Bandai 1/100 VF-25

[Dobber]

yeah the hole sticker thing kinda sucks....doesn't matter how thin, they still stick out.

Chris

[Lolicon]

So Bandai finally releases reasonably-priced, fighter mode-only Frontier kits... and they don't come with decals?

I don't know what to say to that.

[Chronocidal]

Pretty simple to me.. screw the stickers. Scan them into your computer, and reprint them on some decent decal film. Oh, you can even fix them up so they don't look like absolute crap from their idiot printing process.

As for me, I don't plan on using any SMS markings anyway, so it won't be an issue. I've got the 1/72 kits to leave in the canon schemes, so the 1/100 kits are where I bust out my spare decal box and have fun with customization.

[Lolicon]

You're a goddamn genius! I'll do precisely that.

Not interested in the canon schemes either.

[tetsujin]

So Bandai finally releases reasonably-priced, fighter mode-only Frontier kits... and they don't come with decals?

I don't know what to say to that.

I know what to say to that: "Goddamnit, Bandai, you suck!" I mean, Bandai makes some good stuff. They even make some great stuff. But this sort of thing is why I get pissed off at anybody who gets all teary-eyed fantasizing about how much better all those other mecha kits in the world would be if only Bandai would get the license

Scanning and printing decals works but it's not ideal (in particular, ink colors not matching the desired color of the markings. It results in either incorrect colors, like magenta-for-red, or halftoning... Professionally printed decals can use custom ink mixtures which can yield pretty much any color without halftoning... Though Bandai decals still have halftoning sometimes all the same...)

But the whole issue has made me look at my reliance upon decals. I mean, do I really need decals to put stripes on the fighter? Even angular/bent stripes like the ones on the VF-25? I should be able to mask and paint that stuff. Even an SMS logo shouldn't be unreasonable to do by hand. I think there are some markings that would be very difficult to do by hand but a lot of what's on the fighter doesn't fall into that category.

And I, too, want to do some custom schemes which does take the edge off the decal issue a bit...

[CF18]

Shizuoka Hobby Show display

Edited May 12, 2011 by CF18

[Zinjo]

Thin stickers like the ones Bandai provide with their regular Gundam kits.

Bandai needs to take a few pages from their Gundam lines and release or license decal sheets for these 1/100 scale fighters. Hasegawa has milked their limited Macross licenses very well over the years doing simply that.

Bandai could release VF-17 and VF-171 kits from common molds (except the nose), VF-27G and B versions, all the VF-25 versions, VF-4 versions, VF-2SS and VF-2J kits, Luca's ghost fighters, would also be the basis for the Galaxy ghost fighters, etc...

They are passing up a market that has never been fully exploited the unreleased Valkyries like the VF-4, VF-11C, etc... I would bet they are selling more 1/100 scale YF-29 and VF-25F kits than they ever sold VF100 or Hi-Metal toys. These snap together kits are cheaper to produce and infinitely more customizable than any of their other Macross kits.

Itashi decals are nice, but fans want squadron markings and generic decal sheets like the Gundam kits have. I'm sure many fans would love to be able to buy several VF-25A kits to accompany their VF-25 Alto, Ozma, Micheal and Luca customs. Then pit them against a squadron of VF-27B and G fighters from the Galaxy.

[Lolicon]

Hobby Search has pics of the upcoming Sheryl and Ranka marking versions. Not sure what to make of the Ranka version.

Decal softener doesn't work on Bandai's marking seals, does it?

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10146349

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10146350

[anime52k8]

Decal softener doesn't work on Bandai's marking seals, does it?

walthers solvaset works pretty well.

[Lolicon]

walthers solvaset works pretty well.

Thanks for the tip. I gave it a try but it didn't seem to have any effect on the marking seal. Does it take awhile to work or am I doing something wrong?

[Graham]

Bandai could release VF-17 and VF-171 kits from common molds (except the nose)

Arghhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!

Bangs head against wall.

No, No, No, they couldn't. Every single part of the VF-17 is different to the VF-171 (except the gunpod). You cannot use a common mold.

This irks me no end, the same as people who say you can make a YF-19 into a VF-19F/S/P/Kai just by repainting it and changing a few bits. NO YOU CAN'T they are almost 100% different.

Rant off.

Graham

[Renato]

Arghhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!

Bangs head against wall.

No, No, No, they couldn't. Every single part of the VF-17 is different to the VF-171 (except the gunpod). You cannot use a common mold.

This irks me no end, the same as people who say you can make a YF-19 into a VF-19F/S/P/Kai just by repainting it and changing a few bits. NO YOU CAN'T they are almost 100% different.

Rant off.

Graham

It's kind of funny that some people still overlook glaring differences like this, and others complain when there is a minuscule mistake somewhere, like getting the position of the legs wrong or something.

[anime52k8]

Thanks for the tip. I gave it a try but it didn't seem to have any effect on the marking seal. Does it take awhile to work or am I doing something wrong?

normally I just brush some over the whole decal once it's exactly where I want it, wait 10~15 seconds for it to soak in, wick away any excess liquid pooling on top of the decal with a tissue, then GENTLY start to work the decal into any surfaces it's not already hugging down to with a soft brush or q-tip or something.

Solvaset Works on bandai decals, but only about as well as Microsol does on most other brands of decal.

[Taylor_VFA122]

Is this a snap together kit or do you have to glue it? judging from the pictures posted it looks like it just gets snapped together, but the description at HLJ.com says it requires cement. Can anyone shed some light?

[TSP]

It's a snap-fit kit. HJL wants you to buy some modelling supplies.

[tetsujin]

More likely HLJ just miscategorized the kit...

[Taylor_VFA122]

I ordered this kit from HLJ.com about two days ago. I remember them having faster order processing. Has it normally been taking three days to do this?

[mickyg]

normally I just brush some over the whole decal once it's exactly where I want it, wait 10~15 seconds for it to soak in, wick away any excess liquid pooling on top of the decal with a tissue, then GENTLY start to work the decal into any surfaces it's not already hugging down to with a soft brush or q-tip or something.

Solvaset Works on bandai decals, but only about as well as Microsol does on most other brands of decal.

I think something got lost in the exchange here - I think Lolicon was referring to the "stickers" on this kit. That's going by the fine work he did on his 72 scale builds - he knows how to use softener on the decals. If I can be so bold to assume your meaning there Lolicon. If that's correct, I don't think anything will work on their stickers!

[Lolicon]

I ordered this kit from HLJ.com about two days ago. I remember them having faster order processing. Has it normally been taking three days to do this?

Hit or miss with HLJ. Sometimes they ship fairly quickly, sometimes it takes forever. I guess it depends on how many people bother showing up to work there.

When I ordered my YF-29 kits, they sat in the the "Preparing for Shipment" stage for 9 days. And they were "in stock" items.

I think something got lost in the exchange here - I think Lolicon was referring to the "stickers" on this kit. That's going by the fine work he did on his 72 scale builds - he knows how to use softener on the decals. If I can be so bold to assume your meaning there Lolicon. If that's correct, I don't think anything will work on their stickers!

You are correct, sir. I held out hope that maybe the stuff would be caustic enough to melt those stickers, but then again if it was that strong it'd probably just melt the plastic too.

I did discover something that is effective at getting the stickers to conform to the surface: a toothpick!

[Taylor_VFA122]

Hit or miss with HLJ. Sometimes they ship fairly quickly, sometimes it takes forever. I guess it depends on how many people bother showing up to work there.

When I ordered my YF-29 kits, they sat in the the "Preparing for Shipment" stage for 9 days. And they were "in stock" items.

You are correct, sir. I held out hope that maybe the stuff would be caustic enough to melt those stickers, but then again if it was that strong it'd probably just melt the plastic too.

I did discover something that is effective at getting the stickers to conform to the surface: a toothpick!

Just how bad are these stickers? I haven't built a gundam kit in a long time and I thought from what I was looking at on another page that these were wet transfer decals. Am I wrong in assuming this?

[mickyg]

Yep - just good old fashioned, adhesive backed stickers, I'm afraid. If you've got a 1/72 kit, you'll be familiar with them. They're not bad, just thick and, well, stickers! They are flexible and as has been mentioned, probably stretch a bit, which makes the toothpick method a really good idea!

[Taylor_VFA122]

I wonder how you get the red stripe over that nub that sits a top the vf-25f's head, or was that part omitted from this kit?

[Taylor_VFA122]

so I was lucky enough to speak to someone who built this kit and he told me he didn't bother with the stickers at all for this thing. He just painted everything. He said also that getting the stickers on what would be the top of the battroid's head would have been far too difficult. He also did some modding. He opened the vents above the intakes up, did a bit of panel lining, and lastly he split the feet apart, and inside he stuffed some really cool blue-ish/purple LED's in the legs to simulate afterburner. Its very nicely done for sure.

[tetsujin]

so I was lucky enough to speak to someone who built this kit and he told me he didn't bother with the stickers at all for this thing. He just painted everything.

Painting the stripes would certainly be a good exercise in masking. There are some markings that would be a bit hard to mask and paint, however: any of the lettering, the warnings on the intakes, etc. At least the "SMS" logo shouldn't be too hard, though...

[Thom]

If you have one in 1/72 scale, maybe you could scan it's decals and downsize, and reprint on blank decal sheet.

[tetsujin]

If you have one in 1/72 scale, maybe you could scan it's decals and downsize, and reprint on blank decal sheet.

I would probably just scan the 1:100 sticker sheet instead - though printing decals carries additional limitations, like dithering if you're printing a color your printer doesn't provide. At the very least, though, one would probably be able to print them on ink-jet, since Alto's fighter has a fairly bright white as the background for everything.

[Taylor_VFA122]

I may end up cancelling this order for now and wait until someone else on here buys one and posts a build of it. If the stickers are anything like a Gundam kit, it'll be a nightmare. Especially since I don't have adequate space to use an air brush.

[Chronocidal]

If the stickers are anything like the 1/72 kits, they'll be screen-printed.

[Taylor_VFA122]

aren't most decals screen printed? I mean thats what a water-slide decal is isn't it

[tetsujin]

aren't most decals screen printed? I mean thats what a water-slide decal is isn't it

Well, not by definition. Screen printing just describes the process used to put pigment onto the decal carrier film. I think that's the main way mass-produced decals are made. But short-run or home-made decals can also be done on a printer.

[Lolicon]

He means Bandai decals/stickers are hideous screen-printed affairs, if you stand closer than 3 feet away from the model.

[Taylor_VFA122]

Well, not by definition. Screen printing just describes the process used to put pigment onto the decal carrier film. I think that's the main way mass-produced decals are made. But short-run or home-made decals can also be done on a printer.

Ahh gotcha! Excuse the ignorance guys I never knew the terminology when it came to these things. I've also been away from the modelling world for a while

[Chronocidal]

I'm actually not familiar with what the screen printing process is exactly. I just remembered them being labeled as such, and realized it's very appropriate, since it looks like they were printed through a screen door.

[anime52k8]

He means Bandai decals/stickers are hideous screen-printed affairs, if you stand closer than 3 feet away from the model.

honestly I think that particular graphic has the spotty look on purpose. I'm looking at the decals and stickers that came with the original VF-25F kit as well as the original set of Sheryl itasha decals and neither of them have that dotted look from any reasonable viewing distance. (If you look at them under a magnifying glass or take a picture of the decal with a macro lens then yes, you can see the dots but with the naked eye you're not going to notice it.)

:edit:

of course this is with them still on the backing paper, not actually applied to the model. It could change when you apply them but I doubt it.

:edit: :edit:

It just occurred to me that I bought both my VF-25F kits and those decals when they first came out in 2008, and I still haven't built either of them. I haven't even taken the parts/decals out of their individual bags.

that sucks

Edited June 21, 2011 by anime52k8

[tetsujin]

I'm actually not familiar with what the screen printing process is exactly.

Wikipedia can be very educational.

Basically, it's a process where you take some kind of screen (like a wire, silk, or nylon mesh) and apply a stencil to it (permanently attach a material to certain areas of the screen to block ink from passing through) - then you lay the screen down on something, and apply ink to the other side. Ink will travel through the areas of the screen not blocked off by the stencil, and when you remove the screen you'll have the desired pattern printed.

It's very common as a way to create T-shirts, for instance. There are DIY kits for that kind of screen printing.

But it looks like what we're talking about here isn't screen-printing at all - it's dithering or halftoning. That happens in any printing process, any time the colors you're trying to reproduce don't correspond to the inks you're using to reproduce them. Dithering of some sort is then the only way to approximate the color. If the design isn't made up of a few easy-to-reproduce colors it's bound to have some of this. Gradients of any kind will be a problem. The effect is terrible on a scale model IMO.

Of course, you could simply mix the color you actually want and print with that - this is something that is within the realm of possibility for mass-produced decals and stickers. But I think it's cheaper to just use a consistent set of colors across a whole product line and dither anything that doesn't match up.