HG and Robotech Debates

[Seto Kaiba]

I just spilled my coffee laughing, thanks, that made my evening .

Insults to make Blackadder proud

We aim to please...

So many things to point out here, so I'll take em one by one. First paragraph simply seems what most RT elitist want to believe.

And y'know what... that's damn scary.

Nevertheless, it seems that PTH talks a lot to Memo, and it must be Memo who gave him that idea of some sort of conspiracy theory.

Sure enough, MEMO's loudly claiming that it's not real and that it must be the work of someone trying to destroy the future of the "Shadow Saga".

Tom Bateman is a friend of mine, and I know for a fact that he could careless about what happens to the future of Robotech. Tom has much bigger plans than to orchestrate some feable attempt at undermining Shadow Rising by putting out Tommy's idea for it. It's the people who know much that know the truth, and Memo may just be trying to steer people clear of valid leaked info.

Pretty much everyone's assessment but Pizza's... that MEMO is trying to steer people away from the truth by trying to handwave the whole thing (including Harmony Gold's attempt to have it taken down) as a fraud.

Regret what, Seto? Your absolutely right people should forget worrying if their government has ever lied about crashed UFOs, assianating Kennedy in broad daylight, or going to war with nations solely for materieal gain. Issues like who created and owns the rights to an entertaining 1980s cartoon is so much more important.

[HappyPenguins]

Sure enough, MEMO's loudly claiming that it's not real and that it must be the work of someone trying to destroy the future of the "Shadow Saga".

What's there to destroy though? Doesn't the piece of crap do that enough on its own?

[terry the lone wolf]

Is HG being deceptive about the existence of the original Japanese shows? I don't see it; back in Robotech Art 1 both Super Dimensional shows & Genesis Climber Mospeada was listed. As was the original title characters lined with their RT counter parts. Also, HG and Streamline released those RT Perfect Collections with the Japanese and American shows.

Maybe HG been ambiguous about the "connection" between each but I don't see a effort to hide the originals.

[VFTF1]

Re: "the conspiracy theory" - told you it was real and to quote myself:

Yaaaaaaaaaaawn.

Why is this so surprising? It's actually not hard to believe. I could totally see Memo divorcing his wife for an RT fan and emptying his bank account to fly VAs and HG reps to Chile.

Why not?

Look - let's start from the basics here:

Many of these people like a show that is fake - from start to finish. They consider a screwy bootleg to be a great work of art.

If you start from THAT premise - then why would any other crazy sounding thing be that hard to believe?

So - I would tend to believe Pizza The Hut here. Yes - I am perfectly open to this theory. I am also perfectly open to the in-fighting theory and all of that.

It sounds perfectly in line with their MO up to this point.

As for conspiracy theories in general - I think most of them have merit. Conspiracies are just secretive actions planned by small groups of people... if you look at it that way, then the word doesn't sound like such a crazy concept.

The REAL problem with "conspiracy theories" is that some of them are nutts, others are more plausible. But "conspiracy" in and of itself is not something unheard of, and is actually fairly common amongst human beings - and not always something done with an evil goal, world domination or the destruction of the universe in mind..

Re: HG hiding original Japanese anime:

Lone Wolf has a good point. They've never pretended the stuff doesn't exist. I think the problem is they didn't anticipate the growth of the internet, and they were completely blindsided by the rise of fans who prefer watching something in Japanese with subtitles.

After all - look at it this way:

Americans don't DO substitles. Americans don't watch movies with subtitles. Americans need and by and large want things in english so they can turn off their brain an absorb during a movie, rather than read. Subtitles is something the rest of the world reads.

But lo and behold - it turns out that a plurality of American anime fans want to see the original Japanese work with subtitles (I think...)

Maybe HG was hoping that people would react to the news that Robotech was based on Macross/Mospedea etc just like TF fans reacted to news that the 84 cars were all from the Diaclone line.

It's not like there's a huge Diaclone following around...although in fairness I guess that's because Diaclone never really went anywhere - whereas Transformers did.

Hard to say. Lots of guessing...unless someone in the know can lay it out.

Pete

[Seto Kaiba]

Is HG being deceptive about the existence of the original Japanese shows? [...]

Maybe HG been ambiguous about the "connection" between each but I don't see a effort to hide the originals.

Harmony Gold hasn't so much attempted to outright conceal that Robotech is a hastily (and poorly) executed rewrite of Macross, Southern Cross, and Mospeada as they have tried to distort the actual relationship between the originals and Robotech. Carl Macek did a lot as far as distorting the truth, trying to make it sound like Studio Nue was working for Harmony Gold when they made Macross, that Studio Nue's intent was to make it part of Robotech, and that the originals were all failures on their own and had only succeeded as part of Robotech.

Basically, it wasn't the originals they were trying to hide, it was the existence of the rest of Macross as a successful franchise... something that they still try to sweep under the rug even today.

[Keith]

Don't forget Carl Macek's various comments about how he "fixed" those crazy Japanese stories.

[Lolicon]

Don't forget Carl Macek's various comments about how he "fixed" those crazy Japanese stories.

If by "fixed" he meant they were neutered, then yes, Macek was being 100% truthful.

[Einherjar]

Don't forget Carl Macek's various comments about how he "fixed" those crazy Japanese stories.

And not just once, at least twice starting with the novels to make a darker and edgier version of Robotech. It's the definitive vision of those crazy Japanese stories with more pretentious fluff.

[Dynaman]

After all - look at it this way:

Americans don't DO substitles. Americans don't watch movies with subtitles. Americans need and by and large want things in english so they can turn off their brain an absorb during a movie, rather than read. Subtitles is something the rest of the world reads.

But lo and behold - it turns out that a plurality of American anime fans want to see the original Japanese work with subtitles (I think...)

The entire American Anime market is still a pathetically small group of people, most likely there are the same number of people that prefer to see Das Boot in German with subtitles as well. (If the market were larger then the Japanese companies making Anime would put more effort into wringing some profit out of us)

I'll hazard a guess that the two primary reasons we prefer Subs to Dubs are.

1 - English VAs are not as good as the Japanese VAs (not even close in many cases)

2 - Dubbed shows often got chopped into kiddified versions stripped of their essence. (Clash of the Bionoids anyone?)

[VFTF1]

Actually, the longer I sit in this business, the more I come to the conclusion that one of the main reasons why the anime market is a mega-niche market outside of Japan isn't necessarily because it's "small" and therefore the Japanese don't have any incentive to market to us - but rather due to reasons which are completely internal to the west:

A) VAT taxes. The USA isn't affected by this, but Europe has horrendously high VAT taxes, and while a business like mine is VAT neutral - so what - since customers have to pay it anyways - whether buying from an importer or whether importing themselves (unless it's a parcel under 100 Euros value...which given the prices of things like statues, valkyrie and SOCs is rare). This tax really REALLY eats into profit margins and makes it very difficult to offer items in bulk

B) BUT - even IF a big distributor wanted to offer things in bulk - and this goes for the USA as well, if not even more so than Europe - they have to deal with...TOY SAFETY LAWS. The sad fact of the matter is that toy safety laws in the west have basically made 99% of what WE (adults) once played with as kids..."adult collectibles." Now, with current technology, it is possible to make more and more accurate representations of figures with swords, guns, airplanes, robots etc etc. But so what? Child safety laws prohibit jets from looking like jets, guns from looking like guns, prohibit the accessories we love (because they fall under small chokable pieces) and prohibit "sharp edges" and projectiles - basically FORCING toy makers to MAKE UGLY TOYS. THIS is, in my opinion, one of the biggest reason why Transformers are progressively uglier. In order to mass market them, Hasbro MUST sell them to children - but to target children, Hasbro must comply with laws which effectively say "your jet cannot look like a jet, your robot cannot look like a robot but must look like a safe blob and have nothing that children might swallow, shoot their eyes out with etc". Yamato and Bandai and Kaiyodo and all of the best Japanese companies ARE NOT going to have seperate factories to produce INFERIOR products that happen to comply with American laws - it would just make not sense.

C) Licensing Agreements - which are actually nothing more than big corporations using government to impose mafia-like restrictions on other companies and dividing the world into "corporate turfs" much like different Mafia families divide cities into turfs. I'll give you an example: I noticed that in Poland, Cosplay is pretty popular - so I thought I might start offering Cospa stuff in my store. Turns out that according to the laws here, in order to import ANY clothing - you need a "certificate of origin" from the manufacturer... but Cospa, under licensing agreements from all the various owners of the IP that they make clothing to correspond to CANNOT sell outside of Japan. I can import "samples" - 1 or 2 pieces of individual Cospa items - but not in bulk - and therefore it becomes impossible to actually offer anything but direct import at a higher price than I would have been able to offer if not for the licensing agreements.

Now - in my opinion - either we have a global marketplace or we DON'T. Imagine a licensing agreement in the USA whereby a producer in NYC cannot "export" goods to...Boston. That would be pretty stupid, wouldn't it? But corporations cut up turf between countries in a way that they couldn't within individual countries because it would go against freedom of commerce.

These are just three reasons - but important ones in my view - why Japanese companies CAN'T - not "don't want to" - but CAN'T expand the anime market.

And the corporations in the west are happy about it too. What do they care whether kids go into Toys'r'us and see crap on the shelves? They love the "child safety laws" because it keeps competition off the shelves - competition that makes BETTER products (which happen to cost more). This way they can keep manufacturing "safe crap" for pennies on the dollar and shove it down the mass of peoples throats.

But thankfully - the internet and independent dealers and little importers (to toot my own horn) are slowly revolutionizing the way the world does business.

And we WILL win.

Because the huge retail giants are going bankrupt. Big retailers have overhead costs that they simply can't cover in a depression - renting space, workers, electricity bills, health benefits, social security, payroll taxes - not to mention most of them run on credit which has run out.

I am happy that there is a global economic crisis because it's time to clean house. These big guys need to go bankrupt. The sooner the better. People are just not buying their crap.

Sure - small dealers and retailers are suffering too - but it's proportionate suffering. We're not over-expanded and it's precisely because we service niche markets that we have a better handle on what's going on instead of having a huge store full of over priced crap that nobody wants.

So - I predict that when this crisis blows over - anime and the anime market will be stronger for it and all the big guys who regimented the world will be weaker.

Pete

The entire American Anime market is still a pathetically small group of people, most likely there are the same number of people that prefer to see Das Boot in German with subtitles as well. (If the market were larger then the Japanese companies making Anime would put more effort into wringing some profit out of us)

I'll hazard a guess that the two primary reasons we prefer Subs to Dubs are.

1 - English VAs are not as good as the Japanese VAs (not even close in many cases)

2 - Dubbed shows often got chopped into kiddified versions stripped of their essence. (Clash of the Bionoids anyone?)

[Einherjar]

A) VAT taxes. The USA isn't affected by this, but Europe has horrendously high VAT taxes, and while a business like mine is VAT neutral - so what - since customers have to pay it anyways - whether buying from an importer or whether importing themselves (unless it's a parcel under 100 Euros value...which given the prices of things like statues, valkyrie and SOCs is rare). This tax really REALLY eats into profit margins and makes it very difficult to offer items in bulk

Cool, I just learned about this. That's the Value Added Tax, where the government requires companies to pay extra fees during each stage a product is assembled.

[Robelwell202]

The entire American Anime market is still a pathetically small group of people, most likely there are the same number of people that prefer to see Das Boot in German with subtitles as well. (If the market were larger then the Japanese companies making Anime would put more effort into wringing some profit out of us)

I'll hazard a guess that the two primary reasons we prefer Subs to Dubs are.

1 - English VAs are not as good as the Japanese VAs (not even close in many cases)

2 - Dubbed shows often got chopped into kiddified versions stripped of their essence. (Clash of the Bionoids anyone?)

Well, I'm an American, and I watch subtitles.

While I'm not a HUGE fan of foreign films, I have found several out there that are exceptional, and yes, I watch them in thier original dialogue with subs.

Cases in point:

Amelie, Wasabi, Das Boot, Ran (Well, all of Kurisawa's works, actually), and some others that escape me right now.

The reason I watch them in thier original dialogue is simple: The first time I saw 'Das Boot', I saw it with the english dubbed in, and I found it completely attrocious. When I got a copy on DVD, I tried it with the original German dialogue, and it sounded SOOOOO much better, and made more sense, besides. After that, I was hooked.

[Robelwell202]

Ohhh!!! I just remembered...

I remember somoene posting a comic about Kevin McKeever on one of these thread a while ago, but I can't find them, now. I'd like to share the link witha fried, so that he may get the same amount of LULZ that I did.

Does anyone know who the original poster was for those comics, or thier location?

Thanks!

[Freiflug88]

The entire American Anime market is still a pathetically small group of people, most likely there are the same number of people that prefer to see Das Boot in German with subtitles as well. (If the market were larger then the Japanese companies making Anime would put more effort into wringing some profit out of us)

I'll hazard a guess that the two primary reasons we prefer Subs to Dubs are.

1 - English VAs are not as good as the Japanese VAs (not even close in many cases)

2 - Dubbed shows often got chopped into kiddified versions stripped of their essence. (Clash of the Bionoids anyone?)

That is not true at all. In fact some Anime companies have grown so big from going international that they can no longer depend on profiting from the Japanese market alone. The whole reason you see Anime companies like funimation streaming their anime release subbed an hour after the Live Japanese broadcast is because the Japanese companies have been hurt by American anime fans watching fansubs over waiting a year to buy the American releases.

Just as VFTF1 said its not that the Japanese are uninterested in the American market its that its often too expensive or impossible to take what is made for Japanese and asian markets and release it in western markets.

[Gubaba]

Ohhh!!! I just remembered...

I remember somoene posting a comic about Kevin McKeever on one of these thread a while ago, but I can't find them, now. I'd like to share the link witha fried, so that he may get the same amount of LULZ that I did.

Does anyone know who the original poster was for those comics, or thier location?

Thanks!

You mean this one?

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry768822

[Funkenstein]

Part B is not correct for the United States. We get the same kind of products that Japanese can purchase, in fact Walmart is selling the Shoji Kawamori designed Thundercracker master piece toy. It looks almost exactly like an F-14. There is a huge market for these collectible toys, especially authentically reproduced ones that can cost upward of 200 dollars. BigBadToyStore wouldn't be so big if it wasn't for the American collectors.

USA even gets "bishoujo" type figures from Diamond Select, DC and Kotobukiya, with the various X-Men,Batman and assorted superheroines. I would say that the only thing preventing the market from Japanese goods is accessibility.

Lets not forget that Gundam is not a Japanese anomaly.

[Freiflug88]

Ohhh!!! I just remembered...

I remember somoene posting a comic about Kevin McKeever on one of these thread a while ago, but I can't find them, now. I'd like to share the link witha fried, so that he may get the same amount of LULZ that I did.

Does anyone know who the original poster was for those comics, or thier location?

Thanks!

It 's in one of the old and now archived HG and Robotech debate threads. I remember that the Poster used an Avatar of Kamina dying with all that white noise, I don't remember his name though.

[VFTF1]

Cool, I just learned about this. That's the Value Added Tax, where the government requires companies to pay extra fees during each stage a product is assembled.

Almost. The thing is, companies can later get those "fees" refunded if they overpayed. Tax payers (consumers) cannot. Thus, it is really a tax on the poor and middle class, not on companies.

Part B is not correct for the United States. We get the same kind of products that Japanese can purchase, in fact Walmart is selling the Shoji Kawamori designed Thundercracker master piece toy. It looks almost exactly like an F-14. There is a huge market for these collectible toys, especially authentically reproduced ones that can cost upward of 200 dollars. BigBadToyStore wouldn't be so big if it wasn't for the American collectors.

USA even gets "bishoujo" type figures from Diamond Select, DC and Kotobukiya, with the various X-Men,Batman and assorted superheroines. I would say that the only thing preventing the market from Japanese goods is accessibility.

Lets not forget that Gundam is not a Japanese anomaly.

But notice that BBTS has the following written on ALMOST every item they sell:

Safety Warning: This Product is for Adult Collectors. It may contain sharp points, small parts that are choking hazards, and other elements that are not suitable for children under 16 years of age.

They've tagged this on to even regular Hasbro Transformers - I suspect it's because they couldn't be assed to go item by item to determine which one mandates the "warning" and which one doesn't. Is there any doubt why the warning is there? I'm sure that lots of children want to and do purchase stuff from them - yet technically the stuff cannot be legally sold to children - so the big fat warning is there to avoid them getting sued by overzealous parents and other problems.

You're right about MP Starscream - however, in a way, Transformers as kind of an exemption to the rule because in general Takara develops them ALONG with Hasbro, so they probably take the needs of the US market into account.

But try selling Revoltechs or Macross products in the "toy" section of Walmart -- assuming there were no licensing issues - you'd run into the problem of regulations and toy safety laws because of sharp parts, small parts etc etc.

However - you're right that this does not apply in all cases - I'm kind of speaking in general.

Finally, as cool as BBTS is... it's not like they're walmart or Toys'r'us. They're one store. A huge one, and a cool one - no doubt - but it's not like it's a chain.

Pete

[MastaEgg]

American children eat just about anything. That's why they're so fat.

[VFTF1]

Well - I will admit that I always could tell I was back in the states whenever I'd fly into Detroit Metro...just so many overweight people in sweat pants But on the plus side, Americans are usually nicer than Europeans IMO. Or at least more accessable.

Pete

who is straying way off topic...so...will try to come back to the topic by predictably announcing: ROBOTECH SUCKS!

Pete

[HappyPenguins]

You mean this one?

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry768822

Ah good ol MMG and his anti HG goods those are great

he should make more!

American children eat just about anything. That's why they're so fat.

Hey now, I'm american and I eat just about anything and I'm skinny as hell

curse my metabolism!

[Jasonc]

Yeah, that VAT tax sucks. When I was in Greece and Venice, it was annoying having to pay extra for nothing, which basically is what it is. Politics aside, they had a pretty cool anime store in Venice, Italy. I was actually quite shocked to see it. Kinda made me feel like there were more kindred peeps around. Anyways, rt.com has some big article on the issues with getting the original Robotech that was redone in spanish, and the issues with pirating. I say, one of those guys down there buy the set when it's released, then make copies and set up shop (j/k).

OK, OT here, but I didn't want to look for the right thread, call it laziness. But, why is my new avatar not working??? It's jpg file, under the size limit, it just comes up as a lame box, as you can see. Any ideas why would help. Thanks guys.

[Gubaba]

OK, OT here, but I didn't want to look for the right thread, call it laziness. But, why is my new avatar not working??? It's jpg file, under the size limit, it just comes up as a lame box, as you can see. Any ideas why would help. Thanks guys.

It looks like Penny from Inspector Gadget wearing Yot-chan's Macross overalls.

[Xeros]

Yeah, that VAT tax sucks. When I was in Greece and Venice, it was annoying having to pay extra for nothing, which basically is what it is. Politics aside, they had a pretty cool anime store in Venice, Italy. I was actually quite shocked to see it. Kinda made me feel like there were more kindred peeps around. Anyways, rt.com has some big article on the issues with getting the original Robotech that was redone in spanish, and the issues with pirating. I say, one of those guys down there buy the set when it's released, then make copies and set up shop (j/k).

I would say that's true, that's why I'll never do any DVD patch in spanish xD

[VFTF1]

Re: Jasonc's avatar:

Actually - I've seen that girl before. I ran across some Robotech fansite where the guy had re-done the entire Robotech saga using flash player and semi-South Park animation. I think that's Minmey or somebody...not sure who...but... I did see that avatar.. now I don't see it... oh well.

Wait - crap. Now I see it again.

Heh - that's wierd. It literally dissapeared and reappeared.

Hey now, I'm american and I eat just about anything and I'm skinny as hell

I'm not going to ask a girl how old she is because that would be rude of me, but I will say that until I hit 30, it was the same for me. People joked that I had a tape worm or something because I could eat without limit.

Then again, it's only when I reached 25 or 26 that I REALLY started to eat. I mean, in the sense of filling portions. Before that it was KFC, Macdonalds etc etc - Pizza...although not so much Pizza hut...I liked Pappa John's the best, Dominos (when it was still around...but that was a long time ago, right?...or are they still around?) ...there's a kind of polish equivalent to it here...

anyways - nowadays I do what I can to keep weight down to tolerable levels. So clearly my metabolism is dead, because now I have to get on the exercise bike and work out.

Pete

[Freiflug88]

But notice that BBTS has the following written on ALMOST every item they sell:

Safety Warning: This Product is for Adult Collectors. It may contain sharp points, small parts that are choking hazards, and other elements that are not suitable for children under 16 years of age.

Come to think of it I have never seen a toy banned from shelves for small and sharp points only forced to come labeled with a warning. Years ago I remember seeing a News special about the most dangerous child toys sold in America and all them were toys made by Europan companies and they were considered dangerous because they had "ZERO WARNING LABELS!" Apparently according to American safety experts everything is dangerous until its rendered harmless with warning stickers.

But try selling Revoltechs or Macross products in the "toy" section of Walmart -- assuming there were no licensing issues - you'd run into the problem of regulations and toy safety laws because of sharp parts, small parts etc etc.

However - you're right that this does not apply in all cases - I'm kind of speaking in general.

Finally, as cool as BBTS is... it's not like they're walmart or Toys'r'us. They're one store. A huge one, and a cool one - no doubt - but it's not like it's a chain.

Pete

I think the real reason Walmart does't sell Revoltech Robotech or Macross is because they aren't a house hold name brand and because they aren't known through TV broadcasts. I have seen cheap Gundam Bandai's on Walmart shelves, but only while respective Gundam series were being broadcast on Cartoon Network. After the Broadcast though they are eventually liquidated to Big Lots. Chain stores like Walmart and Toys'R'us always devote what limited shelf space they have to whats hot at the time, BBTS on the other hand is one large store that specializes in selling toys so they can devote shelf space to lesser known toy lines.

Well - I will admit that I always could tell I was back in the states whenever I'd fly into Detroit Metro...just so many overweight people in sweat pants But on the plus side, Americans are usually nicer than Europeans IMO. Or at least more accessable.

Side-effects of the fluoride in the majority of the drinking waters in America compared to fluoride being banned in most of Europe. Few realize that the fluoride in the water suppresses there thyroid gland and causes weight gain and loss of aggression, sex drive, and motivation among its many side effects.'

Hey now, I'm american and I eat just about anything and I'm skinny as hell

curse my metabolism!

I was the same way until I discovered that I had a "leaky gut" because I couldn't digest the proteins in bread or dairy products which I was literally addicted to like crack. Once I removed bread and dairy diet I was able to quickly bulk up quickly though.

[taksraven]

Actually, I think that I would like to work for Harmony Gold. I mean, its got to be a pretty cruisy job. Sitting round all day, doing ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!!

Taksraven

[Bri]

Actually, the longer I sit in this business, the more I come to the conclusion that one of the main reasons why the anime market is a mega-niche market outside of Japan isn't necessarily because it's "small" and therefore the Japanese don't have any incentive to market to us - but rather due to reasons which are completely internal to the west:

A) VAT taxes. The USA isn't affected by this, but Europe has horrendously high VAT taxes, and while a business like mine is VAT neutral - so what - since customers have to pay it anyways - whether buying from an importer or whether importing themselves (unless it's a parcel under 100 Euros value...which given the prices of things like statues, valkyrie and SOCs is rare). This tax really REALLY eats into profit margins and makes it very difficult to offer items in bulk

In fairness, VAT is not the issue. It's a more sophisticated form of sales tax and both are always paid in full by the consumer. Main difference it's at least 10 percent higher in Europe than in the States. What kill any attempt to import large quantities of anime related merchandise is the import duties as it's produced outside of the union. Those protectionist measures are far worse. (Though I can't stand shops that don't include VAT, sales tax or tips in their price and I'm left guessing at the final amount until checkout.)

Licensing Agreements - which are actually nothing more than big corporations using government to impose mafia-like restrictions on other companies and dividing the world into "corporate turfs" much like different Mafia families divide cities into turfs. I'll give you an example: I noticed that in Poland, Cosplay is pretty popular - so I thought I might start offering Cospa stuff in my store. Turns out that according to the laws here, in order to import ANY clothing - you need a "certificate of origin" from the manufacturer... but Cospa, under licensing agreements from all the various owners of the IP that they make clothing to correspond to CANNOT sell outside of Japan. I can import "samples" - 1 or 2 pieces of individual Cospa items - but not in bulk - and therefore it becomes impossible to actually offer anything but direct import at a higher price than I would have been able to offer if not for the licensing agreements.

True except in Europe there is also a language issue. Certain licenses are bought for Europe as a whole but only used in one language area leaving other areas without the content as the licensee only cares about their home market. Also happened with Robotech, worldwide license for HG but not a single RT item to buy in the stores (should one want too).

Sure - small dealers and retailers are suffering too - but it's proportionate suffering. We're not over-expanded and it's precisely because we service niche markets that we have a better handle on what's going on instead of having a huge store full of over priced crap that nobody wants.

So - I predict that when this crisis blows over - anime and the anime market will be stronger for it and all the big guys who regimented the world will be weaker.

I think anime as a niche market is really a blessing in disguise for the small entrepreneurs. Over here during the anime boom in the late nineties, fueled by pokemon, digimon etc, the large retailers discovered anime merchandise and DVDs. They bought up the available stock, saturated the market and locked out the specialist stores, ruining the market in a few months. What took the specialist years to built was destroyed in no time. The small firms only recovered when the hype was long over and anime returned to its niche status.

Well - I will admit that I always could tell I was back in the states whenever I'd fly into Detroit Metro...just so many overweight people in sweat pants smile.gif But on the plus side, Americans are usually nicer than Europeans IMO. Or at least more accessible.

Ha ha, yea, I'll never forget my first visit to the States, the eerie politeness of people really freaked me in the beginning. It's one thing Hollywood doesn't prepare you for Also I noticed quite a regional difference, a lot of my colleagues are from either Michigan or upstate New york, mostly cold as ice, the rest is from California and Texas and are way more relaxed and easy going, coincidence or cultural difference?

Edited November 8, 2009 by Bri

[Gubaba]

I think anime as a niche market is really a blessing in disguise for the small entrepreneurs. Over here during the anime boom in the late nineties, fueled by pokemon, digimon etc, the large retailers discovered anime merchandise and DVDs. They bought up the available stock, saturated the market and locked out the specialist stores, ruining the market in a few months. What took the specialist years to built was destroyed in no time. The small firms only recovered when the hype was long over and anime returned to its niche status.

That's a good point. Most of the import shops (and the comis store/anime-specialty video store near me) seem to be keeping their heads above water. Meanwhile, the Borders Bookstore near me has drastically reduced its anime section. The manga section is still big, however.

Ha ha, yea, I'll never forget my first visit to the States, the eerie politeness of people really freaked me in the beginning. It's one thing Hollywood doesn't prepare you for Also I noticed quite a regional difference, a lot of my colleagues are from either Michigan or upstate New york, mostly cold as ice, the rest is from California and Texas and are way more relaxed and easy going, coincidence or cultural difference?

Well...I'm from California (near Los Angeles, no less), and I haven't met many peole from Texas that I liked (and most of the ones I like are from Austin, which doesn't really count). But I do generally get along with East Coast people. So yes, I'd say it's a cultural difference, but I'd also say there are finer gradations of cultural differences than you may have come across.

And, um, yeah...this thread's about Robotech, right? SHADOW RISING FOR 2010!!!

[Robelwell202]

You mean this one?

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry768822

Gubaba, I appreciate it. Thnks for the find!

[Beltane70]

Bri, it's probably because upstate New York and Michigan are cold way more than they are warm. The cold climate up there just makes them a bit more grumpier than the rest of us!

[Jasonc]

Actually - I've seen that girl before. I ran across some Robotech fansite where the guy had re-done the entire Robotech saga using flash player and semi-South Park animation. I think that's Minmey or somebody...not sure who...but... I did see that avatar.. now I don't see it... oh well.

It was a character that my wife created for a comic a member here was working on, but as time passed, kinda fizzled out. My wife did the character faces, and the coloring doesn't do the pic justice, but I was bored, and was a noob at photoshop when I first colored it. Anyways, until I can figure it out, I'm gonna keep the t-shirt design as my avatar.

On subject, I like the fact that anime is kinda going back to where it was a number of years ago. While there are a couple new titles that I am currently watching and interested in, most of the DVDs I get are older titles. Robotech has the distinct position that it's flooded itself in the market, and as far as the spanish dub, it's unfortunate that it took them this long to do it. I'm sure by now, most, if not, all Robotech fans who watch it in Spanish, have old versions of it from T.V., or from burned copies from a friend of a friend. I kinda thought it funny when I read the article that it basically says for the RT fans to not let others borrow their DVD or VHS tapes, so that they can sell the DVDs when done. Kinda a strange attempt at not getting the series to fans till the redub in espanol is done. Just thought it strange.

[Gubaba]

I'm curious to see how they'll dance their way out of this one...

http://www.robotech.com/community/forum/re...&id=2027877

[Jasonc]

I'm curious to see how they'll dance their way out of this one...

http://www.robotech.com/community/forum/re...&id=2027877

Easy, they'll have one of the mods say that they can't answer that, and ban that person. I think it's funny to think that Kevin would actually answer a question straight up with the truth told. I don't think that's ever been done yet. It's like when RTSC was stalling with distribution, and someone asked what the real deal was with it...Kevin's statement was more or less "I'm gonna give you 'bankofkev's no spin' explanation..." Which was then followed by more spin than a piece of rotisserie on a skewer. I doubt the staff will answer this one. If they do and it's straight to the point, I'd be very surprised, not like it's a big deal though.

Last statement re: my OT question, got it to work finally.

[SkullLeaderVF-X]

I'm curious to see how they'll dance their way out of this one...

http://www.robotech.com/community/forum/re...&id=2027877

I'll tell you how. The'll sick MEMO on him for causing site disruption, and ban him. Also just got my ADV Macross episodes, ans was wondering...did they change the sub from the animego release on these?