that Frontier simply failed miserably. You maybe over-thinking the whole thing just to attempt to be right in your argument, but it still comes out the same. It's probably just the way you worded what you said that makes your statement wrong, i.e. making a comment of failing as fact. So, if you are qualifying your opinion based on that fact, well, you can come to the conclusion there. If you wanted to be a little clearer, you would say something like "I think the idea of duplicating and/or paying homages to original Macross failed miserably", then it would just be your opinion, and that's that. Sentence structure makes all the difference. Example: Let's eat Jim. Let's eat, Jim.
macross_fan99 Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Example: Let's eat Jim. Let's eat, Jim. He's dead, Jim. Sorry, I just couldn't help myself.
Jasonc Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 He's dead, Jim. Sorry, I just couldn't help myself. I was just waiting for someone to chime in on that, LOL. Winning!!!
Aeternalis Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) You maybe over-thinking the whole thing just to attempt to be right in your argument. (sigh!) No Jason, that is exactly what you are doing. Also while we're on the issue of sentence structure, you might want to learn about "compound sentences", "coordinators" and the difference between "dependent" and "independent" clauses. Edited October 31, 2011 by Aeternalis
Smegalot Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Hey Atermalis. I was just wondering are you one of the type of RT fans that says Macross and all it series ripped of RT? Just that what you are writing comes off as a RT fan. You know the oximorn concept. That the series that it so called is (Macross) ripping it's ideas off itself from other shows (Robotech which has no actual orginality at all). including names and designs which ripped off the series that you say is ripping it off (I have go on about this in the past)? And as for Macross plus ripping off RT the sentinels. Have you actually watched Megazone 23? As for your writing it does sound like that you are trying to make you opinion fact. Regardless of how you say that you are writing it to actually be. That is how it is comming off as. You sort of come in here firing cannons trying I guess to get everyone to see you point of view as the way it is. And failing at that big time. Mybe you should read some of the older posts from the past and find out what this topic is about. If you have come in here to call different shows rubbish. Maybe you should go the correct forum to voice your opinion that my 2 cents worth
Jasonc Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) (sigh!) No Jason, that is exactly what you are doing. Also while we're on the issue of sentence structure, you might want to learn about "compound sentences", "coordinators" and the difference between "dependent" and "independent" clauses. C'mon man, it shouldn't be that hard for you to figure this stuff out. You said Frontier failed miserably. Fact is, it did not. You made a false fact, plain and simple. If you have to try and validate making a false fact OK, you're simply wasting your own time. Edited October 31, 2011 by Jasonc
Aeternalis Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 ^ LOL! You know what Jason, you're right. I am wasting my time. You win dude!
Funkenstein Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Hunh?! Umm... are you saying that annoying, cliched and asinine characters are a staple of "space opera"? If you meant Soap Opera however, you would be correct. Also, having a dissenting opinion doesn't automatically make one a "Robotech fan". I am certain this forum isn't meant to be some type of self-affirming circle-jerk. If you find Macross/Robotech to be so cliched, then why do you watch it?
Einherjar Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Turns out the mech in Piranha Game's Mechwarrior reboot was an Atlas, not an Archer. Also, the Unseen mechs owned by HG will probably not be in the game. Mechwarrior reboot complete image
Jasonc Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) ^ LOL! You know what Jason, you're right. I am wasting my time. You win dude! The idea of winning was never the issue. It's just a matter of correcting the problem. Consider it fixed. Turns out the mech in Piranha Game's Mechwarrior reboot was an Atlas, not an Archer. Also, the Unseen mechs owned by HG will probably not be in the game. Mechwarrior reboot complete image I stopped keeping up with this game a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away. does it actually have a release date yet, or is it being pushed back more? Edited October 31, 2011 by Jasonc
hulagu Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Turns out the mech in Piranha Game's Mechwarrior reboot was an Atlas, not an Archer. Also, the Unseen mechs owned by HG will probably not be in the game. Mechwarrior reboot complete image "ONLINE?" Are they going the MMORPG route now? Colour me disinterested.
TehPW Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 Turns out the mech in Piranha Game's Mechwarrior reboot was an Atlas, not an Archer. Also, the Unseen mechs owned by HG will probably not be in the game. Mechwarrior reboot complete image I have a erection now. Thank you.
Reïvaj Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 ^ LOL! You know what Jason, you're right. I am wasting my time. You win dude! Glad you got it. So let's get back on topic.
eugimon Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 Takes a big man to admit when he's wrong and considering how wrong Aeternalis is, he must be a giant.
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