Macross Translations, and more

[sketchley]

1/100 scale VF-25F Messiah Valkyrie Alto Custom Instruction Booklet and Box

http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2796.0

I find the expansion to various roles most interesting.

Does that mean that in addition to the fighter (F,S, presumably G, too), reconnaissance aircraft (RVF-25), and unmanned fighter squadron command craft (presumably the RVF-25 with some modifications), there's also an attacker (like the VA-3) and fighter bomber (like the VB-3000) models? Intersting.

[valkyriechild]

Maybe the tornado or armored pack is already enough to fulfill those roles?

Personally I think it means that the system connects with the Vajra-produced fold wave energy that they use to communicate (and I think the implication is that it also provides power to the Vajra).

I certainly wish that the Wyvern variant of the VF-25 was further developed (appeared in Macross Ace & VFMF:VF-25), as the description says something about a propeller driven craft is needed for Vajra reconnaissance as the Vajra can't detect a VF-25 with its engines deactivated. If that is true, then the YF-29 would stick out like a sore thumb to the Vajra, given that it also uses their fold wave energy!

All i can think about this fold wave system is wireless energy transfer. I wouldn't surprise if the energy supply came from fold space. Like xenogears.

[sketchley]

Maybe the tornado or armored pack is already enough to fulfill those roles?

Possibly for the Tornado pack. The armoured pack is a totally different specification.

I wouldn't surprise if the energy supply came from fold space. Like xenogears.

This makes sense, especially considering how ISC uses, if I'm not mistaken, the super dimension as a place to temporarily store inertia.

[sketchley]

Newtype 2009.09 (YF-24 Evolution, YF-25 Prophecy)

http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2797.0

Thanks to the "Official Complete Book: Macross F Theatrical Edition: the Wings of Goodbye", I was able to locate the specific Newtype issue that the YF-25 Prophecy article appeared in. Fast forward a few months of searching through local Bookoffs... et voila!

Some of the stuff penned by Kawamori is best guess. As my wife has said, he doesn't have the easiest-to-read handwriting.

What I found most interesting is the appearance of Isamu Dyson. Still at Eden! Albeit retired. Great that the 2 Macross F movies (or at least their backstory) flesh out other parts of the Macross universe, too.

[Talos]

What I found most interesting is the appearance of Isamu Dyson. Still at Eden! Albeit retired. Great that the 2 Macross F movies (or at least their backstory) flesh out other parts of the Macross universe, too.

IIRC they even promoted him to Major before he retired and joined a certain other organization. He was chief test pilot for that program. At least one other was killed and another injured.

[sketchley]

Current project: finding and translating info on the VF-1X.

Macross Digital Mission VF-X Flight Manual: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2835.msg43382#msg43382

... also `corrected the English text at the front of the book, and some other odd translations. Not going to do the other part on the VF-1 in the tail end of the book at this time, as it is basically about the origins of the VF-1, and the standard specification VF-1. Which we've already got oodles of translations of.

[sketchley]

More VF-1X-Plus:

Macross VF-X2 Perfect Official Clue File: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2837.msg43385#msg43385

... alas, the information is more geared toward game play, then in-universe stats. Nevertheless, it does add some stuff of interest when it compares the VF-1 to the other VFs. The ability graph also is an interesting dynamic - in comparison to the other VFs.

[Zinjo]

1/100 scale VF-25F Messiah Valkyrie Alto Custom Instruction Booklet and Box

http://www.macrossro...hp?topic=2796.0

I find the expansion to various roles most interesting.

Does that mean that in addition to the fighter (F,S, presumably G, too), reconnaissance aircraft (RVF-25), and unmanned fighter squadron command craft (presumably the RVF-25 with some modifications), there's also an attacker (like the VA-3) and fighter bomber (like the VB-3000) models? Intersting.

That would be a cool addition!

The F/A-18 not only replaced the Fighter compliment on CVS' but also their Attack craft as well with it multi-function. On Emigration fleets with limited resources, a similar extension of a new generation VF's duties would be equally reasonable.

[sketchley]

last on the VF-1X+ (in my collection at least. Note: checked the booklets that come w/ both MDM:VF-X & M:VF-X2, and natta on the VF-1X+).

Macross VF-X2 Official Visual Guide: http://www.macrossro...g43399#msg43399

Plus some spot translations of the intro (it was most interesting to compare the differences in the English and Japanese text in the book), as well as speed, turning performance and so on.

This later one is noteworthy for giving at least an impression of the relative throttle settings between the VFs that appear in the game. I'm fairly certain that lifting bodies and other aerodynamic features that increase lift (thereby allowing for a lower flight speed) are not taken into consideration. Nevertheless, it provides a place to start the conversation on throttle settings.

Edited December 18, 2011 by sketchley

[sketchley]

Newtype Ace 2012.02: Macross F the Movie My Best Memory booklet

partial translation: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2846.0

The main "goal" was the VF-19 that appeared in the 2nd movie. However, that turned out to be less about the VF-19 per se, but Isamu Dyson's fate, post Macross Plus.

Did some other spot translations of titles, etc., to give a sense of the content. The most interesting was Kawamori's comment on the possibility of a sequel.

Also... did anyone spot Tetsuwan Atom (Mighty Atom, Astro Boy) appear in the movie???!??!??!

[Gubaba]

Also... did anyone spot Tetsuwan Atom (Mighty Atom, Astro Boy) appear in the movie???!??!??!

Yeah...it caused quite a stir at the time.

[Lobizon]

Also... did anyone spot Tetsuwan Atom (Mighty Atom, Astro Boy) appear in the movie???!??!??!

Also...Burakku Jakku!

[sketchley]

This is Animation Macross Plus - Variable Fighters Aero Report: VF-11

completed the section: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2250.msg33505#msg33505

Going to try and summarize things:

VF-5: UNS's main space fighter at the time of the VF-11's introduction (what happened to the VF-4???)

VF-11A (shorter laser gun, two-window sensor camera)

VF-11B (improved thrust)

VF-11C (improved avionics)

VF-11 reconnaisance model

VF-11 electronic warfare model

VF-11 increased offensive-ability model

VF-11 two-seater trainer model

Reconnaissance pod for the VF-11

The Unified Government Chief of Staff Rescue Operation is also enlightening. I think that description itself formed the basis of M3.

[sketchley]

Macross Digital Mission VF-X Flight Manual also adds further question marks to the VF-5...

(from page 81)

VF-5: space combat dedicated craft

an aircraft for space combat and local/regional combat

development begins 2009

first flight 2013

mass production starts 2015

mass production stops 2023

grey-scale bar starts really fading 2026

grey-scale bar completed faded out 2028

... 2028 being the same year as the VF-11's first flight.

[Reïvaj]

VF-5?

What does it look like?

[sketchley]

See: http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=18842&st=0

[Reïvaj]

Oh! Thanks for the link.

[sketchley]

Oh! Thanks for the link.

Here's another... WIP: http://studiootaking...llery/#/d4b8lam

... anyhow, started on the VF-17 (same book; thanks for the patience Graham), and something struck me:

As a result, in order to deal with this,two kinds of GERWALK form were set up; one for high-speed combat, and the other for hand-to-hand combat.

How many years of 'net arguements have there been about the VF-17 not having a standard looking GERWALK form... when all along, it's been sitting there, in print, since 1995.03.01?!?!?!?!

[Graham]

Yay! Was actually just going to send you a remnder about this, Sketchley, but then saw your post.

Graham

[sketchley]

Working through it this week... and just like the VF-11, I'm surprised at how much the VF-17 doesn't talk about the VF-17. A big chunk of the intro is dedicated to General Galaxy, the VF-14, and mention of the GG light fighters in passing!

[sketchley]

This is Animation Macross Plus - Variable Fighters Aero Report: VF-17

completed the section: http://www.macrossro...g33507#msg33507

Going to try and summarize things:

This article highlights some recent revisions to Macross. Mainly active stealth not being present in any VF prior to the YF-19 and YF-21, and the VF-14 is not so good as a carrier-borne aircraft...

anyhow, going to try and summarize the model content:

VF-17A: essentially a trial production craft with output deficient engines

VF-17T: model conversion trainer continuing to be produced (unclear if it's only during the VF-17's development, or after the non-trainer VF-17's production stopped)

VF-17C: A type with improved avionics

VF-17D: C model with the engines the craft was planned to have from the start

VF-17S: tuned D model w/ higher resultant performance

... and AKA, the Stealth Valkyrie.

Random thoughts: I like this and the 11's write-up, as not only do they provide some fine details on the two craft, they also paint in, albeit with large brush strokes, some of the background of Macross. Not only do we get production companies and a bit on their histories, but we get the same for the Unified Forces AND bits on in-Universe publications AND attitudes of in-universe aviation fans. Great stuff.

EDIT: silly me... go and make a long post, and forget the linky! The most important frikken thing in the post >.<;;;

Might as well add the translation's TOC that this appears in: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/Sketchley/portal/translations.htm

and the Macross Chronicle TOC for good measure: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/Sketchley/portal/Chronicles.htm

Edited February 9, 2012 by sketchley

[Graham]

Hi Sketchley,

So only 718 VF-17 produced in total. Quite a small number.

Graham

[VF-15 Banshee]

Considering the number of colonies and colony fleets, that does seem kinda small.

[sketchley]

Hi Sketchley,

So only 718 VF-17 produced in total. Quite a small number.

Graham

Yes, and Macross Chronicle repeats the information.

That said, one nagging question the publications don't clear up is: is that only the total number produced AS OF the events of Macross Plus? The article does vaguely state that the VF-17T model is continuing to be produced (it's not clear if that's only during the development from the VF-17A through to the VF-17D, or above and beyond that).

The other angle to consider is official produced (basically during the production run), and produced afterwards. An example of this is the VF-1X++ produced in 2047: they're not counted.

Of course, it's implied that the VF-17 has a high or extremely high operating cost, and beyond special forces, it's not worth procuring more than the 4 that Macross 7 implies are standard for emigrant fleets and planets (that's 2x D model, 1x S model, 1x T model (later converted to the VF-17T Kai).

Fuzzy math gives us approximately a deployment of 175 different places (if each place receives 4 fighters, total).

Edited February 10, 2012 by sketchley

[TehPW]

remember, they are retconning all this, Sketchy. Claiming small numbers of VF-17s helps their rational on using the VF-171 as MFs cannon fodder birds (since we know they claimed they didnt use the VF-19 because of heroship conflict with the VF-25 [Though i argue it was legal reasons with M7 that they didnt even show a VF19 in MF])

Edited February 10, 2012 by TehPW

[sketchley]

remember, they are retconning all this, Sketchy. Claiming small numbers of VF-17s helps their rational on using the VF-171 as MFs cannon fodder birds (since we know they claimed they didnt use the VF-19 because of heroship conflict with the VF-25 [Though i argue it was legal reasons with M7 that they didnt even show a VF19 in MF])

Erm... you do realize that "This is Animation Special: Macross Plus" was published in 1995, right?

PS, Sketch hasn't been active in this thread...

[VF-15 Banshee]

So if this info was originally from the Animation Special Macross Plus, I'd be more inclined to believe that they meant that it was the total number of VF-17s thus far.

[VF5SS]

[Though i argue it was legal reasons with M7 that they didnt even show a VF19 in MF])

There are no legal reasons for not using the VF-19. Big West owns the character and Frontier is a Big West show.

[sketchley]

So if this info was originally from the Animation Special Macross Plus, I'd be more inclined to believe that they meant that it was the total number of VF-17s thus far.

Agreed.

HOWEVER, with the introduction of the VF-19 and VF-22, impressions are that the reasons to continue producing and utilizing the VF-17 get fewer and fewer.

This *may* be the reason why GG revises the base aircraft and starts producing the VF-171.

[sketchley]

Completed the VF Series Development Chronology in "Macross Digital Mission VF-X: Flight Manual"

http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2835.msg43563#msg43563

Aside from providing general dates of milestones for a host of VFs, it also provides an exceedingly rare bit of info on the VF-2, 3 and 5!

... continuing the discussion on the VF-17: given that the bar is still very dark at 2040 (when the chronology stops), implications are that the VF-17 continued to be mass produced.

For how long and in what quantity? Unknown. But if approximately 700 are produced in the 2.5 years since production begins, and if production continues for another couple of years... it's not much of a jump to say something in the order of 1,400 to 2,100 were produced. (Though, I feel these are rather high estimates, as implications are that the VF-17, 19 and 22 have high cost-operation ratios...)

[Graham]

Yes, and Macross Chronicle repeats the information.

That said, one nagging question the publications don't clear up is: is that only the total number produced AS OF the events of Macross Plus? The article does vaguely state that the VF-17T model is continuing to be produced (it's not clear if that's only during the development from the VF-17A through to the VF-17D, or above and beyond that).

The other angle to consider is official produced (basically during the production run), and produced afterwards. An example of this is the VF-1X++ produced in 2047: they're not counted.

Of course, it's implied that the VF-17 has a high or extremely high operating cost, and beyond special forces, it's not worth procuring more than the 4 that Macross 7 implies are standard for emigrant fleets and planets (that's 2x D model, 1x S model, 1x T model (later converted to the VF-17T Kai).

Fuzzy math gives us approximately a deployment of 175 different places (if each place receives 4 fighters, total).

I'd say that the Macross 7 fleet (and other fleets) must have likely had more than 4 x VF-17. These extras would be needed to cover conversion training from VF-11C to VF-17, spare VF-17s if some are down for maintenance and also attrition replacements for those VF-17s lost in accidents or combat.

Even though the Macross 7 fleet likely has the ability to build replacements VF-17s to cover combat losses, that would take time, so at least a small quantity of spare VF-17s would likley be held in reserve.

We start the Macross 7 series seeing 2 x VF-17D and 1 x VF-17S. Physica takes over Dockers VF-17D after Docker is incapacitated, but then Physica's VF-17D is later destroyed. So there must have been at least 1 spare VF-17D held in reserve.

Milia pilots a VF-17S in episode 21, which is painted red, but it is unclear if this is Kinryu's old VF-17S or another spare VF-17S.

So I'd say that the Macross 7 fleet probably had 1 x VF-17S and 2 x VF-17D on active duty, probably a similar quantity held in reserve (or at least 1 x VF-17S and 1 x VF-17D) and a VF-17T for training duty to convert a cadre of the best VF-11C pilots as reserve/replacement pilots for Diamond force to replace casualties.

I personally doubt the the VF-17T trainer was converted and given to Sound Force. More likely the VF-17TKai was purpose-built for Sound Force (please let me know if any source material contradicts this).

Graham

[TehPW]

Erm... you do realize that "This is Animation Special: Macross Plus" was published in 1995, right?

PS, Sketch hasn't been active in this thread...

bruhahahahahhahahahaha and my plot device to BRING you here was successful

[sketchley]

This is Animation Macross Plus - Variable Fighters Aero Report: Variable Fighter Squadron Marking

http://www.macrossro...g37811#msg37811

Little bit too tired to go back and proof read it at the moment... speaking of proofreading, there are a couple of errors in the book (man, this TiA book has a lot of them!). My favourite was 'gun pot'. Another one - one that I'm not 100% certain is an error - is referring to a part of an aircraft's wings as 'the cranial border'! (Translated that one as leading edge...)

Random observations:

I like how it rounds out the Macross universe a little bit more. The stuff about micronized Zentraadi pilots disliking Regaado in targeting sights on their VFs is fun. Nevertheless, some parts have to be taken with a grain of salt. Even though the stuff on the VA-3 strongly implies that those squadrons were flying the VA-3 during SWI, I think it's a safe bet to say that they were flying VF-1, in the VA role during that war.

The SDF-6 that gets mentioned has most likely been retconned to the SDFM-6 (or SDFM-4, as the SDF-1 and 2... exist... :confused: )

Also, despite the book not directly stating it, I'm fairly certain that the VT-25 VF-17 colours are one and the same as the VF-17 that can be seen in the Macross Plus movie.

Oh... Graham, I found the stuff on the VF-17 squadrons interesting. I hope you do, too.

Edited February 16, 2012 by sketchley

[Talos]

Also, despite the book not directly stating it, I'm fairly certain that the VT-25 VF-17 colours are one and the same as the VF-17 that can be seen in the Macross Plus movie.

Yes, they are. You can even see the tail markings. The VF-17Ts aren't the only 17s in the movie though, there are a few single-seaters in the color scheme we see in 7 there too.

http://www.macross2....smovie-vf17.png

Edited February 18, 2012 by Talos

[TehPW]

is that entry 'VF-3: SVA-155' is that a error? i can imagine they meant VA-3 (though presuming they are using USN Side numbers, the use of 603 is confusing since 600-609 is used for E-2C birds in a typical real world CAG). I think these guys are tossing numbers just to make the Macrossverse look cool, LOL...