The MW Automotive Thread 5.0 GT

[dizman]

Because AM/FM radio sucks these days?

I didn't mean you can't have the modern amenities like CD/Bluetooth/Whatever else there is I am more against seeing those cheapo head units you buy at best buy in a 50k resto project. There are a few brands that have radios modeled after the original designs with all the new stuff hidden in them to keep the period look.

[Sildani]

Oh! That makes sense then.

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[SchizophrenicMC]

Throw me on the button/dial/cupholder love train, I don't have much love for touch screens. I just like the feel of turning a knob or flipping a toggle as opposed to poking a screen. I also hate seeing modern radios in restored classics, why cheap out at the radio when you spend thousands getting everything else just right?

I didn't mean you can't have the modern amenities like CD/Bluetooth/Whatever else there is I am more against seeing those cheapo head units you buy at best buy in a 50k resto project. There are a few brands that have radios modeled after the original designs with all the new stuff hidden in them to keep the period look.

The problem is, the retro-styled decks are expensive and all of the money is in the styling. The sound quality is awful and the fitment is not guaranteed. They also often lack the features of a modern stereo, such as bluetooth hands-free and media profiles, HD Radio, Sirius/XM compatibility, or extensive digital signal processor controls. Most of which are reasons why, despite loving the throwback styling of Nakamichi and Blaupunkt decks, I won't be buying one for my 240SX. They look like modernized versions of the period style, but they just do not have the features I demand in a stereo. The same is true of many builds. Why spend all this money on your build, then put a deck in that sounds like trash and has no way to control your sound staging, while also not providing the types of media inputs you require? At that rate, why not go really big and put together a custom deck with a microcontroller and PCBs? (Answer: it's way too much dick pain for anybody sensible to bother)

Also, some touch screen decks have volume knobs. The one I put in the Subaru does. The Fusion has knobs for volume and tune, though the latter is difficult to reach if you have small arms.

Because AM/FM radio sucks these days?

Hear hear.

on the button/dial subject, my favorite thing is steering wheel mounted controls. I love being able to flip radio stations without having to take my hand off the wheel at all.

also, any car you plan to drive in for more than an hour should have cup holders. I'm all for driving as an extension of your being and driving for the enjoyment of the ride itself, but that experience is gonna be better when you're properly hydrated.

I love steering wheel controls. I wire them into all my Jeeps. Unfortunately the Scooby and the Nissan don't have them. Also, agreed on the cupholders.

In other news, the headers for the niner arrived yesterday. Behold:

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[areaseven]

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sounds nuts!

[vlenhoff]

Lol A7

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[areaseven]

Still a sexy beast after over two decades.

Edited February 20, 2016 by areaseven

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wow! 200 grand for the Lambo back in 93 must have been a staggering figure!

[Sildani]

It was. And it wasn't a particularly good car. Still, it's V-12 is like nothing else.

[areaseven]

It was. And it wasn't a particularly good car. Still, its V-12 is like nothing else.

Since when were classic Lambos ever good cars? The Miura has major steering problems whenever the gas tank sitting above the front wheels goes half-empty. The Countach actively wants to kill its owners with everything, if the faulty air conditioning doesn't suffocate them first. Lambos have always been for bragging rights, never for comfort or reliability - not even for high performance, for the most part.

[ErikElvis]

It was. And it wasn't a particularly good car. Still, it's V-12 is like nothing else.

Yeah I wouldn't be happy with low 13's for that price.

[SchizophrenicMC]

In the 70s, 80s, and even the early 90s, 13s was a lot of speed. The fastest cars of 1990, the F40 and 959, struggled to break the 12 second barrier. The '93 Viper hit its lowest reported time at 13 flat, and it was a lot less car with a lot bigger engine. (Both, funny enough, were Chrysler products at the time) Not to mention, that Diablo did 13.2 with a slipping, burned-up clutch.

This was back in a time when 400hp was supercar territory. Today there are pickup trucks with more. Even 300hp was high-end sports car power, and now most midsize sedans have a 300+hp option. Back then there was no traction control, ABS, or clever AWD systems to make you faster than you deserved to be. And if you had the gold and the guts to buy a Lamborghini, you were either on top, or backwards in a ditch, leg snapped clean off by the heavy clutch.

The early 90s, truly, was the golden age of the sports car.

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Yeah I wouldn't be happy with low 13's for that price.

if I recall wasn't the Buick NGX capable of a sub 5 second 0-60 and a 13 second quarter!? and for a fraction of the money!

[Sildani]

Schizo has the right of it. I recall a magazine article I read in a doctor's office some 25 years ago about the "Five Second Club" - those cars with a 0-60 time of five seconds or less. Many exotic marques, including a couple you wouldn't expect, like Vector Aeromotive and Jaguar I believe - I think the XJ220 was built at that time.

Now? An Audi TT RS can get to 60 in 4.2, for around $58,000. Supercars these days routinely break a four second 60. And family sedans get to 60 in less than six seconds. Technology. All tech. And somehow, it's not as exciting as it used to be.

"And when everyone is Super... no one will be."

[SchizophrenicMC]

A $65,000 SUV will break the 5-second barrier by a wide margin, with a curb weight well in excess of 5,000lbs, and a 6,000lb towing capacity. And they're making an even faster version of that SUV, with over triple the horsepower of its original version, which was also praised in its time for its blistering 0-60 time. (1998 Grand Cherokee 5.9 Limited 0-60: 6.7s; 2016 Grand Cherokee SRT 0-60: 4.4s; some are speculating the 2018 Grand Cherokee Trackhawk will do it in 2.7s!) And many much cheaper cars break the 6-second barrier. The Miata does it in 5.8s for $25,000. The Focus ST does it in 5.9s for around the same. The WRX does it in 5.2s for $28,000, and the STi will break the 5-second barrier at 4.6 for only $35,000!

The horsepower war is over. We won. And yet somehow we still lost. The new Miata, perhaps the slowest sports car in production, is faster to 60 than the 300ZX non-turbo was in its heyday, and that was a very expensive dedicated sports car. And yet the original Miata, the tiny, objectively slow thing, was still so much fun. And so was the 300ZX. The new one still is, but it's a little strange to put that much speed into a car designed to not be fast. But that's the new normal. Everything's gotten faster, bigger, and heavier all at the same time. We've added so much power to everything, we have to use electronic aids to wind it back in and keep people who have no business holding that kind of power, from killing themselves because their enormous sedan weighs more than its tires can corner it with at those speeds.

And yet somehow, my 160hp Outback is still capable of achieving freeway speeds before the end of the on-ramp, and usually before these 300hp sedans with their drivers who don't comprehend the power they wield. People have become insulated from driving, and driving has become just another chore to use technology to whittle away into something that is lived through, rather than experienced. All of this makes me want to add an 80s car to my stable again. The 90s was a golden era for cars, and my 240SX is so representative of that. But the 80s was a special time, before we had the engineering tools that made the 90s such a golden period. Everything was mechanically brutal. Clever suspension that can keep itself composed under anything but perfect conditions didn't exist yet. Brakes were just getting used to the idea of rear discs, and there was no ABS at all, for anybody. Fuel injection was in its infancy, and likely the most complex electronic driving aid you had was transistorized cruise control. "Turbo" was a cool and meaningful word that meant your car was on the bleeding edge of engine technology. "Twin Cam" too for that matter. And maybe that sheds light on the matter:

People by and large just don't care about cars anymore. They've become appliances. Objects purchased to improve quality of life, then discarded when they wear out. The days of "Win on Sunday, Sell on Monday" are over, as racing viewership has diminished. There's no more emotional or cultural investment in cars. Just the financial one. No sense exciting people with exciting cars that do exciting things. Just give them enough horsepower to move their large appliance from A to B fast enough, and give them the electronic help they need to not kill themselves with all that power.

brb guys, I'm gonna go for a midnight drive in the 240.

[spanner]

You're absolutely right. Cars now days have become so good and plentiful and disposabledisposable and that we are now spoiled for choice. I think people do still care about cars but that percentage is much smaller now. And the fact that there are far fewer exciting cars coming out. Most are the mass produced appliance type and they aren't very exciting or interesting. I mean as good a car a brand new Camry or Sonata are, they are woefully bland, boring, generic and uninspiring cars.

[SchizophrenicMC]

I think midsize sedans aren't bland enough. They're overstyled and over-equipped. Big, heavy, stupid things that look too fancy. There's a lot to be said for the understated looks of the 1990-94 Nissan Maxima.

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WTF!? this made me laugh so hard! what a joke! its almost embarrassing to watch..

Edited February 22, 2016 by spanner76

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and now for some proper content..

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[areaseven]

[areaseven]

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love these old motor week reviews!

[Sildani]

What a cool car the 3000GT is. I still want one in Pearlescent White.

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What a cool car the 3000GT is. I still want one in Pearlescent White.

yeah they are a nice bit of kit! I've always really liked the 3000GT! Much more so than the Nissan 300ZX twin turbo which is still a nice car though..

but ultimately would love to own a original Honda NSX! even if its not turbo charged like the others.. An original 1990 or 91 model in red with the smaller wheels. How friggin sweet would that be! so hard to find. And most I've seen are automatics or poor condition tacky modded examples..

[Sildani]

NSX used to be a goal of mine. I don't fit. 😔

[dizman]

Heh you better buy that 91 NSX quick, prices are starting to shoot up quickly on the unmodded ones.

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NSX used to be a goal of mine. I don't fit.

my uncle had a 90 model silver but in auto which he sold in 95 towards buying a new house. But he kept his silver (non turbo) 300zx.. the guy doesn't really know what a good car is even if it ran over him.

Heh you better buy that 91 NSX quick, prices are starting to shoot up quickly on the unmodded ones.

the prices of clean original and manual NSX here in Australia have been astronomical for quite some time now.. and extremely rare!

[SchizophrenicMC]

I wish I'd been in the position I am now, 5 years ago. Before the NSX hype really kicked off, they were $20,000 cars. Now I can't find any under 60.

Now's the time to buy a Z32 though. You can still get the NAs under 5 grand all day, but once the twin turbo stock starts to dry up, even those will start appreciating.