eugimon Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 How can you guys claim to know how complicated or not the 17 is? The complexity and size of the individual part is going to affect the price but the complexity and size of any individual piece will also be affected by the physical limitations of the molding process itself. As will the finish. The 19 has a glossy finish, which is cheaper than the matte finish of the 17. Whether or not the pieces form a complex shape when assembled isn't going to affect the per unit cost. You also need to factor in what yamato thinks it will be able to sell. The 19 has the kai, the two blazers and the P (and probably two variants of that) ready to go with minimal retooling in between. The 17 has only the two types, with possibly a milia repaint. The 17 is also not as popular of a valk as the 19. So maybe the 19 is more complex with more parts, Yamato is also probably going to sell a lot more units of it so it can spread that cost out over more units than the 17.
Actar Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 How can you guys claim to know how complicated or not the 17 is? No one was claiming anything. We were just looking for clarification and information.
eugimon Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 No one was claiming anything. We were just looking for clarification and information. I was actually hoping to get the S as well, but due to the price and the relative unimportance of the S (as opposed to the D) in the series, I'll be missing out on this one. Question though, does it cost the same for all new molds? Does the complexity of engineering or pieces used factor into the cost? Thinking along these lines, shouldn't the 17 cost less than the VF-19 due to the more simplistic transformation? I was thinking about this too... Looking at the designs, the -19 looks much more complicated (though I could be wrong). Is the Yamato VF-17 even MORE complicated than the -19 to justify such a larger pricing, or is it just a pricing increase trend that Yamato is going for....? Okay, so that's what I read and it seemed to me you guys already had it in your mind that the 17 should be cheaper because of...? But there you go.
Archer Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 (edited) Okay, so that's what I read and it seemed to me you guys already had it in your mind that the 17 should be cheaper because of...? But there you go. Well, I tried to say that the -19 *looks* more complicated, and even made sure to put parenthetical notation that I could easily be wrong. Take that as you will.... I also just wanted clarification, as I even asked whether the the Yamato -17 was more complicated, as I was unsure. As Actar said, we just were asking for clarification, and I made sure to inorporate that into my message and tone.... Edited October 30, 2011 by Archer
Raptor One Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 In addition to the complexity of the design and the expected sales there's also the factor of R&D costs. The VF-19 might have been cheaper to design since they could have brought some of the lessons learned from the two previous YF-19 toys. Whereas the VF-17 they are doing pretty much from scratch and the design is very different from any of their previous valkyries. Then again I don't know how much R&D matters to the retail price.
Tking22 Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 I knew if I tossed out the tiniest little bit of dislike towards this thing people would try to downplay my opinion, yes it was my opinion, it's ugly, the color, the mold, everything to me. And like I said if I perhaps saw it in another scheme, oh yea that means color scheme people, then I might like it. I don't know, I'm still a little ticked that Yamato would make this fat ugly mess before they tried their hand at putting out a VF-4, maybe that will be next on the line after they milk the hell out of this mold.
Archer Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 I knew if I tossed out the tiniest little bit of dislike towards this thing people would try to downplay my opinion, yes it was my opinion, it's ugly, the color, the mold, everything to me. And like I said if I perhaps saw it in another scheme, oh yea that means color scheme people, then I might like it. I don't know, I'm still a little ticked that Yamato would make this fat ugly mess before they tried their hand at putting out a VF-4, maybe that will be next on the line after they milk the hell out of this mold. Don't worry, your not the only one that doesn't like this mold. Although I am one of those that do in fact like it, you should know that like half the posters who saw the first few picks had nothing but angst for it And as for the VF-4, there were some hints previously that it may be next in line as a new mold...
Mommar Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 How likely are those hints to pan out now? If the 17 sells well there will likely be a 17T and the 11Kai to completely Sound Force. I would imagine those would be made first before any theoretical 4 is done.
VF5SS Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 I don't know, I'm still a little ticked that Yamato would make this fat ugly mess before they tried their hand at putting out a VF-4, maybe that will be next on the line after they milk the hell out of this mold. I too am offended that a company would create a toy based on a character from a TV series they are currently focusing on rather than take the time to develop something that played a small part in a music video. Clearly they are not simultaneously working on another toy. the nerve :<
Jasonc Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Trying to analyze why they're going to price one thing higher than another is a moot point. The analysis isn't going to change the price, only let us all know that you don't know their reasoning anymore than the rest of us. There's many factors that go into it, and if they project wrong, they'll either not sell well, sell all of them, or be in their forecast of sales. To me, it looks fine, but doesn't have the WOW! factor. That makes the high price of it an easy pass for me. Maybe if they go on sale later on, I'll get one.but either way, I hope they dial the price of these toys, back a bit.
Actar Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Okay, so that's what I read and it seemed to me you guys already had it in your mind that the 17 should be cheaper because of...? But there you go. Ah, sorry about that one, need to watch my language next time. Though it does *seem* that the VF-17 has a more simplistic transformation than the VF-19.
raptormesh Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 I think it looks better than the VF-19, notably in Fighter mode. Still won't be able to afford it however. $200 is my absolute ceiling for valks.
Tking22 Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 You seem to dislike mostly everything bro. I like plenty of stuff, hell I might one day be tempted to get a VF-17, if I see the right paint scheme, for the most part it's just too fat a valk for me to like, when I think valkyrie I think sleek, and slender. But like I said if I see the right version I might get it. I'll be honest, I usually hate everything Yamato does because I've been screwed by them many, many times, yet I got an SDF-1 and the VF-19 Kai, this has always been and always will be a hit and miss company for me. Oh and I personally don't think this thing is anywhere near worth the price, more than the Kai with what, half the gimmicks? Like everyone else said, nobody truly knows what it costs to make these things, every project is different. To each his own though, I know Graham and many others have been dying for this thing, all I've wanted for the past 5 years has been a VF-4, until it does get announced, with a $400 price tag
Archer Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 ^True, Yamato has been a hit and miss, but I think some of their newer stuff is pretty solid. To each his own though, as I don't know what experiences you've had with them. I am sticking it out until I see some of the main gimmicks of this new toy. If I like, I buy. If not, I save $350. Guess thats how you should look at it
promethuem5 Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 I like plenty of stuff, hell I might one day be tempted to get a VF-17, if I see the right paint scheme, for the most part it's just too fat a valk for me to like, when I think valkyrie I think sleek, and slender. But like I said if I see the right version I might get it. I'll be honest, I usually hate everything Yamato does because I've been screwed by them many, many times, yet I got an SDF-1 and the VF-19 Kai, this has always been and always will be a hit and miss company for me. Oh and I personally don't think this thing is anywhere near worth the price, more than the Kai with what, half the gimmicks? Like everyone else said, nobody truly knows what it costs to make these things, every project is different. To each his own though, I know Graham and many others have been dying for this thing, all I've wanted for the past 5 years has been a VF-4, until it does get announced, with a $400 price tag Don't like fat Valks, but buy the chunky 19 Kai? I'd much rather have the machines that actually show up in things, like the 17, rather than some mythical fan-wank Valk that's nothing more than a footnote.
Tking22 Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Don't like fat Valks, but buy the chunky 19 Kai? I'd much rather have the machines that actually show up in things, like the 17, rather than some mythical fan-wank Valk that's nothing more than a footnote. It's all personal preference man relax, I've been wanting a VF-4 since as far back as I can remember. I' rather have a beautiful uh, fan-wank valk, than a fat ugly flying turd. There is no doubt in my mind the VF-17 will be a fantastic figure, the SDF-1, the VF-19, all of Yamato's new stuff has been incredible, and I'm glad they're finally getting around to making valks fans have been wanting for ages. Oh and I personally don't see the VF-19 as that fat, I mean c'mon, the VF-17 is a flying triangle.
promethuem5 Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 It's all personal preference man relax, I've been wanting a VF-4 since as far back as I can remember. I' rather have a beautiful uh, fan-wank valk, than a fat ugly flying turd. There is no doubt in my mind the VF-17 will be a fantastic figure, the SDF-1, the VF-19, all of Yamato's new stuff has been incredible, and I'm glad they're finally getting around to making valks fans have been wanting for ages. Oh and I personally don't see the VF-19 as that fat, I mean c'mon, the VF-17 is a flying triangle. Well, you're faulting Yamato for making the smart business move over a personal and minority opinion.
Tking22 Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Well, you're faulting Yamato for making the smart business move over a personal and minority opinion. What? I'm not faulting anybody, what the hell are you talking about? Please don't try to get all pissy and start up a big argument where we both go back and forth trying to sound as smart and intellectual as possible, while all the while we're talking about plastic toys. Whatever you thought I did, I didn't. just relax I'm not uh, faulting? Anybody or anything.
VF5SS Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Some people feed their families because of plastic toys ;-;
kanedaestes Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 I like it, it's completely different than other valks out there and will be a great addition to my collection. I am a die hard valkaholic. I have been burned but that doesn't stop me from coming back.
anime52k8 Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Personally I think everyone needs to go out and buy this, possibly in multiples, regardless of whether they like it or not so that Yamato will decided to do a VF-17T variant. Then when that comes out everyone needs to buy it as well so that Yamato will be encouraged to finish off the Fire bomber squad with a VF-11MAXL. Because the MAXL is the best valk ever and it needs a toy. Just saying.
VF5SS Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 I can do nothing but agree with the crazy poniez on that one.
Uxi Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) Is the canopy going to stay purple for production, Graham? I hope it matches the VF-22S paint scheme exactly, especially on the black/primary color, as well as the yellow. Edited October 31, 2011 by Uxi
Graham Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 Just spoke with Yamato Japan. 1) Canopy windows are supposed to be purple, as per Kawamori's instructions. 2) They will double check with Kawamori and Big West regarding the color of the intakes. 3) Confirmed the VF-17S ankles are ball joints, but the ball joint tray that holds the ball joint will be chrome plated on the inner surface that hold the ball joint (same as VF-19S), which should make it tighter and more durable compared with the VF-19Kai ball joint tray, which was just painted on the inner surface. Graham
ff95gj Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 Personally I think everyone needs to go out and buy this, possibly in multiples, regardless of whether they like it or not so that Yamato will decided to do a VF-17T variant. Then when that comes out everyone needs to buy it as well so that Yamato will be encouraged to finish off the Fire bomber squad with a VF-11MAXL. Because the MAXL is the best valk ever and it needs a toy. Just saying. If you guys buy enough Destroids so I get the Spartan and Phalanx toys (NOT KITS) I would be obliged to help.
Graham Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 I also mentioned to Yamato that quite a few Macrossworld members had been asking about a 1/60 Fz-109. Graham
Old Man Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 Just spoke with Yamato Japan. 1) Canopy windows are supposed to be purple, as per Kawamori's instructions. I agree that the canopy windows are supposed be purple, but shouldn't they be more reddish purple than what is shown on the prototype?
charger69 Posted November 1, 2011 Author Posted November 1, 2011 (edited) I also mentioned to Yamato that quite a few Macrossworld members had been asking about a 1/60 Fz-109. Graham A few? A FEW? I'm a one man army Purple/Maroon Villain Mecha Trilogy should be completed! - 1/60 SV-51 Nora Type - DX VF-27 Brera - 1/60 Fz-109F Edited November 1, 2011 by charger69
Twoducks Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 I also mentioned to Yamato that quite a few Macrossworld members had been asking about a 1/60 Fz-109. Graham Hell yeah!!! I want my M7 collection to be really complete.
Renato Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 I also mentioned to Yamato that quite a few Macrossworld members had been asking about a 1/60 Fz-109. Graham We have? Huh. Ok.
Limbo Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 Can you also ask them no drop the price so I don't have to take a second mortgage?
SpaceCowboy Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 I'd love a Fz-109F, but given it is an enemy mech with a complicated transformation, I'm guessing it would be a limited run north of $500 by the time it came out, which would be a pass for me.
ff95gj Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 I also mentioned to Yamato that quite a few Macrossworld members had been asking about a 1/60 Fz-109. Graham And what those 50000 of them who want the Spartan and Phalanx? Sorry, I OTed again.
Kelsain Posted November 1, 2011 Posted November 1, 2011 I also mentioned to Yamato that quite a few Macrossworld members had been asking about a 1/60 Fz-109. Graham FTW, but I'm with Limbo. I'd love an enemy mech, but can't afford to shell out $300 for it. Wish I could for the 17. Maybe by the time the D comes out...
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