Macross R / Macross The Ride

[David Hingtgen]

F-15DJ, F-16CJ, F-16CG, are all unofficial nicknames. The F-16CG is really the Block 40 or Block 42 version of the F-16C, and the F-16CJ is the Block 50 or 52. F-15DJ is simply an F-15D built by Mitsubishi. No different than Viper or Warthog---people may call it that, but that's not the name.

Ok, as for VF-11MAXL---I totally forgot that, sad considering that's one of my fave valks.

[sketchley]

Don't forget (and apologies if someone already posted it):

VF-1A+ (VF-1A Plus), 1B+, 1D+, J+, 1S+, 1X+

VT-1C+

(Not sure if the plus is supposed to be written long form or short form. If it's long, then that's a 5 letter suffix; tying the VF-11MAXL Kai (Kai being a single letter in Japanese).

[sketchley]

A double-suffix goes against NATO/US tri-service aircraft designations, which is what Macross generally follows quite closely. (VF-2SS doesn't count).

Erm, my impression is that it follows the Air Self-Defence Force designations (which can be argued that the A-SDF follows NATO/US designations quite closely).

As for a double suffix in use by the A-SDF: F-4EJ

See text body of: http://www.mod.go.jp/asdf/about/equipment/sentouki/F-4/

Therefore, isn't it likely that the double suffix nomenclature is a nickname of the source company and/or manufacturer, but is the standard name and/or official name in the countries that actually used/made the equipment?

Edited December 9, 2010 by sketchley

[Seto Kaiba]

[...] the F-16CJ is the Block 50 or 52. F-15DJ is simply an F-15D built by Mitsubishi.

Granted, but isn't that more or less exactly what we're dealing with here? Instead of a F-15D built in Japan for the JASDF, we're talking about an export-specification VF-19E (presumably) built on Frontier for the fleet's New UN Spacy garrison and the attached SMS forces. This does take place like fifty years after whatever was left of NATO went up in smoke, so it's not like they're wedded to the NATO designation system... and I'm pretty sure there's not a lot of precedent for "改" as a variant letter under NATO's guidelines either.

[azrael]

Anyways... Back to Macross R...

[RedWolf]

Scarlet and Aoba... Blatantly Red and Blue. Can we expect a knife fight courtship?

[frothymug]

Good catch on the naming conventions!

[Zinjo]

Erm, then what's the point of racing a VF? Let me remind you of the GERWALK mode slalom racing illo I already mentioned.

Screw that!

GERWALK hockey!

THAT would be fun to watch...

[Gubaba]

From Macross the Ride Chapter 2:

Again, the VF-19EF Caliburn...

And the VF-19ACTIVE Nothung

("Nothung," or "Needful," by the way, is the magic sword that Siegmund finds in Wagner's Ring of the Nibelung. Clearly, there's a magic sword theme going on here...)

The racecourse:

Starting off with a pinpoint barrier gate, followed by a fighter area, a gerwalk slalom, and then a roughhouse game of "capture the flag."

New chapter is up on the website, and will be updated every month on the 25th.

[valhary]

wow i want it on 1/60 toys

[RedWolf]

Boy we're getting a bunch of VF-19 variants aren't we?

[eugimon]

I'm digging that vf-19 Active Nothung

[anime52k8]

I'm digging that vf-19 Active Nothung

I think it's really cool looking, but that's one of the most awkward names ever.

Edited December 26, 2010 by anime52k8

[eugimon]

I think it's really cool looking, but that's one of the most awkward names ever.

yeah... I'm just going to call it the AN.

[David Hingtgen]

LOL, they just changed one word and made ACTIVE all Macrossy yet still work as an acronym. In the real world, ACTIVE is "Advanced Control Technology for Integrated VEhicles". Seriously, the Japanese sure do love ACTIVE, it shows up in WAY too many video games etc.

Also note how Gubaba posted it--that is certainly the intended way. All caps, and no space between "19" and "ACTIVE".

VF-19ACTIVE

[eugimon]

LOL, they just changed one word and made ACTIVE still work. In the real world, ACTIVE is "Advanced Control Technology for Integrated VEhicles". Seriously, the Japanese sure do love ACTIVE, it shows up in WAY too many video games etc.

Also note how Gubaba posted it--that is certainly the intended way. All caps, and no space between "19" and "ACTIVE".

VF-19ACTIVE

I barely have a grasp on regular old fashioned english, I'm not sure I have room in here for your fancy shmancy military english.

[David Hingtgen]

It's the same as VF-11MAXL

[eugimon]

It's the same as VF-11MAXL

Look here, I'm trying to disguise my ignorance with humor and faux old man snark, I don't need you rubbing it in as well.

[sketchley]

For anyone doing machine-translations - full text of Gubaba's posted images available herein: http://hobby.dengeki.com/macross_r/index.html

I've tried to grab the images of the VFs by saving the page but no luck >.<

Anyhow, in trying to find them via google, I stumbled upon the model makers blog:

VF-19EF: http://frameout.blog67.fc2.com/blog-entry-308.html

VF-19ACTIVE: http://frameout.blog67.fc2.com/blog-entry-311.html

Got the images:

Edited December 26, 2010 by sketchley

[sketchley]

translation of the new info on the VF-19EF:

- three-dimensional thrust vectoring with thrust reverser equipped exhaust nozzles.

- Shinsei Industry/P&W/RR FF-2550E Thermonuclear Burst Turbine Engines

- Active Stealth System

- chaff/flare/smoke discharger system

- pin-point barrier system

- Energy Conversion Armour system

- REB-30G

- REB-23

Rest of the info looks to be recycled from last month's release.

The VF-19ACTIVE is pretty much the same except:

- user: SMS (only!)

- no armaments

Machine translation of the blurb:

Airframe that receives consignment from LAI as experiment machine for data collection by S.M.S based on VF-19EF and does test run. ACTIVE is Advanced Control Technology for Integrated Valkyries: It means a technological advanced control integration and changeable aircraft.

The equipped changeable type wing let is used the OTM freedom transformation material with which YF-21 was equipped before, and changes the wing section and the wing type to the aerofoil tip according to all phases of the empty war.

However, development is on the way, is still necessary, indispensable the ability of an intuitive interface and the skill pilot with support and the EX gear of high-end AI to get on and to digest, and has become an airframe that chooses the rider as for the technology that controls a complex like this vehicle control system relying on neither BDI (brain wave control system) nor the implant.

The phase turned on in S.M.S by the above-mentioned reason is limited, and the number of production machines of this machines is extremely little though it was this machine with a strong experimental shade of meaning for a new technology assessment including "[No-tou;ngu]" that became Chelsea Scarlett's multiplication machine.

It is thought that it is a part of the data collection for the one and further next generation type changeable fighter development ..turning on having shown the appearance in the van quiche race this term...

[David Hingtgen]

A thrust reverser? Interesting, they're quite rare on fighter jets. Curious as to how it'd work, as it says in the nozzles themselves, for which there's no real-world equivalent assuming either VF-19/25 style of nozzle or F-14/15/16/18 style nozzle.

[sketchley]

Macross Ace Vol. 007 pgs 160-161 have an article on it, with lineart of the thrust reversers. Literally, a panel from both the top and bottom of the engine nacelle flips out, and they meet over the rear of the engine. Or just the lower one pops out a little, and something inside of the the 3D vectoring system diverts thrust out the bottom.

the art is a little unintelligible, but it looks like the 3D vectoring system becomes the heel, and the thrust reverser (or at least the part that swivels out) becomes the front of the foot.

If the images are anything to go by, this month's issue of Dengenki Hobby will have some sweet images.

[David Hingtgen]

That sounds like a target-type thrust reverser. (737-200, DC-9, MD-80, Fokkers) The Tornado is the only fighter I know of with that style--but again, it really needs that type of nozzle to start with, which is not like any valk or "iris-petal" style of nozzle. (that nozzle design is part of the reason the Tornado isn't very fast at high altitude--it's fine for airliners, but far from optimal for high-alt high-mach flight)

PS to everybody--yes, thrust reversers are a special interest for me.

[frothymug]

Aren't the thrust reversers located farther up on the nacelle? What are those ports on the top of the nacelles on the model?

[sketchley]

That sounds like a target-type thrust reverser. (737-200, DC-9, MD-80, Fokkers) The Tornado is the only fighter I know of with that style--but again, it really needs that type of nozzle to start with, which is not like any valk or "iris-petal" style of nozzle. (that nozzle design is part of the reason the Tornado isn't very fast at high altitude--it's fine for airliners, but far from optimal for high-alt high-mach flight)

PS to everybody--yes, thrust reversers are a special interest for me.

Hmmm (googles a few images). I'd almost say that the Tornado (fighter) is the inspiration source for those thrust reversers. Of course, we've only seen a side view of them with the VF-19ACTIVE. So... not much to go on just yet.

[sketchley]

Translation of the VF-19ACTIVE Nothung section: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2667.msg41084#msg41084

[Gubaba]

I think it's really cool looking, but that's one of the most awkward names ever.

Would it help if you pronounced it the German way, like "No-tuung"?

[frothymug]

So, is it a common naming convention for 19's to be named after swords?

[David Hingtgen]

It is now...

[Vic Mancini]

The Active looks like the product of what would happen if the YF-19 and YF-21 had a baby. I like it!

[Graham]

Macross the Ride pages from the new February 2011 issue of Dengeki Hobby magazine.

On page 4, I see VF-9, VF-19A, VF-19S, VF-1, VF-4, VF-22S

Graham

[valhary]

yamato should make it

[eugimon]

yamato should make it

yes, please! I'm really digging all the new vf-19 variants. FAR more than the ones from M7 in all honesty.

[David Hingtgen]

If Yamato makes a V3 YF-19, I may get hers instead of Isamu's---I have a hard time buying the same valk THREE times.

Anyways---hmmn, the ACTIVE's thrust reverser seems "incomplete" to me (it has a cascade array etc, but no real blocker system that I can see)--and based on the drawing and underside views etc, it almost looks like it only exhausts to the underside--that is a horrible design flaw if it does, it's self-defeating. (that would cause the back end to effectively lift up when landing on a runway, taking weight/effectiveness off the brakes---making it take longer to decelerate--which defeats the point of reversing in the first place---many an airliner has been stymied by this problem)

[Vic Mancini]

If Yamato makes a V3 YF-19, I may get hers instead of Isamu's---I have a hard time buying the same valk THREE times.

Anyways---hmmn, the ACTIVE's thrust reverser seems "incomplete" to me (it has a cascade array etc, but no real blocker system that I can see)--and based on the drawing and underside views etc, it almost looks like it only exhausts to the underside--that is a horrible design flaw if it does, it's self-defeating. (that would cause the back end to effectively lift up when landing on a runway, taking weight/effectiveness off the brakes---making it take longer to decelerate--which defeats the point of reversing in the first place---many an airliner has been stymied by this problem)

I think that's what the black shutters are for on top of the nacelles to the left and right of the head. They probably counter-balance the reverse thrust from below so it doesn't pitch forward. Just a guess.

I think it's a neat design. The method of thrust vectoring is interesting. It's unlike anything I can remember from Macross.