The MW Automotive Thread 5.0 GT

[reddsun1]

The Aircraft vs thread appears to have been locked so...

or maybe it does go here, since it's a "parking" issue?

but anyways. I don't care if it is just one; you gots to be one bad mutha fu**a, when you can say you've got your own private air force parked out in front of da house!

[Agent ONE]

That does look like something from Grand Theft Auto. HAHA

[reddsun1]

[reddsun1]

da fook, man?

Seconded...

Edited March 12, 2012 by reddsun1

[pfunk]

I kinda want to drive that tractor thing. Just another example of money doesn't equal taste

Not to make another jab, but an Italian manufacturer comes to mind

Edited March 12, 2012 by pfunk

[electric indigo]

Ok I got myself a new car at the beginning of the year and now went and visited an old friend in the north. The whole trip was 680 km and I made it with less than one filling of the tank. This means a fuel consumption of about 3,5 liter per 100 km. (that's 1,47 gallons per 100 miles for you aliens). Now, the car, an Audi A2, is from 2001.

W

T

F

?!

Obviously for the last ten years the majority of automotive engineers is busy placing more cupholders in the interiors or putting jet engines into the latest haute volée extravaganza, all the while promising us the electro-/hydrogen-/etc-engine is just around the corner, instead of building really efficient cars.

/rant

[eugimon]

they do build really efficient cars but really efficient cars are made out of soda cans and have a lawn mower engine so people would rather have power, luxury, comfort and power.

[areaseven]

Batman called - he wants his Batmissile back.

[pfunk]

Ok I got myself a new car at the beginning of the year and now went and visited an old friend in the north. The whole trip was 680 km and I made it with less than one filling of the tank. This means a fuel consumption of about 3,5 liter per 100 km. (that's 1,47 gallons per 100 miles for you aliens). Now, the car, an Audi A2, is from 2001.

W

T

F

?!

Obviously for the last ten years the majority of automotive engineers is busy placing more cupholders in the interiors or putting jet engines into the latest haute volée extravaganza, all the while promising us the electro-/hydrogen-/etc-engine is just around the corner, instead of building really efficient cars.

/rant

Your calculations are off, cause there is no way that car gets almost 70 miles per gallon ie 1.47 gallons per 100 miles

Audi claims 45 mpg with that car, so expect 40 or for over the pond 1 ltr per 17 km

Eugimon is right to a degree. the majority of fault lies with insurance and federal mandates of safety. A small car on average weighs over 3000lbs. That was a large car in the 60s and 70's. That weight came from safety measures (from airbags to unibody) for the most part and like Eugimon stated luxury (sound deadening and stiffening of parts makes them heavier). When you have more weight, you have to have more power and that means more fuel consumption. So a car that should weigh 2500lbs weighs 3500lbs. Thank your insurance safety lobbyists for the most part and BTW they mostly lobby for the repair of the damages and not the peoples safety because this is what costs them the most in claims. We have EXTREMELY efficient engines out today with things like direct injection,, up to 30 percent more effecient then a non direct injected model of the same year and power output

Edited March 13, 2012 by pfunk

[eugimon]

well, it's not just the safety features. Americans are bigger and so cars are bigger. Growing up, my parents owned a volvo something or other and I remember it was a boat. It was HUGE inside. But just the other day I was driving around in my car (which reviewers complain as being too small) and in front of me was that same model volvo and it looked like a toy car compared to my "undersized" modern car.

And yeah, some of that size comes from packing in 30 air bags, pillars the size of elephant legs but it also comes from people wanting 19" wheels, lazy boy loungers for car seats, 30 cup holders and an AC that can cool down a walk in freezer at your local jamba juice.

[pfunk]

Those pillars you speak of are for FMVSS 201 requirements. They are that big for head impact constraints for unbelted people with nonfunctional airbags. I was mainly speaking of the smaller cars and why they weigh so much. As we "type" I am trying to take weight out of an electric car while keeping strength and not using exotic materials. Some small cars go the extra by having electronic power steering instead of hydraulic. The 30 air bags are from the insurance lobbyists to meet standards they advertise (example a 5 star will sell better then a 3 and to meet the 5 star gov rating that the insurance institute set up, you need 30 air bags).

Heck, a Camaro is a whopping 3800lbs,, no wonder the Mustangs are whooping them,, and they even come in at a heavy 3200 compared to the old fox body notch-backs 2900. You wont surpass energy required to move mass which we are really close to its highest efficiency, and no one wants to pay a million bucks for a daily driver that is ultra light weight loaded with exotic materials

hey man, when you rode in the Volvo,,, you might have been smaller

[eugimon]

smaller, but not by much. I drove that volvo into college.

But even with the little entry level compacts. They're huge compared to what they were 20 or 30 years ago. And yeah, I realize a lot of that comes from hauling around all the safety gear but it doesn't help that today's cars are designed for people who weight more and are wider than people 30 years ago.

I mean, a kia optima has optional electric, heated and cooled electric seats... That has nothing to do with safety. I'm sure modern cars could easily weigh less without sacrificing safety if people were willing to have less plastic fluff all over the dash and doors, have manual seats, ditch the dual panoramic moon roofs, and so forth. As long as people view cars as status symbols, they're going to be loaded down with "status"

Edited March 13, 2012 by eugimon

[pfunk]

Yeah those things do add up, heated and cooled cup holders, seats are heavy, but not that much difference between a regular seat and heated/cool, but a pound or two (from what I remember working at Lear) its the electric ones that add a lot over the manual track. Like you said you can shave a few pounds in a variety of extras but maybe a hundred. Just look at the base models curb compared to a loaded version, even a bare bones fiesta weighs 2535 and that thing is tiny, That's a crappy radio and manual everything. A regular 1970 Chevy Nova weighs about the same (2660 with the IRON 6 cyl) and that would be considered a full size car now a days and it was a unibody, 1.08mm thick sheet metal compared to the .75mm on the fiesta

Edited March 13, 2012 by pfunk

[electric indigo]

Your calculations are off, cause there is no way that car gets almost 70 miles per gallon ie 1.47 gallons per 100 miles

Audi claims 45 mpg with that car, so expect 40 or for over the pond 1 ltr per 17 km

I have the 1.4 TDI which has an official figure of 54 mpg in mixed conditions, and I had a trip without city traffic, at very moderate speed, so believe me that I got in at 68 mpg. There even was an "3L" edition of the model that had an official figure of 78 mpg.

The car is, as Eugimon described, a soda can (aluminum space frame, less than 1.000 kgs) driven by a lawn mower engine (3 cylinders turbocharged diesel), but it drives like an Audi and makes you feel on the right branch of automotive evolution.

The safety issue has become an arms race: The heavier your opponents get, the more armor you have to pack on your car...

PS last year Audi presented the new A2 concept car with electric engine, aluminum and carbon body and a weight of 1,150 kg including the battery.

[reddsun1]

Batman called - he wants his Batmissile back.

I dunno, but the "layman engineer" in me thinks that on all but the ultra-high-speed, glass-smooth European tracks, that design layout will create handling dynamics that will best be described as: absolute sh*t . The term: terminal understeer just keeps coming to mind...

[pfunk]

I have the 1.4 TDI which has an official figure of 54 mpg in mixed conditions, and I had a trip without city traffic, at very moderate speed, so believe me that I got in at 68 mpg. There even was an "3L" edition of the model that had an official figure of 78 mpg.

The car is, as Eugimon described, a soda can (aluminum space frame, less than 1.000 kgs) driven by a lawn mower engine (3 cylinders turbocharged diesel), but it drives like an Audi and makes you feel on the right branch of automotive evolution.

The safety issue has become an arms race: The heavier your opponents get, the more armor you have to pack on your car...

PS last year Audi presented the new A2 concept car with electric engine, aluminum and carbon body and a weight of 1,150 kg including the battery.

Ah, sorry I thought you were talking about the gas model, direct injected turbo diesels are about 40% more efficient then an equivalent gas. A guy I worked with had a Jetta TDI and got 55mpg

On the safety thing, yup, its protect, the biggest fatality crashes are offset barrier (immovable object above 35mph covering 1/3rd the front drivers side). For standard impact a vehicle is tested against its own weight in a pendulum hit, wall, offset barrier, full barrier. angle barrier, etc...

Edit, if those TDI's wernt so expensive and they increase the injector pump life was a little longer (not really that bad, but an expensive part) id love to own one, but here they are hard to find

Edited March 13, 2012 by pfunk

[Bri]

Edit, if those TDI's wernt so expensive and they increase the injector pump life was a little longer (not really that bad, but an expensive part) id love to own one, but here they are hard to find

Is that why diesels aren't as popular in the US for family cars? Wondered about that one, the greater efficiency, durability and torque of that type of engine seems ideal for American conditions.

[pfunk]

Is that why diesels aren't as popular in the US for family cars? Wondered about that one, the greater efficiency, durability and torque of that type of engine seems ideal for American conditions.

They are stinky (taken from the words out of dang near every girl I dated when owning a diesel) (ive owned a couple diesel trucks for the efficiency and power)

[Bri]

They are stinky (taken from the words out of dang near every girl I dated when owning a diesel) (ive owned a couple diesel trucks for the efficiency and power)

Ah ok. People still have experiences with diesels of an older design? My girlfriend drives a current Toyota Aygo with a 1.4 diesel, doesn't smell any different than my own gas powered Scirocco. Cept at the pump ofc.

[eugimon]

There's a bit of a demand for diesel engined cars in some parts of the US. They're popular with a lot of social conscious, green types who like to run them as bio-diesels. But the ones I've seen are all older diesel mercs that have been repurposed to be hipster mobiles after their doctor/lawyer/real estate agent owners gave them up for the latest gadget infested M badged BMW.

[Vegas]

My Car

2008 Lexus IS250 by Eddie 11uisma, on Flickr

I took this one from this year's CES

Lexus GSF by Eddie 11uisma, on Flickr

[eugimon]

those are great pics! That new audi lexus looks great. Not a fan of the interior though. Finally a lexus that doesn't look like a camry with a body kit.

[jenius]

In my neck of the woods diesel costs more than premium. Seems crazy.

Edited March 14, 2012 by jenius

[myk]

My apologies for posting away from the diesel topic, but I need your guy's opinion on color. You see, after many years my '69 Charger is finally getting its paint and body work done, and I need to select a color. It's been orange since I've owned it and everyone including the body shop is insisting I pick a different color. My personal finalists were plum crazy (a deep purple), sublime (lime-greenish-neon-yellow sort of thing) or just keeping it orange. There were some suggestions of painting it flat black or silver, not unlike the Charger used in Blade and the Fast and Furious movies, but right now "everyone" seems to be doing those colors. Also, I was thinking about getting a fiberglass hood and keeping it flat black. So what do you guys think?

Any opinions and suggestions are appreciated...

[anime52k8]

There's a bit of a demand for diesel engined cars in some parts of the US. They're popular with a lot of social conscious, green types who like to run them as bio-diesels. But the ones I've seen are all older diesel mercs that have been repurposed to be hipster mobiles after their doctor/lawyer/real estate agent owners gave them up for the latest gadget infested M badged BMW.

When I was a little kid my parents owned a Mercedes diesel hatchback. It was the most pathetic, gutless, POS lemon ever.

Edited March 14, 2012 by anime52k8

[Bri]

My apologies for posting away from the diesel topic, but I need your guy's opinion on color. You see, after many years my '69 Charger is finally getting its paint and body work done, and I need to select a color. It's been orange since I've owned it and everyone including the body shop is insisting I pick a different color. My personal finalists were plum crazy (a deep purple), sublime (lime-greenish-neon-yellow sort of thing) or just keeping it orange. There were some suggestions of painting it flat black or silver, not unlike the Charger used in Blade and the Fast and Furious movies, but right now "everyone" seems to be doing those colors. Also, I was thinking about getting a fiberglass hood and keeping it flat black.

Black subdues the visual lines of a car, big no no for me. For a charger I'd go with something bright and a black hood. Not too thrilled about the purple but I think the sublime looks great.

[pfunk]

My apologies for posting away from the diesel topic, but I need your guy's opinion on color. You see, after many years my '69 Charger is finally getting its paint and body work done, and I need to select a color. It's been orange since I've owned it and everyone including the body shop is insisting I pick a different color. My personal finalists were plum crazy (a deep purple), sublime (lime-greenish-neon-yellow sort of thing) or just keeping it orange. There were some suggestions of painting it flat black or silver, not unlike the Charger used in Blade and the Fast and Furious movies, but right now "everyone" seems to be doing those colors. Also, I was thinking about getting a fiberglass hood and keeping it flat black. So what do you guys think?

Any opinions and suggestions are appreciated...

Personally you cant go wrong with a rich glossy black on those cars

[reddsun1]

My apologies for posting away from the diesel topic, but I need your guy's opinion on color. You see, after many years my '69 Charger is finally getting its paint and body work done, and I need to select a color. It's been orange since I've owned it and everyone including the body shop is insisting I pick a different color. My personal finalists were plum crazy (a deep purple), sublime (lime-greenish-neon-yellow sort of thing) or just keeping it orange. There were some suggestions of painting it flat black or silver, not unlike the Charger used in Blade and the Fast and Furious movies, but right now "everyone" seems to be doing those colors. Also, I was thinking about getting a fiberglass hood and keeping it flat black. So what do you guys think?

Any opinions and suggestions are appreciated...

There's a '69(?) around where I live that's been done in dark green metallic that looks positively EE-VIL--in a good way. It was sitting on some fat meats--245 and 265 BFGs, IIRC. That dark green really popped, it looked very much the part of the street bruiser...

Edited March 14, 2012 by reddsun1

[anime52k8]

Go with the purple, that purple is the best color ever.

[Vegas]

or this?

Audi A8 Quattro by Eddie 11uisma, on Flickr

[eugimon]

I saw that pic on your stream, it's a gorgeous shot. I'd love an audi quattro one of these days.

[Vegas]

I saw that pic on your stream, it's a gorgeous shot. I'd love an audi quattro one of these days.

Thanks for visiting

[reddsun1]

[pfunk]

and dead

[areaseven]

and dead

Indeed