More New Macross After Zero.

[azrael]

We should go and outfit our military aircraft with guitars instead of joystick and throttle. G major hits the afterburners and E minor drops the bomb.

Which is actually a misconception produced when people watch M7. The controls of the Sound Force were on the slider and movement was read since the instruments were one joint-systems which really work like a joystick. By moving the slider up and down and pressing one of the buttons on the slider, it would produce the same effect if one were to be using the stick and throttle. Now playing that guitar and controlling the VF..that's a whole new ballgame.

The whole point of Sharon (like the Jamming Birds in 7), was to show just why manufactured attempts at altering peoples emotions doesn't work. Instead of using emotion to trigger reactions in people, she was designed to alter their brain chemestry through lights & sounds, and used that ability to control people (once she became self aware).

I do agree with that interpretation (except for Jamming Birds, I'll need to think about that). Listen to some music and see what happens. It's not the music making you sing along with it, or whatever you may do. It's you.

[Aegis!]

.

If you forget Gundam, you will understand better Macross. Macross is cheating mecha fans, giving them the most gorgeous mechas (without relying too much on the "it's powerful, then it's good" cliché) and the most choreographic action scenes, but with little actual action, and little of what a typical mecha fan want.

That was the whole point. It wasn't meant to be mecha fanservice. It was meant to be an inversion of the usual Gundam mecha-action orgy by bringing characters to the fore and making them real human beings as opposed to just adjuncts to the machines.

I completely agree with you there

Macross flows in the same level as Gundam but it is its opposite in many ways...Macross focuses more in the human factor of war and the social evolution through this experiences , Mechas and Music are just tools for the characters to reach this state.

About the Jamming birds : as characters they sucked , but God , wasn´t the VF-11D Jamming bird custom beautiful. It has to be one of the most functional designs in the whole of the Macross-class fleets

Edited November 26, 2003 by Aegis!

[Legioss]

Macross 7 rocks. I love the songs and the character designs. I blinded myself to it before, but now watching it again with a better knowledge of Macross I understand. The passion of Basara reminds me of Sakuragi Hanamichi from Slam Dunk or Kintaro Oe from Goldenboy. It's fun to watch.

[Keith]

Hehe, huh? Okay. We should go and outfit our military aircraft with guitars instead of joystick and throttle. G major hits the afterburners and E minor drops the bomb.

Basara never (until Dynamite) played guitar whlie flying. He sang to pre-recorded tracks (likely an intelligent karaoke system that detected when he was & wasn't singing to keep up), while using the guitar stick as a normal control stick. It wasn't even playable until the slider was placed all the way at the top of the headstock (like in the M7 movie). Playing notes as such wouldn't have done anything. It was moving the guitar stick, and using its slider & switches that allowed for flight control. i.e. no differnet from a regular flight scheme.

Because there's absolutely no point to having mounts and noses on a robot. At least with the VF-1's you can argue that it has different sensor arrays and laser arrangements. With M7, it jus t becomes a circus.

There's no point in not having them. Far more sci-fi robots through out history have had faces than haven't. Doesn't hurt anything, an entirely superficial statement, and like I said, theren'd be no point in progressing past the standard large VF-1A large camera eye by your standards. As opposed to the mroe stylish eye-visor like VF-1S design.

Well, anime is first and foremost something we watch. If it looks and feels like absolute crap, then really, what point is there to watching it? Apparently, you're a little TOO diehard-m7 for me, so there's really no point in arguing my point any further when we'll probably never see eye to eye over the issue.

Anime is first & foremost, like any other entertainment medium, something you take in as a whole, i.e. story, visual, audio, etc. There's been no legitimate argument of why a Valkyrie can't have a face, especially when it actually serves a purpose in 7. They're not used as combat machines, and the faces just help distinguish them that much more.

[Oihan]

As long as some fruity guy with guitar and a horrible voice doesn't show up it will be good. No more American idol, Jamming birds either please lol

LOL! That's one of the funniest images I've seen in a long while. Thanks for the laugh. $$$

[Oihan]

i hear its a SD version of Macross II the movie. i hear the main characters will have "carebear stare" powers.

lol...sounds like a great story! Can't wait to see it.

[bandit29]

As long as some fruity guy with guitar and a horrible voice doesn't show up it will be good. No more American idol, Jamming birds either please lol

LOL! That's one of the funniest images I've seen in a long while. Thanks for the laugh. $$$

The credit goes to Myriad. he posted it once I couldn't let that image be forgotten lol

[Aegis!]

Wow , I thought that the M7 bashing threads were in extinction ; Nice to see them pop out again since that gives the nitpickers something to do other than nitpicking Macross Zero for the sake of filling their free time <_

[Abombz!!]

Don't let it be an OVA..... please. I'm tired of waiting 6 months for nothing more then crummy 30 minutes of animation.

[the white drew carey]

Because there's absolutely no point to having mounts and noses on a robot. At least with the VF-1's you can argue that it has different sensor arrays and laser arrangements. With M7, it jus t becomes a circus.

There's no point in not having them. Far more sci-fi robots through out history have had faces than haven't. Doesn't hurt anything, an entirely superficial statement, and like I said, theren'd be no point in progressing past the standard large VF-1A large camera eye by your standards. As opposed to the mroe stylish eye-visor like VF-1S design.

Although I absolutely abhor the Power Ranger faces on the VF's, I have to agree with Keef here. There's no reason to paint mouths on fighter planes, yet it has happened, and still does all the time.

That said, I still think that two eyes, a nose and a mouth is one of the stupidest things Kawamori has ever incorporated into his VF designs.

...but that's just me.

[imode]

Nice to know I'm not alone here )

[Duke Togo]

Kawamori sold out when he made Macross 7. He turned Macross into every other anime show. Thank God for Plus and Zero.

[yellowlightman]

Kawamori sold out when he made Macross 7. He turned Macross into every other anime show. Thank God for Plus and Zero.

Yeah, because SDF: Macross was totally original. Well, minus the whole bunch of Gundam homages.

It's Japanese animation, they don't make them to be original... they make them to sell toys and models. If you think that Macross exists for any other reason other than to sell merchandise, you need to pull your head out of the sand.

Working in the anime industry means selling out, the sponsor is the number one authority... not Kawamori, and no amount of the worshipping you guys lay down for him will change that. Its getting to the point where you'll say the most ridiculous and irrelevant things just to insult Macross 7. WE GET IT, you don't like it.

[Final Vegeta]

There's no point in not having them. Far more sci-fi robots through out history have had faces than haven't.

Learn the Anime Laws of Mechas: the more human a mecha does look, the more powerful it is

This is true especially for the good guys. For the baddies, usually the more powerful are the uglier mechas, but nowadays things changed (try comparing Ziong and Sazabi)

And for a mecha there is something worse than having a face, it's having a penis and a vagina on the top of the head like in Five Star Stories

(sample image of the Knight of Gold)

FV

[Aegis!]

Don't let it be an OVA..... please. I'm tired of waiting 6 months for nothing more then crummy 30 minutes of animation.

Oooook...so you´re seriously telling me that M0 animation is crummy ?

You gotta be kidding me , that has to be the most ridiculous statement I´ve EVER seen on this boards and that´s something <_<

Wow , I still can´t believe this guy actually thinks the animation is crummy

This is certainly unbelieveable

Ok You may say the Music is crap , the characters are lame , you could critisize just about everything but the animation

[imode]

The animation isn't crummy per se, but having only 30 minutes of it certainly is.

[Effect]

She didn't say the animation was crummy but that the 30 minutes was crummy. I agree, I hate waiting that long for such a short product as well.

[Aegis!]

The animation isn't crummy per se, but having only 30 minutes of it certainly is.

Yeah , but at the end we´re getting 1 episode more than Plus , with better animation (than plus AND current series).

Of course I would love 15 mins more per episode , but with the current quality of the episodes I´m certainly satysfied.

[imode]

The animation isn't crummy per se, but having only 30 minutes of it certainly is.

Yeah , but at the end we´re getting 1 episode more than Plus , with better animation (than plus AND current series).

Of course I would love 15 mins more per episode , but with the current quality of the episodes I´m certainly satysfied.

Let's not try to compare with other things.

6 months between releases is just slow. I don't expect one OVA week after week, because I know that the standards are higher than that of a regular TV show. However, that still doesn't make 6 months go any faster.

[Graham]

Kawamori sold out when he made Macross 7. He turned Macross into every other anime show. Thank God for Plus and Zero.

Actually, my personal view is that kawamori went the other way with M7 and created something completely new and original, rather than taking the easy road, ala what Sunrise and Tomino mostly does with the Gundam franchise and making a clone of a clone of a clone.

That's what I like about kawamori-san, he's not afraid to experiment with Macross rather than endlessly retreading the same ground.

And while his results may not always please everybody, he can always be expected to take Macross in fresh new directions.

Graham

[JsARCLIGHT]

I want the next Macross (if there is one) to be more of the same... you heard me. I want to see the UN Spacy fighting the Zentradi on the SDF Macross and I want to see more crazy space combat action with ace combat pilots, killer VF-1 valkyries and regult pods getting blowed up real good.

To me there is no Macross after Flashback 2021... just knock-offs trying hard to be Macross.

[Aegis!]

Actually, my personal view is that kawamori went the other way with M7 and created something completely new and original, rather than taking the easy road, ala what Sunrise and Tomino mostly does with the Gundam franchise and making a clone of a clone of a clone.

That's what I like about kawamori-san, he's not afraid to experiment with Macross rather than endlessly retreading the same ground.

And while his results may not always please everybody, he can always be expected to take Macross in fresh new directions.

Graham

I completely agree with you Graham.

What makes Macross different from other animes is that it doesn´t need to resort on repetetive themes or plots (hence the lack of mass appeal ). Macross is always open to improvement and variety , that´s what it makes it special to me , it´s never the same thing over and over like Gundam or Pokemon or ...you get the idea.

I agree with those that say 6 months is just too much for 1 episode at a time but if that´s the only way of getting such high quality OVA series then I´ll live with it. Macross Plus was just about the same story , it´s always this way (don´t remember about Dynamite though ).

So far M0 beats the hell out of most series out there (yukikaze included ) and is currently setting the standards for CGI application in anime (as always with Macross series and the plot is really interesting let alone the fact that the mechas are just awesome.

Only dissapointment so far is the Music , I would´ve liked something more exiting like M+ , but at least it does the job and it isn´t annoying or crappy .

[Mr March]

Actually, my personal view is that kawamori went the other way with M7 and created something completely new and original, rather than taking the easy road, ala what Sunrise and Tomino mostly does with the Gundam franchise and making a clone of a clone of a clone.

I must say I totally agree. While I'm not a fan of Macross 7, every Macross product Kawamori has had a hand in has both that familiar Macross theme with a welcome sense of originality and innovation. As someone who got into Gundam just a few years ago and has seen more than his fair share of the many series, movies, and OVAs, I find Gundam suffers from a simple re-run formula. I'm pleased that Macross maintains it's identity well, while constantly diving into new and different areas.

[CaptRico]

Forgot about that...could he give us Armored Core?

An Armored Core anime? That'll be interesting...

Yeah, man! I agree.^^

[ogami]

I don't mind a new Shoji Kawamori's Gundam OVA.

Haruhiko Mikimoto has his own Gundam manga in a manga magazine - Gundam Ace.

Edited November 27, 2003 by ogami

[Druna Skass]

Actually, my personal view is that kawamori went the other way with M7 and created something completely new and original, rather than taking the easy road, ala what Sunrise and Tomino mostly does with the Gundam franchise and making a clone of a clone of a clone.

Yeah Kawamori did go the other way with Macross 7 but to me it seems like he went the way Tomino went when he made G Gundam. In terms of just over the top stuff 7 has to be the G Gundam of Macross.

Since Kawamori's a fan of Kuberic I want to see a Kuberic-esque series. Or at least a commander who's the spitting image of R. Lee Ermy.

Edited November 27, 2003 by Druna Skass

[Druna Skass]

I don't mind a new Shoji Kawamori's Gundam OVA.

Haruhiko Mikimoto has his own Gundam manga in a manga magazine - Gundam Ace.

I'd be happy if he just did his own variations on Mobile Suits like the way Hajime Katoki does. I'd love to see his version of a Zeta Plus.

[Abombz!!]

Don't let it be an OVA..... please. I'm tired of waiting 6 months for nothing more then crummy 30 minutes of animation.

Oooook...so you´re seriously telling me that M0 animation is crummy ?

You gotta be kidding me , that has to be the most ridiculous statement I´ve EVER seen on this boards and that´s something <_<

Wow , I still can´t believe this guy actually thinks the animation is crummy

This is certainly unbelieveable

Ok You may say the Music is crap , the characters are lame , you could critisize just about everything but the animation

I may hate Macross Zero from the bottom of my heart.... but I know the animation is good. With that out of the way.... I said crummy in reference to the amount not the quality. Regardless of it getting more episodes then Macross Plus... I simply cannot stand waiting 6 months for simply 30 minutes of animation.... no matter how breath taking the animation is.

So don't get your panties in a bunch. <_<

Yeah Kawamori did go the other way with Macross 7 but to me it seems like he went the way Tomino went when he made G Gundam.

Gundam was created by Yasuhiro Imagawa, the creator of Giant Robo to celebrate 15 years of Gundam. Tomino had nothing to do with G Gundam. <_<

Edited November 27, 2003 by Abombz!!

[Druna Skass]

Gundam was created by Yasuhiro Imagawa, the creator of Giant Robo to celebrate  15 years of Gundam. Tomino had nothing to do with G Gundam. <_<

Ah just confuesed the names it happens...

Point is Macross 7 is like the Macross version of G Gundam.

Edited November 27, 2003 by Druna Skass

[Aegis!]

I may hate Macross Zero from the bottom of my heart.... but I know the animation is good

Wow , you actually sound like you´re pissed off about M0 , now that´s something to admire.

Not that I want to defend M0 all over again but it´s certainly a good series , if not better than anything out there. Of course it has its dissapointments (such as music , slow character develoment , continuity gaps ...) but even then it makes one hell of a good Macross series , up there with Plus and DYRL.

Even if I wanted to hate M0 as much as you , it would be impossible or hughly unlike for me to find any good or relevant reason to hate it. It would have to be the crappiest sh*t in the Macross universe for me to hate it. MII was a huge dissapointment for me yet still I haven´t reach that point where I could say I hate it , but I certainly dislike it for personal reasons

Strong words indeed

[Final Vegeta]

Yeah Kawamori did go the other way with Macross 7 but to me it seems like he went the way Tomino went when he made G Gundam. In terms of just over the top stuff 7 has to be the G Gundam of Macross.

Tomino had nothing to do with G Gundam, but neither Imagawa choose to do G Gundam.

http://www.mahq.net/rants/cons/imagawa/imagawa.htm

Since Kawamori's a fan of Kuberic I want to see a Kuberic-esque series. Or at least a commander who's the spitting image of R. Lee Ermy.

He said he likes Kubrick but he doesn't like to copy anybody.

FV

[lebhead]

And while I'm loving nearly everything about Macross Zero, I'm hoping a new Macross TV series would have more memorable music. Zero is the only Macross series so far where I cannot remember the music to hum or sing it

agreed.

[ogami]

off topic:

At first, i rejected G Gundam. However, once it gets to the Devil Gundam storyline, i love it. It is fun to watch.

G Gundam also shows that we have to protect nature before it is too late. (The purpose of Devil Gundam is to use DG cells to restore nature to its best shape)

And for those of you who hate M0, I want to say "keep an open mind". M0 only has 2 eps and there are 3 more to come. It is unwise to think M0 is a bad show because the amount of time it takes to have 1 eps when the best has yet to come.

(Waiting is not a problem as long as I can see a good show and M0 is a good show. )

[Abombz!!]

I may hate Macross Zero from the bottom of my heart.... but I know the animation is good

Wow , you actually sound like you´re pissed off about M0 , now that´s something to admire.

Not that I want to defend M0 all over again but it´s certainly a good series , if not better than anything out there. Of course it has its dissapointments (such as music , slow character develoment , continuity gaps ...) but even then it makes one hell of a good Macross series , up there with Plus and DYRL.

Even if I wanted to hate M0 as much as you , it would be impossible or hughly unlike for me to find any good or relevant reason to hate it. It would have to be the crappiest sh*t in the Macross universe for me to hate it. MII was a huge dissapointment for me yet still I haven´t reach that point where I could say I hate it , but I certainly dislike it for personal reasons

Strong words indeed

lol..... I just seem to find reasons to hate things way too easily for comfort.

I guess I hate it because I was expecting more.... and that I seriously hate prequels to already established continuities. That.... and the fact that I have to wait 6 months to see if the story develops into something watchable or if Kawamori flushed his toilet with Zero in it. <_<

I guess I would've liked the series better if I had seen each episode 1 after the other... instead of watching a new episode every decade.

But lets move on.... I don't want to sound like a certain someone who can't seem to get over his hatred for Macross 7 (though... I did a few months ago ).

[motley]

Point is Macross 7 is like the Macross version of G Gundam

actually no. macross 7 is equivilent to turn A gundam. G gundam is the gundam version of macross 2, along with X, Wing and Seed, where the parent company made a sequel without bringing in the original creator.

as for a new macross series, i'll just be happy to see one. macross is one of the better mecha anime's out there, but its seen fairly little development over the last 20 years. so a new show, in whatever form it comes in will be apreciated. the thing to remember, though, is that the reason macross is different from your standard mecha anime is that Kawamori doesn't approach the show from the standard angle, and never has. so i would expect that whatever show follows Macross 0 will be completely different from all the shows and OVAs (though i think we can expect singing as a major plot component)