Limited Exclusives

[ff95gj]

Video games satify some of my thrist for the anime, but only last for a very short time. Once I complete the game I don't feel like to pick it up again.

Toys, last for years until the next version come out... Or maybe forever.

[Graham]

Usually, I'm the same with games - complete and then never touch again, but I've found myself going back to MUF again and again, when I feel the need to fly or fight in a Valk. Definitely a game with hidden depths.

Also, now I'm in my early 40s', I'm starting to question my need for toys, especially the larger high-end ones.

I've got so many of the things, that my house is overflowing with them and even my private storage is nearly full.

And for what? Each one I buy, I transform for a few times, then it goes onto a shelf on in a display cabinet to gather dust and maybe be touched once in a blue moon, to be zoomed around for a few minutes before being but back on display, or worse being packed away in storage.

Perhaps just a year or so ago, such thoughts would have been blasphemy to me, but as much as I still love Macross, I'm starting to think why have I spent all this money on things that while nice to look at, hardly get touched/used?

Mid-life crisis?

Not saying I'm giving up on toys completely, but may stick to smaller/cheaper veriosn from now on, such as selected 1/100 Hi-Metal and the 1/250 scale Macross Fighter Collection.

Graham

[m0n5t3r]

overflowing??? send them to me!

[ff95gj]

I think I understand how you feel, Graham. Because I have a small home, I reflect about it after only 2 years of toy-collecting.

I also find it easier to justify purchases for small items too, so I am into Robot Spirit and SHFs.

But I don't ask "for what" in buying toys, because they still give me the joy and satisfaction - I think that's what toys are meant for people.

I think the next thing to learn is to let go older ones, if you plan to buy new ones - which I am still learning for my toy collection. I used to be a video game collector, but these days I sell them and free up spaces for toys (and my baby). I miss my old video game collection a bit, but I am glad they can fulfill their destiny once again instead of sitting in the closet forever.

[m0n5t3r]

@ff95gj - congrats, man.

Graham did say it could be a midlife crisis thing... maybe in a few years it'll happen to us too!

Edited May 25, 2010 by m0n5t3r

[bluemax151]

I certainly believe their is some truth to the claim that videogames are replacing tactile/physical toys. Kids even barely go outside these days in my experience. Too busy with social networking and videogames to bother I bet

From what I see marketed and what people have posted I'm under the impression LARGE high quality toys in Asia are kind of on the out (mostly because of the size previously now somewhat do to cost in this economy?). Maybe someone who lives in some of these areas can comment with their personal experience?

I could see how these could be among the contributing factors to the birth and increase of exclusives especially the web variety.

Another thing I've always been curious of is the various brick and mortar retail models followed in Asia. Are high end toys/models more of a specialty shop deal or more main stream and Wal-Marty?

[Graham]

Getting back to the topic of web-exclusives, I think this is an inevitable evil that we are going to have to learn to live with and which will become even more common in the near future.

As our already niche hobby becomes even more niche (niche-er?), due to the shrinking fan base and other reasons Renato stated in his original post, I think web-exclusives are going to be the only way that small-to-medium size toy manufacturers such as Yamato and even giants like Bandai can justify releasing anything other than the main hero mecha for a franchise such as Macross.

It’s all well and good a toy company wanting to producing a 1/60 toy of ‘Enemy X’ and an accessory set of ‘Weapons Pack Z’, but if the wholesalers, distributors, and retail stores don’t want to carry them, or don’t want to carry enough, then what’s the toy company supposed to do sit on the stock? Dump it at a loss?

As much as we may hate them, web-exclusives do allow a toy manufacturer to manufacturer smaller production runs of niche products. As stated by others, the greater mark-up made by cutting out the middle-man allows the company to cover the greater costs of the smaller production run and by taking orders in advance, the toy companies know exactly how many to make, without the risk of ending up with dead stock.

Graham

[Renato]

Are high end toys/models more of a specialty shop deal or more main stream and Wal-Marty?

From what I can tell, that is very much the case. One cannot walk into the toy section of some department store and buy a Yamato valk. The retail outlets are extremely limited, you have to go to a model kit/hobby store, and even those are becoming rarer than ever these days, outside of areas like Akihabara.

Specialty stores are closing everywhere. When I lived in Tokyo nine years ago I could just go over to Kichijoji without travelling all the way into the city and I would have several shops to compare Valk prices. They are all gone (though there is a Yodobashi Camera there now). Even just going into Shinjuku you had a Mandarake, Sakuraya and several garage kit shops to choose from. Again, all gone (again, you do have Yodobashi, though).

Literally, outside of Akihabara, Nakano and that one Mandarake in Shibuya, I don't know any physical shop in Tokyo where you could get a Yamato valk today. C'est le Suckage.

[ff95gj]

I live in Hong Kong. These days, a good toy may only be available for a month or so and disappears from the market.. Sometimes sooner than that. Shops are just not stocking up anymore. There are so many new toys releasing every month, that they don't have to worry what to sell tomorrow.

It becomes easier to justify purchases because if I don't buy it today, it would be gone next week or price shot up for 20%.

[Graham]

I still get enjoyment from looking at my toys as well as occasionally handling them, but more and more I'm wondering does that really justify the high price tag of these things, especially when there are so many other demands on my hard-earned money these days, such as the mortage, my kid's school fees, the next family holiday, house renovation etc, etc.

Graham

[Graham]

Another thing I've always been curious of is the various brick and mortar retail models followed in Asia. Are high end toys/models more of a specialty shop deal or more main stream and Wal-Marty?

High end toys/models are defintely the province of specialty hobby shops here in Hong Kong. Thankfully there are still quite a few of these in areas like Wanchai, Mong Kok and Causeway Bay.

Although, as ff95gj mentioned, most shops only hold limited stock due to their small physical size. So products do tend to sell out pretty quickly and it's often a case of 'if you snooze, you lose'.

Graham

[ff95gj]

I still get enjoyment from looking at my toys as well as occasionally handling them, but more and more I'm wondering does that really justify the high price tag of these things, especially when there are so many other demands on my hard-earned money these days, such as the mortage, my kid's school fees, the next family holiday, house renovation etc, etc.

Graham

I agree that the first priority should be on family too. But I believe Graham make enough money that his toy fund doesn't eat into his family fund! A bit of his saving, maybe.

Justifying the high price, that is another issue. Sometimes I wonder why I pay so much for a particular toy too.

Thus far Macross toys are on the reasonable side. I wish to use an example of Bandai's SHF and SOC.

I got these two items in the same week:

SoC Ideon, over 30cm, or 40cm I think, with a good amount of diecast; the battroid is combined by 3 fighters. The 3 fighters, in turn can be transformed into 2 modes. A lot of accessories including a huge Ideon cannon and the Ideon Swords. Also the space monsters, etc. It cost me around US$109.

SHF New Den-O Strike Form, around 13cm. Posable figure. Accessories: swappable hands and a sword. It cost me around US$126.

It may not be fair as the New Den-O SHF is one of its kind in the line. But less extreme cases exist in a lot of places, such as the Hi-Metal VF-19 and 1/60 Yamato VF-1J.

[sketchley]

As much as we may hate them, web-exclusives do allow a toy manufacturer to manufacturer smaller production runs of niche products. As stated by others, the greater mark-up made by cutting out the middle-man allows the company to cover the greater costs of the smaller production run and by taking orders in advance, the toy companies know exactly how many to make, without the risk of ending up with dead stock.

This is a very good point. Especially because of the echoes of Atari, and the video game crash of '83: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_crash_of_1983#High-profile_disasters

[Actar]

Just chiming in on why I spend money on pieces of pretty plastic. Many figure collectors base their collections on a figure’s details, sculpt, paintjob and overall appeal. However, my passion for figure collecting stems from my love of Anime, and the intriguing stories and memorable characters that Anime offers.

A figure is meant to be a real physical representation of a 2D character and it is supposed to capture the character’s essence. When I acquire a figure of a character I like, I can appreciate the significance of the figure more. I also collect to show my support for a particular series that I like.

As for mecha, I would suppose that like many of the 'newer generation' of otakus, I don't appreciate the actual design nuances of mecha, but am instead more concerned with the role of the mecha in the story and their pilots.

[Roy Focker]

About Exclusive and High Prices. These Toys are already on the pricy side. Provided that a buyer has a job, isn't in debt and doesn't have kids they are likely able to buy one a month without worrying about their pocket book. When it goes to Exclusive Prices you really have to decide do I really need this toy? I look at my display worthy Toy collection. It contains stuff from several Toylines. If I want $400 Regult I'll need to decide what two Toyline I wanna stop collecting. Then again I haven't brought a new video game in months. For $400 I can buy several and then I've always wanted to try getting some of those Hot Toy Man dolls. I thought those were too pricey but I can get 2 for $400 instead just one Macross Toy. Its not like there is any really special about these exclusive. Kawamori doesn't deliver them in person, shows me how to transform it and we share pizza together. It is just the same crappy toy that someone says "it's special."

[VF5SS]

It is just the same crappy toy that someone says "it's special."

I don't think you understand logistics and manufacturing.

[bluemax151]

Roy's example isn't specific so it's entirely possible it is basically the same figure(repaint/additional or different accessory/different box/etc). Sometimes you're really just paying for the exclusivity.

If I'm buying say the Tamashii exclusive Regnant that's a different story.

[anime52k8]

Roy's example isn't specific so it's entirely possible it is basically the same figure(repaint/additional or different accessory/different box/etc). Sometimes you're really just paying for the exclusivity.

If I'm buying say the Tamashii exclusive Regnant that's a different story.

I think he's being quite specific actually.

[bluemax151]

I think he's being quite specific actually.

Its not like there is any really special about these exclusive.

I dunno maybe that's just a typo I interpreted differently. I figured he meant these exclusives and not this exclusive. I'm going to stick with I think he's not but he's certainly welcome to clarify.

[DARKWIND]

From what I can tell, that is very much the case. One cannot walk into the toy section of some department store and buy a Yamato valk. The retail outlets are extremely limited, you have to go to a model kit/hobby store, and even those are becoming rarer than ever these days, outside of areas like Akihabara.

Specialty stores are closing everywhere. When I lived in Tokyo nine years ago I could just go over to Kichijoji without travelling all the way into the city and I would have several shops to compare Valk prices. They are all gone (though there is a Yodobashi Camera there now). Even just going into Shinjuku you had a Mandarake, Sakuraya and several garage kit shops to choose from. Again, all gone (again, you do have Yodobashi, though).

Literally, outside of Akihabara, Nakano and that one Mandarake in Shibuya, I don't know any physical shop in Tokyo where you could get a Yamato valk today. C'est le Suckage.

Man that sucks big time, when I lived in Japan, you go over to Toys R Us and pick them up easy.

Hell there were at least two or three small specialty shops in Yokosuka, and about 10 to 15 I would go to in Yokohama.

To think that they might be gone is kind of depressing.

[Uxi]

That's an extremely interesting observation.

I've had a similar thought regarding mecha games and their relationship to mecha toys while playing MAF/MUF.

It struck me one day while playing MUF, that games like MAF/MUF are not just mecha games, but in effect give us virtual toys of our favorite mecha, but at a far lower cost in terms of both money and storage space.

In MUF for example, we can have nearly every single VF from every Macross anime, that we can fly, fight with, view from different angles, customize the color schemes etc., in a far more realistic manner than simply holding the physical toy in our hand and zooming it around.

At 196 hours on MAF and currently 224 hours on MUF, I'm spending far more time with these virtual Valks than I have been with my physical toys and I have noticed my desire to buy new toys does seem to be reduced, (although to be fair there may be other contributing factors to this as well).

Something to think about though.

I could be sated if... and it's a big IF... there was a PS3 version to use other than just low-rez PSP.

I dream of MUF remastered in HD like the God of War collection.

[Fortress_Maximus]

Generally do not care for the mail away or exclusives unless they really look amazing! Personally find it very hard to justify buying anything more expensive than a regular 1/60 valk anymore in this hobby with the rare exception of original artwork and production cels. I do see the future direction for many toy companies heading towards limited editions and mail away. As others stated the companies do need to find ways to reward local customers and to entice them to buy more in the hopes they can obtain a limited release. As for myself, will I buy any? Highly unlikely, which I think is a good thing b/c it saves me monies and gives others a better chance too.

[Funkenstein]

I got a good feeling that 3rd party webshops will be able to sell web exclusives for export. HLJ is already doing that with some of Yamato's stuff, its only eventual that the major toy makers make deals with the export shops.

[Lott Sheen]

Literally, outside of Akihabara, Nakano and that one Mandarake in Shibuya, I don't know any physical shop in Tokyo where you could get a Yamato valk today. C'est le Suckage.

Most department stores in Tokyo and Japan have hobby shops within them and definately a selection of Yamatos aswell.

On video games vs physical toys, I cant see how one can replace the other. I will always prefer physical things on my shelf, DVDs, CDs, books, toys, I`m just not of the generation that is apparantly satisfied with digital versions of everything all on their PC. Sure it saves space and money but wheres the love for that out of print CD, comic book back issue or rare video game? Holding something `real` in my hands is more nostalgic and satisfying than executing a file will ever be. Same as with girls

Edited May 31, 2010 by Lott Sheen

[DARKWIND]

Most department stores in Tokyo and Japan have hobby shops within them and definately a selection of Yamatos aswell.

On video games vs physical toys, I cant see how one can replace the other. I will always prefer physical things on my shelf, DVDs, CDs, books, toys, I`m just not of the generation that is apparantly satisfied with digital versions of everything all on their PC. Sure it saves space and money but wheres the love for that out of print CD, comic book back issue or rare video game? Holding something `real` in my hands is more nostalgic and satisfying than executing a file will ever be. Same as with girls

And on that note i'd love to get a copy "Weird Science" (J/K)

[Cent]

On video games vs physical toys, I cant see how one can replace the other. I will always prefer physical things on my shelf, DVDs, CDs, books, toys, I`m just not of the generation that is apparantly satisfied with digital versions of everything all on their PC. Sure it saves space and money but wheres the love for that out of print CD, comic book back issue or rare video game? Holding something `real` in my hands is more nostalgic and satisfying than executing a file will ever be. Same as with girls

Have to agree, I really prefer keeping boxes and manuals. Sure they took up space, but they were cool to look at, even if I wasn't playing with whatever came in them. It also meant that the producers spent time and effort making the extras meaningful and charming. Now, games are expected to be distributed digitally, and you'll rarely even find a manual, but either just a CD or a URL . Such a shame. I miss when my games came with a full flat spine manual that was more of a lorebook than a game guide. That was immersion.

[bluemax151]

On video games vs physical toys, I cant see how one can replace the other. I will always prefer physical things on my shelf, DVDs, CDs, books, toys, I`m just not of the generation that is apparantly satisfied with digital versions of everything all on their PC. Sure it saves space and money but wheres the love for that out of print CD, comic book back issue or rare video game? Holding something `real` in my hands is more nostalgic and satisfying than executing a file will ever be.

Just from my own personal experience with my brother who is about 10 years my junior there seems to be a trend moving towards the digital. He never really was big on actual toys/action figures/etc and now that videogames are moving towards digital distribution he definitely is more welcoming to the idea than I am. Maybe I'm just the proverbial dinosaur but I'm more than a little hesitant to spend money on something I never physically own. Semantics aside about software being licensed and not owned.

It may be a bad analogy but brick and mortar in general is going the same way in my observation. Only in this instance I'm hesitant to purchase something I've never seen in person.

I'm kind of rambling now..

[Graham]

At 40, I'm probably a few years old than many on this forum. I've never warmed to the idea of downloads, prefering instead to go out and buy something physical that I can hold with my hands, be it a book, toy, DVD, music CD, game disk etc.

Heck, I'm not even really keen on online shopping, instead prefering to travel to a bricks and mortar store to buy a book, toy, DVD etc. The only time I shop online is when it's something I can't easily or cheaply buy here in HK (usually English language books).

The main reason, I'm starting to warm up to "only digital", is I guess mostly due to lack of space in my 'shoe box' size Hong Kong apartment. Heck, if I lived in a typical American sized house (which is a mansion compared to most HK residences, I'd probably never stop toy collecting (finances allowing of course).

Graham

[EXO]

I prefer digital downloads to actually buying media. It's instant, it's neater... I guess the only thing I would spend any money on that takes up space is necessities, electronics and Macross toys.

[Graham]

While proably not hurting the Japanese market in any way, I wonder how much this trend of online exclusives is going reduce spending by MW members living outside of Japan on Macross goods?

I know it is definitely going to mean I will be buying less.

A lot of my purchases are impulse buys. before the product is released, I always tell myself I'm not going to buy it, but more often than not when I walk past a toy or hobby store and see the shiny new VF sitting on the shelf, I'll cave in and buy.

With webshop exclusives being that

much harder to get and more expensive to buy, they are that much easier to resist.

Case in point, the Hi-Metal Sound Booster Pack for the VF-19Kai. I neither need it or want it, but if it was a general retail release, I'd no doubt end up buying it. As a web exclusive, I'll pass.

Graham

[General Chaos]

Exclusives will put a big dent in my collecting. I can't see myself jumping through many hoops and paying top dollar at the same time.

All I hope is any yet to be released 1/60's are available through general release. I will be very displeased if a VF-17 etc comes out as a limited exclusive.

[Bri]

Shipping and taxes make Valks already too expensive for impulse buying for me. I only buy the Valks now that I really want. As long as the web exclusives allow international shipping and an English order form it wont be a problem for me. If I were forced to eBay or would need intermediaries for every order then it would seriously affect my collecting habits.

[sketchley]

Just from my own personal experience with my brother who is about 10 years my junior there seems to be a trend moving towards the digital. He never really was big on actual toys/action figures/etc and now that videogames are moving towards digital distribution he definitely is more welcoming to the idea than I am. Maybe I'm just the proverbial dinosaur but I'm more than a little hesitant to spend money on something I never physically own. Semantics aside about software being licensed and not owned.

(...)

Interesting. I'm in the same boat, and reading the comment it reminded me of something that Bill Gates once said:

If you want something to be completely free of digital locks and copy protection and want the ability to transfer it to any player, buy the CD.

Without much reworking, it can be applied to more than just music.

[Renato]

I know what Graham means when he describes a round of MUF as essentially playing with 100 valk toys all at once. It's basically your own custom, virtual collection.

However, I also agree with the viewpoint that having tangible objects will always "feel" more comfortable when compared to digital data, whether it be a CD or a DVD or a valk.

I have so many MP3s and JPGs and DOCs of stuff that would normally be in CD/LP format, or in a photo album, or be a printout, but due to space, I keep it as data. As such, it is prone to accidental deletion or almost equally bad, loss. I know I have an MP3 of Casey Rankin's rare Christmas song somewhere in my files, but even if I start searching for it now I probably won't find it before New Year. I can't label every single file.

My books, CDs, records and DVDs are in order on shelves, and ever since I was a kid I've loved displaying them in cabinets, kind of like a library of cool. Even toy/model kit boxes. So when people walked into my room they'd be struck with a fistful of pop culture.

And that's what I used to feel when I used to walk into a toystore. The Volks store in Nipponbashi, Osaka still has the most amazing display which will make you want to impulse-buy truckfuls of Chogokins, but now it seems we're shifting to "see it in a magazine or online, place order, and then wait for it to come to your door". I understand that for most of the members here this is the way it has been for about a decade, but it's new to me.

Interesting turn this thread has taken.

[sketchley]

(...)

I have so many MP3s and JPGs and DOCs of stuff that would normally be in CD/LP format, or in a photo album, or be a printout, but due to space, I keep it as data. As such, it is prone to accidental deletion or almost equally bad, loss. (...)

This reminds me of an article I read on BBC news a couple days ago: CD/DVD lifespan is much shorter than thought. Something on the order of 2 to 4 years.

Here's the article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/click_online/8711747.stm