Macross Translations, and more

[sketchley]

I've been waffling over posting this or not, but it's become clear that this resource of translated and organized material should be a little bit more visible for the Macross community.

http://sdfyodogawa.mywebcommunity.org/

Macross Translations
All translations that I've made available on the internet are indexed under the Translations header. They are kept up-to-date as I add new translations to the web. The easiest way to check for new content is to refer to the revision date in the upper-left corner.

Reviews
Slowly growing. Check back for updates!

Translation Tools
Recommended, useful and accurate. Some require minimal Japanese knowledge to use. Sadly, some of the better ones have disappeared from the net.

Sketchley Stats sister site: http://sdfyodogawa.mywebcommunity.org/Stats/index.php

Note: if content is in green, it is canon. If it's not in green, it's based on educated speculation.

Sketchley Statistics:

All the equipment found in Macross that I know of.

RPG stats are for the Palladium game engine. I've created the stats as:
a) canon accurate (even if it's game unbalancing)
b) game balanced & consistent with each other (therefore, they should be convertible to other game systems)
Discussion on the stats is here: http://nomansland.site.nfoservers.com/MRG-Active-Archive/forums/index.php

Locations

Even though some things are guesses, it includes all of the canon location information I've come across. (Any assistance on locations that are missing would be appreciated!)


Note to moderators: I've been waffling over posting this in this forum, or the Homepages forum. I opted for this section because of the canon Macross information in the translations section, as well as having the intent of posting future translations not worthy of their own topic herein. Thanks.

Edited September 7, 2018 by sketchley

[sketchley]

Question for y'all:

So far, I've been translating 統合軍 as UN Forces (consistant with the logo's emblazed on craft seen in-unvirse). However, due to fan confusion on UN = United Nations (when it doesn't) and the actual appearance of UN (= United Nations) in some M0 content, I've been struggling to come up with a better term to use.

So far, I think:

統合政府 = Unified Government is the best. However, I don't like what becomes of 統合軍 = Unified Forces (as there's a different conotation).

I personally dislike "Unity Government", as there's the nuance of trying to get others to join. Unification Government also has similar nuances.

What are your thoughts?

EDIT: of course there's always UNified Forces.

But that looks like a typo...

[frothymug]

I can take a shot at possibly helping you come up with a term. From my point of view, I think you should try using a thesaurus for synonyms for the terms you're trying to use. I'm guessing you're trying to keep the "UN" acronym, so that restricts the number of synonyms you can consider.

However, you can play with some combinations like you've already listed. You're looking for a term that's all-inclusive to (initially) the nations of Earth, and (later on) the unification of Zentraedi and Humanity as one force. The term "Universal" comes to mind for the "U". As far as "N" goes, there's not much wiggle room. "Nations", "Nationalities", etc... can be alternatives, but even I don't like those.

I think what ultimately needs to be considered is that the organization started out as the United Nations and the term was used for many decades following the events of the Unification Wars and Space War I. No attempt to reorganize was made until the formation of the New UN to decentralize the power and allow colonies and colony ships to govern themselves with the loose association of the New UN binding them all together.

Obviously, I have no knowledge of Japanese language and culture, so I don't know if certain terms could be accurately translated into English and keep the same acronym. It could just be an idiom, or we're missing the true meaning that only Shoji Kawamori knows of.

Just my $0.02.

[sketchley]

Obviously, I have no knowledge of Japanese language and culture, so I don't know if certain terms could be accurately translated into English and keep the same acronym. It could just be an idiom, or we're missing the true meaning that only Shoji Kawamori knows of.

See first definition here: http://linear.mv.com/cgi-bin/j-e/sjis/dosearch?sDict=on&H=PS&L=J&T=%93%9D%8D%87&WC=none

Hmmm...

Integrated Government. Integrated Forces. Integrated Space Force.

Unified Government. Unified Forces. Unified Space Force

Union Government. Union Forces. Union Space Force.

Merged Government. Merged Forces. Merged Space Force.

Common Government. Common Forces. Common Space Force (meaning starting to get distorted here)

Hmmm...

Ps, you've gotta check your terminology. There's a lot of innaccurate translations on the fan subs:

- Unification Wars: outcome of this discussion will result in the correct term for the war (singular, not plural): 統合戦争.

- New UN: same as previous, though it's usually rendered as New (??) Government: 新統合政府 or New (??) Forces: 新統合軍.

- colonies: emigrant/immigrant planets:　移民惑星.

- colony ships: emigrant/immigrant ships. Technically, emigrant/immigrant fleets is most correct: 移民船/移民船団.

Edited August 4, 2010 by sketchley

[frothymug]

Bah! Details! I was close enough and you know what I meant!

I tend to appreciate the term "United" more than anything. It is, after all, part of the name of my country, so it has extra-special meaning to it. As far as the other conglomerating term goes, some sort of "federation" type of term would be pretty accurate to the meaning.

Excessive attention to and dedication to the preservation of hyper-accurate translations of Macross-related materials is hereby dubbed "Sketchleyitis".

We all appreciate the lengths to which you go to provide us with translations of printed media and the such. I'm just giving you a hard time...

[sketchley]

Added a "Translations Glossary" under the Macross Translations Header.

There are a couple of other terms (currently) on it in addition to the one(s) posted earlier in this thread. There's at least one other term that I have to dig out my notes to get accurate (the correct name of the 117th fleet from MF).

Enjoy.

[Seto Kaiba]

Unified Government. Unified Forces. Unified Space Force

Just my two cents, but doesn't the Macross Compendium use the term "new Unity Government" to describe the reestablished U.N. Gov't? In that context, I would go with "Unified Forces/Military". I'd say, given the various examples of strife between some of the colonies and the Unity Government, and the later reformation of said government into more a loose coalition of states instead of a strong central authority justifies the nuances you're talking about.

Edited August 9, 2010 by Seto Kaiba

[sketchley]

Great Mechanics.DX 9 translation continues!

Completed the VF-25 section. Some interesting stuff, especially the hard numbers (not many, but enough to hope that the rest of the article has more). Dr. Chiba's section is the most interesting, IMHO, as it implies volumes about the state of the New Unified Government and it's satellites (emigrant fleets/planets).

Other random stuff: got the 5th postcard set from Macross Chronicle. One of these days I'll have to get around to posting pictures of them, and the 4th postcard set.

[cannon_fodder674]

why not just call it "The United Nations"? when you think about it, the Zentradi and Meltrandi were a nation in itself with their own set of principles, industry, and warrior culture upon their unification/integration with humankind right after the first stellar war. they just sort of joined UN as a new intergalactic member.

i say culture because, unbeknownst to the Zentradi, humanity actually does have a warrior culture in portions of the planet a few millenia ago, if not now. waging wars big or small just happens to be every man's favorite pastime since time immemorial.

[sketchley]

why not just call it "The United Nations"?

Please read http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=33597&view=findpost&p=864968 more carefully before replying.

Or to put it uber clear: 国連 does not equal 統合政府.

Anyhow, completed the Dr. Chiba/Magazine staff comments for the VF-0 section (re: Great Mechanics.DX 9)

Edited September 5, 2010 by sketchley

[HannouHeiki]

So your main concern with:

Unified Government. Unified Forces. Unified Space Force

is that some fans would think UN still means United Nations?

I think any UN logo may have the same connotation on both sides of the Pacific...

Anyway, I like Unified.

[cannon_fodder674]

the planet-wide government that resulted from the unification wars was a direct transformation from its previous entity known as U.N. . throughout the original tv series, the words "UN + (insert military affiliation)" always appear at every opportunity. whether or not kawamori and his team intended the "U.N." has having retained its official designation despite the unification, its safe to say then that the government that emerged from the unification wars was definitely THE united nations. the strict adherence to the literal meaning of the japanese characters would only render it vague and absurd.

peace.

Edited September 5, 2010 by cannon_fodder674

[sketchley]

Funny how you guys are still trying to debate something that was already decided a month ago.

[azrael]

Funny how you guys are still trying to debate something that was already decided a month ago.

We have people who run on Island time...

[sketchley]

Anyhow...

Finished the Dr. Chiba and Magazine staff comments on the VF-1 (re: Great Mechanics.DX 9)

[HannouHeiki]

Funny how you guys are still trying to debate something that was already decided a month ago.

oh well, at least it keeps the topic top posted.

[cannon_fodder674]

sorry, but that's the way i see it. UN = government post unification wars, post SW 1 till present macross timeline. you don't buy it, well whatever. id rather call a spade a spade.

Edited September 7, 2010 by cannon_fodder674

[sketchley]

Can you clarify what your opinion is based on? Is it your own personal understanding of Japanese (ie your own translations)? Or third party translations of dubious veracity? (Ie fan subs that wrongly refer to Super Long Range Emigration Fleets as "colonization fleets")

[HannouHeiki]

sorry, but that's the way i see it. UN = government post unification wars, post SW 1 till present macross timeline. you don't buy it, well whatever. id rather call a spade a spade.

The issue is the japanese wording/speech is not "United Nations." The word used is translated as unified, unity, integrated. Sketchley has been using "UN" to match up with logos that we've seen in the show.

国連 = United Nations (the real one)

Macross uses:

統合政府 = Unifed/Integrated Government (but we see UN logos)

So, in Japanese, it is not called "United Nations," even though they may have UN logos or have it romanized as "UN Forces."

Also, 国連 (real UN) appears in Macross Zero. We can't call 国連 and 統合政府 both United Nations because the anime refers to pre and post war governments with different words.

Anyway...I don't want this topic to get hijacked. Sketchley, thank you very much for creating that gateway. I've already taken advantage to it; those without the time or Japanese skills have another thing to help us keep connected to all things Macross.

[frothymug]

I was always under the impression that the UN government was destroyed when the Zentraedi fleet bombarded the earth. The NEW UN government was formed after Space War I, but was still known as the UN government. It wasn't referred to as the New UN (New UN Spacy, or NUNS) until the reorganization of the Earth/Zentraedi government sometime between the events of Seven and Frontier.

Basically, the United Nations as we know it in real life was in the Macross universe prior to the Zentraedi invasion. It ceased existence at the end of the Space War and a new governmental body was formed. This is what we're talking about here.

Does that help at all, or am I still somewhat incorrect in my explanation?

[HannouHeiki]

The Unified Government is the government in charge since Episode 1 of SDF Macross. The space military arm of the Unified Government is the UN Spacy.

I believe post SW1 episodes, SDF Macross 28 and onwards, they would say that there was a "new Unifed Government," but in Macross 7 and Macross Plus they used the original UN Spacy logo. In otherwords, it was "new" in the sense that it is a recreation of the same entity, the Unified Government and UN Spacy.

It was not until Frontier that we see the NUNS (New UN Spacy) logo. I take this as the formation of a brand new entity that was formed sometime after Macross 7.

[Seto Kaiba]

Does that help at all, or am I still somewhat incorrect in my explanation?

Eh... really, OptimusX has it right, more or less.

In practice, it seems that there have been three distinct entities bearing some permutation of the moniker "U.N. Government". Obviously, the first of these is the original U.N. Government that was drafted in 2000 and became reality in January 2001. It was this incarnation of the Earth U.N. Gov't that established the U.N. Forces and their space division... the U.N. Spacy. After the war ended, the old U.N. Government and its constituency were mostly dead, so the survivors established the little-n "new U.N. Government". One would assume, given the state that Earth's population was in and the what Kawamori had to say in the Otona Anime #9 interview, that it was more or less a re-establishment of the old U.N. Government system they'd had before... something roughly analogous to a strong central planetary (and later, interplanetary) government. In later years, humanity had spread out so far in the galaxy that it became impossible for the little-n "new U.N. Government" to unify its constituents, and it began to change into the big-n "New U.N. Government"... something more along the lines of the EU.

Prior to that interview, it was generally assumed that the formation of the big-n New U.N. Government and the subsequent reorganization of the military stemmed from Wilbur Garland's 2051 coup attempt in Macross VF-X2. Now, it seems that's no longer the case... though it was probably a factor.

[HannouHeiki]

.

Basically, the United Nations as we know it in real life was in the Macross universe prior to the Zentraedi invasion. It ceased existence at the end of the Space War and a new governmental body was formed.

The United Nations was replaced by the Unified Government in 2001. So the United Nations as we know it ceased before the start of SDF Macross episode 1. The Unified Government was replaced by NUN after Macross 7.

Edited September 8, 2010 by OptimusX

[Seto Kaiba]

The United Nations was replaced by the Unified Government in 2001. So the United Nations as we know it ceased before the start of SDF Macross episode 1. The Unified Government was replaced by NUN after Macross 7.

Eh... dragging the real United Nations into it makes it rather more complicated than it needs to be. At some point or other all the "unified" government are all referred to as some permutation on "U.N. Gov't". It's also probably a bad (and misleading) idea to treat the pre-Space War 1 U.N. Government as being the same entity as the post-Space War 1 "new U.N. Government". Using inconsistent naming conventions isn't going to help either. A less confusing and more explicit progression would go something like this:

United Nations (1945 - 2001) - The real-world international organization.

U.N. Government (2001 - 11 Feb 2010) - The planetary central government established as a result of the 1999 crash of an alien ship on South Ataria island.

new U.N. Government (April 2010 - ~2051) - The re-established planetary central government after Space War 1.

New U.N. Government (~2051 - Current) - The decentralized E.U.-style interplanetary governing body present in Macross Frontier.

If you really have a hard-on for using "Unity" or "Unified" instead of "U.N." that's fine too... but be consistent, or it can get a lot more confusing than it needs to be.

[RedWolf]

Was it 2051 or 2048?

2050-2051 is to the events Macross VF-X2.

[sketchley]

If you really have a hard-on for using "Unity" or "Unified" instead of "U.N." that's fine too... but be consistent, or it can get a lot more confusing than it needs to be.

First of all, in the post you're quoting, he's correct amd was consistent.

Second of all, in this thread, Unified Government is used, as "U.N. Government" is a) confusing (too similar to the RW UN, which should actually be written as U.N.), b) not how it appears in the animation.

Third of all, no one is forcing you or anyone else to use the more correct terminology; outside of this thread and in reference to my translations, that is. That said, not using the more correct terminology is the same as relying on bad translations, and in the end, breeds confusion and passes along wrong information.

Lastly: the animation may have "UN <insert noun>", but that doesn't mean it's correct. As we all know, animation is notorious for bad English. Case in point: Spacy. You know, animation errors, et al.

Anyhow, corrected list:

United Nations (1945 - 2001) - The real-world international organization.

Unified Government (2001 - 11 Feb 2010) - The planetary government established as a result of the 1999 crash of an alien ship on South Ataria island.

new Unified Government / Unified Government* (April 2010 - ~2051) - The planetary central government after Space War 1.

New Unified Government (~205X - Current) - The decentralized government body in Macross Frontier.**

* the addition of the adjective, new, is inconsistant at best. In fact, the majority of the publications dealing with the M7 and onwards part of the Macross timeline don't have the adjective when refering to it.

** I'm still in the midst of assembling information on what exactly it is. Therefore, it's best to err on the side of caution, and not describe it with limiting detail that may or may not be correct.

Lastly: please move the discussion to a new thread, thank you.

Edited September 8, 2010 by sketchley

[Seto Kaiba]

Second of all, in this thread, Unified Government is used, as "U.N. Government" is a) confusing (too similar to the RW UN, which should actually be written as U.N.), b) not how it appears in the animation.

[...]

Lastly: the animation may have "UN <insert noun>", but that doesn't mean it's correct. As we all know, animation is notorious for bad English. Case in point: Spacy. You know, animation errors, et al.

Eh... by any rational measure, that the animation has consistently abbreviated it as "UN <Noun>" over the past twenty-plus years seems like a pretty fair indication that it is correct... or at least what the show's creators had intended, which is effectively the same thing. If the animation consistently uses "UN", I don't see any reason to second-guess the show's creators. Unity/Unified is used too... but all that's really necessary there is a note that "UN" is short-form for "Unified" or "Unity", whichever you happen to favor.

Using "UN" is what most of the fanbase is familiar with... so, as we've just graphically demonstrated, going with "Unified" or "Unity" without explanation is going to inject additional confusion into something that already causes some degree of confusion on its own. Really, what this calls for, if anything, is a bloody footnote.

Edited September 8, 2010 by Seto Kaiba

[sketchley]

Island time?

See post #6.

[sketchley]

re: Great Mechanics.DX 9

Finished the VF-27 Lucifer section.

[sketchley]

Started translation of: Great Mechanics.DX 8: Reinvestigating the History of the Macross World: 0 to F

http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2634.msg40732#msg40732

So far, it's just the first two pages. But, man oh man, what a killer Macross Chronology! (By this I mean lots of small point text >.< )

[sketchley]

Same publication as last post. Finished next two pages: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2634.msg40762#msg40762

[sketchley]

At the end of November, I did a bit more translation of the article in GM.DX #8. It got shoved to the side and has only been updated now.

See: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2634.msg40762#msg40762

From: "Regeneration of the Earth"

[sketchley]

Completed the sections of the GM.DX #8 article that I wanted to completed: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/forums/index.php?topic=2634.msg40762#msg40762

Some eyebrow raising stuff. Interesting insight on a bunch of stuff in the backstory of Macross F.

[nexxstrait]

Completed the sections of the GM.DX #8 article that I wanted to completed: http://www.macrossro...g40762#msg40762

Some eyebrow raising stuff. Interesting insight on a bunch of stuff in the backstory of Macross F.

Cool!

Knowing how hard and time consuming can be translating, I really appreciate all your efforts (as I'm sure everyone else does). Your work is an invaluable Macross resource.

My deepest thanks.

[sketchley]

Thank you. Appreciation is always appreciated.

I've reorganized the Macross Chronicles translations page somewhat: http://www.macrossroleplay.org/Sketchley/portal/Chronicles.htm

It's a bit easier to navigate now. One of these days, I'll have to get around to adding all the pages, not just the ones that I/others have translated and are interested in translating. One of these days...