Thoughts on Macross II

[Operator7G]

Macross II just isn't that good. It contradicts the idea of Zentraedi and makes music a bizarre tool, kind of like a bad version of Robotech Masters. I do think the actress playing Sylvie did a good job. But overall, yes, Macross Plus is a good dub. Yan sounds too old and Lucy's voice is annoying. Still, very watchable and a much better mini-series than Macross II.

[Uxi]

I still like MII more than DYRL. DYRL fits as a "movie in a movie" but departs too much from SDF for me to appreciate it's story.

Love the designs, especially the Metal Siren and Phalanx upgrade and the very idea behind the emulators and why the Zentran and Meltran were so easily victimized by the Minmei attack. It just needed a lot more expansion and was too rushed. Give it 20-30 episodes and it could have challenged SDF, Kawamori or not.

[RyuRoots]

Macross II is a bad joke; a mediocre retelling of Macross at its absolute best, and near the point of causing physical pain at its worst. Its crowning moment of fail is probably the "love" scene near the end; rarely do I see, even in anime, a romance with THAT little chemistry or buildup. At least the VF-2SS looked nice.

[eugimon]

uhm... I liked the music.

The vf-2ss... well, I like the yf-2 better

[Marzan]

I liked Macross II. Sure its not DYRL, SDFM or Plus, but its quite entertaining in its own right, has cool music, great capital ships and one of the prettiest character designs in the Macross universe in Ishtar.

Having said that it does have one of the worst dubs I've ever had the displeasure of listening to. But that's why I learnt my lesson in the past and stick to the sub versions as much as possible.

[Shaorin]

I liked Macross II. Sure its not DYRL, SDFM or Plus, but its quite entertaining in its own right, has cool music, great capital ships and one of the prettiest character designs in the Macross universe in Ishtar.

yep, gotta love the Awesome OST...

[Vic Mancini]

He's brilliant because he's Bryan Cranston, also known as Hal from Malcolm in the Middle. He's also the main character of Breaking Bad (I haven't watched much of the show and can't remember the character's name), a role which he's sooo good at, he's won several awards. From what I've seen of that show, he's an absolute badass.

Walter White.

Breaking Bad is my favorite show currently on TV, hands down. And Isamu Dyson is still my favorite thing Cranston has ever done. So yeah, the Mac Plus dub gets my stamp of approval.

In regards to Mac II, it's the only series/movie I haven't seen yet. Well, except for the 2nd part of the Frontier movie, but that's on my to watch list as soon as it's leaked.

[JB0]

I still like MII more than DYRL. DYRL fits as a "movie in a movie" but departs too much from SDF for me to appreciate it's story.

Love the designs, especially the Metal Siren and Phalanx upgrade and the very idea behind the emulators and why the Zentran and Meltran were so easily victimized by the Minmei attack. It just needed a lot more expansion and was too rushed. Give it 20-30 episodes and it could have challenged SDF, Kawamori or not.

Wasn't it originally supposed to be twelve episodes and truncated due to low sales? That'd explain a lot of the complaints about it being rushed and stuff just happening out of nowhere.

Meanwhile Mac+ was supposed to be a movie and dragged out into an OVA. Apparently, the secret to making good Macross is getting extended mid-production.

[VF5SS]

Wasn't it originally supposed to be twelve episodes and truncated due to low sales?

This was asked in an old thread and I believe the answer was Macross II was always advertised at its given episode count.

Meanwhile Mac+ was supposed to be a movie and dragged out into an OVA. Apparently, the secret to making good Macross is getting extended mid-production.

I forget doesn't the movie and the whole OVA have roughly the same running time?

[Reïvaj]

I forget doesn't the movie and the whole OVA have roughly the same running time?

Pretty much.

[Gubaba]

I forget doesn't the movie and the whole OVA have roughly the same running time?

The OVA is about thirty or forty minutes longer.

[Zinjo]

This was asked in an old thread and I believe the answer was Macross II was always advertised at its given episode count.

Perhaps the writers envisioned a longer series, but essentially Japanese distributors don't believe an OVA series can last longer than 5 episodes, even though several have dis-proved that theory.

The writing team certainly set up a story that would take much more than 5 episodes to finish.

The progressively degraded animation was the result of poor home video sales, which prompted budget cuts before the series was finished, not the writing.

Macross Zero also would have benefited from a 6th episode, but alas only 5 were budgeted for...

I am of the personal opinion that mac II should be revisisted, however its fans would not support this and neither would its critics...

Edited September 7, 2011 by Zinjo

[frothymug]

The Macross Plus story was originally written as a movie, but someone in charge of the process made the decision to adapt it into an OVA. Several scenes were added and deleted and the story was reworked to fit it into the OVA structure.

I don't know. I kind of prefer the OVA to the movie, but perhaps that's because I first saw it in its OVA form.

Bah, it looks like we're getting slightly off-topic from MII, but I'm sure nobody really cares.

[Gubaba]

Perhaps the writers envisioned a longer series, but essentially Japanese distributors don't believe an OVA series can last longer than 5 episodes, even though several have dis-proved that theory.

Well...I'm pretty sure it was always intended to be a six-episode series (at least, I've never heard any credible claim to the contrary) but there IS an official continuation in the form of novels. There are five Macross II novels: the first two cover the story of the OVA, the next three (from what I can tell...I have them, but haven't really read them yet) cover Hibiki and Sylvie investigating a Chinese mafia group called (IIRC) "Black Panda," headed by a man who claims to be Minmay's grandson.

Edited September 7, 2011 by Gubaba

[Zor Primus]

Can you spare the time?

Loved the fleet battles and mecha...would have been happier with some more destroid action.

Agreed on plot points being a mimic of dyrl, but Silvie is an absolute hottie

[Gubaba]

Can you spare the time?

I plan to get around to them...but let me finish the stuff for the original series and DYRL first...

[TheLoneWolf]

Here's my take on Macross II:

The Good

• Character designs
  
• Mecha designs
  
• Music
  
• Fleet battles
  

The Bad

• Character personalities (excluding Sylvie, Feff and Dennis)
  
• English Dubbing
  

The Mediocre

• Plot
  
• Script
  
• Mecha battles. Ichiro Itano's absense is glaring.
  

The progressively degraded animation was the result of poor home video sales, which prompted budget cuts before the series was finished, not the writing.

Where did that information come from?

[Marzan]

Well...I'm pretty sure it was always intended to be a six-episode series (at least, I've never heard any credible claim to the contrary) but there IS an official continuation in the form of novels. There are five Macross II novels: the first two cover the story of the OVA, the next three (from what I can tell...I have them, but haven't really read them yet) cover Hibiki and Sylvie investigating a Chinese mafia group called (IIRC) "Black Panda," headed by a man who claims to be Minmay's grandson.

Minmay's grandson a mob boss? Sounds entertaining in a surreal kind of way

[valhary]

The worst story but the best valkyrie design (vf2ss and vf2j)

[Xx-SKULL-ONE-xX]

I think there are good points on both sides.

Here is my take

Good

1) Mecha designs (Minus the battle pod). I actually didn't care for the VF-2SS initially but it really grew on me (come on Yamato!).

2) Macross Cannon. 'Nuff said.

3) Sylvie and Hibiki's Ishtar rescue attempt and escape.

4) Though at slow speed the Metal Siren looks pretty boring/odd, its action sequence is pretty awesome, especially when Nexx destroys the cruiser.

5) The music is pretty good.

Bad

1) The plot is just meh.

2) The animation quality is inconsistent at best and poor at worst. I really feel that if the animation had have been at a higher quality most people would be willing to forgive many of Mac II's sins. I mean, there are many scenes in Macross TV that look better then some of the best scenes in Macross II. That seems unforgivable considering their age difference. And don't even get me started on DYRL.

3) The pacing feels off to me. Often times the show didn't let the excitement build, it just dropped you into an action scene, or when the excitement did build, the action sequence was far too short. Some of the slow scenes were a little too long without moving the plot forward at all and not really developing the characters.

As to whether I would like to see more in the Macross II universe? Yes, but not at the expense of the non-alternate universe timeline. What I really want is for a Macross show to fill in some of the gaps between FB 2012 and Plus. Getting to see the VF-4, Star Mirage, and VF-9 and VF-14 in action would be pretty sweet.

[anime52k8]

Have I ever mentioned that I absolutely hate the mecha design in Macross II. I think the VF-2SS, VF-2JA and VA-1MS are all absolutely atrocious.

[hulagu]

The vf-2 and that one other vf just look derivative as heck, but

The Metal Siren looks completely out of place in a Macross show, and looks like a half hearted kitbash of the Zeta Gundam , and is ugly as sin in all four! modes.

For what it's worth, I liked the Zentran Valkyrie and some of the destroid design lineart, but don't remember them making much of appearance on the actual show.

[Shaorin]

I think there are good points on both sides.

Here is my take

Good

1) Mecha designs (Minus the battle pod). I actually didn't care for the VF-2SS initially but it really grew on me (come on Yamato!).

doesn't BANDAI/EMOTION still have some sort of long-term exclusive rights going with MACROSS II?

that could explain YAMATO's inability and/or lack of interest in producing MAC II products.

that, and possibly japanese fan-apathy towards MAC II in general.

IIRC, MACROSS II fairly went over like a lead balloon in japan during it's initial release...

[TheLoneWolf]

Bandai may have held some exclusive merchandising rights in the past, but that exclusivity would've expired by now. After all, CMs released an Ishtar toy 6 or 7 years ago. I think the reason that we hardly ever see Macross II toys is due to a lack of corporate interest or that no one else is willing to take the financial risk.

Edited September 8, 2011 by TheLoneWolf

[Shaorin]

Bandai may have held some exclusive merchandising rights in the past, but those rights would've expired by now. After all, CMs released an Ishtar toy 6 or 7 years ago. I think the reason that we hardly ever see Macross II toys is due to a lack of corporate interest or that no one else is willing to take the financial risk.

ah, thanks.

it's too bad, really, as even though the MAC II designs aren't exactly my favorites, and i happen to absolutely DESPISE the "METAL SIREN"

i really wouldn't mind seeing a nice 1/60 Yammie VF-2JA in addition to the obligatory VF-2SS;

VF-2JA

VF-2SS

[azrael]

II?

Good character designs. Decent mecha designs. Animation? Starts good then drops...a lot, then comes back, then drops a lot. Like watching the stock market. That pattern does influence my opinion. Story pacing was terrible. Going from small fleet action to full invasion was way too quick. Story itself was meh, at best. Like they put DYRL? with a few grains of other ingredients and shook it up, hoping for something that tastes different. Too much happening with the story/characters and not enough time.

[505thAirborne]

Its been pretty much said already, awesome character designs (Its Haruhiko Mikimoto!!), the Mecha is great, battles are fun to watch and music is really cool too.

But a weak story, you can tell by the animation either they were behind schedule or on a shoe string budget at times, Episode 5 is awesome and yet the final episode has some really bad scenes in it. (Especially Nexx in the Metal Siren)

The english dub isn't to bad, just watch in Japanese with subtitles.... its far more enjoyable.

Should Yamato make 1/60 toys of the VF-2JA, VF-2SS+SAP, Destroids & the Mac Cannons.... YES!!

[CaptRico]

I personally like Macross II, mostly for its mecha designs. I thought the VF-2SS, the VF-2JA, and the Metal Siren were bitch'n at the time.

The only thing that could make the OVA better was a better storyline with more depth in it.

[sketchley]

Found something (and I think the page *may* be by a certain non-English speaking poster on this forum) while looking for something else.

VF-4 Siren GERWALK/battroid piccies: http://w.livedoor.jp/harmony-gold_japan/d/%A5%E9%A5%A4%A5%C8%A5%CB%A5%F3%A5%B0#content_11

Has that been posted on this forum before?

As for the rest of the kibble on the page... just look at the English in the URL after the domain name... anyhow, besides that, don't trust any of the English on it. The author has romanized the Russian surname Kurakin as the Anglo-Saxon Clerkin...

[VF5SS]

Yeah that pic was created by a poster on this forum. I think the post is still here in the fan section.

[Gubaba]

Yeah that pic was created by a poster on this forum. I think the post is still here in the fan section.

Was it YuiYusasa...? (Or whatever she calls herself here...?)

[azrael]

Found something (and I think the page *may* be by a certain non-English speaking poster on this forum) while looking for something else.

VF-4 Siren GERWALK/battroid piccies: http://w.livedoor.jp/harmony-gold_japan/d/%A5%E9%A5%A4%A5%C8%A5%CB%A5%F3%A5%B0#content_11

Has that been posted on this forum before?

As for the rest of the kibble on the page... just look at the English in the URL after the domain name... anyhow, besides that, don't trust any of the English on it. The author has romanized the Russian surname Kurakin as the Anglo-Saxon Clerkin...

Feels like that user, yui1107. In fact, it looks like the stuff she/he/it post here. It's a wiki too so feel free to edit it.

[RDClip]

I have to put myself in the proper mindset when i watch MacII. Heres how it works:

You know how DYRL fits into Macross canon? I'd like to think that MacII is also a fictional sci-fi movie within the Macross universe. Otherwise i wouldn't be able to stand the bad script, boring characters and make-no-sence plot points. I'm probably gonna get some flak for this, but i liked MacZero more.

I also found the romance to be very badly pigeon holed into the story. I didn't realize it was supposed to be a romantic triangle until Ishtar said to Sylvie, "You made a great rival." what? where did that come from? what indication did we have that Ishtar had a thing for Hibiki? On that note, the romance between Hibiki and Sylvie seemed rushed with little to no build up.

I don't think MacII was all bad, I guess it had potential. The mecha designed were nice and the idea of using music as a weapon was interesting. With a better script and a episode or two more, it could've been much better. Oh and cut out that terribly cliched cyborg villian.

And i like the dub for MacPlus.

[frothymug]

I really don't get why you guys are always taking a dump on MacZero. I really like that OVA, and I can't find a lot to complain about. I guess this is my M7, by comparison.

[RDClip]

I really don't get why you guys are always taking a dump on MacZero. I really like that OVA, and I can't find a lot to complain about. I guess this is my M7, by comparison.

Macross Zero seems to me like a 6 episode OVA where they forgot to make part 5. Watch it, it has a terribly awkward transition between ep4 and ep5. Not to say that there aren't more flaws than that in it, but that is the most glaring to me.