HG and Robotech Debates

[chrisk]

Not entirely... if such a thing could even be said to have existed in the first place given the general shortage of Shadow Chronicles merchandise. Apart from the DVD, the only merchandise the movie had was the artbook, the soundtrack, the recalled Shadow Fighter MPC, and some miscellaneous odds and ends. In the last year or so, the only "new" RTSC merch is the reissue of the recalled Maia Sterling MPC.

Right, right. Harmony Gold makes their money with the convention gravy train. Kinda weird though that even on regular non-anniversary year, the Macross franchise puts a frightening amount of content compared to Robotech's current 25th anniversary. To be honest, I always get giddy when I see Tommy new Mikimoto-lite manhwa artwork. And then I realize its some form of repackaged junk from three years ago.

Being an IT guy by trade, I have no respect for any division of Apple except their marketing team, who have gone above and beyond the call of duty by using fraud and deception to sell low-grade consumer trash to the general public and got them to like it.

I speak as an ignorant consumer. Doh!

Harmony Gold doesn't have the talent to do more than flail around and look foolish whenever someone asks a question for which they don't have an answer that makes them look good.

Well, there's always that Talkshoe thing in case public relations goes down the toilet again.

[Jasonc]

Love these episodes of "As the Franchises Turn". Why did Memo ban PTH? That should've been a great hint as to what he meant to the fanbase there (aside from TOU breakings). And then they wonder why people don't stick around.

For the PTTSC comic novel, it'll sell for those RT fans who have to double dip, or those that never got the comic. I'm sure HG will claim that it sells super well once it's out. They'll do a small print run, just enough to cover some fans, and the casual buyer, and if they sell out, it'll be a huge success.

[Seto Kaiba]

Love these episodes of "As the Franchises Turn". Why did Memo ban PTH? That should've been a great hint as to what he meant to the fanbase there (aside from TOU breakings). And then they wonder why people don't stick around.

So far, I haven't been able to find the exact post where it all went down, but given what he's said about it he was banned for antagonizing other members on the Series & Stories section of the Robotech.com boards. He was baiting the "Disciples of Leonard" in a thread about what would've happened if the Robotech Masters had made peace and warned humanity about the Invid, and he seems to have interpreted his ban as having been motivated by MEMO's friendship with some members of the DOL. Once again, he seems to have concluded he was banned not because of his actions, but rather because someone was conspiring against him.

Based on this, I'd say his attacks on MEMO and Harmony Gold are probably motivated more by anger over his ban than having come to his senses and realized what a crapshoot Harmony Gold is.

[Einherjar]

Based on this, I'd say his attacks on MEMO and Harmony Gold are probably motivated more by anger over his ban than having come to his senses and realized what a crapshoot Harmony Gold is.

That relationship really needs to end soon, it's getting very uncomfortable and unprofessional (MEMO wants to be treated like one, right?).

Or better yet, remake the Sentinels as a 50+ episode TV series. They already have a lot of materials to pick and choose a part to animate.

I do not doubt that they have a lot of ideas and material to make a new show. But how are they supposed to make one without the proper money or facilities to make one? Hire another DR Movie? Gonna cost more money than they could ever have. Remember, Tommy Yune is the only talent and resource they have beyond legalities.

Edited January 26, 2010 by Einherjar

[Seto Kaiba]

That relationship really needs to end soon, it's getting very uncomfortable and unprofessional (MEMO wants to be treated like one, right?).

Definitely... at this rate it looks like it's only a matter of time until Pizza's pointed criticisms of Harmony Gold's handling of Robotech and the 25th anniversary get MEMO so thoroughly hacked off that he'll re-ban him from RobotechX, leaving him nowhere to go except back to RobotechFactor or over to HappyPenguins's site, assuming he doesn't just re-register there under a new name like he did last time.

I do not doubt that they have a lot of ideas and material to make a new show. But how are they supposed to make one without the proper money or facilities to make one? Hire another DR Movie? Gonna cost more money than they could ever have. Remember, Tommy Yune is the only talent and resource they have beyond legalities.

I doubt it... they couldn't even scrounge up enough material to make a single reasonably compelling 90 minute movie. At least the first 30 minutes were recycled story from Symphony of Light, and the remainder could only be called flat, dull, and uninteresting. Yes, other people have essentially handed them everything they need in the setting, the characters, the mecha, and the overall plot outline, but even then they couldn't come up with a compelling story to save their souls.

[VFTF1]

Pizza the Hut got banned at Robotech.com? That's funny

Pete

[Dangard Ace]

Being an IT guy by trade, I have no respect for any division of Apple except their marketing team, who have gone above and beyond the call of duty by using fraud and deception to sell low-grade consumer trash to the general public and got them to like it. Harmony Gold doesn't have the talent to do more than flail around and look foolish whenever someone asks a question for which they don't have an answer that makes them look good.

It's like Apple's core demographic, the militant macfags who don't care WHAT the new Apple product is or how much it costs, so long as they can get their hands on it as soon as possible.

You know half of the admin staff here use Apple products and some of us are IT for large corporations.

Stay on topic even if you are getting burnt out by all the Apple buzz about their new tablet product being released tomorrow.

[VFTF1]

I have an Apple Mac II from 1986 up in my attic. It still works great!

Pete

[VFTF1]

Wow.

Amazing.

Look at this: http://www.asosbrigade.com/

Episode 01

Bandai Entertainment are SMART.

Do they piss on the fans for downloading, fansubing and torrenting their favorite anime PRIOR to the 'official' licensed release?

Nope.

This is excellent excellent PR. It's smart, it's down to earth, and it will get people to buy the DVDs.

Haruhi: "I even heard there are people in America already watching it through internet fansubs...which is cool...but don't forget to get the DVD because there are even cooler extras on that."

And then Yuki's whole bit about "primative form of data transfer called Bit Torrent" and how only using a more advanced data transfer device (implied: DVD player) can fans truly appreciate the series.

BRAVO Bandai!!

That is EXCELLENT business sense.

It's so much better than either IGNORING internet fansubs or trying to arrest people for actually daring to LIKE an anime and wanting to see it earlier than two years later when corporate leaders might sign a contract.

It relies on people who love the anime to support the anime when an official product is offered and understands that the motive behind downloading fansubs was not evil intent and piracy, but a desire to enjoy something that was made for people in Japan to enjoy.

This is a great example of how to act in light of events like these - an example HG needs to learn to follow.

Pete

EDIT: HA HA!! AWESOME!! As linked below in the pictures --- she says "renounce fansubs and buy the DVDs" and gives a spiel about taking rice away from animators...while at the same time they spoof the fact that the episode is already being Torrented!! EXCELLENT BANDAI!! HG BLOWS!!!

Edited January 26, 2010 by VFTF1

[Jasonc]

Bravo, Bandai!!!! Now, if they can just put english subs on their DVDs and blu-rays, fans here in the U.S. and in other parts would buy the Macross productions even moreso. It'd be a great way to "get around" the blockade. Bandai, be like Nike, don't think about it, "JUST DO IT"

[Einherjar]

The HG version would have Lynn Kyle sounding like an A-hole as usual, but actually be a serious threat from HG to everyone thinking about Macross.

[Seto Kaiba]

Stay on topic even if you are getting burnt out by all the Apple buzz about their new tablet product being released tomorrow.

It's nothing to do with my antipathy towards Apple, well-justified though it is. Take my remarks in context and you'll see I was drawing a parallel between the business plans of Apple and Harmony Gold. Specifically, how the core demographic of both companies is a "captive consumer base" which will buy just about anything with the brand name on it, with little or no regard for quality. In some ways, Harmony Gold's current situation reminds me a lot of where Apple was in the mid-90s, with a small but fanatically local consumer base keeping the brand moving forward despite some astonishingly stupid calls by the management and public opinion of the brand ranging from polite indifference to undisguised scorn. Now, whether or not Harmony Gold will find that one magic product (like Apple's iPod) that'll become wildly popular and make them mainstream... your guess is as good as mine.

EDIT: I wonder why Maverick_LSC keeps checking my MacrossWorld profile... 's that boy back to spying on me to see what I'm saying about Robotech again? Dude needs to get a life... or maybe his wife just needs to take away his internet privileges .

Edited January 26, 2010 by Seto Kaiba

[chrisk]

That Bandai stuff is great! Hope their gimmick works...

Now, whether or not Harmony Gold will find that one magic product (like Apple's iPod) that'll become wildly popular and make them mainstream... your guess is as good as mine.

Easy. When all the Japanese Macross products finally gets officially distributed by Harmony Gold on the States! That would be an odd day...

I wonder why Maverick_LSC keeps checking my MacrossWorld profile... 's that boy back to spying on me to see what I'm saying about Robotech again? Dude needs to get a life... or maybe his wife just needs to take away his internet privileges

It's called guilt, Seto.

Edited January 27, 2010 by chrisk

[Seto Kaiba]

Easy. When all the Japanese Macross products finally gets officially distributed by Harmony Gold on the States! That would be an odd day...

So... never? It's not like they have the know-how to produce anything that'll make the industry take them seriously again. Any future the franchise has is going to be in the hands of someone other than its owners.

It's called guilt, Seto.

Nah, I think it's called cyber-stalking... poor bastard must think I'm behind PTH's latest bout of unfocused rage.

[Jasonc]

EDIT: I wonder why Maverick_LSC keeps checking my MacrossWorld profile... 's that boy back to spying on me to see what I'm saying about Robotech again? Dude needs to get a life... or maybe his wife just needs to take away his internet privileges

Those are some issues. It's not like profiles here really say a lot about people. Maybe his sense of hatred for you has turned into some weird attraction towards you. I think if you were simply talking nonsense, there would be no concern from them. However, since you do speak logically, and with some truth, as many of us have, you'll get the occasional drone either contacting you, or "spying" on you, if you even call it that.

[Seto Kaiba]

Those are some issues. It's not like profiles here really say a lot about people.

Granted... but it's dollars to donuts he's been accessing my profile here to keep an eye on what I say about Robotech and Harmony Gold. Just like MEMO, Mav's borderline-obsessed with silencing criticism of Robotech and its creators by any means available, and thanks to the incredibly childish antics of Doug Bendo my reputation among Robotech fans seems to be an eclectic mix of "top Robotech expert" and "ringleader of the Robotech haters". For all practical purposes, they seem to perceive me as Schrodinger's Fan... I'm both an expert fan and detestable hater until they read a post of mine and the waveform collapses temporarily, leaving me as one or the other.

Maybe his sense of hatred for you has turned into some weird attraction towards you. I think if you were simply talking nonsense, there would be no concern from them. However, since you do speak logically, and with some truth, as many of us have, you'll get the occasional drone either contacting you, or "spying" on you, if you even call it that.

I do seem to attract the crazies, don't I?

[anime52k8]

You know half of the admin staff here use Apple products and some of us are IT for large corporations.

Stay on topic even if you are getting burnt out by all the Apple buzz about their new tablet product being released tomorrow.

tablet computers suck harder than robotech. (see, it's on topic because it related to how much robotech sucks )

[Dangard Ace]

It's nothing to do with my antipathy towards Apple, well-justified though it is. Take my remarks in context and you'll see I was drawing a parallel between the business plans of Apple and Harmony Gold. Specifically, how the core demographic of both companies is a "captive consumer base" which will buy just about anything with the brand name on it, with little or no regard for quality. In some ways, Harmony Gold's current situation reminds me a lot of where Apple was in the mid-90s, with a small but fanatically local consumer base keeping the brand moving forward despite some astonishingly stupid calls by the management and public opinion of the brand ranging from polite indifference to undisguised scorn. Now, whether or not Harmony Gold will find that one magic product (like Apple's iPod) that'll become wildly popular and make them mainstream... your guess is as good as mine.

EDIT: I wonder why Maverick_LSC keeps checking my MacrossWorld profile... 's that boy back to spying on me to see what I'm saying about Robotech again? Dude needs to get a life... or maybe his wife just needs to take away his internet privileges .

I know what your point was and I won't disagree with you...during the 90's. The Gil Amelio years were when Apple went down the crapper. They wanted to emulate the PC business model and failed. In that comparison, I completely agree with you. Where I find your comparisons wrong is that unlike HG Apple is a design leader that innovates and their competitors take notice. For example. Popularizing the GUI interface. Xerox PARC was first but Apple commercialized it. The PDA(Newton) which is the precursor to all of todays smart phones, including BB and iPhones. Tablets in 1983. The famous iPods, which while not innovative nor the first mp3 players to market, they distilled it down and made it simple and easy to use instead of being bloated and unintuitive like alot of competitor products.

Apple creates new products. Quality products. HG doesn't. Marked difference.

Oh and if you haven't guessed by now, I'm the Mac lead for my IT department. I'm also the guy that builds standardized Window staff/public images for our laptops/desktops (Dell/Toshiba and HP/IBM) as well as maintain the DHCP servers that talk to them. I like to think I could say I'm a little bit qualified to say when I've come across quality machines.

[RDClip]

Easy. When all the Japanese Macross products finally gets officially distributed by Harmony Gold on the States! That would be an odd day.

But the RT fans have their vastly superior MPC collection from the greatest toy company in the world Toynami.

I have to wonder if when HG was looking for a company to make toys for them, they were looking for a company whose incompetence equaled their own.

[azrael]

...

...

....

Alright kids, you know there's a app thread for that.

Seriously, who cares if they look at your profile? What are they going to do, ban you again after you've been banned? Good grief.

[Saraphys]

OH, oh, oh! Mr. Azrael...

.

..

...Im looking at your profile

[Seto Kaiba]

I know what your point was and I won't disagree with you...during the 90's.

Glad we're on the same page as far as the context of my analogy goes... the rest is generally irrelevant.

Oh and if you haven't guessed by now, I'm the Mac lead for my IT department. I'm also the guy that builds standardized Window staff/public images for our laptops/desktops (Dell/Toshiba and HP/IBM) as well as maintain the DHCP servers that talk to them. I like to think I could say I'm a little bit qualified to say when I've come across quality machines.

Nice to see some more IT blokes around here, I do IT work in the auto industry m'self, but that's neither here nor there.

Seriously, who cares if they look at your profile? What are they going to do, ban you again after you've been banned? Good grief.

Well, I do... the idea that I'm being actively cyber-stalked by two married men with no lives because they're afraid that I might say something bad about a failed animated sci-fi franchise from the mid-80s is somewhere between hilarious and downright creepy. That the people in charge of the Robotech franchise are SO thin-skinned and SO incapable of handling criticism that they actually want to silence me is nothing short of comical.

If I had a Facebook account or anything like that, I don't doubt that one or both of 'em would be spying on me there too... and that's just freaking ridiculous.

Edited January 27, 2010 by Seto Kaiba

[Jasonc]

Seto, while I do understand your concern there, at the same time, this is the internet, and a public forum. We put ourselves out there, just like they do, and because of that, people are going to wanna look at posts you make, as well as scrutinize your views and comments. They do it to me as well, and others here. As long as you put yourself out there, the possibility for it to happen is out there. As long as nothing illegal is going on, not much you can do, except maybe introvert yourself. But then again, how true would you be to yourself at that point. I don't think there's much harm they can do, and let them get what they will out of it. It should boost your points for argument sake. They still don't have much of a counter argument yet for certain things, which maybe why you have a new admirer. "Maverick and Seto, sitting in a tree....." (J/K) spoken to lighten it up a bit.

[Saraphys]

They do it to me as well

Well, arn't you the centre of the Universe...

LMFAO!!!

[Gubaba]

Well, arn't you the centre of the Universe...

LMFAO!!!

I just looked at your profile. You are now the new center of the universe.

Oh, and consider yourself cyberstalked.

[Jasonc]

No, that title is given to wife, family, and all that per se. Literally, since we're not even in the center of our own galaxy, that's enough to say I'm not the center of the universe.

Edit: Why, while reading this thread as of the past few posts, do I here the song by Rockwell, the song in the Geico commercials, "I always feel like, somebody's watching meeeee." There's a new theme song for you.

Edited January 27, 2010 by Jasonc

[Einherjar]

But see, for a short while right before Shadow Chronicles came out, the individual comics were VERY expensive on Ebay...so that justifies coming out with the book long after the prices plummeted...er, I mean...wait a sec.

yeah, why ARE they coming out with it? You can get all five issues now for, like, ten bucks or less these days.

Maybe part of the merchandise celebration for 25 years of just existing but not progressing. They need something to complement the replacement Maia Alpha retool and recolor (forget the Shadow Fighter moniker, that's what it really is in the the end), the stiff Vinyl Battlepod, and limited market RPG books to make the franchise look like it's still active and worth the hefty prices they're asking. Also, gotta keep the fandom focusing on what they really care about; Rick MacGuffin Hunter.

Edited January 27, 2010 by Einherjar

[Seto Kaiba]

But then again, how true would you be to yourself at that point. I don't think there's much harm they can do, and let them get what they will out of it. It should boost your points for argument sake. They still don't have much of a counter argument yet for certain things, which maybe why you have a new admirer.

Oh, there's precious little in the way of actual harm they could do... but that doesn't make it any less obnoxious, nor any less creepy. I must confess it is somewhat amusing to me that even after being banned from Robotech.com and MEMO's RobotechX for what I can only call my "heretical views", they still consider me enough of a threat to their narrow-minded, dogmatic little fantasy world to want to keep a close eye on me to make sure I'm not spreading my dangerous, seditious knowledge among the fans. I doubt they're watching me because I'm saying something they can't counter, because in all the time I was verbally sparring with them they never once came up with a counterargument for something I'd said which didn't immediately set off the bullshit detectors of every sane reader.

[Saraphys]

Well, if their watching you, Kaiba...

Does that mean I can do something for a change? ...or, again, as the dozen accounts may proclaim...

Ofcourse, the question would be...If they are so carefully watching this thread, as is believed, then can they find my new account in time before I start spreading the messages of "Macross Nazi Pedophile" Purists... thats basicly what they call us, yes? ...well, It'll be fun, none the less...

[Einherjar]

Well, if their watching you, Kaiba...

Does that mean I can do something for a change? ...or, again, as the dozen accounts may proclaim...

Ofcourse, the question would be...If they are so carefully watching this thread, as is believed, then can they find my new account in time before I start spreading the messages of "Macross Nazi Pedophile" Purists... thats basicly what they call us, yes? ...well, It'll be fun, none the less...

Posting on this site and this thread potentially flags you as someone who needs to be banned/suspended from rt.com or rtx as a way to control dissent and the spread of more accurate information. But regardless of the stupid rivalry that's been going on, it's surprising that they're STILL so scared about this site that they monitor it, sometimes under the guise of catching up with friends, when they practically have their own "professional" one (the mods treat the HG site as their own as well, to the point of making rtx look almost a redundant sister site to it now). I think they've been trying to find my account on their sites as well (but they'll never find it).

That's a HG lapdog for you.

[VFTF1]

That Bandai stuff is great! Hope their gimmick works...

I don't think it's a gimmick. Again -How many of you guys download movies instead of going to the cinema to see them? I remember ONCE ONE TIME my girlfriend got a pirated copy of a Woody Allen movie from somebody at work and insisted we see it on my laptop while we were spending a week on Easter vacation in a remote rural Polish village where there were no movie theatres. I guess she thought it would be neat to watch it in our little cabin room with dinner and wine. I kind of frowned at her for it, like there weren't enough legal movies to get on DVD...but she insisted...and it kind of made sense given the circumstances:

She wanted two things at once: 1) to be there, 2) to watch the new Woody Allen movie. Fine.

Whatever.

I also remember watching Rocky Balboa on Youtube while it was in theatres.

BEYOND those two instances, I have always either gone to the cinema and paid for a ticket or bought the DVD. I haven't the time nor the patience nor the desire to pirate DVDs.

Although I DO remember the days when a DVD could cost upwards of 50 USD. Now it costs a fraction of that - partially due to better technology, but largely due to the fact that legal companies have to compete with the illegal pirates. They compete by offering lower prices as well as better quality.

And - wow - surprise - it actually works.

The vast majority of consumers DON'T WANT cheap crappy bootleg DVDs. My step dad once brought a whole bag of this crap home from China - I threw it all away after TRYING to watch it. You had movies that had been split into three parts - wher you watched like 20 minutes and then had to put another DVD into the player. You had movies that were abruplty cut in the middle, with no menus and no possibility of switching or resuming or going from scene to scene. You had lousy sound and picture quality...

I could go on - but do I have to?

The ONLY reason that anime gets "pirated" so much is NOT because anime fans and otaku are pirates and evil. It's because between the time that an anime comes out in Japan and the time when some corporate suits sign a licensing agreement and issue it in Europe or the USA, you usually have a lapse of at least a year - sometimes two or three years.

And somtimes - like in Poland - it just NEVER gets licensed.

So what? Am I supposed to pretend it doesn't exist? Fly to Japan? Heck - I can't even buy the legally licensed US DVDs off of Amazon, because Amazon doesn't deliver to Poland.

I COULD buy off Ebay...but how many people on Ebay have legal businesses that pay their taxes?

The fact is that the system is screwed up. Nobody wants to steal or cheat people out of their earnings. But let's put it another way:

When a Japanese-only anime is produced - it is produced for the Japanese market. And nobody goes to a Japanese production company and sells the anime by saying "it'll make millions in Brazil!" or something. They look primarily at their market. Overseas is an after thought.

Then - suddenly - they are shocked to discover that via the internet - their Japanese only anime has developed a fan following - and so they get the ball rolling to put out DVDs and make money off of it.

Do they REALLY want to bite the head of the fansubbers off? They got wonderful free global marketing thanks to the fans. They are smart. They know it. They would NEVER get the profitable marketing that they get FREE from fansubbers and fan websites from an official PR company.

The dynamic works different for Harmony Gold though.

Harmony Gold has a financial interest in perpetuating human IGNORANCE.

Harmony Gold does not want you to surf the internet. Harmony Gold hates the internet because it brought down their monopoly in the USA on whipping their asses with Japanese anime and then selling it in the USA as a Harmony Gold original product. Now fans can go to the internet - see the original and choose. And because HG produces crap - fans are choosing original Macross.

They will never go the way of Bandai because the truth is that NOBODY is marketing Robotech for free for them.

There are no huge mass internet movements marketing Robotech. There just aren't. It's not an internet phenomena. What IS an internet phenomena is Macross - and that's cutting into their profits, not increasing them.

And they are in a bad situation where they have to actually free themselves from Macross and make Robotech something independent. Thus the LAM efforts.

Pete

[Ginrai]

the stiff Vinyl Battlepod

How do you know it's stiff? It's not out.

[VFTF1]

Well - looking at the promo pic of the Battlepod- it looks stiff. It's not dynamically posed - and if it COULD be dynamically posed, then you'd think the promo pics would highlight that.

I mean - most people can tell that Revoltechs are dynamic just based off of promo pics - even before the product is actually out

The pic of the Battlepod looks like it doesn't have much range of motion.

Pete

[Einherjar]

How do you know it's stiff? It's not out.

It's going to be the second toy in Toynami's Robot Vinyl Collection, so I'm assuming it will have similar characteristics as the first one that's come out so far. The first was their vinyl Voltron. Unless the quality of their product actually improves, this may be a rough description of how the Battlepod will be like.

http://www.collectiondx.com/review/character_toy/voltron

[Jasonc]

In other news, just read this bit of garbage from the guy who thinks he knows all things. post can be found here: http://www.robotech.com/community/forum/re...p;pagenumber=11

Maverick wrote all this:

godmatrix wrote;

We are told to trust an actor/ producer to help bring authenticity to Robotech. You must be either stoned or just plain naive.

I hope you know Warner Brothers excels at rebooting and bringing franchises to the big screen like 'The Matrix', 'Batman Begins', 'Harry Potter series' and so on. Tobey is not going alone on this, it's a group effort with Warner Brothers having a major role in the production side and Harmony Gold lending them a hand in honouring the creative side.

This is funny. Warner Bros only has a major role??? As far as has been presented, WB is doing all the work, while HG isn't doing anything with it. They have no say-so creatively in the movie. For someone who claims to know so much about the "industry", he hasn't proven much. We're just getting warmed up.

godmatrix wrote;

The talk now is Macross Frontier. A completely different take with familiar snap-its to the old classic. Sure the names have been changed, but the platform remains. Bandai has learned from its horrific take of Macross Zero and humbled themselves to tell an old story with a new twist.

The episodes were compressed to 25 vs its predecessor but with a minor different - a tighter story line that answers question and eye-catchy CG dog fights. No, you won't see a Zentradi Pod - more like eva01 meets minmai

And this is EXACTLY why this explains how many Macross fans including myself are sticking to Macross II and Macross 7, atleast they were somewhat original.

Since Bandai are so afraid of experimenting in different storylines as not to stray too far off from the original SDF:Macross storyline itself in fear of alienating its fanbase.

I think that's pathetic, atleast gundam in almost every story based in the UC timeline is unique and original unlike Macross which tends to find another new enemy of the moment, have some major conflicts which cumulate to a finale where an idol singers wins the war ONCE AGAIN

That there is 90% of plot of all Macross and its sequels.

Many macross fans are sticking ot Macross 7 and II? I know a few fans prefer the alternate universe, and feel it should be the canon, but besides that. While this is all opinion, and open to interpretation, Bandai is afraid of experimenting? Then the whole thing with Gundam??? OK, first off, there's not really anything that's 100% original. What becomes original in these storis points is the pace, direction, and the individual events. What Macros has, is a formula that not only makes the series continuously popular, but also helps sell millions of dollars in merchandise, as in movies/series, clothes, toys, model kits, books, posters, heck, even food. Since Maverick is talking about the franchise formulas here, what has RTSC's story formula given it in comparison? Talk of a LAM? That doesn't even mean anything, as there's nothing to complain. Moving on...

Atleast Shadow Chronicles had a unique storyline and plotwise is more tied to hard science fiction like that of reknowned SF author Robert Sawyer to whom by the way has a credit in the Robotech: The Shadow Chronicles movie.

Unlike Robotech: The Shadow Chronicles, Macross Frontier seems to be written by the likes of a hard up Macross fanboy whose on SDF:Macross withdrawl.

And to cover up for the lack of story as the budget went to all kinds of flash in the pan effects to cover it obvious lack of creativity.

Of course that's my opinion, as a Macross fan myself Macross Frontier was an utter disappointment, probably far worse than Macross Zero.

Macross Frontier is one reason why most Gundam fans point and ridicule Macross fans to no end.

Shoji Kawamori should really be sticking to Macross II and Macross 7 as those designs were really unique and amazing in terms of characters and mecha.

I have faith in Harmony Gold more than ever, especially since Macross Frontier at best was mediocre. I'm looking to see what Warner Brothers can do to the Robotech property as it's obvious Bandai has no direction whatsoever with the Macross property.

Mav...

Shadow Chronicles had a unique storyline??? Really? Plotwise??? Since 1/3 of it is rehashing story directly taken from Genesis Climber MOSPEADA, I don't think that part qualifies as original and unique. The rest, well, Robotech synopses...Aliens invade earth because of a flower energy source, humans fight aliens while being the underdog, and humans eventually win. Not original at all. As a matter of fact, at least Macross had endings that were new in their own sense. Robotech's 3 endings were other endings to different shows.

the whole bit about Gundam fans ridiculing Macross fans because of Macross F? Who cares! If they don't like it, or don't like Macross, they're gonna do it. I doubt it's because of Frontier, but for whatever reason, who cares. Frontier is successful enough to get criticized. Again, people have their opinions, and the success of the series, and the success of the movie in theatres (not a special engagement release like RTSC) shows that despite yours, mine, and others opinion, the general consensus is that it's good. Comparing to RTSC, well, there is no comparison needed. I hate comparing the two, cause it always ends up with RT fans getting upset, but look at what is, and you see where things stand. Frontier is already going for a second movie. RT is still trying to figure out if they can make Shadow Rising, or still in a pre-production version of Dante's inferno.